How can "Christians" support these wars?
Eye for an Eye is old testament stuff. Thus, if a Jewish person wanted to return violence with violence... they would NOT be hypocrites. However, I have a real problem understanding how ANY "CHRISTIAN"... ya know... PRINCE OF PEACE... turn the other cheek... love thy neighbor... can support these wars. There was NEVER an imminent threat... the only evidence was brought forth and investigated by GOVERNMENT... which of course is run by Satan... Wasn't it Satan that offered Jesus anything on Earth?
Maybe I am off base here... and not to up to date on my Bible quotes... Is there ANY where in the Bible that relates to the question? Did Jesus say anything close to the ole, "get em over there before they get you here." and "sacrifice your kids for your government" and "be in fear and give up all your free will to your GOVERNMENT".
anyone?





















PRO LIFE ≠ PRO WAR
CATHOLIC ≠ CHRISTIAN
the DARK AGES & CRUSADES are credited to PAGAN ROMANISM disguised to persecute true Christianity (the followers of Jesus Christ & his words.. Blessed be the peacemakers)
The UNITED NATIONS was created by the CATHOLIC JESUITS to persecute the BIBLICAL CHRISTIANS
Revelation - Chapter 17
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Rev&c=17&v=1&t=KJ...
Have you ever wondered why all of the major media talking heads are Catholic, and why they are pushing the wars and the One World Agenda?
Did you know POPE = ANTI-CHRIST (Vicar of Christ)
Forget The Press, Watch Meet The Truth
http://MeetTheTruth.com <<|
It's Easy....
they have a blood fixation/psychosis.
Drop by a church sometime you might get lucky and hear them doing their little primitive cult chant over and over. "The Blood~The Blood~The Blood~The Blood~The Blood~"
All this nonsense over a mythological being...funny
See:
http://www.caesarsmessiah.com/
http://www.dailypaul.com/152976/diebold-vs-paper-ballots
http://www.ncel.w4sp.com/
http://www.blackboxvoting.org/
http://www.votefraud.org/
http://www.hulu.com/hacking-democracy
Not all Christians
adhere to this "blood fixation."
See post below on dispensationalism as to the ones that do.
My Christian/Political Blog:
We the Serfs! Blog
And There You Are Doug Digger...
"Gary Bauer and other dispensationalist would like to expedite the "end of times."
The Hoax Of Christianity Has The Possibility To Destroy Every Last One Of You Unless You Wake Up To The FACT That Jesus Never Existed.
http://www.caesarsmessiah.com/
http://www.dailypaul.com/152976/diebold-vs-paper-ballots
http://www.ncel.w4sp.com/
http://www.blackboxvoting.org/
http://www.votefraud.org/
http://www.hulu.com/hacking-democracy
Yes...
I wrote that Gary Bauer and his ilk are dispensationalists. They are not true Christians and they need to be exposed. That's what I did.
My Christian/Political Blog:
We the Serfs! Blog
In the 300's "Christians" sold out.
Before they were the persecuted, then became part of the establishment that persecuted others.
The "Just War' concept was created to allow "Christians" to violate the teaching of Jesus.
Of those who today call themselves "Christian", those closest to the teaching of Jesus are of the Anabaptist tradition(not Baptist) like the Amish.
Many Americans can't distinguish any difference between being a patriot and a good "Christian". In the church Caesar's flag is displayed,the Pledge of Allegiance recited, and the Battle Hymn of the Republic sung. They've long forgotten their roots.
There must have been many Germans in the 1930's who believed being a good "Christian" and a good patriotic German were consistent and desirable.
so what you are saying is Ron
so what you are saying is Ron Paul is wrong on the Christian just war concept? So Christians should just let themselves be slaughtered is what you are saying?
also Christians were persecuted immedietly after the death of Jesus. No ceasars flag is in my church.
“Defiance of God’s Law will eventually bring havoc to a society.” - Dr. Ron Paul
Don't know Ron Paul's position on "Just War".
Why would anyone claim to be a follower of Jesus and violate what he taught? Who decides what a "Just War" is? A priest or minister? George W Bush? Which wars in American history were "just"?
As was once said in a Christian work, try to be perfect, but if you can't do the best you can. Those who call themselves "Christian" who volunteer and go half way around the world to kill aren't doing the best they can. They can't even claim self defense. They're, at best, unwitting pawns of the state.
Once we reject the idea that a relationship with God is corporate, the church and clergy and the corruption they bring falls away. All "Christianity" is local. It's about each in his/her daily life. JMO
Ron Paul on Just War Theory
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93HVpT4TjSw
My Christian/Political Blog:
We the Serfs! Blog
So Christians should just let themselves be slaughtered...
"So Christians should just let themselves be slaughtered is what you are saying?"
Hope someone can answer that. I don't understand what's allowed so I'm stuck.
I understand defensively you're allowed to fight from thieves... but the govt. you're supposed to let them come and get you. You can run and hide, but you're not supposed to turn yourself in, let them come get you. Then, don't fight. Don't even prepare a defense. If the sentence is death, so be it.
