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The Lucifer Effect: How Good People Become Evil

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 07:45
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Dr Phil Zimbardo, famous for Stanford Prison Experiment study, discusses the pyschology of evil at MIT in April 2007.
http://mitworld.mit.edu/video/459

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Here is a 23:17 minute

Submitted by Bob Smith 1234 on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 23:33.

Here is a 23:17 minute version of the MIT talk:
http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/philip_zimbardo_on_the_ps...

And this material is what is "presentable"

Submitted by declarationofre... on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 22:07.

I'm sure even more horrific abominations went on off camera...

And worst of all...all of these men were absolutely innocent. They were patriots defending their country from an evil tyrant empire that was invading them for a made up reason.

I can barely handle that fact.....

"There can be only one permanent revolution - a moral one: The regeneration of the inner man."
—Tolstoy

—

"The body is but a vessel for the soul,
A puppet which bends to the soul's tyranny.
And lo, the body is not eternal,
For it must feed on the flesh of others,
Lest it return to the dust whence it came.
Therefore the soul deceives and despises."

Were these people "good" in the first place?

Submitted by Henry on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 21:42.

I think not.

—

"The deepest sin against the human mind is to believe things without evidence." Thomas H. Huxley

They were for all intents

Submitted by Bob Smith 1234 on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 21:55.

They were for all intents and purposes "good". They weren't ghandi or anything but they weren't bad either. This talk was about how situations can turn anybody into a bad apple.

You gotta watch the seminar

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 21:44.

I think you may see it differently.

—

Explore Orthodox Christianity

This research presents a

Submitted by Bob Smith 1234 on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 21:14.

This research presents a very VERY good case for individualism! The collective destroys society! When you deindividuate people, they become more willing to hurt others!

FREE CHIP FREDRICKS!!

Submitted by The Granger on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:14.

If I was in the audience I would have asked Zimbardo, "How much of the book sales is going to Chip Fredricks, the guy doing 8 years, or the guy who turned in the photos?

And I will add, Ralph Nader fits Zimbardo's discription of hero.

—

WE ARE GOING TO WIN!
___.---.___
.' ( ) '.
) /)' '( )
',_( ';-;'\_,'
|-|
(")

Great lecture

Submitted by Jive_Dadson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 17:43.

I was prejudiced against it going in, because of the title, and the intro didn't do much to dispell the feeling. But I watched it all the way through, and I was edified. It occurred to me afterward that the message would be lost on anyone who thinks he is talking about "other people." I intend to watch it again, reminding myself continually, "He is talking about me."

Glad you gave one of my long ones a chance

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 17:54.

I really do choose them wisely. You should give that Bill Cooper lecture a chance now, it takes a while to get going, but it's great stuff.

—

Explore Orthodox Christianity

Thanks

Submitted by declarationofre... on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:39.

"There can be only one permanent revolution - a moral one: The regeneration of the inner man."
—Tolstoy

—

"The body is but a vessel for the soul,
A puppet which bends to the soul's tyranny.
And lo, the body is not eternal,
For it must feed on the flesh of others,
Lest it return to the dust whence it came.
Therefore the soul deceives and despises."

Yes, I believe

Submitted by quiltingsando on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 15:30.

good people can do bad things. Thanks, for sharing this I have a lot to learn.

—

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

What this isn't telling about

Submitted by pearl on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 14:43.

is the small number of people who won't go along with the evil. There is consistently a group of people who adhere to their values in these experiments. Who are these people and why don't they get in line?

Yes,

Submitted by amerianna on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:29.

The Enlightened Ones.

******************
It is good and proper to respect the U.S. flag, perpetuated with the blood of American heroes. It is a fatal mistake not to recognize those who wrap themselves in the same flag to cover up their crimes against the American people.
~ Sherman H. Skolnick

—

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

Watch it all the way through.

Submitted by Jive_Dadson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 17:47.

Watch it all the way through.

I'd be very interested in that population too

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 15:50.

I wonder if there's any similarities between them or if it's as random as the study population. I'm going to e-mail Zimbrado and ask about this. It has to be equally intriguing to someone else.

—

Explore Orthodox Christianity

This looks good

Submitted by ArmorOfChrist777 on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 10:37.

