-2 votes

We need a New Constitution -- We are engaged in a Perpetual War

a Perpetual War that cannot ever be resolved.
----EVER!

There's an audio debate with Tom Woods and Neil Siegel that proves that you will never "resolve" the constitutional question of legality.
---http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcgbNVenUTA

We need a "clear cut" Constitution that eliminates "rights" for everyone save consumers -- who foot the bill (all Bills - Laws - Regulations - Licensure).

No "rights" need to be enumerated for consumers either. The consumer is free when all others have no rights/protectionism; meaning none can circumvent consumer-demand.

Here's my 350 Word Constitution

Central Gov't
The ZEROS

0% Tax Authority (on any individual or group)
0% Currency Authority (100% freemarket money / coinage / credit)
0% Regulatory Authority (100% Consumer Sovereignty)
0% Judicial Authority
0% Lobbying
0% Foreign Debt Accrual

Central Gov't shall be a 24Team Naval Meritocracy

The 24-Team will be hired owing to resume, education, and business plan presentation. They will be hired by a revolving panel of experts who are pooled from 4,000 or more such experts in the fields of: weaponology, bidding analysis, contract analysis, accounting, efficiency experts, oceanography, and military strategy.

This team will be paid from the remainder of their budget (unused). A very open source (for all to view) rubric will be used and a public auditing to factor their incentives based on: anti-pirate record (safeguarding our ships and ports), non-international water violations, communication improvements, weaponology improvement, search and rescue, cost accounting, contract bid analysis, efficiency improvement, etc.

They will hire "employees" from the free labor pool on a contractual basis.

1% National Sales Tax (cover budget and incentive plan)
One 6-year Term

State Gov't

The Zeros

0% Tax Authority (on any individual or group)
0% Currency Authority (100% free market money / coinage / credit)
0% Regulatory Authority (100% Consumer Sovereignty)
0% Judicial Authority
0% Lobbying
0% Foreign Debt Accrual

State Gov't shall be a 24-Team Army and Air Guard Meritocracy

Search and Rescue (disasters only) and Border Patrol

Logically Similar Rubric (to assess incentive merit)

Logically Similar Hiring "board of experts"

3% State Sales Tax (for budget and incentives)
ONE 6year Term

GAO (Gov't Accounting Office)

The Zeros
0% Tax Authority (on any individual or group foreign or domestic)
0% Currency Authority (100% freemarket money / coinage / credit)
0% Regulatory Authority (100% Consumer Sovereignty)
0% Judicial Authority
0% Lobbying
0% Foreign Debt Accrual

The GAO shall be a 24Team Foreign Debt Meritocracy they have one job "Pay off all Foreign Debt

Logically Similar Rubric (to assess incentive merit)

Logically Similar Hiring "board of experts"

3% National Sales Tax (for budget and incentives)
This is a temporary dept until all debt is paid

All above taxes will reduce by .5% per 6 year period. There is no emergency forced taxation authority.

-----------------------
-----------------------

Easily pay-off off all foreign debt in 90 years
---I'm sure the amount will be negotiated down

Probably need to start at 12%, but eliminate the tax-collection by .25% per year for 90 years. Self-Diminishing.

You wouldn't reach zero -- but could dump the whole thing at around 8% and then allow everything to be handled privately -- private courts, private security.

We just need time to transition and 90 years would give the world time to adjust to us not carrying them and give us the protection to secure our markets while they adapt.

It's a 93% Tax Free Society -- So, it requires only 7% Abdication, rather than the reverse which is what we have now.

Currently we live in a 80-90% Tax-Theft Society -- So, it requires 90% Abdication.

Minarchism requires "some" Gov't

This is a transitionary model (thus temporary).

A Meritocracy exists outside the control of the people -- It's the only form of leadership that can have REAL WORLD restrictions put against it -- Because there is ZERO Voting / Lobbying.



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It was John Adams that pointed out,

"Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."

I am not sure that any Constitution, no matter how skillfully written, can withstand the immorality of the likes of those who today occupy the seats of power. They would eventually find a way to twist the words and expand their power.

I find it sad that the only real way for people to effectively redress grievances is by shedding blood. Even the treason provision of the Constitution require making war against the US or giving aid and comfort to its enemies; it does not apply to politicians repeatedly violating the provisions of the Constitution.