I just don't get it. Seems all we're called to do after arming yourself with the spiritual armor is... stand...?
Just War Theory
Our Constitution says that war needs to be declared. Congress abdicates their duty and should be held accountable when they pass that power onto the President (Korea, Vietnam, Iraq).
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Just War Theory
The strict conditions for legitimate defense by military force require rigorous consideration. The gravity of such a decision makes it subject to rigorous conditions of moral legitimacy. At one and the same time:
* the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;
* all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;
* there must be serious prospects of success;
* the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. The power of modern means of destruction weighs very heavily in evaluating this condition.
These are the traditional elements enumerated in what is called the "just war" doctrine. The evaluation of these conditions for moral legitimacy belongs to the prudential judgment of those who have responsibility for the common good.
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Congress has failed us... whether Christian or not...
My Christian/Political Blog:
We the Serfs! Blog
Because they don't even know
Because they don't even know what thier own book they claim to revere says much less understand it. They are filled with dogma preached over the pulpit to keep them in line and keep them paying all those tithes. Most of thier churches are corporations so the state is thier God anyway and they feel like as long as they attend these churches regularly and adhere to the dogma they have thier ticket to heaven where they can all sit around playing harps and rail on the so called bad people that were all destroyed so they would be justified in thier hatred.
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End The Fat
70 pounds lost and counting! Get in shape for the revolution!
Get Prepared!
This is what Christ said
the most important message in all of the Holy Scriptures:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDCbJ4vnMNg
Mathew 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
Some good question
First you need understand there is a difference between personal and civic life.
I can deny revenge or justice for myself but I can not deny that to you.
An eye for an eye is not a vengeful Old Testament think. It is a limit put on revenge. It is not a command that if you remove my eye I must remove your eye. It is a limit put on revenge. It says if you remove my eye the MOST I can do it remove yours. I would be breaking the law if I got angry and removed both your eyes. As you can see the wars we are now fighting far go beyond what was done to us on 9/11
Also,
eye for an eye was a step away from revenge, because the previous standard was that if you take a person's eye, he might kill you or your family.
Dispensationalism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispensationalism
"Dispensationalism rejects the notion of supersessionism, sees the Jewish people as the true people of God, and sees the modern State of Israel as identical to the Israel of the Bible."
-----------
I've emailed back and forth with a former Presidential candidate, Gary Bauer, who runs a Christian website "Our American Values."
I started off by challenging his attitude of hate;
Hi Gary,
One question... Do you hate the radical Muslims you mention (Al Qaeda, Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah and Hamas); or do you love them as God has commanded?
Doug Eberhardt
--
I want them dead before they kill more Americans—what do you want?
-Gary
-- I asked him for Bible verses that back up this hatred.
To which he replied:
"After you have read a book or two on the Christian basis for “just war,” I’ll answer your question. What Biblical basis do you have to allow evil men to live so they can kill more innocents?"
-Gary
--
Gary,
Answering my question with another question is not an appropriate response. Again, "which verse or verses in the Bible do you base this statement on?"
It's a simple question and I'm sure you, as a Christian, know that the answers come from one Book, The Bible.
Doug Eberhardt
-- To which Bauer replied;
Doug, you are in no position to instruct me on either theology or what is an appropriate response to a question. Our conversation is over.
-- To which I closed by saying;
Gary,
You're right. But the Bible does and you refuse to utilize it to justify your statement.
----
Gary Bauer is part of the think tank "Project for a New America Century" that advised the Bush administration on foreign policy leading to the attack of Iraq, and is also part of the organization Christians United for Israel (CUFI).
Gary Bauer and other dispensationalist would like to expedite the "end of times."
Ron Paul's take on Israel is to stop funding them. He also says we give more to Arab nations than we do Israel. Of course the dispensationalist like Bauer, Frum and Horowitz, among many other in the media, don't like Paul's solutions to withhold funding.
“Blessed are the Peacemakers.” Matthew 5:9
My Christian/Political Blog:
We the Serfs! Blog
wow, that man (Bauer) just 'hung' himself . . .
theologically--
*shaking my head*
it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--
I don't know, and it troubles me . . .
I 'profess' to be a Christian, but I try to talk less about it and 'do' it more--
I do know other Christians who are pro-life completely, including being anti-war. I know there are some who would disclaim and say that there is such a thing as 'righteous' war or declared war, etc. Well, that's a personal thing, I believe; I, frankly, would rather be killed than kill. Just me. I believe that God will protect me if He wants me alive--
but I am surrounded, also, and alas, by "Christians" who believe in . . . some bizarre thing that I find incomprehensible and have for decades--
this notion that peace or 'democracy' can be enforced; these people are deluded--but they are sincere; sincerity doesn't make 'right'--
also, hijack.
Christianity has been hijacked time and time again since shortly after Jesus Christ ascended into heaven--
and there are a LOT of people who sound pretty 'nice' who are nasty stinkers--
mentioned by someone on here--the Zionist Christians--very, very scary people--
it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--
agree with you completely
agree with you completely 1988...
although just for clarification....I would never deny that I am a christian ....and only bring it up on here to help someone see which direction I am coming from.....
