Wow: PG vs H1N1??
Wait. What?? Shut. Up. What? Seriously???
Hm...should I accept a poorly-tested, rushed and dangerous flu shot, or, vape harmless PG to kill off dangerous viruses and bacteria?
About two weeks ago, I tossed the old analog (traditional tobacco) cigarettes in favor of using a "digital" (e-cigarette) alternative. You'd think stopping a 19+ year-old smoking habit would be difficult, but the truth is, it wasn't only not difficult, it's been downright pleasurable, and far more satisfying that smoking cigs. I am now a full fledged vaper. A "vaper" is one who "vapes" the "vapor" of Personal Vaporizers aka PVs aka e-cigarettes, just as a "smoker" is one who "smokes" the "smoke" of analog cigarettes.
Now I've discovered that, as it turns out, I may be more protected from colds and flus than those who don't vape, thanks to the propylene glycol (PG) vapor of PVs. Check this out (emphases are mine):
But what [Dr. Robertson] did learn in his PG studies was that a vapor, not an aerosol or mist, was most effective at killing germs. "As the work progressed it was found that propylene glycol in vapor form was highly bactericidal, and that the marked and rapid germicidal action of propylene glycol aerosol was due to vapor liberated from the small glycol droplets. When pure vapor was employed, it was found to be more effective than an equal quantity of propylene glycol dispersed as an aerosol," his report says.
"Propylene glycol vapor was also found to exert a lethal or at least an inactivating effect on the virus of influenza," he added, as well as many even more serious germs.
Who was this guy? "A physician and naturalist, Oswald Hope Robertson worked at the Rockefeller Institute, the Peking Union Medical College, and at the medical school of University of Chicago (1927-1951). With a broad range of research interests, Robertson contributed important work on the transmission of pneumonia, the disinfection of air with glycol vapors, and later in his career, on the physiology and ecology of salmonid fishes. He is best remembered, however, as the creator of the first blood bank, established for use by British and American forces during the First World War.
The germ/virus killing effects of PG were known in the 40s, but they did not at the time have the technology for effective dispersal, so the matter was dropped and forgotten. The finding has not been revisited since then...until a fellow vaper happened upon the medical literature.
Just imagine the implications of this.
Read this entire thread, if you're interested (and if you're concerned about flu and the flu vaccine, then you should be interested). It's enthralling:
P.S. Yes, PG is available in Zero Nicotine strength; flavorless or in a cornucopia of flavors.
Ahhh marketing. I love it.
I heard that Pure Earth Weed Eliminator, available online at www.pureearthfarms.com prevents the common cold and makes hot tea for people on sundays.
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Bacteria or Virus
Not to be a party pooper but... Bacteria and viruses are two different things. Where does the article say PG kills viruses? Antibiotics will not stop the common cold. It is a virus.
Most things that kill viruses will also kill the host. Bleach is a good anti-viral but nobody would consider inhaling bleach to kill the flu virus.
propylene glycol is not a sugar but is an diol alcohol
It is a safe additive found in many foods and is even found in things like some massage lubricants ("warming effect").
It is not a skin irritant and it is not dangerous.
Smoking anything is not particularly good for the lungs.
PG metabolizes as a sugar
http://www.propylene-glycol.com/faq.html#5
"What happens with propylene glycol in the body?
In the body, under conditions of normal low exposure, propylene glycol is quickly metabolised and excreted. Its metabolic pathway is comparable to that of sugar: propylene glycol is rapidly converted into lactic acid, just like what happens with the sugar (energy) in the muscles when being exercised during sports. The lactic acid is then excreted via the urine."
And consider this information:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2009/nov/06/nanoparticles-...
The other link included a comment about PG increasing the susceptibility to carcinogens. I just don't use "personal care" products, I make cleansers of herbs, and food. Vinegar, lemon juice, baking soda, etc.
Truth exists, and it deserves to be cherished.