We would be better off with no federal government at all. At least the people of the former USSR had the balls to get rid of their similarly worthless and destructive central government; I think that is the answer.

"Bend over and grab your ankles" should be etched in stone at the entrance to every government building and every government office.

Henry: Well said

For the constitution I suggest there would need to be a powerful education.

I offer for purposes of education -- maybe to build a model off of it.

It would work (and logically so) because if you read it then you know there is a self-diminishing aspect to it, meaning as time goes on the budget gets smaller, but the possibility for incentive-commissions based in open source review and the random people from the specific industries chosen to "judge" would be very high -- thus drawing the best and brightest.

There's no power to Tax, no power to regulate -- imagine in the rare circumstances that gov't actually hires a private firm based on competitive bidding (the rare times this happens) and that commissions are only made based on a very tight rubric. In those instances it is far far more efficient and innovative program and far far better than what gov't could produce. But it's rare that anything be that public that the gov't wouldn't rather hire their buddies or bribers (lobbyist's friends) to do the job -- sometimes they do good work, but always at an astronomical price.

In my model -- there is no gov't hiring body, the rubric is known and the decision on payment/reward for service is in open-source.

The public is judging the "judging body" and the firms or institutions they come from in terms of how much "sunlight" they allow into their decision tree.

It would work -- I built it off of Mises Consumer-Sovereignty model.

Interesting

While I do enjoy these philosophical exercises I do believe that this is the wrong venue for this discussion. Lest us not forget, if the MSM cannot find anything Dr. Paul said to slander him, they will most surely use what we say against him. This site is in a way dedicated to him; so everything said here will be associated with him, if for no other reason than to scare the average person into not voting for him. Saying that we, Dr. Paul's supporters, don't want to fix the problems, but throw out the entire Constitution. We will be labeled Anarchists and so will he by association.

If one thinks that the MSM do not visit these sites every now-and-then for this very reason you are sadly mistaken.

HAH! new constitution. Yeah right.

You would end up with authoritarian regime.

Well people what you got is something other that a REPUBLIC.

NO THANKS I stick with what we got. We'll simply get rid of the PERVERTED thinkers who steal from those who would persue HAPPINESS and would protect Liberty and Justice for all involved.

Just The Opposite, I Support All Rights Are Retained By The

Producers.

Constitution of The Oracle

I hereby decree that all Consumers, that is to say corporations and government, shall be forever subservient to those that feed them, and not bite the hand that feeds them nor take that which they have not been freely given by the producers.

This is the Law of The Land and The Law of The Sea, all shall answer to me, the producer.

I think that sums up My Constitution.

Perhaps I could fancy up the paper with a pretty border or something.

The Oracle

I was a producer all my life.

now they want to take my retirement funds they say I am no longer ENTITLED to.

The Consumers Have No Intention Of Letting You Consume The

Wealth that you produced. Oh, no, they are eating it all up because it's only fair that they share in your wealth.

The Oracle

Are you distinguishing between the makers and the takers?

In which case the makers would include both the producers and the consumer.

The takers being those who use to steal another's property.

Free includes debt-free!

Because The Fiat Currency Redistributes Wealth

I am saying that is bad for the producers. Under the current system the producers do not consume the lions share of what they produce because it gets redistributed to whoever gets currency coupons passed out to them.
Simple theft by coupon misdistribution. Producers should get ten fish coupons for ten fish they produce, not one coupon for them and the other nine get passed out to others who were given them for no merit.

So under the current system the producers do not consume more than a fraction of the wealth that they produce. "Other" "consumers" who produce nothing are fed the wealth stolen from the producers. The consumer and the producer need not be the same individual and in in fact aren't in a redistributionist society (commune).
This is flat out wrong.

The Oracle

Producers must "consume" before they can Produce

Consumption -- To Use, To Diminish, To Transform

We Consume -- Knowledge, Food, Nutrients, Tools, Ideas, Energy, Fuel, Water, Air, Minerals, Bandwidth, Light, Sound, Feeling, Emotions.

There was ONLY one "production" moment and that was either God-the-Creator or Big Bang.

Everything after that was an act of Consumption.

