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HIV never discovered! HIV IS A FRAUD!

They got the proof and the scientists, about 2700 top scientists saying it...


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Yes, because you resurrected it. :(

That was a sarcastic thread meant to pick a fight by the poster who was irritated one night about some of the topics that were going at the time.

It was not intended as serious, sincere discussion about Pasteur, as he verified later with his "sarcasm" notes and explanation he added underneath.


Want to see the smoking gun?

Gallo in his own handwriting


it don't get no better than this thanks Janine Roberts and Gary Null
for having her on his show

I think you are the troll or maybe not.

Because trolls only exist in the forests of Norway!
I just hope that those with an open mind has the guts to look at the links
further down on this thread and learn.
I have actually put the link from Gary Null's website straight to the documents that proves what I am saying.
But don't believe me, read what top scientists are saying.
Janine Roberts discovered the documents that show Gallo in his own handwriting changed the outcome of the research from what it said.
If there ever was a smoking gun...


The bankers would love nothing more than for us to get bogged down on idiotic arguments.

Is HIV real? I think so.... Will arguing about it help END THE FED? NO!

Please don't feed the throlls.

" That commenter on your blog may actually be working for the Israeli government

July 19, 2009

Straight out of Avigdor Lieberman’s Foreign Ministry: a new Internet Fighting Team! Israeli students and demobilized soldiers get paid to pretend they are just regular folks and leave pro-Israel comments on Twitter, Facebook, YouTube and other sites. The effort is meant to fight the “well-oiled machine” of “pro-Palestinian websites, with huge budgets… with content from the Hamas news agency.” The approach was test-marketed during Israel’s assault on Gaza, and by groups like Give Israel Your United Support, a controversial effort to use instant-access technology to crowd-source Israel advocates to fill in flash polls or vote up key articles on social networking sites.

Will the responders who are hired for this also present themselves as “ordinary net-surfers”?"


"it is good for the establishment to adopt liberty ideology, but it is not good for those who have already adopted liberty to fall to the feet of the establishment." ~ Annica2

you can bitch all you want but louis pasteur

admitted this stuff. HE ADMITTED IT!
So why don't you do some real research. Start with the link and start by reexamining everything you have been told.
Because i will tell you that if you do you will find that everything you ever believed in will be upside down inside out and backwards...


Yes Louis Pasteur was a fraud!

Read below or better yet here is the link:


In the medical schools of the United States and many other Western countries today, doctors are taught a lie. This lie is a particular viewpoint about disease called The Germ Theory. The scientist credited with discovering it is Louis Pasteur, also credited with finding a cure for Rabies. Pasteur has been heralded as making some of the most important discoveries of all time. Yet, when we look at the historical evidence, we see that Pasteur was an incompetent fraud! Not only did he NOT understand the processes which he experimented with and wrote about, but most of what he is credited with discovering was plagarized from scientists previous to or contemporary with him. For a thorough rendition of this history, you can read the full text of the 1940's book "Pasteur, Plagarist, Imposter" by R.B. Pearson at The Dream and Lie of Louis Pasteur .

Basically, it boils down to this: Both Pasteur and a contemporary of his, Antoine Beauchamp, were experimenting with the process of fermentation. The prevailing theory was that fermentation was a simple chemical reaction, but the experiments of Beauchamp showed that fermentation was a process brought about by microorganisms in the air. Pasteur continued to insist for some time after Beauchamp's discovery that fermentation was a process that did not require oxygen because it was a lifeless chemical reaction (called spontaneous generation). It took Pasteur many years to finally grasp the concept that fermentation of sugars is caused by yeast fungus, a living organism. When he did grasp and write about these concepts, he presented them as his own discoveries, giving no credit at all to Beauchamp. So at the very least, he was a thief and a plagarizer, and at the most, a poor scientist (1).

