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Prophecy by Joseph Smith being fulfilled

Joseph Smith said this and for anyone who doesn't know who he is go here http://www.josephsmith.net

Update June 23rd:

http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20110621/NEWS02/11062...

As recorded by A. Milton Musser:

"...Prophet Joseph said that the next great (U.S. civil) war after the war of the rebellion (the Civil War of the 1860's between the North and the South) would commence in a little town now called Chicago but at that time it would have grown to be a very large city. And another brother told me that the Prophet said that the cause of the next great trouble of the United States would be the depreciation of the currency of the United States. I believe I have given you all the facts in as short and concise manner as possible."

"There will be two great political parties in this country. One will be called the Republican, and the other the Democrat party. These two parties will go to war and out of these two parties will spring another party which will be the Independent American Party. The United States will spend her strength and means warring in foreign lands until other nations will say, “Let’s divide up the lands of the United States,” then the people of the U.S. will unite and swear by the blood of their fore-fathers, that the land shall not be divided. Then the country will go to war, and they will fight until one half of the U.S. army will give up, and the rest will continue to struggle. They will keep on until they are very ragged and discouraged, and almost ready to give up—when the boys from the mountains will rush forth in time to save the American Army from defeat and ruin. And they will say, “Brethren, we are glad you have come; give us men, henceforth, who can talk with God.” Then you will have friends, but you will save the country when its liberty hangs by a hair, as it were." - Autobiography of Mosiah Hancock

I've know about this prophecy for a while but haven't thought about posting it until now for some odd reason. I know there are many skeptics but simply this testifies, among other things, that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God in these latter-days to bring about God's work. He also accurately prophesied concerning the Civil War.

Doctrine and Covenants 87

1 Verily, thus saith the Lord concerning the wars that will shortly come to pass, beginning at the rebellion of South Carolina, which will eventually terminate in the death and misery of many souls;

2 And the time will come that war will be poured out upon all nations, beginning at this place.

3 For behold, the Southern States shall be divided against the Northern States, and the Southern States will call on other nations



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Are not the two parties at

Are not the two parties at war?

Will a currency collapse not start civil war?

Joseph Smith - Proven False Interpreter

Joseph Smith was not only a proven false Prophet, he is a proven false Interpreter. See here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Abraham

Really not that hard to figure out.

But of course we would have to get into the whole "Mason Debate" once again.

And for the record..I don't believe Masons are bad, I believe the SYSTEM is bad and ultimately supports and directs the NWO. Peons, even 32nd degree Masons, are mostly not "in the know". I feel the same about the Catholic Church and the "Church" overall. It isn't the people who are misled that I have the most problem with, it is the system who is purposefully deceiving its own people in order to gain worldly (self indulgent, self centered) means and control.

Back to the original statement. Your man Joseph Smith and his brother were both Masons who actually started a lodge in Illinois. If you look at some of the ceremonies, such as the "endowment" ceremony, you will see that the Mormon version and the Mason version are almost identical.

Did you know that Albert Pike, also a Freemason, worked out a global blue print for three world wars?

"The First World War must be brought about in order to permit the Illuminati to overthrow the power of the Czars in Russia and of making that country a fortress of atheistic Communism. The divergences caused by the "agentur" (agents) of the Illuminati between the British and Germanic Empires will be used to foment this war. At the end of the war, Communism will be built and used in order to destroy the other governments and in order to weaken the religions."

"The Second World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences between the Fascists and the political Zionists. This war must be brought about so that Nazism is destroyed and that the political Zionism be strong enough to institute a sovereign state of Israel in Palestine. During the Second World War, International Communism must become strong enough in order to balance Christendom, which would be then restrained and held in check until the time when we would need it for the final social cataclysm."

(Readers who argue that the terms Nazism and Zionism were not known in 1871 should remember that the Illuminati invented both these movements. In addition, Communism as an ideology, and as a coined phrase, originates in France during the Revolution. In 1785, Restif coined the phrase four years before revolution broke out. Restif and Babeuf, in turn, were influenced by Rousseau - as was the most famous conspirator of them all, Adam Weishaupt.)

"The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the "agentur" of the "Illuminati" between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other. Meanwhile the other nations, once more divided on this issue will be constrained to fight to the point of complete physical, moral, spiritual and economical exhaustion…We shall unleash the Nihilists and the atheists, and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will from that moment be without compass or direction, anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view. This manifestation will result from the general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time."