The Supra-Activity of the Universe is Consumption (Use, Waste, Transformation, re-Use, Waste, Transformation).

God Creates -- Man Transforms, Uses, Wastes what God Creates.

Mises advocated a Consumer-Sovereignty

Exactly what the anti- christ will impliment.

good luck with that. SEE YOU LATER iiiiid.

What we have in Gov't now is from "Christ" and what I

suggest is from the "Anti-Christ"

Wow.....

So what we have now, which was born from Slavery, Land Theft, the Kidnapping and Forced Assimilation of Children, Reservationism and Forced Relocation, Genocide and Democide, Internment, and then a Dismount from Capitalism (the former lot) into Internationalism (Corporatism) -- what we have now is from Christ?

And what I suggest -- which strips power from the few and puts Self-Health, Self-Defense, and Self-Rule is from the Anti-Christ?

Really?

Jesus taught -- "seek ye first the Kingdom of God......the Kingdom of God is within you......know ye not that ye are Gods.....I and my father are one.....Be still and know that I am God" -- and in your mind "Pailofwater" when you hear those words you think Capitalism and Corporatism were wrought from Christ and Individualism, Consumer-Sovreignty (Mises), and Self-Rule is wrought by the Devil?

Hahahahahahahahaha

I'm a Deist and I know Christ better than you :-)

Where The Producer is The Consumer Equals Freedom

Producer is the Consumer. = freedom and maximum happiness
Producer gifts his product to another equals charity happiness for giver some happiness for gifted
Producers product is taken and used by another, not happiness for producer, great happiness for thief.
Government takes producers product and gives it to another. No happiness for producer, little happiness for recipient.
Government takes producer's product and spends it on behalf of it's wards, no happiness for producers, no happiness for consumers.

So it is not about consumers rights, it is all about producers rights.
Because a consumer can acquire the product of a producer by charity, theft, third party theft.
The first charity gives the consumer no choice.
The second robs the producer.
The third robs the producer.
The fourth robs the producer and the consumer.
Stop robbing the producers and the consumers will be the producers except in the case of charity so maximum happiness will result.
It is all about protecting producers, who cares about the consumers "rights"? They don't have any. How they got the stuff they are consuming is the question, did they violate the producers rights or trade fairly.
Mises is not right about everything.

Protecting Producers rights is Upholding The Law, protecting consumers rights is communism.

The Oracle

No - But your close (well "no" according to Mises)

Before the Producer is of age to "producer" he must consume -- vast amounts of resources per annum.

If Mark Zuckerberg is curtailed in the wrong areas from consumption, we do not have Facebook.

Consumer-Sovereignty was Mises phrase for the largest group of individuals -- all individuals are consumers long long long before they "produce"

Now -- The very act of Production is actual a misnomer. To produce something you must take from the earth or altered earth "products" (man made inputs) and "transform, diminish, and use" (the definition of consumption) into your final "prodcut" (object of consumption).

If any consumer-producer is blocked from consumption then he cannot complete the final good (again being an object of consumption).

Your smart guy -- I smart guy -- Mises smarter than both of us.

I just "consumed" time and "trasnformed" (act of consumption) Misesian knowledge into a digestible (consumptive product) form (for you -- the consumer).

Hahahaha

Fractional Reserve Banking Creates Wealth Held In Trust That

Amounts to forced savings which is not consumed by the producer but is instead consumed by bankers, attorneys, judges CEOs and a large number of the welfare class who are used to adjust aggregate demand as needed by party policy.
So all those skyscrapers are not consumed by the producers any more than the great pyramids were. Instead they are built by the producers and enjoyed by the elite who borrow the buildings from the producers.
A friend just looked up his cusip number and found that over a billion dollars in currency has been issued in his name. There is some seriously crazy redistribution, forced savings and borrowing/use by the consumers going on that I sure bet the producers didn't authorize.

The Oracle

Your understanding of "consumer" is not Misesian and is therefor

not Free-Market Theory.

There are NOOOOO "producers" -- humans can only transform, use / re-use, diminish (waste or reduce). They cannot "produce" or "create" anything the religious folk would say only the "Creator" can "create"

Now -- you could have a "producer" designation under the umbrella term "consumer" -- but for consumers to be free (including consumer-producers) you need to free all consumers not just a limited batch.