Throughout their lives, Pasteur and Beauchamp continued to experiment with microorganisms. Pasteur continued to adhere to the idea of Monomorphism, the belief that all microbes and bacteria have only one form. Beauchamp was able to prove, however, the existence of Pleomorphism, that microbes can alter their form to appear as different germs. This discovery was confirmed by many scientists that came after Beauchamp, including Gunther Enderlein.

In his experiments, Enderlein found that every living cell contains two distinct kinds of microorganisms called endobionts (which means "inside life"). These microorganisms live inside the cell and cannot be removed from it. They play an important role in cellular health. The state of a person's health is determined by the stage of development of these organisms. Enderlein found that all microbes that live permanently in our bodies go through three stages:

The Primitive Stage (microbe)
The Middle Stage (bacteria)
The End Stage (fungus)

Other scientists were later able to confirm that there was a fourth stage which occurs only after extreme toxicity in which the fungus goes through a transformation, mutating into the Virus.

Most of the diseases in modern society today are not caused by the "pathogenic bacteria" that enter from outside us, as was taught by Pasteur. Disease occurs as these endobionts are transformed from the microbe stage to more virulent forms of life. The state of development of these organisms depends upon the state of the medium in which the germ lives. In other words, the microbes which live in our cells and assist the cells in maintaining a healthy state will mutate into bacteria, fungus, and viruses when the tissues of our bodies in which they live change to provide a medium for their growth. They begin to become "pathogenic" when the pH of the tissues becomes more acidic.

Primitive phases live in a strong alkaline pH
Bacterial phases live in mild alkaline pH
Fungal forms live in a medium acid pH
Viral forms live in a strong acid pH (2)

These primitive organisms can live in our bodies in the microbe stage indefinitely, and do not cause disease, but rather perform a restorative function. Bacteria and other germs consume dead matter. That is their function. Experiments show that if you put a fresh, raw steak that still has active live enzymes in it, and a cooked steak outside in the open air, it is the cooked steak that will become infested with maggots. Microorganisms cannot live in living tissue. It is only when the tissue becomes dead that they move in to do their job.

That's what happens in your compost pile. You put your table scraps in there, along with some bacteria, and the bacteria decompose the food scraps into soil. Everything that exists on this earth eventually BIODEGRADES. It is really true that when we die, we will return to dust. Bacteria and other pathogenic microorganisms are only doing their jobs. They are able to sense chemically when dead matter is present, and they go about the business of breaking it down. That is where disease comes from. The microorganisms in your body are breaking down your dead tissues in preparation for biodegradation (3).

Most of the germs which enter our bodies from the outside are quickly killed by the immune system. But it is the microorganisms which live permanently in our bodies that cause us to get sick. And they cause sickness because we provide them with a rich growth medium so that they can mutate and transform themselves into deadly bacteria, fungus, and viruses.

So you see, whether or not we get sick and die has very little to do with what germ we catch, but has everything to do with whether we keep our bodies free of the dead matter which these germs feed on. The dead matter these germs feed on is produced when the pH in our bodies is altered from a slightly alkaline state to a progressively more acidic state. In the next lesson, we will learn how to properly equip our bodies so that these microorganisms cannot mutate into virulent forms.

At the end of his life, Pasteur admitted that his theory was a fraud. He said that it was not the germs that mattered, but the medium in which they lived. And yet, his so-called "work" is the basis of the whole medical model of disease and healing.

The Germ theory CANNOT account for the fact that if you expose 100 people to what he called "pathogenic bacteria" that 10 of the people in that room will NOT DEVELOP THE DISEASE. It's not that germs cause disease at all. The pH of those people's bodies' was not acidic enough to support the transformation of the germ into a bacteria, fungus or virus. Because the germ never mutates, the person never gets sick.

Because of what I know about Louis Pasteur and The Germ Theory, there is no way that I will allow myself to be treated by a medical doctor trained in the United States or other Western countries. Their diagnoses and treatments inevitably make the patient sicker by plunging the body into an even more acidic state, and encouraging the more rapid transformation of microbes into deadly pathogens.