Can't watch it right now, but I will later.

ditto

Submitted by cultivator on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 21:10.

bump
_________________________________________
sdrawkcab gnihtyreve od deF eht & tnemrevog ehT

My opinion on this

Submitted by amerianna on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 10:34.

is that difficulties are brought our way to teach us and help us to grow and evolve. If we can't "get it", the problem will continue to present itself until either we DO get it (Overcome), or we become bitter (Evil - the opposite of what is good).

******************
It is good and proper to respect the U.S. flag, perpetuated with the blood of American heroes. It is a fatal mistake not to recognize those who wrap themselves in the same flag to cover up their crimes against the American people.
~ Sherman H. Skolnick

—

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

Yes!

Submitted by Habit4ming on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 10:51.

Life is a spiritual experience...we are here to grow and evolve...

—

Berwick, Columbia County, Pennsylvania
Ron Paul 2012 - The People's Choice
rEVOLution SuperPAC: http://www.revolutionpac.com/
WTP Federal Lawsuit to BAN ALL ELECTRONIC VOTING
http://www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/UPDATE/Update2011-07-26...

Yes!

Submitted by amerianna on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 11:13.

Bump for a common ground.

******************
It is good and proper to respect the U.S. flag, perpetuated with the blood of American heroes. It is a fatal mistake not to recognize those who wrap themselves in the same flag to cover up their crimes against the American people.
~ Sherman H. Skolnick

—

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

You definitely didn't watch the seminar

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 10:48.

You're being played just like those he discusses in the film. You want violence as long as you don't personally have to administer it. Waking up is easy to do. I can help you. You must be willing to learn.

—

Explore Orthodox Christianity

I want no violence! What do

Submitted by amerianna on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:31.

I want no violence!
What do you mean?

******************
It is good and proper to respect the U.S. flag, perpetuated with the blood of American heroes. It is a fatal mistake not to recognize those who wrap themselves in the same flag to cover up their crimes against the American people.
~ Sherman H. Skolnick

—

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

You want the government to force me to have health ins.

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:38.

If I don't comply, they'll be violent.
We've only had a chance to banter on the healthcare issue. I want to have a basic philosophy chat with you.

—

Explore Orthodox Christianity

I don't want to force you to do anything you don't want to do.

Submitted by amerianna on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:52.

What I DO want is the opportunity to make the public option in healthcare insurance a viable choice for anyone that WANTS it. I'm asking that we don't take that choice away.

*******************
It is good and proper to respect the U.S. flag, perpetuated with the blood of American heroes. It is a fatal mistake not to recognize those who wrap themselves in the same flag to cover up their crimes against the American people.
~ Sherman H. Skolnick

—

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

If I am required to have health insurance of any kind

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:53.

it's forced. The bill I read says I must have insurance or I must get on the public plan. Just like car insurance. That's force. Force is violence.

—

Explore Orthodox Christianity

That isn't the way it should be or the way I understand it to be

Submitted by amerianna on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 20:57.

You'll have to prove that to me.

******************
It is good and proper to respect the U.S. flag, perpetuated with the blood of American heroes. It is a fatal mistake not to recognize those who wrap themselves in the same flag to cover up their crimes against the American people.
~ Sherman H. Skolnick

—

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

Section 401 Part VIII Healthcare Related Taxes

Submitted by MikeLawson on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 21:17.

Subpart A--Tax on Individuals Without Acceptable Health Care Coverage
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c111:1:./temp/~c111oib...
and you gotta admit, this is funny: `(6) NOT TREATED AS TAX IMPOSED BY THIS CHAPTER FOR CERTAIN PURPOSES- The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax imposed by this chapter for purposes of determining the amount of any credit under this chapter or for purposes of section 55.

—

Explore Orthodox Christianity

I'm sorry,

Submitted by amerianna on Tue, 08/18/2009 - 21:31.

The link you gave me deleted the information before I could get to it!

******************
It is good and proper to respect the U.S. flag, perpetuated with the blood of American heroes. It is a fatal mistake not to recognize those who wrap themselves in the same flag to cover up their crimes against the American people.
~ Sherman H. Skolnick

—

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!