Honestly, for someone who is
Honestly, for someone who is a smoker, it's a question of whether you would rather metabolize PG or VG (vegetable glycerin, the other kind of bonding agent for an e-cig, which I use) or deal with the thousands of chemicals in cigarettes, including known carcinogens. I've been on an e-cig for a week. I could breath again after just a few days. I no longer woke up and coughed up brown stuff. I'm going to the doctor to see if my blood pressure got better (the week before I got them I was told for the first time that it was starting to be a problem). To top it off, I no longer smell like an ash tray, don't have to go outside every hour, and the cost is much less than cigs in the US (here its about the same). When a person uses an e-cig they aren't "smoking" anything, nothing burns. For people that become downright evil when they try to quit, like me, e-cigs dramatically reduce the health problems while cutting costs and keeping us from killing a bunch of people. If I can keep "smoking" by reducing my health risks I’ll do it.
____________________________________________________
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
Lesser of 2 evils? ;)
Sometimes it is the best we mere mortals can muster!
Cheers for kicking the Tobacco Industry bloodsuckers out of your habit, at least!
Truth exists, and it deserves to be cherished.
I found the same results
I found the same results when I switched to all natural tobacco and started rolling my own. I went through three days of withdrawal from the chemicals in prepackaged cigs. Then after that my breathing came easier, my loved ones said I no longer smell like an ashtray, and they have no problem with the smell of the tobacco burning either. Its the crap they put into the tobacco that will kill you.
Blessings )o(
Blessings )o(
Folks may want to check this out - is PG DANGEROUS?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=busI57n-EQc
I have NOT checked the facts, and I note the video starts with a lovely Isis eye logo... but smoking sugar does not sound good (and I am pretty sure the "G" is a sugar) and if this guy is right, they may be trying to switch you from one poison to another.
I DID find this about PG:
"The Material Safety Data Sheet warns users to avoid skin contact with propylene glycol as this strong skin irritant can cause liver abnormalities and kidney damage."
http://www.natural-health-information-centre.com/propylene-g...
I don't think I want that on my throat and lungs.
I quit smoking after 27 years. A critical element for me was the realization that every dime I spent on cigarettes was lining the pocket of evil men who were deliberately trying to kill me - and that was before I "woke up."
And I am not trying to be "negative" - I am trying to keep my friends healthy.
Truth exists, and it deserves to be cherished.
Thanks for this thread. I
Thanks for this thread. I ordered a starter kit of 510's and fluid from cignot last night.
____________________________________________________
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
I've had my e-cig for a
I've had my e-cig for a week. I can't recommend it highly enough to anyone who wants to quit smoking. I've only had 6 cigs since I got it and that was because they were left in the pack and didn't want them to go to waste.
The original poster recommend cignot.com. I can second that. They have good prices and great service.
Seriously, if you smoke, check these things out. It saves tons of money (a carton worth is roughly $10), is far healthier, there is no smell, you can choose your flavors and you can do it pretty much anywhere.
____________________________________________________
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
only time will tell what this will do to you
I'll wait and get a report from you about it in 6 months. If you still have vocal chords and can walk, maybe I'll give it a try
That's the ticket!
That's the ticket! ;-)
____________________________________________________
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
"Freedom suppressed and again regained bites with keener fangs than freedom never endangered." -- Cicero
Dunno...
I just don't see trading off the physical component of a bad habit and keeping the habit itself to be a win.
Let me help... just don't put that in your mouth anymore.
Do you own you, or does your body?
Vitamin D will pretty much take care of any flu issues... get out in the sun.
:)
~Live life to its fullest, with an open heart, open arms and most important... an open mind~
Hi Devon
Long time no see.
My purpose of posting this topic was *not* to instigate a debate of smoking vs. vaping. I've already made my own decision for myself on that issue, and responded to one person's question about that topic in the midst of this discussion.
The purpose of this thread, in case it wasn't clear in the OP, is simply to introduce the discovery that PG serves as an effective agent against bacteria and viruses; one of those surprising "whoduhthunkit" kind of findings.