Your argument above -- get your language straight -- is a relflection of the "owners" of currency creating boom-bust and fiat-credit on behalf of the "producers" who have enough money to bribe or who are related (both).

The Upper 1% rule the next 8% down and the Upper 8% rule the lower 92.

They rule by controlling the valuation-mechanism behind all assets.

Corporatism is different than a Free-Market (the latter being the exact opposite).

I Am In A Different Place, So My View Point Comes From Where I

Am looking at the world from.
I see consumers as someone or something that eats up stuff and turns it back to lowered states of organization.
For example a consumer would use a product and reduce it's value, therefore consume value.
A producer would add value.

Perhaps it is easier to just say value adders and value subtractors.

Producer= value adder
Consumer=value subtractor

Those who add value (producers) are not the same people who subtract the value (consumers) in a communist society like the U.S.

Have you read Starving The Monkeys?

The Oracle

No no -- leave it to Mises and Hayek

To Consume: To Use, To Transform, To Diminish (waste or reduce).

We Consume: Fuel, Light, Gas, Air, Minerals, Energy, Water, Nutrients, Knowledge, Tools, and Resources.

"Usefullness" or "Value" has nothing to do with it -- it's all valuable anyway, depends on the time line.

In the future when our recycling technologies are a million times what they are today all those landfills with be gold mines.

Conversion is never negative in the long-run, only in the short to medium run. The long-run is not a fixed period of time -- when it comes to nuclear waste it's a bit longer; when it comes to sperm and ovum then maybe in one lifetime we see the good or bad of that conversion (thinking Hitler -- born positive "clean slate" then developed an opinion and became a vegan).

We're getting off topic here.

What you are calling "producers" are really consumers (go read the above definition) -- they do not "produce" they transform what's already there, mix in things they've diminised (from other inputs), and create some level of waste for the purpose of "use" by another.

Consumers are everyone -- so when everyone is responsible for Self-Health, Self-Defense, and Self-Rule (or if they gain a champion -- who then is repsonsible) then everyone is free. If some can abdicate this responsibility and gain advantages from the Gov't then anything they produce is always negative -- because it was not based on demand, he circumvented consumer-will.

Meditate on it -- Mises was a clever guy it will come to you.

Constitution of The Oracle

is such a thing possible in this country?

or should we consider them one and the same?

Yes, If You Read Everything What I Just Said Is The Constitution

They just junk it all up to confuse you. You are the producer. All things are created by your hand or intellect. Thus everything belongs to you. You are the holder of all equity in The United States and in the public corporations.

You are the creator, the creator/creditor/equity holder has all say over his creations/property/equity.
The banks, corporations and the giant trust known as the United States are just the holders/trustees of our property.

I found a killer guy in Canada who was refered to me by KingsofCommerce.
His name is Dean Clifford and he is teaching the same stuff as I am. He put some videos up on YouTube of his little class and they went viral.

I cannot recommend these videos enough to everyone.
Check it out on FREEmanitoba. Dean Clifford.
Watch the first one and see what you think. I believe the series starts with part2e1.

The Oracle

The Declaration, The Constitution and the bill of rights.

are not 3 separate documents. they work together.
the first is a template. [insert grievances here]
the second was their best effort.
the third was the "cliff notes" version.
did I miss something?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viYdHvYM6ao

I suspect

the newly appointed Super Congress is working on a new and improved Constitution as we speak.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

Because Rod Sterling is "odd" -- hmmm?

Was what I wrote that complex.

It is a Synthesis of Mises and Ron Paul refers to Mises as his primary mentor.

RP is a Misesian Scholar of the Austrian School.

What I came up with above is a "proper" Minarchist Constitution based on the broadest category where everyone fits under.

Seniors are 1st Consumers
Producers are 1st Consumers
Students are 1st Consumers
Women are 1st Consumers
Babies are 1st Consumers
Bums are 1st Consumers
Muslims are 1st Consumers
Christians are 1st Consumers
Teachers are 1st Consumers

Consumer is the 1st defining attribute of man when he is born and then the Earth "consumes" him -- smile.

The Earth and Sun were born from Consumption.

Consumption: To Use, To Transform, To Waste (diminish)

We can only Consume -- We Consume all day long (air, love, emotions, fuel, energy, light, bandwidth, ideas, knowledge, tools, time, water, minerals, and nutrients).

