Neo Con Policy: Idiotic or Evil?
Submitted by Hard Work on Fri, 12/07/2007 - 10:46Ok, I have a big issue. One of the main hurdles I have faced in stumping for Paul is overcoming the war issue. For some reason, a good number of otherwise sane people seem to trust Bush and the neo con policies we have suffered through over the past number of years. They seem to buy the line that fighting "over there" will keep us from having to fight "over here". It really boggles my mind.
Anyway, I have one MAJOR issue with this line of reasoning (among many overall issues), but that is: why ON EARTH would you have a concurrent policy of aggressive overseas war and OPEN BORDERS at home while the war is still being fought?!?
How do people not speak up about this more? Do people really think it is safe to the American people to be out waging wars, but meanwhile have very low security here at home?
Our border, especially to the south, but even to the north, is pretty much a sieve. What would stop our enemies from gradually allowing thousands of sleeper fighters to sneak into the country through latin America or even via Canada into the U.S.?
What if this happened on a large scale and numerous attacks were coordinated and set up on the American people? Why do we have to be overseas fighting aggressive wars, supposedly to defend ourselves, but meanwhile leave the back door wide open for the American people to be brutally attacked RIGHT HERE AT HOME??!
I just don't get it and it needs to be brought up MUCH MORE OFTEN!
If we MUST fight this "War on Terror", at least can we utilize sound strategy to actually DEFEND THE AMERICAN PEOPLE??!
In relation to defending the American people, securing Iraq is about item number 1000 on the list of key things we must do.
I fear waging aggressive wars overseas, while at the same time leaving our own borders wide open, is a recipe for potential disaster.
Is it supreme idiocy or blatant disregard for the true safety of the American people that drives this policy?
I hate having to ask this question, but with the facts being what they are, I simply must. The diligence, integrity, wisdom and honesty of our current leadership is in serious question.
Sincerely,
Kemp
www.ponderthis.net
















National Security
is one of the prime concerns of the Neoconservatives - only problem is, it's not the US who's national scurity they are interested in ... it's Israel's. That is a delicate subject that most in the media choose to ignore, but it's true. However, Israel security is not the only reason the US is meddling in the Middle East - there's the oil, and other factors.
Everyone knows about the oil, although most assume the US wants to steal it - actually, the prime concern is to control production to keep the price up. Either way, it's all getting privatized as we speak. The "other factors" are not so widely discussed. Iran just stopped accepting dollars for it's oil. Saddam Hussein tried to do the same thing and got clobbered. (One of the things that keeps the dollar, un-backed by anything, high, is that the whole world uses it to purchase oil, as per policy that was set up by OPEC in the early 70's.) Then there's the matter of central banking - you know, the Federal Reserve "type". Economies the world over are manipulated in the same ways, as the owners of these banks collect interest on the currency they print - except in certain "rogue" states which have resisted this trend. Afghanistan and Iraq now have western controlled central banks. Iran, which does not, is next on the list.
Essentially, there several reasons why these counties have been targeted, the big three are oil, Israeli security, and central banking, which semi-coincidentally converge on a specific geographical area - sort of like a perfect storm.
It becomes easy to see why the neocons would spearhead the push to wage these wars, when you notice that all of their prominent leaders are members of the Council on Foreign Relations. Heck, Cheney was a director for a time. The CFR was set up by the same men that set up the Federal Reserve system, and the Rockefeller family, who lead the the CFR, made their fortunes in OIL. Once you connect the Fed and the CFR to their actual roots, the Rothschild family and the Bank of England, you can begin to connect more of the dots ... even to Israel.
My little analysis is simplistic, I will admit, but there is a plan. Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Syria, North Korea ... one by one. This "long war" will destroy America's economy, but I suspect that is part of the plan as well. On a side note, there won't be enough US troops or political will to take on North Korea, I suspect this is why there currently is a campaign in Japan to change the constitution to allow the offensive use of their military.
Great post!
Truthfully said:
Everyone knows [the war is] about the oil, although most assume the US wants to steal it - actually, the prime concern is to control production to keep the price up.
The nation of Iraq was created at the early part of the last century to prevent the oil from being extracted, i.e., to keep the supply down and prices up. Iraq was created by artificially combining the 3 dominant tribes.
http://www.truthout.org/cgi-bin/artman/exec/view.cgi/61/20480
Why
Train sleepers to fly airplains but not land them? Just teach them to speak Spanish and emulate Latin culture and they can get in here no problem.
why can't it be both?
humans will devolve into non existence without cultural integrity maintained.
Point out the Domino Theory.
We have to fight the commies in Vietnam or we will have to fight them in the streets of the good old U.S.A. Same rhetoric. Different war. If the war on terrorism is true, then why does the U.S. federal govt. leave the border open? We could close the borders, at least try, but we don't.