Does this sound familiar at all? I reads like a modern plan that is being fulfilled and worked before our very own eyes. Read more here if you are interested.... http://www.threeworldwars.com/albert-pike2.htm

So my question is this...was this "inspiration from God", or is it simply a group of Illuminati simply knowing what the plans were, before they happened? Pretty easy to predict what's coming out of the oven if you put the recipe together and cooked it yourself.

Way to many problems with Joseph Smiths writings and "story" for me to even consider.

Just like the crazy guy predicting The Rapture for October, Joseph Smith is also a false prophet and therefore not of God. He predicted Christs return sometime before 1891, and that was in 1835. It didn't happen. He was a fake who bred fakes, however he was in on some Illuminati plans and knowledge through the likes of people such as Albert Pike.

In fact here is a whole list of failed "prophecies" by Joseph Smith. And all it takes is one failure when claiming that the knowledge is straight from God.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/835357/posts

Jesus warned in Matthew 7:15 that many false prophets would come, and several other places warn us about false prophets and spiritual deception (2 Corinthians 11:4-15; Galatians 1:6-9; 1 Timothy 4:1; 2 Peter 2:1-3; 1 John 4:1 and Jude 3-16). We should not be surprised, therefore, to discover that there are false prophets in the world today.

Soapbox now empty. :O)

He is not a false prophet. He

He is not a false prophet. He has had many prophecies come true and they continue to come true.

http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDSFAQ/FQ_prophecies.shtml

You are clueless as usual...

If I put out 100 guesses, and 20 come true..does that make me a true prophet? True Prophets, who come in the name of God, and speak of the future, are not wrong. I suppose this douchebag that predicted the worlds end in May, and now in December got something right along the way..so in your thoughts he would still be a true prophet. They both have something in common too...Both have predicted the "Coming of the Lord" on several occasions...and of course were proven to be fools.

False prophets are after one thing....profit. And they both profited in big ways. I'm really not sure why I'm even arguing with someone like you....go ahead and buy what the wolf is selling. Enjoy!

Geneva Bible 1599

2 Corinthians 11:13-15 For such false apostles are deceitful workers, and transform themselves into the Apostles of Christ. And no marvel, for Satan himself is transformed into an Angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing, though his ministers transform themselves, as though they were the ministers of righteousness, whose end shall be according to their works.

A very nice piece of scripture..Given that Joseph Smith, his brother, and his father were all high ranking masons who even started their own temple. We all know they worship, or look towards the "Angel of Light", aka lucifer for their guidance and "knowledge".

Deuteronomy 18:22 When a prophet speaketh in the Name of the LORD, if the thing follow not nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously; thou shalt not therefore be afraid of him.

2 Peter 2:1-3 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, which privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that hath bought them, and bring upon themselves swift damnation.
And many shall follow their damnable ways, by whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of,
And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you, whose judgment long since resteth not, and their destruction slumbereth not.

Question about Mormons

Didn't Joseph Smith teach it was alright to have many wives? Brigham Young had close to 50 or 60 wives. If G-d's law allowed for multiple wives, why did Mormons stop this practice?

"I support the Declaration of Independence and I interpret the Constitution."

They stopped the practice

They stopped the practice because the Federal government started jailing members although they were not illegally doing it.

The Mormons were heavily inflicted by local and state governments.

Polygamy, according to the Constitution, should be legal. A contract should be respected and honored by government. If a man and 2 women agree and create a contract it should be respected.

ive probably heard this

ive probably heard this prophecy predicted by 100 people. Joe smith is no prophet.

This is for my friend who

This is for my friend who says that anyone could have predicted the Civil War 30 years before.

http://en.fairmormon.org/Joseph_Smith/Prophecies/Civil_War

samadamscw - Buddy, I hope

samadamscw - Buddy, I hope for our sake that we aren't attacked but I know without a doubt we will be and not too long from now. The world is fed up with us. They don't want anymore of us. North Korea has the largest, standing ?, army in the world and they are nothing compared to China in terms of money and technology. The United States is filled with disillusioned people who would be very easy to take control of. Looking at how our politicians continue to control us even after THEY, along with central bankers, caused the dire situation we are currently in it stands to reason that most Americans would have no idea what to do. I don't know where you come from or where you currently live but I know that my generation along with many before have been brainwashed and spoon fed with consumerism and the "good life". They can't survive. They can't go without. They can't sacrifice. They are mostly immoral, without character and integrity. They are all about themselves and their wants. They want the BMW, the big house, and the fake wife. They want to sin to their hearts delight while not taking into account God's judgments. They want to believe that their money will protect them and save them and they are in for the surprise of their life! If you wish to pick apart everything this man said then be my guest. I know what he said he knew because God revealed it unto him. God continually reveals things to many people but this isn't something the normal, everyday churchgoer would predict accurately.

