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Were the Founding Fathers Alcoholics?

http://www.peele.net/blog/100615.html

A recent bestseller has taken up the cudgels of a longstanding political and religious controversy: Were our founding fathers really religious and, more specifically, Christian? On the one side, humanists point out remarkably little specific mention of Christ in the fathers' (including Lincoln's) public utterances. Rather, they refer to an all-inclusive, generic deity. But advocates for Christianity maintain this should not be taken to dispute our founders' deep, underlying faith in God and belief in the divinity of Christ.

Leaving that contentious debate aside, I want to talk about how much the founding fathers drank. The answer: quite a bit. The New York Times on Sunday published an account of how Jefferson (according to writer Ann Mah he was "a lifelong oenophile") spent a lot of his time in France while representing the United States inspecting the vineyards of Burgundy.

Was Jefferson a closet drinker? He had no reason to hide his love of wine -- no founding father thought it unusual in this pre-Temperance era to love the fruit of the vine or, for that matter, hard cider, beer, or even whiskey and rum. Take Jefferson's primary rival, John Adams. According to a descendant of his, "To the end of John Adams' life, a large tankard of hard cider was his morning draught before breakfast." Get the man to the Betty Ford Center!

How do we know the founding fathers as a group drank a lot? Well, for one thing, we have records of their imbibing. In 1787, two days before they signed off on the Constitution, the 55 delegates to the Constitutional Convention partied at a tavern. According to the bill preserved from the evening, they drank 54 bottles of Madeira, 60 bottles of claret, eight of whiskey, 22 of porter, eight of hard cider, 12 of beer and seven bowls of alcoholic punch.

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interesting thoughts . . .

this is something about which I had never thought (though I don't drink or do drugs, I'm sure I have other addictions, like having to come on DP every day, LOL!)--In the winter I do like my daily cocoa as well,

and I like original thoughts. Your words were 'provoking' in a positive way, so I had to ask.

I was not trying to incite. I have always appreciated what you have to say. Especially about slavery. And local activism.

And you answered well. So my question must not have been TOO obtuse.

it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--

YEP...

They also grew some great pot...

Isn't it great to be amongst friends... HA!

Joel - A 70+ Survivalist...
http://cegsilver.com

"Those who give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Ben Franklin
"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance."
- Thomas Jefferson
"Dissent

Almost everyone has a DOC

Drug Of Choice. Most Americans pick one that is prescribed so they can legally be zoned out and everyone will applaud their zombiness. "At least he is taking care of himself, following doctor's orders!" The founding fathers were self reliant chaps, of course their drug of choice was one they could home brew!

Love or fear? Choose again with every breath.

By our standards probably

But not by theirs. As someone mentioned, the water was not to be trusted so people actually drank beer instead. It was true for centuries. Roosevelt and Churchill would be considered alcoholics by the standards of today. Probably most of my mother's friends would be. But, that was the lifestyle back then. An alcoholic was viewed as a drunken bum who abused or neglected his family and couldn't keep a job.

So, Legalize, what's your point? :)

Healthnut4freedom

The lip of truth shall be established forever: but a lying tongue is but for a moment...Lying lips are abomination to the LORD: but they that deal truly are His delight. Prov 12:19,22

do you want me to change the title

Do you want me to change the title of the article {I have nothing to do with} - I did not write it!

I post the stuff for you all out there so you can see for yourselves what is good informative and worthy of getting to others...

LL on Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
sometimes LL can suck & sometimes LL rocks!
http://www.dailypaul.com/203008/south-carolina-battle-of-cow...
Love won! Deliverance from Tyranny is on the way! Col. 2:13-15

Oh, ok Legalize

I forgot that. I thought you were trying to make a point or something from what it said. So, I was just asking. :)

Healthnut4freedom

The lip of truth shall be established forever: but a lying tongue is but for a moment...Lying lips are abomination to the LORD: but they that deal truly are His delight. Prov 12:19,22

Love...the only path...

Thank you.

I wanted to tell others but sometimes it is like shouting out to the open ocean...

All the books WRITTEN on this planet will not give you ALL Truth.

These are just like tourist guides when a tourist comes to town.