I hope Im...
wrong on this. It has come to light with me in the past 4 years that the neoCons do not want to close the borders of this country. The plan is to merge the USA with Mexico and Canada. This most likely will happen when the dollar is about to tank.( already at 47c ) Americans will be screaming for a currency that will hold its value with competing world currencies. ( people will be starving ) It will be a currency that can be used in all three countries. It would be easier to acomplish this with open borders. ( 20 million illegals ) what better way to introduce the NAU? We will have to fight to save this country from these treason leeches who infect our high offices. Any elected official takes an oath. This oath is to uphold the Constitution, anything short of that and its TREASON. Remember that.
Yes, and the penalty for
Yes, and the penalty for treason is death. And of course the government isn't going to do that to itself, so that means it would be up to us.
You're at the right place,
You're at the right place, buddy. I don't think I've seen one guy here who agrees with Bush.
the borders
Assuming that one must take seriously mere imaginary lines slammed down on the ground by armed force, with the consent of no one living then or ever since: why not just annex Canada and Mexico? Then the northern borders vanish and the southern one shrinks by 80%.
What's not to like?
Or best of all: just abolish them globally, as United Europe is doing locally. They're all in our heads, essentially as a shared mass delusion that one square foot of ground is somehow different from the one right next to it. Who needs them anyway?
Borders can keep people IN, too
I often wonder what the East Germans told their people about The Wall. At any rate, I can see the day when those attempting to leave The Land of The Free and The Home of the Brave will get the FMACC (Federally Mandated Anal Cavity Check), a quick screening to see if they Owe any Child Support, Federal, State, Local Taxes, Condo Dues, Have failed to pay any fines or have any overdue library books.
Sounds like a vote for the
Sounds like a vote for the NAU.
Look, I'm not a knuckle-dragger like some other people who believe in border enforcement. If and when the little green men land and start making threats, I'll be willing to consider a world government. Until then, I'll keep government as local as possible, thankyouverymuch.
If government is a necessary evil, I want those in power to have to deal with the consequences of what they impose on me. "Wild" humans lived in bands of ~30 individuals of mostly extended family. On such a small scale, socialist ideas make sense. I'm not too bothered by giving over a little individual freedom to such a group, because we're all in this together.
But "we" as Americans are not "all in this together," no matter how much they want you to feel that way as you salute the flag. People on the other side of the country know nothing about me, and they don't much care about my local concerns. Now extend that to Mexico; Canada; South America; Europe; Asia....
Keep government small and localized, and you will keep it sane. Borders matter. I'd prefer even stronger enforcement of borders between the states. It used to be that way. The U.S. was designed as a federation of sovereign states, like pre-unionized Europe was. That all got flipped upside down after the Civil War, and we've been on a road to world government ever since.
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F**** YOU TATCOV
You must be a complete assine idiot or a troll. Which one is it? Men and women have died for this country and its borders! You are a disgrace and a traitor. Your day will come.
You're fighting nature,
You're fighting nature, dude. It's nature of almost all creatures to have their area, that only their group belongs to. Except humans are so big and all over the place, we create countries. Realistically, we need enforced borders as anyone can just come right the fuck over. And with the current hatred America has in the world, I wouldn't doubt if they're already here.
Don't worry!
I'm from the Government and I'm here to help. We will take good care of you! We will tell you what school to send your kids to, what kind of car to buy, what you can eat and how much, what websites you can visit, and who you will have to fight and the reason ( always freedom!). Now be a good slav...uh...citizen and go back to work. Do your civic duty and pay your taxes!
Shep
Shep
SIMPLE WAR ON TERROR OR FOR OIL
Its not up to us to sell you anything ,its not up to Dr Paul to convence you. I trust that you are an honest carring individual in search of answers. You have to follow our feelings don't look to others ,thats what has made sane people insane all thru history. When you step behind that curtain and you think about your life, that of your child , grandchild ,a freind being left on a battle field somewhere ask yourself is it for the good of big oil or for a good cause. Big oil is not going to greive believe me . If i make a sacrific like that,,,,,,,It will not be for a President that has lied to me and other patriots in the name of oil. Every canidate that belongs to the CFR or has sold their soul to the bilderburg group will continue this war.
If voting could really change things,
it would be illegal. Here is hoping for change!
Invested in "success"
Rush Limbaugh often talks about how the left is "invested" in defeat in Iraq. His reasoning is that if they are wrong and we are "successful" in Iraq, then they will lose elections. They are invested in defeat.
However, the neo-cons are invested in "success" (I'll explain my scare quotes in a minute). They won't admit it, but if we pull out of Iraq, it means they were wrong, and they won't be able to get elected with this policy in the future. As much as politicians flip-flop, they hate looking inconsistent. That, and some of them are really convinced of the threat of "Islamo-fascism", and others are war-profiteers.
However, neither side, except ours (the "old right", the libertarians, etc.), understands that there is nothing to win OR lose in Iraq. We already "won" - we toppled Saddam. We should have brought our troops home when Bush flew in and said "Mission Accomplished". This is how Republicans USED to be pre-2000.
I even remember and use Rush's quote from the 90's, when he was arguing against Clinton's "missions" in Somalia and Bosnia. He said, (paraphrasing) "The US military are not peacekeepers. They are not police. Their job is to kill people and break things - that's what they are trained to do."
