New Drudgere Healdline: Ron Paul: 'When fascism comes it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross'
Submitted by lem on Tue, 12/18/2007 - 09:30Referring to Ron Paul's statement on Fox News about Huckabee's cross.
I love it! It is about time there is some exposure that postulating doesn't equal policy.
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That is what I love about Ron Paul
He calls them like he sees them, very honest for a politician.
That Fox interview was so stupid he was probably thinking he could have slept another hour instead of giving "one word" answers. What was that about?
I disagree strongly with you!
RP was not tired. He is doing great - the show he was on lead off with Huckabee's commercial, nothing about Dr. Paul, issues, money raised, Iraq, economy, social securtiy, debt.
It was a boring interview for RP.
Maybe he was bored and wondering, what dumb boring questions.
Glendale Keith
Glendale Keith
Isn't it amazing
how nimble Ron Paul intellect is? You just can't box him in. Most of the other candidates don't even know who Sinclair Lewis is, much less know his work. I bet the google site has been hit few time on this one.
alan laney
I Only wish Ron Paul would use the Bible to his advantage
and tell Huckabee to read Matthew 6.
Matt Ch.6
Thanx for this link, be great to shut my parents up about huck-a-god this xmas
I was thinking the same thing
That passage has crossed my mind many times. The people who have to make a big show of how religious they are, usually don't understand the message.
That's why I love how Ron Paul handles it. His religion shows through by who he is and how he acts. There's no need to talk about it. He gets it.
Why?
Religious affiliation, party affiliation, secret society affiliation have no reason whatsoever to be involved in or have anything specific to do with a campaign.
We know that the whole collectivism ideology (religion included) is what is the problem with the political system and will not be changed until we look at what the individual stands for on the issues not what the individual's faith or party affiliation etc. are.
Why use religious based attacks against Huck, it is a low blow and very childish thinking that shows that we are willing to stoop to their level. In order to bring this country back from the immoral decline people need to see the errors of their ways as individuals instead of having a tag/classification and a dogma pushed upon them.
We as believers of liberty and the cause of freedom should respect religion not push and advocate it as that is just as bad as any other special interest pushing their views upon the general public.
Stay with the moral high road and let the actions speak louder than pulling religious quotes from the word to make your point.
That is just my $.02.
That Bible passage is exactly what you are saying
Click on that link. You'll see that it's about what you are saying. You shouldn't make a big display of your praying and giving and such. You should pray in private and give annomyously.
Odd
It's odd to me that the idiots on Faux News brought the cross up, NOT Ron Paul. They made the implication and now RP is having to answer for it. I hope he never goes back on that network. It was The Three Stooges interviewing Ron Paul.
Dominionism
In quoting Sinclair Lewis yesterday, perhaps Dr. Paul was alluding to the fact that espousing one's "Christianity" in American politics these days HAS become a kind of litmus test for one's suitability for office. After all, Governor Romney felt it necessary to address the religious rights' concerns about his Mormonism. Our candidate is amazingly well read and has served in Congress for 10 terms. I'm sure he has noted this trend toward "showing oneself to be a Christian" in Washington so as to influence voters, something thankfully he would never use to his advantage. I wonder too if he is cognizant of Christian dominionism, sometimes called Christian Reconstructionism. Wikipedia provides a synopsis of this movement. To be fair, Christians on the soft side of dominionism, if even they could be considered dominionists at all, would probably be pleased being allowed to read their Bibles during lunch at their schools or say a prayer at a high school graduation. In its most extreme, hard form, however, dominionists seek to make America a "Christian" nation, top to bottom, a "Christian theocracy, if you will. This, I believe, is the fascism Sinclair Lewis predicted and perhaps the one to which Dr. Paul was referring to. Under the Dominionist model of government, there would be no separation of church and state. This distinction would cease to be. Laws would follow those of the Old Testament. Archaic as it seems many hard dominionists would advocate stoning for adultery and homosexuality. For hard dominionists this control of society is some sort of precursor for the return of Christ, an end times eschatology that I really don't understand. I don't know where Governor Huckabee sits on the dominionist continuum. In fact, most dominionists disavow this term entirely due to its negative connotations. Still, it doesn't take much internet research to find that the late D. James Kennedy of Coral Ridge Presbyterian in Miami, Florida was considered one of the founders of the dominionist movement. In 2006 in his "Reclaiming America for Christ" Conference, his keynote speaker was Governor Mike Huckabee. In addition, Tim LaHay of the popular Left Behind series is known as a dominionist. He recently endorsed Governor Huckabee for the President of the United States. Secondly, the Falwell empire is associated with the dominionist movement as well. Pastor Falwell's son and successor recently contributed, illegally I think, to Governor Huckabee's campaign for President. Perhaps this issue should be more widely addressed.