If the Constitution we already have isn't being recognized or

respected what makes you think any other Constitution will?

There isn't anything wrong with our Constitution because it is based on 'Natural Laws'.

Firstly, I want to make very clear what I am about to speak about here. These are my own ideas and I take full responsibility for them.

If we violate any of the natural laws, there will always be negative consequences because it goes against that which is the 'hidden forces' of our Universe (the essence of moral laws on earth).

As soon as man desires to be equal or greater than God, its game over.

What is 'wrong', are those who have been 'allowed' to usurp the power mechanisms that were set up for checks and balances.

Those who have usurped our country thus far know all about 'natural laws' so much so that they have managed to 'harness' the forces in such a way as to seemingly make us 'the cause' of the stealing (only partially correct because we have not been vigilant, nor responsible).

As long as the people are always 'found wanting'(and this is deliberately being manipulated of course with very bad education), it increases the chances of most people to choose 'moral hazards' which is the necessary ingredient that serves 'controlling' purposes that will trap us in 'servitude' where the debt is never extinguished (hence gold/silver is banned from use because only gold/silver can extinguish a debt).

This is also called, 'Anti-christ'.

Many of you scoff at this term because you are so brainwashed to 'condemn' Christians, yet you are clueless as to what this really is. Orthodox Christians/Muslims/Jews are correct here.

It is anything that goes 'against' nature. This is highly esoteric, and yes these 'dark' ones know all there is to know about the 'hidden forces' of light and of the dark and they have been milking us using these forces for their selfish reasons for a long, long time on earth.

And if Americans must know, the Declaration of Independence and our Constitution with its Bill of Rights, for a time, actually 'chained' and warded off these forces animated within certain 'rogue' characters until little by little through intense study and observation of our human natures, these 'rogue characters' began to figure out how to manipulate all of us and take control of our entire world once they could usurp the printing of money.

It doesn't take too much imagination to see what they have done and how they did it.

I am sorry Octobox, but surely you waste your time here, though I understand your sentiment and frustrations.

The original U.S.Constitution with Bill of Rights and the spirit of the law, the Declaration of Independence one could say is in fact a form of a 'spell' that served the forces of light to both ward away evil and 'bind' the dark forces provided the people were vigilant and virtuous with good and honorable intentions, as soon as they let this slip, oops they're trapped within the forces of darkness and become slaves/pawns for the dark side.

It is understandably difficult for those who were taught to associate anything like what I have described as a form of 'witchcraft'. Yet this is NOT superstitious stuff, it is sound spiritual science.

The proper use of the elements have always been humanities' inheritance from our celestial realm as long as they were put to use 'for the benefit of all' without any selfish intentions whatsoever.

We are all paying for our ignorance of these fundamental precepts.

That is essentially why I urgently support the legal mechanism of the Articles of Freedom brilliantly crafted together by all those who attended the Continental Congress 2009.

These beautiful highly conscious people, whose deep love for their fellow man, each brought intentions for the 'highest good' of America and their product is simply magnificent even despite the imperfections.

It is a profound force of light to ward away and bind these dark forces once and for all.

What I have expressed here are my own ideas, observations, and understandings of fundamental workings of the forces of the Universe and in no way represent any of those people or organization who arrived at the Articles of Freedom.

I am certain I would be considered crazy for mentioning these things, yet I feel they need to be said once and for all.

These 'forces' can be felt by our natural 'intuition'.

When we have a sense of something yet cannot 'rationally' explain it consciously. This is a human attribute that will become much more refined once the darkness has been bound and banished from our world.

Please support the Articles of Freedom.

Anisha,

you wrote:

There isn't anything wrong with our Constitution because it is based on 'Natural Laws'.

This is absurd. By writing such a thing, you make it quite obvious that you are not objective. Further, you show that you have never given any serious thought to the question of how the Constitution could be improved in light of what has gone wrong in the nation.

Why should we listen to anything else you say when you are so irrational on such a fundamental level?

You have a habit of shying away from rational arguments. Instead, you just come back with more shameless promotion, as if nothing had been said at all. This is the type of behavior that works well in cults because it's designed for people who already have a predetermined conclusion in mind. It does not work well, however, on people who insist on rational evidence before they believe a thing.