The cognitive dissonance that has resulted with the right astounds me. It's like everyone is having collective amnesia. And as a result, we are LESS SAFE, and at an expense so great it will ruin us. Just like EVERY other empire in history.
How do we
get them to finally swallow their pride and accept that the continued strategy is the one that is dangerous to our lives here at home? In many respects, I think these people are cowards who tremble in fright - how do we get them to see that their policy is actually more dangerous?
_________________________________
Freedom - Peace - Prosperity
The fiscal problem is a good
The fiscal problem is a good start. "Even if you're right, we can't afford it." Also, hitting home the fact that we already "won", and that what we are doing now is nation building, not fighting a war.
As a good friend once told me
Freedom is not FREE!!
It's always about the MONEY!!!!!!
When in doubt, it's all about the Money!!!
Freedom is not FREE!!
I agree
Follow the "paper" trail...
_________________________________
Freedom - Peace - Prosperity
You are correct!
The 2nd amendment was created to ensure we are not attacked from outside....but....we decided to elect people who kinda gave that one up to be on the "safe" side.
'Dere go 'dem rights! And 'dey ain't comin' back!!!
Shep
Shep
Here's the answer I use to
Here's the answer I use to the "We fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over here" assertion: Ever heard of home field advantage? Why would we prefer fighting them on their own turf to fighting them here? The Iraqis have, since the war began, killed thousands of us and maimed tens of thousands more, and that doesn't even take into account the incredible costs of fighting an overseas conflict. Why not let a foreign power absorb these costs and let them come here where we have our army, navy, marines, and air force waiting for them? If they are willing to die for their cause, let THE ENEMY put in the effort of organizing a campaign that has to be held 10,000 miles away and let THEM bankrupt THEIR country. And just where ARE these "terrorists" that we're fighting over there so we don't have to right them here, anyway? The people that we are bombing and shooting are people hanging out in their homes and places of business and not planning a dang thing. Whether the saturation bombing of Baghdad killed one single terrorist has yet to be determined, but we DO know that for every single person killed or maimed in our attacks, there is a husband, father, mother, aunt, uncle, and so on who now hate their family's killers more than you can even imagine. And who can blame them?
www.paulforronpaul.com
Sorry for the spelling errors
Here's how it will go....America fights war on terror, Government/Congress does nothing to secure homeland, America eventually comes under attack because of this, Government steps in to protect country, civil liberties are restricted in the name of "freedom", Government is given more power, international government sold to Americans as best way to prevent further attacks, America loses its soveriegnty...and the people actually support it to be safe. Study history on how tyrants enslave their people.
Shep
Shep
One, it's the media that let's this boneheaded strategy go on...
The obvious culprit is the multi-national corporations. They are the profiteers, if you put it all together, these corporations are the number one threat to this country, hands down. They are the one's profiting from the immigration policy, the trade policy, the foriegn policy, etc... and they are the one's using our own federal government against us when it comes to regulations. Just ask yourself why millions of lead poisoned toys continue to flow into this country...anyone with a brain would immediatly halt something that could harm millions of children...but not our government!
They listen to the money!
Mike
Who is Ron Paul? I am Ron Paul! We are Ron Paul!
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Mike
"Fire Team for Freedom"
visit www.mikeandjake.com
Yes
"Evil or Idiotic?"
What can't it be both?
Viva Agora!
LehrBoy
West of 89
a novel of another america
https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/161155#longdescr
Bush/Cheney WANTS a terror attack here
I agree totally with your point. What we must remember is the Bush and Cheney would be delighted if there were a real terrorist attack in the States because it would allow them more power.
Besides, they will tell us they can't afford to defend our borders because all our troops are overseas, defending the rest of the world.
And where are the Democrats on this issue? Well, we know where their heads are...
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Restore the Republic 2012!
I don't think they want one by way of the Mexican Border
.
I truly hope this is not true
But I am afraid it may be hard to argue against you, given the evidence.
_________________________________
Freedom - Peace - Prosperity
a little from coumn A, a little from column B....
Yes, the policy makes no sense. Even more....we are taking border patrol people away from the Mexican American border and sending them to Iraq! All the while the government and the media hate the brave minute men who are trying to be loyal to America....its disgusting.
It is part of the White House agenda. More people are coming over now more than ever, trying to escape the police state in Mexico. It is because Bush WANTS immigration and amnesty, he wants to ERASE the borders. The reason being his puppeteers want to eventually merge the US, Canada, and Mexico. It won't happen tomorrow, but their plan is to do it incrementally over time so no one complains. And of course not a word from the mainstream media.....
I'd say most politicians are just selfish idiots. But the people at the top, the people even above Bush, the bankers and the top ceo's of certain corporations, they are delusional, but I don't know if they are evil. Certainly, evil will be perpetrated by them if they are not stopped, but I'd say they are more ignorant than anything else.
"Truth is treason in the empire of lies." - Ron Paul
Relief of Constitutional Rights
It is VERY easy to convince a free people to give up their rights in defense of foriegn attack. An open border and aggresive foriegn policy almost garauntees this will happen. Kiss your freedoms goodbye when it does.
Shep
Shep