If the Daily Paul's guiding light is Ron Paul, it's focus should be on philosophy and ideas - not personalities!
Submitted by Ralph Waldo on Wed, 09/02/2009 - 13:42
As Ron Paul often says, the debate at hand should be about philosophy and ideas - not personalities. If the Daily Paul turns into a "personal chat room", especially with this "gay flirting" and childish egos of late, it's demise will soon be in the making!
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It takes all kinds of
It takes all kinds of inter-action to formulate a rebellion. Is it my personality that causes me to state that I agree with you? I tolerate much on this site as I do in the world around me. Tolerating something does not mean I condone it, I just except that it exists. I will go a step farther and say that all the posters here are posting things that are inportant to their personality.
"Our relationship to the United States ( CORPORATE ) government is much like the one I have with my wife. It is a very common thing when I find out we're not "on the same page". Occasionally, I wonder if we're in the same book. And sometimes, I have to wonder if she's even on the same planet as I am?" --Me
The real issue.
Ralph, yours is a sentiment long expressed here and I agree with it. Not so much the demise of DP part, but the implication that DP could be so much more for the liberty movement and Ron Paul. I suggest no longer falling for the 'free speech' straw man. The old line about free speech and the value it has, how it's not always pretty or serious --- posts responding to threads like this always include this unproductive curtailing speech argument. Personal chat room stuff, fine, people have a right to do that within Michael's definition of what is verboten on his privately owned and operated site. What you are suggesting that I agree with is we can be more effective and more important to the liberty movement if we would only choose so.
Before I logged onto DP tonight, I had just finished the excellent Reason article today on Bernanke as Friedmanite not Keynesian. Great stuff for me because I like it but also great stuff for my efforts to continue to win converts to Austrian theory. DP is great for links to info I don't always find on my own, terrific for quickly posted video of RP and others, and has a couple dozen posters that are often compelling.
It's a strategic thing. Example. Why aren't we advocating that RP fans by the hundreds show up at Rand/Ron Paul events with 'legalize pot' signs? Why not? Put down those 'End the Fed' signs. Both issues have overwhelming support by DPers. Both issues are important to the freedom movement. To NOT flood a Rand Paul rally with 'legalize pot' sizes is keeping secret one of our core principles. It would gain media attention, why not do it? Answer: Because it is NOT selling out your principles to choose smart packaging. After all, elections are popularity contests. Give sheeple our best arguments and do it with class and fierce conviction. Do it here, there and everywhere. And everday. Ron Paul does.
The first 5 million supporters of Dr. Paul are 'early adopters.' The next 10 million will require a modified approach.
Thank you for sharing your very wise words
your last paragraph is why I come to the DP. Finding gems like that mixed in with the opposite, anti-message in a thread is one of the best parts of this palce
Gay flirting? Personal chat room? What ARE you talking about??
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
There is only one absolute standard to measure the intent of ...
men and that is the Constitution. How do they live, act, and vote when put up against this document and when they are in situations of either duress or power grabbing or largess? Are there such people out there?
The second important measure is time meaning consistency of one's voting record and life. There is no substitute for time. Especially new personalities could be deceivers and could lead people astray by their persona. Selective Constitutionalists are the most deceptive i.e., Beck, Savage, Limbaugh, and Hannity. They apply the Constitution when it benefits their agenda and not consistently. They have the power the sway many away from our focus.
My concern is that no one will be capable of filling the shoes of Ron Paul. The standard is so high that all will fall short of simply following the Constitution. The less they follow it, the more charisma and personality will come into play. None will have a voting record as consistent as Ron Paul has voted. Who now in politics will take up the banner of liberty?
The subjects that you mention are asides, phases that we go through here. Part of the reason for these diversions is the lack of people who are filling the void of a future political landscape without Ron Paul. That time is not so far away and that inevitability now has no answer. We will in fact have a cause and a purpose, but without a leader...not a good situation. Will we just wait for a re-incarnation of Ron Paul to magically occur like the Buddhists or will one of us step up?
Imagine the subjects that we will be discussing after Ron Paul leaves Congress. The moderators will have their hands full with in-fighting, nit-picking, and expletive-deleting. Also, not a good situation. So we had better start thinking about what life will be like on the DP after RP is gone.
the constitution as the standard
excellent thought!
Good night
Good night and good luck.
Freedom is Popular
Can it ever be too popular?
Freedom is NOT popular!!
No disrespect Michael, but that is about as effective as saying "Muffy is popular" or " Biff is popular"
Most people have no idea they have been enslaved. How could they even know what freedom is?!? Most people don't even know the Fed, is not part of the govt. Hell, most people probably don't even know what the Fed's function is.
Granted, people are waking up, but they are no where NEAR, where we need them to be.
I hate to be a pessimist, or a realist, or whatever, but that phrase irks me for some reason. I think it comes from the lack of faith in the medicated, dumbed down, 6 hour a day TV watching, decadent, materialistic, public we are trying to reach, and the supposed representatives that are on the verge of seeing the business end of pitch forks, and torches.
The question should be....How do we MAKE freedom popular? We show our fellow citizens how they've been enslaved.
That is what many in the know are not getting from Ron Paul's message. He says we must get the word out to as many as possible.
Internet ( while we still have it) , micro radio stations, and guerrilla advertising (posters, signs etc.) are the way, not sitting here chatting about "guiding lights" and "gay" whatever. BE your OWN guiding light, and your OWN leader. quit waiting around for someone to lead you.
Once again, no disrespect intended.
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It's tough when you
genuinely care, I'm thinking Mike is saying that once freedom is understood it's popular. And I'm sure he realizes just like you the predicament that is ahead of us. Then again I'm not him. But I'd be willing to make a safe bet.