In fact, if a person learns to alter their diet so that it encourages a more alkaline pH in the body, there is no need to ever visit a medical practitioner of any kind.

Everything I have said here is based upon sound scientific studies, and actual historical documents. And yet, many people who choose to refuse allopathic medical treatments are looked at as mentally unbalanced. And if a person refuses to allow their child to be given medical treatments, they are looked at as guilty of medical negligence and can have their children taken away. And for what? Because they don't agree with one particular interpretation of scientific data? The evidence I have given is sound and proven. I hope anyone who reads this can see that a person who chooses to reject The Germ Theory does so with much evidence to back them up, and they are not being negligent with their own health or their children's.

I choose to reject the Medical Model. I choose to take charge of my own health. And in doing so, I will avoid most all of the plagues of the 20th and 21st centuries, including Cancer, Anthrax, and AIDS.


(1) Pearson, R.B. (2001). The Dream and Lie of Louis Pasteur. Available online: [http://www.sumeria.net/dream.html]. Taken from "Pasteur, Plagarist, Imposter" by the same author, 1940's.

(2) Poehlman, Karl H. (1997). Synthesis of the Work of Enderlein, Bechamps and other Pleomorphic
Researchers. Explore Vol. 8, No. 2.

(3) Logan, Cordell E. (2000). A Partially Unified Theory of Disease. Priority One Health and Nutrition. Available online: [http://www.priorityonevitamins.com/articles/theory_of_disease_Logan.htm].

That is a serious claim

And even if some of what you said was correct, which I do not think it is, it does not make him "and incompetent fraud"
He did many many other things than just germ theory


Let's look at the main thing he's famous for: pasteurized milk. The pasteurization process was supposed to kill all the harmful microbes in milk without destroying the milk as a food source. Instead, it harms the milk without killing all the harmful microbes (scroll down a bit): http://www.mnwelldir.org/docs/history/biographies/louis_past...

Louis Pasteur was trained as a chemist, but dabbled in other fields and even went so far as to falsify data to come up with things that proved personally profitable. Why do you try to defend him?


He did not "invent" Pasteurization for milk, he "invented" it for beer.

The beer spoilage bacteria or wild yeasts killed by Pasteurization ONLY effect the shelf life/flavor/aroma of beer, they do not have any dangerous health effects.

Campylobacter, Salmonella, E. coli, and Listeria, etc do NOT occur in beer, unless you take a crap in the beer during fermentation.

Don't forget, he was working at Carlsberg Brewery when he made most of his discoveries. Pasteurization allowed Carlsberg to sell their beer farther from the the brewery. The increased shelf life allowed for increased travel time to more distant markets.

Lager yeast, Saccharomyces Uvarum, was originally named Saccharomyces Carlsbergensis. Notice the word “Carlsberg” in there. The name was chosen to honor the brewery that was credited with first isolating lager yeast, Carlsberg Brewery. The yeast was later named Saccharomyces Uvarum.

The fact that a process used to increase shelf life of beer is applied to other things it may not be effective for is not Pasteur's fault.


While it's true Pasteur invented pasteurization for use on wine and beer, it was Pasteur himself who expanded it for use on milk. Don't try to rewrite history to suit your purposes.


It is ridiculous to compare scientific knowledge of today to the emerging scientific discoveries of 150 years ago. How many scientific theories in 1862 hold up without modification in 2009?

How many "truths" we accept today will be thought of as the quaint archaic stumblings of primitive man in 2209?

Pasteurization that is typically associated with milk, was first suggested by Franz von Soxhlet in 1886.

The dude called him an "incoptitant fraud"

The guy discovered stereo chemistry at 26.
Just because he was not 100% consistent with his note book, should not lead people to jump to hysterical conclusions.

Look at RP.
He had a bunch of racist crap published in his name. 100 years from now some one can do a hit piece on him by taking things out of context.