I had thought that news of a cheap, easily obtainable, and reliably successful agent to fight against nasty diseases would be a helpful thing to submit here; not as a panacea to trump other approaches, but as another arrow in the quiver of protections. Not sure whether anyone is reading any of the links I have provided, or whether protestations are coming without benefit of such study, but regardless, there seems to be a nice truckload of Not Welcome on the topic. Clearly, I misjudged the temperature here. Seems the DP Knowledge Base is already chock full of all the information it can hold. Perhaps another forum would be more interested in the content.
No worries. Hope all's well with you.
The negativity level at the DP
is astounding sometimes. Thanks for the post. I am going to check it out before I make stupid remarks. Don't take anything said personally, it is typical. Every single thread gets turned on its . . . head around here. I think it might be an attempt to fold the DP. I appreciate you caring enough to spend your time informing us of something you have found beneficial. I hope others will continue to do so. God knows, the msm won't do much to help the people, besides we don't watch any more, government is out to eliminate us, can't trust anything they say, so every little bit helps.
Nothing like huffing anti-freeze
Propylene Glycol is used in flavorings, & anti-freeze but it is NOT a naturally occurring molecule.
If you want to know if something is bad/good for you, then see if it occurs naturally. If it does occur naturally, then in most cases there is probably an enzyme to degrade it in your body.
This is not always true, but works most the time.
That said I would avoid Propylene Glycol.
http://www.umass.edu/tei/wrrc/WRRC2004/pdf/no.174.pdf
MSDS
http://www.sciencelab.com/xMSDS-Propylene_glycol-9927239
Chlorine Gas kills bacteria too, but you wouldn't want to start inhaling it just because of its anti-microbial properties.
____
"Take hold of the future or the future will take hold of you." -- Patrick Dixon
I think
the stuff in anti freeze is ethylene glycol. It's kill you.
Fear mongering.
.
*sigh* PG is not anti-freeze
You may as well have referred to water, and said, Nothing like drinking anti-freeze. Both water and PG are in anti-freeze.
Propylene glycol is _an_ ingredient in anti-freeze to make anti-freeze *safer* -- see the Wikipedia entry on propylene glycol:
Still, I wouldn't advise chugging anti-freeze as your beverage of choice.
RV owners put stuff in their freshwater holding tanks to keep the drinking water from freezing -- from what I've read, that jug of non-toxic stuff is PG.
I have not claimed that PG is the purest and most natural thing on God's green earth. Further, I am not suggesting that this is the best defense against illnesses. I *am* sharing news that studies are showing that PG is: 1) an inexpensive, 2) easily obtainable, and 3) very effective agent against colds and flus.
And, I strongly suspect, not as debilitating as Tamiflu or other Big Pharma "solutions" to H1N1 and other bacterial/viral concerns.
I'll be sure to take Chlorine Gas off my list of Things I Plan To Inhale. Right after I finish drinking this jug of anti-freeze.
RV use is for winterizing
Then you must flush it out thoroughly before adding drinking water. You don't put it in the water and drink it!
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(Don't own an RV)
That's why I mentioned I had read about it. But I doubt RV manufacturers would recommend using an agent to winterize a drinking water holding tank, even with thorough rinsing, that is known to be deadly toxic.
You might check out the findings of the New Zealand Study on PG...or, you know, not.
Again, I'm not putting forth this information as the Grand Poobah Ambassador of PG. I figure, any information out there that might point to protection against nasty bugs is good information to find out about, particularly when faced with such threatening tactics as forced vaccination.
Everyone is free to ignore this post, or conduct further research on their own, if interested.
Since you've been particularly vocal on this topic, sharpsteve, I assume you have personal knowledge of PG you'd like to share? Some deep research you've delved into, backed with references, such as I have provided? If so, I would (earnestly) welcome them. I have no investment in "being right" about the topic; I seek only truth and accuracy. And from the two months that I personally have been looking into the subject, the PG barometer falls squarely on the side of "safe."