That is why it's a good thing for those of us who have a clue as to what is going on to keep our heads cool and calm.
Let the people who are trying to take our freedoms slip up.. not us.
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Maybe so...
Once one awakens, freedom is ESSENTIAL, not just popular. I asked for help in keeping a cool head, and I appreciate your input.
I just get so frustrated with these hypocrites, that talk about name calling when they call others "chicken shits", and others that think their info is so much more important than others they have to put their name in the title. They purposefully make attack threads, but then act like a monk, and talk about meditating and praying. I have to keep in mind that freedom means letting these types have their say as well.
I'd be willing to bet, a lot of these types haven't lifted a finger other than to pontificate on the internet.
I have had a rough day, and should not be on the DP. Thanks for the reminder. Hey, email me back, with phone so we can discuss the plans for the plan, regarding the plan. I have new info. Or, email me and I will give my toll free #.
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"Freedom is Popular"
Is one of Ron Paul's favorite sayings. When asked the reason behind his popularity and success, he often replies with "Freedom is Popular".
However I'm sure there are people on here who think they are much smarter that RP, so they would be quick to correct the good doctor in short order!
Good question
However, freedom without responsibility and wisdom could lead to chaos!
that's right!
it's the message not a party .....
ideas of liberty can not be stopped!
"guiding Light" ??
Are you some kind of soap opera fan?
The purpose of this site is Restoring Constitutional Government, not worshiping Ron Paul like a cult. Strange....
You talk about name calling, but you were quick to call me a "chicken shit" because I asked the purpose of your nosey militia thread.
You are another strange bird flying around this cage, that seems to like to come up with some dippy subject every week. Give it a rest already.
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Jefferson - Do two things
1. Read the following Daily Paul posting guidelines by MN:
Even though this site is not in any official way affiliated with Dr. Paul or any of his multiple organizations, by participating in this site you are still representing Dr. Paul in the eyes of the public. Please do not write anything that Dr. Paul himself would not say or would not approve of, or that would reflect poorly on Dr. Paul or his organizations. Dr. Paul is a compassionate, humble, honest, fair and kindhearted human. Follow Dr. Paul’s lead.
This site is a place to practice creating the kind of world you want live in with your words. On this site, please don’t use profanity or other disrespectful or divisive language.
2. Please feel free to not reply to any of my post in the future. I neither seek nor want any of your comments. I gave you a dose of your own medicine once before. You are the perfect example of one who has little to contribute to productive debate so you instinctively fall back to name calling or childish distractions. I bet the real Mr. Jefferson rolls his eyes every time you post under his name!
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/103433
Brilliant.
Your link is excellent. Thank you
Glad someone could appreciate it!
!
It infuriates me when,
someone on this forum says something that Ron Paul wouldn't say, or believes in an idea that Ron Paul wouldn't believe in. It is at these times that I am in danger of attacking someone. It is at these times when I must do better to stick to the facts.
Thanks for steering us away from the rocks.
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If it is communicated with tact and grace...
-that does make replying properly easier, but I have a hard time too sometimes.
Thank you for this post. wise words, Indeed.
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"Small minds discuss people.
Average minds discuss events.
Great minds discuss ideas."
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You know what would be a great idea.
Restoring Constitutional Government to the Original Document and Bill of Rights.
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Thanks Jon
Excellent and appropriate !
I like that quote a lot
but not enough to change my signature lines...
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I have two questions
First: what other web site does a better job of keeping the debate free from trolling and sh!t talk? I'm all over the internet and I'm not aware of any.
Second: why do you want to change the stated purpose of the DP from "restoring Constitutional gov't" to "Ron Paul's philosophy and ideas"? The current purpose would seem to give wide latitude to talk about any topic which has to do with gov't and/or liberty.
From the DP Posting Guidelines
1) Even though this site is not in any official way affiliated with Dr. Paul or any of his multiple organizations, by participating in this site you are still representing Dr. Paul in the eyes of the public. Please do not write anything that Dr. Paul himself would not say or would not approve of, or that would reflect poorly on Dr. Paul or his organizations. Dr. Paul is a compassionate, humble, honest, fair and kindhearted human. Follow Dr. Paul’s lead.
For a short introduction to what Dr. Paul is like, read this little article. This site is a place to practice creating the kind of world you want live in with your words. On this site, please don’t use profanity or other disrespectful or divisive language.
Yes, those're the guidelines
IMO guidelines are like general suggestions as opposed to rigid absolutes. It's always possible to parse out someone's words to mean something offensive or to find a narrow interpretation which isn't 100% in compliance with some set of rules. Even Michael must struggle with these issues and he's the guy that wrote the rules. He banned someone, forgave them, and then got stabbed in the back by the very same person. I'm sure at some point in the process he bent his own rules. Anyway, my original point is things aren't so bad here at the DP and we've got to take the bad with the good. Freedom means some people are going to push the limits. How the group responds says a lot about their confidence in their own ideas.
Well...
When you debate philosophies and ideas, personalities always become part the conversation. Our ideas and personal philosophies have a direct influence on our personalities. Dealing with "gay crap" and childish egos are part of a free society.
Watch Ron Paul, he is the master of not being diverted
or sucked into a side issue like personality. He simply ignores the distractions and stays focused on the issue at hand!
Yes,
and he is a politician. I am not. I can say what I think, and it is okay if I'm wrong sometimes. We have the luxury of being able to discuss side issues because we don't have to worry about sound bites. Besides, If all we talked about was ending the fed, people would not come here day in and day out. Ever go to the Campaign for Liberty site? It's boring I tell you. The other "crap" is what makes this place all the more interesting.