Ron Paul screwed up by allowing that to happen, and I am sure Pasteur screwed up many times in his life as well. He is a man not a god.

Pasteurized milk has feed millions of people, that would not have been feed otherwise.

There are biographies of louis Pasteur that you should

consider reading before you start having opinions.
at least then you will have an educated as opposed to an uninformed one!

AMC you're right..just leave

AMC you're right..just leave it at that..Some people are just not worthy of argument because they refuse to see things any other way than the way they already do..And some are just always right..even when they're wrong...

Ron Paul

does not lie for profit. Please don't compare him with a greedy chemist.


deity worship
I never compared him to any one. I used him as an example of how you can do a hit piece on some one.


Take a look at the people who would discredit Ron Paul and the people who would consider Louis Pasteur to be a great contributor to modern medicine. They are the exact same people! They would do a hit piece on Ron Paul to discourage others from believing in freedom and liberty, while the posters here, whose opinions would never be widely spread anyway, would do a hit piece on Louis Pasteur to expose the truth about him being a fraud. The two don't compare, and I have no idea where you came up with the notion I think of Ron Paul as a deity.

I agree that the whole germ

I agree that the whole germ theory is a bunch on nonsense. Read Pasteur Exposed.

Just because germ theory does not explain everything

Does not mean it is not a good theory.

The test of any good theory is its ability to accurately and consistently predict events or behaviors. It does not have to be 100% accurate under all conditions.
We use theories all the time that are seemingly contradictory, but there is evidence to support both.

Good, as in inaccurate? I

Good, as in inaccurate? I am not sure about you, but a good theory should prove correct.

What evidence is there to support the germ theory? Show me where they passed Koch's Postulates.

This is a rather interesting

book by Alan Caltwell, about the AIDS Genocide plot. It is called Queer Blood.


Gives a lot of information what is behind all the HIV hype.

HPV is a joke too .

I'd go as far as to say anything a doctor tells you has some type of lie attached to it when it comes to synthetic drugs. The human body never needs a synthetic drug to be healthy . It's just a money scam based on fear and the brainwashing of "doctors" being the all knowing TV pundits but in reality all they know is how to poison people.

They are only good for stitching bodies and delivering babies.

Leave the rest to nature.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Stop the NWO....It's just illumi..Naughty !

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Stop the NWO....It's just illumi..Naughty !

They're good

for delivering babies? If I got pregnant, I'd be looking for a midwife so fast I'd make your head swim!

Easy, Big Fella

I agree with you in principle: many pharmaceuticals are deadly. But antibiotics have saved lives. They go back, long before the days of Big Pharma. Other medications, such as high blood pressure meds, are helpful to many. So please don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. There really are some useful medications. But since Big Pharma and the FDA got into it, one must tread lightly.

Even OTC medications, such as NSAIDs (Ibuprofen, for example) are very harmful. But plain old aspirin can be good, if taken as directed.


This has to be the dumbest thread ever made on the dailypaul.

Is this a joke?

OK, so try another thread.

If you think the thread is dumb, I am quite sure you can find one you like.

People get passionate about issues that are not interesting to you. We see posts about Alex Jones, about various religious, about God, about being stopped by police officers in Arizona. There are many.

This one, about HIV/AIDs is important. There is new information here, and people are passionate about it.

So if you are not amused, then back out and find a thread that you can get excited about.

Just my two cents' worth.

No, What is a joke is the

No, What is a joke is the whole HIV = AIDS.. but then again, have you done any research? Don't be so quick to dismiss something that appears "crazy" just because you have not heard about it.

Do you have anything meaningful to contribute to this thread?

Or did you just come here to insult and pick fights with people?

While I don't necessarily agree with the conclusions of the poster of this thread and would've worded the title much differently, they did at least post information from a doctor, who also references other doctors and scientists, regarding this subject.

Whether the information is right or wrong, at least by doing so, the poster of this thread has made an effort to bring forth discussion in a manner that appears to be much less of a joke than your insulting posts here.