Okay, so you are North Korea's leader and you want to invade the

USA. Please, tell me - how do you plan to get here?

Next, yes, people in general are sheep. If you listen to the MSM, you'd think everyone is a sheep. If you talk to people in person, you realize quickly that the MSM is trying to "fake it till they make it." I rarely encounter people IN PERSON, that follow the MSM dogma and are easily swayed. Nearly EVERYONE I encounter personally, doesn't buy their garbage. The few socialists I have encountered don't listen to the MSM either, they are just as much independent thinkers as I am, they just happen to be wrong on many issues. (usually due to their lack of personal experience in life)

I'm from the South. People in my area are very resilient. I come from a large family, and we were raised to be independent and self-sufficient. Yes, there are people who do like nice things. And there are plenty in this area who play the "keeping up with the Joneses" game, but everyone of them I've met also has a keen sense of knowing when enough is enough and I have no doubt, they'd be able to handle themselves well in a crises. (most have lost everything at least once to some natural disaster or bankruptcy)

Are there people like you describe? I don't doubt it. Do they make up the majority of Americans? Maybe, but so far, in my personal sample which numbers in a few thousand, from 5 different states, I'd say not at all likely. I've seen no evidence for it save a few nutjobs on YouTube or the MSM. Ordinary folks who are sensible tend not to make news or be the subjects of viral videos.

I'm not here to pick apart Joseph Smith.

You and another DP'er posted some specific predictions, and I pointed out how they didn't happen the way he said, and that him saying them wasn't special, but what anyone else of modest intelligence AT THE TIME, could have said as well. There are plenty of writings on these subjects. It is not the case that war with Mexico or a Civil War or secession were not even contemplated in the 1820s-40s. On the contrary, there was constant agitation between Washington and the States, and between the Commercial North, and Agrarian South. War with Mexico may not have specifically been predicted, but we were expanding westward and had already had some issues. It wasn't out of the realm of possibility any more than war with Mexico, Iran, or North Korea would be today. (all for various reasons)

Anyone can claim "God revealed this to me" in an attempt to get people to believe him. That's an old trick. It's been done many times. Much of our foreign policy if not all of it revolves in some way around the fact that hundreds, and in some cases a few thousand years ago, this guy or that claimed to hear "God" talking to him and that THIS God that spoke to him was the one, true God.

Or maybe, these guys just heard their own thoughts and used God as a club to beat others into submission with.

History tends to play out along the lines of the latter.

Do not interpret this as I'm saying there isn't God, but I'm always wary of anyone claiming any sort of divine presence or intervention personally. Joseph Smith is no exception.

In this case, what he wrote could have come from anyone at the time. There are plenty of other writings to show he wasn't the only one thinking these things.

And what he wrote, specifically, did not come to pass as he wrote it.

Another prophecy. "Elder

Another prophecy.

"Elder Jesse W. Fox, Sen., received the narration from Father Taylor, the father of the late President John Taylor. The old gentleman said that one time the Prophet Joseph was in his house conversing about the battle of Waterloo, in which Father Taylor had taken part. Suddenly the Prophet Joseph turned and said, "Father Taylor, you will live to see though I will not, greater battles than that of Waterloo. The United States will go to war with Mexico, and thus gain an increase of territory. The slave question will cause a division between the North and the South, and in these wars greater battles than Waterloo will occur. "But," he continued, with emphasis, "when the great Bear (Russia) lays her paw on the lion (England) the winding up scene is not far distant."

These words were uttered before there was any prospect of war with Mexico, and such a thing as division in the United States was never contemplated. Yes, these fierce struggles came, and though Joseph himself was slain before they occurred. Father Taylor lived to witness some of the world's most remarkable battles.

The struggle between the Bear and the Lion has not yet happened, but as surely as Joseph the Prophet ever predicted such an event so surely will it not fail of its fulfillment." - Joseph Smith

Caveat: "President John Taylor" is "president" of the Church

in question, not of the United States, just incase someone didn't know. I was about to say we had no President "John" Taylor, then I looked that up. (We did have a Zachary Taylor and a John Tyler, I thought the "Taylor" was a typo at first)

Sir, as I've stated below, anyone who was politically astute at the time, could have made that call. How do I know this? Because I've read writings of the period. War with Mexico was certainly within the realm of logical possibility and a natural assumption considering our westward expansion.