Your continual assurances that if we would only read/study your Articles, we would sign the pledge, are similarly irrational. Indeed, I already dissected your pledge, and you have NO rational response to any of my points. Rather, you continue to delude yourself that our disagreement with you is simply because we haven't studied your position well enough.

Your appeal to having special spiritual enlightenment is shown to be false by how irrationally you argue. If you really understood some special secret wisdom from God, you would indeed be able to explain things in a rational manner. As it is, though, your voodoo approach to politics is askew from reality.

I imagine that you think that you're "using the force" when you write such posts. My question for you is why that "force" cannot seem to guide you into RATIONAL arguments? Weren't John the Baptist, Jesus, Peter, John, Stephen, and Paul known for their stunning and unassailable logical arguments?

So wherever your spiritual kung fu is emanating from, it's most certainly not from the same place they got theirs. Rather, it seems like empty imagination. And you don't even see that it's irrational.

Jack

Anisha -- Individual Self-Rule is granted by your Creator

So powerful is this free-will that God never counters it; man can either succomb to his ignorances or chose to consciously rise above them.

Of course once you mention Creator and God you've just entered crazy town, because everything following that premise can never be proven; proven beyond the benefits of ethical consideration.

This is why religion must be left out of it.

The Founding Father's profited from Slavery (directly or indirectly) -- maybe Adams didn't. I mean the most Libertarian among them Patrick Henry owned slaves (twice during his life). Benjamin Franklin .....so on.

All of them benefited from Indian Land Theft, Broken Treaties, Intentional Spread of Small Pox, and Reservationism.

Yes, they included religion in their "founding" one that only benefited Wealthy WASP men -- all other men and women were excluded (had no rights).

It went from a Small Rights Society to a Big Rights Society.

Small Rights (based on ownership) is Capitalism
Big Rights (based on globalist ownership) is Corporatism.

I don't think my time here is wasted -- I'm only on here when I'm working.

It's fun to interject and debate -- it stimulates the entrepreneurialism in me; when I'm fired up or angry, smile.

Yogananda (Gandhi's Guru) said Anger can be a powerful ally if we can learn to Transmute the Energy.

Your Marxist indoctrination shows well Octobox.

The thinking you espouse here is too compartmentalized for me to reach you with my ideas I am afraid, but, whatever makes you happy.

I am coming from an entirely wholistic perspective here.

Your shunning/denial of something that is all around us, makes our hearts beat, continuously flows through us or we couldn't be here, in my opinion is the most outrageously crazy of all. And makes me sad.

However, to each our own.

Anisha: I've been called a lot of things but a "Marxist"

Wow. How would you begin to rationalize that statement?

I believe in Christ -- I'm fiersely opposed to Religion.

My opinion on the Founding Father's is based on fact; unlike you I don't tie my spiritual belief and practices with men who were in contempt of everything "Christ" but were in-line with everything "Christian;" which historically has proven to twist Christ teachings to fit the current political agenda.

Being anti-Founders (save Adams) is not the same thing as being a Marxist.

I'm anti-Communist, anti-Capitalist, anti-Corporatist, and anti-Socialist -- to name a few.

I follow and add on to the work of Mises, Ron Paul, Gandhi, Lao Tzu, and Spooner (to name the top men).

Consumer-Sovereignty would grant you the greatest freedom; far more than that Bird Cage Liner you Abdicate too.

I agree with Ron Paul; "if you are an elected official and you've sworn an oath to the Constitution, then you should adhere to it," that's the end of my support of the Constitution.

You've never even read of a people getting their liberty via Representative Gov't; the very process begins in Abdication.

I feel the same way about Religion (latin: "to bind or bound") -- "to abdicate"

Christ is perpetually growing state of "being" or "consciousness" -- not limited to this planet or the body of Jesus. We must expand our cosciousness through advanced techniques of stilling the mind; we must make conscious what is "involuntary" within mind, body, nervous system, and psycho-emotional; before we can "know Christ."

I do not believe at all that you must believe as I do to be "free" -- I believe Christ is an experience not a belief, a reality; when you are able to zero out your ego then you will know it and that happens only in deep Conscious-Sleep or Meditation.