"and the truth shall make you free"
John 8:32
Eat some smarties
If God, Christ & the Bible are so wrong , why does satan try to mimic God's every move ? Why does satan use God's plan to become anti- christ ?
You are speaking like 666..You have already been had.
Religion & Christian are not the same.The mind of God has been revealed in HIS book & by His Spirit.
I've been had...?
... do tell.. do tell...
Does my burka make my butt look fatwa?
You are right
666 stands for the:
Six Seals
Six Vials
Six Trumpets
As described in Revelation.
The anti-christ will come when the New World Order has received a fatal wound. The anti-Christ will come looking like Jesus as well as preaching peace and prosperity for all, as long as his team can be the Reserve Bankers for the world.
Is this what you are asking?
If a Christian country tells it's army to kill, is that order perceived as coming from the Christian God Himself?
In the Old Testament, one leader received the go ahead to start the killing and the rest obeyed. The leaders would usually start by saying: "Thus, saith the Lord..."
Our government has omitted the "thus saith the Lord" part of the order, but still retains the Ten Commandments around the SCOTUS and the "in God we trust" on our money.
Do Christians believe that the order to kill is still coming from God, albeit indirectly through the power structure of its leaders?
Americans believed this in the 1800s. Remember the Manifest Destiny? The Native Americans still remember.
Manifest Destiny
Concept of U.S. territorial expansion westward to the Pacific Ocean. The phrase was coined in 1845 by the editor John L. O'Sullivan, who described the U.S. annexation of Texas and, by extension, the occupation of the rest of the continent as a divine right of the American people. The term was used to justify the U.S. annexation of Oregon, New Mexico, and California and later U.S. involvement in Alaska, Hawaii, and the Philippines.
http://www.answers.com/topic/manifest-destiny
Einstein also said:
What separates me from most so-called atheists is a feeling of utter humility toward the unattainable secrets of the harmony of the cosmos. (Albert Einstein to Joseph Lewis, Apr. 18, 1953)
We know nothing about [God, the world] at all. All our knowledge is but the knowledge of schoolchildren. Possibly we shall know a little more than we do now. but the real nature of things, that we shall never know, never. (The Expanded Quotable Einstein, Princeton University Press, Page 208)
I want to know how God created this world. I am not interested in this or that phenomenon, in the spectrum of this or that element. I want to know his thoughts. The rest are details. (The Expanded Quotable Einstein, Princeton University Press, 2000 p.202)
Once again ....
A MANS ETHICAL BEHAVIOR SHOULD BE BASED EFFECTUALLY ON SYMPATHY,EDUCATION, AND SOCIAL TIES: NO RELIGIOUS BASIS IS NECESSARY......
MAN WOULD INDEED BE IN A POOR WAY IF HE HAD TO BE RESTRAINED BY FEAR OF PUNISHMENT AND HOPE OF REWARD AFTER DEATH....
ALBERT EINSTIEN
Zionism invaded the church via Heretical Teaching
Of course, the usual suspects are involved:
Pat Robertson, the late Jerry Falwell, Tim LaHaye, Hal Lindsey, the late Oral Roberts, Kenneth Copeland and his minions, Paul Crouch, Benny Hinn, James Dobson, Jim Bakker, Jimmy Swaggart, Ralph Reed, and Jews for Jesus.
Many believers will run with the neo-con interpretation of the bible to "submit to authority" as the bible is clear that authority is God-breathed but won't respect those passages when it comes to toppling authority they don't agree with (foreign governments).. It really is unintentional hypocrisy as most have no clue that God has a WORLD view, he is not a Republican or even an American, He is God.
I don't know why Saddam Hussein was installed as leader in Iraq but God does and when "we" played "god", we invited rebuke. Of course, that rebuke is upon us now because God is not a respecter of persons or politics.
There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.
Socialists are Everywhere
Authority
"Many believers will run with the neo-con interpretation of the bible to "submit to authority" as the bible is clear that authority is God-breathed"
I get so sick of seeing this crap. In America, the Constitution is the authority that must be submitted to. Not whomever happens to be in the government.
Makes me think of a song.
"Armageddon Days Are Here (Again)", just give a listen to the lyrics: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lel0PzhU6Pk
They've forgotten the message.
"Truth is treason in the Empire of Lies."
This is a very relevant question which I have studied for quiet
sometime. Here are the primary factors involve, some old some new.
1. According to the Bible, God condoned war as a way to clear out certain bloodlines from a region so inter mixing would not pollute the pure bloodline from which Jesus was born which would give him the power to overcome death.
2. Many Christians are inclined to not think for themselves which could disrupt and jeopardize the social and economic benefits that many seek in joining a church, thus it is a "go along to get along mentality".
3. Many pastors also share this attitude which is strongly implied from the heads of their denominations.
You are correct. The current
You are correct. The current agenda does not follow the Just War Principle.