On Drudge...
Huckabee says it was "a bookshelf" (I'm going to ignore the fact that the camerawork was done intentionally to make it look like a cross...)
My point? Now Huckabee has stolen both the red shirt and the bookshelf for his Christmas message :)
Hope the Beck interview goes well. I'm stuck at work and can't watch it :(
Ron was clearly having a bad day
1. The beginning of the interview he was confused
2. The comment about the upton sinclair quote wasnt exactly on point, so this might be why the interviewer misunderstood him. I didnt get that he was calling Huck a fascist, just that invoking the cross is a bad idea.
3. His performance overall was horrible compared to other interviews
4. Whats up with RPs face?
If anyone from the campaign reads this, please slow Rons personal pace down and let him get some more sleep. The guy is tired, and its starting to wear on him. It wont do us any good to get him in front of more cameras if he is sleep deprived.
Upton Sinclair, C.S. Lewis,
Upton Sinclair, C.S. Lewis, Sinclair Lewis... They're all the same person. Yeah.
/end sarcasm
Not trying to attack you but if you watched the interview at least get the source of the quote right. RP mentioned it.
I don't get some of your comments
But what you said about what Ron was addressing.. IS ABSOLUTELY RIGHT...
And to say it was addressed at Huck is B.S...
I thought he was having a fine day.. and his face is fine... geeze
I love the sinclair quote
I am a christian and I am not offended by Ron Paul's comment. I am actually offended by Huckabee for using Jesus for his political gain. Ron Paul called christians like Huckabee out, but this is not a new idea.
Mark 12:38-40
38As he taught, Jesus said, "Watch out for the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and be greeted in the marketplaces, 39and have the most important seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at banquets. 40They devour widows' houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. Such men will be punished most severely."
And every time a politician
And every time a politician publicly claims "Jesus" or to be a "Christian" I always think on Matthew 7:21-23
Wolves in sheep's clothing...
Spot on... Dr. Paul!
Plano TX
Ron Paul’s Sister Souljah Moment
I’ve written this in the past that Huckabee’s “I’m right because I’m a preacher” will not work in the overwhelming majority of the country. This may be rapidly becoming a Huckabee vs. Paul race. In this situation Huckabee will not win a single primary west of the Rockies, in the northeast, nor in the industrial mid-west. Remember Huckabee thinks Horse racing and whisky are evil too so that kills him in Tennessee and Kentucky. Huckabee has a Deep South plurality, but many of those deep southern states allocate delegates by percentage or district. Even in the south at least 1/3rd of Republicans are more of the economic variety. Ron will also do very well in delegate rich Texas.
El Dorado
I wish all of Paul's supporters had the backbone that he has
But of course, wish in one hand and crap in the other and see what fills up first.
This nitpicking in the comment thread amuses me. Dr. Paul is a man of principle. He stated exactly what he thought and has done decades of reflection on politics, government, and liberty. It is exactly why we love him.
Huckabee owes America an apology for using images of Christianity to prop up his quest to become an ELECTED OFFICIAL IN A PARTICIPATORY GOVERNMENT.