War between the States ALSO was a natural assumption. These were not things that were "never contemplated." I don't know who's feeding you that bunk, but there is a plethora of writing on the subject long before the Civil War, and during Joseph Smith's time that current trends would have lead to war and break up of the union. It didn't happen all of a sudden in a vacuum. That was a long time coming.

The same is true today.

People who are clueless today about the nature of money will see some of us as prophets for making certain calls. We aren't prophets. We just pay attention.

People who raised up Joseph Smith as a prophet originally, were people who had little understanding of history or weren't good at connecting the dots. (or else they were deceptive intentionally, you can't have it both ways) I'll err on the side that they just weren't astute and mistook his "trend analysis" for prophecy. But make no mistake. He wasn't the only one saying these things, and his warnings are nothing more than trend analysis. He'd be the Gerald Celente of his time. Someone who pays attention? Yes. A prophet that predicts what no one else can (even though they are paying attention)? Hardly.

Right because everyone

Right because everyone predicted it has he did.

December 25th, 1832:

1 Verily, thus saith the Lord concerning the wars that will shortly come to pass, beginning at the rebellion of South Carolina, which will eventually terminate in the death and misery of many souls;

2 And the time will come that war will be poured out upon all nations, beginning at this place.

3 For behold, the Southern States shall be divided against the Northern States

Anyone half politically astute at the time of Joseph

Smith could have made those predictions.

Our founding fathers gave us many more that were even more accurate and "prophetic." That doesn't mean they are prophets of God, it means they were smart and could think past their nose. It means they understood human nature and human history.

To people who are clueless, and who pay attention to nothing around them save bread and circuses, someone making an informed prediction of what is to come at some undetermined time in the future, will always prove to be a "prophet."

This has more to do with the two comparative levels of paying attention to the world around you than the influence of any deity.

Rebellion in South Carolina will result in the death of many souls? You don't say? Boy, you're right, it takes a real prophet to have called that one.

The Southern States shall be divided against the Northern States? Really? Wow. How prescient? (he died in 1844 folks, sectarianism was well entrenched, and was already evident at the Constitutional Convention in 1789)

He got #2 wrong though. The taking of Fort Sumpter didn't result in World War I.

Also, we have no "American Independent Party" at least not one of any note. Nor are we engaged in a war to prevent the sacking of America by foreign powers.

This is not prophecy sir, but a few well aimed guesses.

Seriously?? Part of your

Seriously?? Part of your argument has already been answered so I'll answer the other half. "Also, we have no "American Independent Party" at least not one of any note." You should pay more attention to politics or at least do more research before you decide to speak. No offense. In 1967 two Americans named Eileen and Bill Shearer founded the American Independent party. There's nothing small about this group either. Visit www.aipca.org/

What are you talking about?

What are you talking about? "The taking of Fort Sumpter didn't result in World War I." He said it would start in South Carolina WHICH IT DID AT FORT SUMPTER! Where are you getting World War I? I'm pretty sure you are copying and pasting from an antiMormon website. LOL!

He said the next great war AFTER the current rebellion

So the next war after the Civil War was the Mexican War, then the one with Spain, then World War I, then II.

None of those began in Chicago.

We've had four declared wars since the Civil War, two of them labeled "world wars" and none began in Chicago as he predicted.

The reference to South Carolina was because he said war would be poured out on all the nations from that place (South Carolina). Yet World War I didn't happen because of the taking of Fort Sumpter or any other event in South Carolina. And the Civil War could hardly be considered to be "poured out on all nations."

--

So people who disagree with you are "anti-mormon." Could it be perhaps they just disagree with you? And please, I think for myself. If I were to reference something from another site, I'll provide the link. (Not that I know of any anti-mormon sites mind you, I don't go looking that stuff up)

He was referring to the next

He was referring to the next civil war. He didn't have to specify it in his quote to be referring to it.

And no, he's making it pretty clear that the war poured out

on all nations will be because of #3 which is the split between the north and south and because the south will "call on other nations." And this isn't about the "next civil war" because the first one hadn't happened yet.

You are confounding two separate quotes.