But, unlike the government, I'm not forcing anyone to ingest anything against their will, nor am I forcibly keeping anyone from putting what they want into their bodies. You grown-ups are free to choose for yourselves.
Which is a belief all of us here hold in common.
Is Propylene glycol safe?
I have heard and read different opinions on this but suggest you research possible dangers to your health from PG.
____________________________________________
The Federal Reserve, Stealing the American Dream since 1913
My News Twitter http://twitter.com/sharpsteve
My YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/sharpsteve2003
I Vote Ron Paul!
My News Twitter http://twitter.com/sharpsteve
My YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/sharpsteve2003
An excellent question
...and one I wondered, myself, too, which is why I researched it.
Some people are, in fact, allergic to PG, just as some people are allergic to peanuts -- it doesn't mean the substance itself is bad; just that some are sensitive to it for one reason or another.
Aside from that? PG is used as the suspension carrier to administer medicines via atomizers and inhalers. Not that this carries a whole lot of weight for confidence in and of itself, but it is FDA-approved. It has been used for decades in cosmetics, foods, baby products, a whole range of goods, without ill effects.
If you're interested in an in-depth discussion on the topic, both pro and con, read Re: Propylene gycol inhaling? -- do read all of it, not just the first couple of pages, lest you see a one-sided conversation.
It's a killer!!!
..of bacteria and viruses, that is. More info:
Read more: Medicine: Air Germicide (Time.com article)
And, according to the world's leading e-smoking researcher, Dr. Murray Laugesen of New Zealand, there is also some evidence pointing to the possibility of PG vapers actually helping to protect those standing nearby via 2nd-hand vapor. However, it is unlikely that bystanders would be exposed to a sufficient amount of PG to be very effective; still, instead of fearing smokers' exhalations, folks might actually benefit from the exhalations of vapers. This is blowing my mind.
They said Fluoride was Good Too
____________________________________________
The Federal Reserve, Stealing the American Dream since 1913
My News Twitter http://twitter.com/sharpsteve
My YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/sharpsteve2003
I Vote Ron Paul!
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My YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/sharpsteve2003
They say the H1N1 vaccine is safe, too
But this PG information isn't coming from "them."
Not for smokers only!
Now, personally, I would not normally recommend vaping to people who don't already smoke.
- that being said -- Non-smokers, please note! -
I suspect that if one were to put PG into a room vaporizer, that would serve the same purpose as vaping, albeit in a less-direct manner than personally inhaling the stuff. No idea as to what PG might do to a room vaporizer; however, I have used essential oils in room vaporizers before without any trouble (as long as I cleaned it out each morning). I suspect PG would be much easier on vaporizing units, but I have never tried it before, and I am not a mechanic, and YMMV -- word.
As far as PV companies go, hands down the best IMHO is Cignot.com -- super (I mean super) fast shipping, friendly, very helpful, and their 510 no-box kit rocks the industry for best price of a great quality dual-unit e-cig. Tell 'em FanOfWalt sent you. :) (No, I don't get any commission!)
Aside: I did not start using PVs to quit smoking, but to enjoy a "cig" in more places and circumstances. But I found myself enjoying my PV so much, and being so completely satisfied from them, that from my very first vape, I haven't felt the desire to pick up an analog. I've got packs of ciggies sitting around the house, gathering dust. Not even tempted. And I wasn't trying to quit. Yes, it is that easy.
what the heck are you
what the heck are you talking about? E-cigarette?
Yep. E-cigs = Personal Vaporizers = PVs
For the uninitiated, here's a primer: The Wonderful World of Vaping: An Illustrated Guide to E-Cigs
(I was one of the "uninitiated" myself just two months ago...I've been on quite the learning curve. Zooom!)
What is your particular
What is your particular brand? Been thinking of trying it but haven't located anyone happy enough with theirs to convince me it's better than another.
.
Trust in God, but tie your camel tight.
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Trust in God, but tie your camel tight.
"Socialism needs two legs on which to stand; a right and a left. While appearing to be in complete opposition to one another,they both march in the same direction." - Paul Proctor