Paul was just stating the truth, that yes, indeed, fascism will come to this country, and Sinclair may be right about how it arrives. And yes, Huckabee promotes himself as the Christian Candidate, which is utterly preposterous.
Grow a spine, and stop worrying about what people might think about Paul's intentions. His first and foremost goal is to spread the message. His secondary goal is to get elected President. That is what makes this campaign so wonderful.
So no, he won't be issuing any freaking apologies, and no he shouldn't.
And I've never been prouder to support this man of great courage.
-dave
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand
SHE STINKS TO HIGH HEAVEN - Michael Savage in reference to Dianne Fienstein
David Burns
Simi Valley, CA
As A Christian I Am Repulsed
At the total pandering to Christians by Mike Huckabee. This is not a good sign. Recent history (George W. Bush) has shown us that those who pander to the Christian vote, turn out to be the most authoritarian. George W. Bush has pushed fascism in this country like no other president in history. Look with eyes to see and listen with ears to hear at the great steps toward authoritarian government that this President has taken. Mike Huckabee will continue in those steps and advance it. He has subtly stated so. There is nothing that the current administration has done that Mike Huckabee would overturn. Not only would he not overturn any of Bush's enactments, he would expand upon them.
Read this past post on Daily Paul on the 10 steps toward fascism. If you cannot see the trouble we are in, then please pray for discernment.
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/2244
Adding to Tom Madison's Post
...which I agree with 100%, The Sovereign Society's newsletter today also educates on the "backdoor" to fascism...it is no longer in our backyard, but now in our frontyard:
http://www.sovereignsociety.com/
Some newcomers to RP may not understand that he is an avid student of history (not revised history/documented real history) as well as an economic intellectual. The word "fascism" is not understood by many; however, we are seeing it more and more as the financial peril we are in is hitting everyone. Look at the retail sales figures. I would like to think that more people are turning to the reason for the season and not feeding the commercial frenzy...but the real truth is that the economy is on the brink of disaster and everyone is frightened. Vote for someone who is going to tell you like Bush did last night, "the underpinings of the economy are in good shape" or vote for someone who is going to tell you the truth ....and then do something about it. This is a time to respect everyone. We have the opportunity to learn a lot about the golden rule through this campaign.
Had Dr. Paul followed one of his first inclination and followed other members of his family to seminary, he would be saying the same things and acting in the same manner. He would never push his platform on the "I am THE Christian" wagon. Instead, he would acknowledge his Christian roots, while acknowledging everyone's right to practice their religions in this country, and he would say that as a citizen of this Republic he has to stand up for and fight for liberty and freedom...so everyone can practice their religion in a free society.
I have a lot of "faith" (no pun) in the Christian community to educate themselves and vote for freedom. That goes for all the facets of Christianity from mainstream to Religious Right. That goes for the often misinterpreted and much maligned Jewish and Mormon faiths as well as all the Asian faiths. That goes for those who claim no faith-branch. Everyone wants freedom and liberty. And, Ron Paul needs everyone's vote.
fonta
I think the comment was a mistake.
As a non-demoninational Christian, I saw nothing wrong with the Huckster's ad...but the media is now pushing Ron Paul's statement because they know it will rub other Christians the wrong way.
It will not change my vote, but I can't say I wasn't disappointed with his comment. There is nothing wrong with that ad and I know many of you liberal secularists who support Ron Paul will disagree with me.
Ron Paul should have said, "Huckabee is a one trick pony and it's unfortunate that he must play the God card rather than focus on real policy, but I do not see anything controversial in the ad he ran. After all, God and Christmas is a part of the lives of most Americans."
Rather than bringing up Fascism, which the media hopes will finally spell Ron Paul's version of the "Dean Scream", so they can eliminate him from any chance at winning the nomination. You can guarantee it won't help him in the Iowa primary....