Tourist booklets on the planet earth...thats all.

Wars go on and on...why?

Because earth is under control of some bad people.

We Can Change it............but only ONLY with the help from above.

LL on Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
sometimes LL can suck & sometimes LL rocks!
http://www.dailypaul.com/203008/south-carolina-battle-of-cow...
Love won! Deliverance from Tyranny is on the way! Col. 2:13-15

Antifederalist Luther Martin of Maryland

Well, he was known to give drunken rants. I can't criticize; I have the same tendencies:)

A link to the review of his biography, "Forgotten Founder, Drunken Prophet: The Life of Luther Martin"

http://www.thefreemanonline.org/book-reviews/forgotten-found...

BTW Jefferson favored wine and had an extensive cellar at Monticello.

Malo periculosam libertatem quam quietam servitutem. ("I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude"). Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, 30 January 1787.

Thomas Paine drank a lot..

and you know how I LOVE him! Thanks for the link Amica, even though it is partly YOUR fault I got too rowdy at the Alpaca Ranch /Rooster Cabin! I promise to call you when sober sometime soon! ;-)

"I think we are living in a world of lies: lies that don't even know they are lies, because they are the children and grandchildren of lies." ~ Chris Floyd

they drank a lot of alcohol

they drank a lot of alcohol in those days because alcohol killed the bacteria that most of the water had in it. I didn't read the article but I'm skeptical the author took that into account.

That was back when they started flouriding all the water....

Then they decided to put petrochemicals in the water, poisoning the water & downright spreading disease once you get into the 1980s.

Right on!

at that time poor people had to drink water that was really bad and the wealthy well to do people where able to drink beer and so on because it was more healthy to drink than water.

LL on Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
sometimes LL can suck & sometimes LL rocks!
http://www.dailypaul.com/203008/south-carolina-battle-of-cow...
Love won! Deliverance from Tyranny is on the way! Col. 2:13-15

Anyone would drink.....

And I do mean anyone....when you are dealing with the tyranny of the British and the Rothschild bankers.

I sincerely doubt they took christianity as serious as the idol worshipers.....Sounds similar to a lot of us too.

They did not deify christians as there was nothing to deify.....It was understood they were clearly rotten scum, many of them using Christianity to promote empire, future Israel Globalism, a naturalized imperial fascist rule over the Incas in the West Indies.

If you look at some of Thomas Jefferson's writings, he downright "scolded" the likes of the Lincoln movement for backing many of these totalitarian ideals found above. He chastised the Christians just as much as the Bankers they followed!!!

He was nearly disgraced for it, in a similar position. In my overall view Jefferson and John Adams were two of the greatest men in all of history, despite their little flaws as we all share. They were deists who believed in a christian philosophy, but NOT organized church based rule.

In fact Franklin even spoke that the organized religions would bring us more tyranny than even those on the separatist front...therefore we should vow to ALWAYS have the separation of church and state.

He got it right.

Adams was not a deist

Jefferson was most likely but Adams was not. A deist believes in a God but that God could care less about us. We are on our own. Adams was much stronger in his faith experience and a professed Christian. Really. Don't stretch the truth to fit your mindset.

While Franklin and the lot believed organized religion was something to keep at bay (history proves over and over why that should be) they believed the moral teachings of the Bible had a very prominent place in the success of a society. The Bible was always a very prominent book for reading and instructing. Its teachings of the golden rule and the 10 commandments, for example, taught young people there are absolutes and there is right and wrong. My mother was never one to believe all of the Bible but she believed it had a prominent place in teaching morals. That is SERIOUSLY LACKING in this day and age. Could there be a correlation?

Healthnut4freedom

The lip of truth shall be established forever: but a lying tongue is but for a moment...Lying lips are abomination to the LORD: but they that deal truly are His delight. Prov 12:19,22

I'm confused

Drinking is not alcoholism.
I'm confused about the need for the first paragraph. Was it relative to the article?

agreed

I wish the author would not have added that intro to the very interesting article.

LL on Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
sometimes LL can suck & sometimes LL rocks!
http://www.dailypaul.com/203008/south-carolina-battle-of-cow...
Love won! Deliverance from Tyranny is on the way! Col. 2:13-15