"It does not take a majority to prevail. But rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." ~Samuel Adams while plotting the Boston Tea Party.
http://disillusionedrants.blogspot.com/
When you watch Huckabees ad,
When you watch Huckabees ad, you can plainly see the camera swings the cross onto Hucks shoulder. I`m a christian myself, but when a person uses our religion to sublimily sell himself then that tells me all I need to know about that person.
That being said, let me state this....if Huck had just had a cross there plain and simple, I would not have objected to it as much because he would have at least been forthright. What he did shows deviousness. I object to his using hidden symbolism, it shows cowardice in my opinion. He is basically saying "shhhhhh...look at this cross, i`m the real christian, vote for me". Do we really want someone in the White House like Huckabee? I know I dont.
The one thing I`m really sick of is, it seems everyone in government is on a religious side, they are either a jew or a christian. We are putting too much religion in politics and we know where that will lead us. Yes down the road to oblivion that we are now on. Jews hate muslims and christians, christians dont like mormons and muslims, atheists dont like anyone. How can we ever govern America with all this crap going on?
Ron Paul 2012
Zapparulez
Regarding the quote
I understand what you mean.
RP quoted an acclaimed writer and than made the comment that he does not believe Huck is doing this... However, the media will take this fodder and run with it as far as they can. Would have been great if all was said was it was a nice ad, now lets talk about getting the message of freedom, liberty etc.
Hopefully this does not cause much damage. I know on a few sites, they are having fun with this. Of course they already viewed RP as a nut. We know he is not, but you do have others who are sitting on the fence and unless they read or listen to the entire quote and Paul's comment, they will only hear or see what the MSM is pushing and that is an anti christian message. We all know it is not, but perception is king in politics.
If you read some of the conservative sites, Huck is on a road to self destruction. The media is pumping him full of steroids. His record is being exposed, let Romney, Rudy and Fred use their money to attack Huck, that way RP's campaign can use the dollars to promote the MESSAGE. People respond to the message better than the attacks.
Looks like a lot of these sites are pushing Fred. Too many people are on the fence, they want to join this revolution because they believe the message. We should work to help them by being tactful and respectful and pointing out the message.
Great luck to you and thanks for posting your opinion.
GEAUX RON PAUL 2012.
Seeds of Fascism
are all around us. Ron Paul has got to be the most courageous person I have ever met. The truth must be exposed.
"No War, No Income Tax, No Big Brother, No Kidding."
"No War, No Income Tax, No Big Brother, No Kidding."
I agree completely,
which is why I am a RP fanatic. I just had to voice my conerns. The media will try to manipulate this like crazy to hurt Ron Paul. That was my main point here.
"It does not take a majority to prevail. But rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." ~Samuel Adams while plotting the Boston Tea Party.
http://disillusionedrants.blogspot.com/
Think with discernment
Have you done any type of study on public manipulation? This advertisement to Christians is textbook psychological manipulation.
I understand the manipulation,
but I thought Ron Paul could have come up with a better answer.
"It does not take a majority to prevail. But rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." ~Samuel Adams while plotting the Boston Tea Party.
http://disillusionedrants.blogspot.com/
Another Huckabee TROLL!!
if you saw nothing wrong with the Huckabee Ad, that means you're a TROLL from the Huckabuck camp, you're wasting your time the Revolution is Underway, prepare to be Rousted!!!!! Now go away!
Blind devotion?
Can someone say something positive about an ad or critical of Dr. Paul without being labeled a troll? This kind of "you're either with us or agin' us" mentality is one of the things I least like about the current administration. There was honestly nothing wrong with the ad. As Christian I appreciate it when I hear 'Merry Christmas' instead of the innocuous 'Happy Holidays.' Was it meant to drum up support? Sure it was. Isn't that what it is supposed to do?
Fact is that net/net, there was little to be gained by Dr. Paul's remark, and much that could have been lost. Does this mean he will lose existing support? No. Will this cost him some fence-sitters? Sadly, yes.
Peace be with you.