Confounding? HAHA! I think

Confounding? HAHA! I think you are because you mentioned earlier WWI and Fort Sumpter?!

No man, let me show you.

There were TWO quotes.

One talking about the "next great war" starting in Chicago.

But the "next great war" was World War I, and it didn't start in Chicago.

THEN there is another quote, #2 in the list in the Original Post. He predicts in #1 that a Civil War will start in South Carolina. (the one we already fought 16 years after he died, not some future war that hasn't happened yet)

Then in #2 he says that from "this place" aka - South Carolina, war will be poured out on all the nations.

In #3 he says WHY this will be (on all the nations) because the Northern and Southern States will split and fight each other, and the South will ask for help from other nations drawing them in, which will lead to our civil war spreading through the whole world.

THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

We did get war "poured out on all the nations" but that didn't happen till World War I, which had NOTHING to do with South Carolina or any fight between the North and South.

I didn't confound anything.

I pointed out how in two separate quotes, his predications failed three-fold.

We got a Civil War, but it didn't spread to other nations.

We got a "next great war" but it didn't start in Chicago.

We got a war that "poured out on all nations" but that didn't start in South Carolina as he predicted.

The existence of World War I, proves that his "next great war" prediction starting in Chicago was false. It also proves that the war that did "pour out on all nations" didn't start in South Carolina and had nothing to do with the Civil War.

He was wrong about the extent of the civil war. And he was wrong about the "next great war."

Got it now?

Yeah he would.

He said "great war" and it looks like the source's author inserted "U.S. Civl War" as an explanation.

If Smith didn't specify civil war and there is no other document to show he meant that, then the source is interpreting so as to make Smith not proven wrong - yet.

The "Great War" that followed the Civil War was World War I, and it didn't start in South Carolina.

There are two places he was wrong - #2 above and the other "next great war" quote.

Remember this quote when the

Remember this quote when the countries of the world wish to divide us up. It doesn't matter because you too will say that it was just a good guess and that anyone could have guessed it right.

For as long as there has been a United States of America

there has been talk of its break up and demise.

It doesn't take a genius or a prophet to hazard a guess that political leaders through factionalism will take the nation down a path that will lead to invasion. Our Founders warned of this with factionalism as well. They warned that factions would lead to breakup of the union both through internal disagreements as well as outside influence gaining a foothold because of it.

However, at this juncture of history, it would take a full scale all out the World against the U.S.A. to even make a successful dent in trying to invade this country. Anyone trying to do so would not just be fighting an army. They would be fighting every citizen as well, at least 1/3 of which are armed, and a large portion of that, to the teeth. No single country or even small group of countries would dare invade the USA. It would be a suicide mission. So how does your prophecy jive with this political reality?

You can't be serious? We our

You can't be serious? We are on the verge of VERY serious economic conditions that will retard the peoples defenses greatly. Most wars are suicide missions for the troops.

Right because citizens are going to shoot pistols and rifles at planes and helicopters? Normandy like invasions will occur again. Casualties of the enemy will be high but they'll reach their destination either way.

On the contrary, we did not fight the Revolution nor the

Civil War during a period of prosperity. Nor World War I or II. And there could be some debate that we were in a prosperous period during the Spanish or Mexican wars as well.

The War of 1812 might have seen some relative prosperity, but it too was fought by a fledgling nation. (were it not for the Battle of New Orleans victory, we may have well lost the war)

Wars generally never occur during "good times." That's kind of how it works. They only get started because of economic reasons when conditions are poor or unstable. Prosperity rarely if ever breeds war.

If you think all the American people have at their private

disposal are rifles and pistols then you are REALLY out of the loop. Start paying attention.

Americans hold some pretty massive weaponry in private hands.

But that isn't the point. Sure, a well equipped army could steam role through our cities. But that doesn't a victory make. Ever turn on CNN lately? Fox News? How's the 'wars' in Afghanistan and Iraq going lately against two NON ARMIES?

And then, most of those people are not armed - nothing close to what we have here.

To defeat the USA, you'd have to take every city, block by block, and every square inch of rural land. That won't happen without surrender. And there are too many well armed Americans that will never surrender.

You seriously need to read up on military strategy and preparedness. This is not a new topic here on DP or elsewhere. The USSR generals were asked after the Cold War about their invasion plans. They were puzzled at the question. They had plans to nuke us to the stone age, yes. But invasion plans? That would be national suicide on their part. In their own words, they would not know just "who" the enemy would be, because the enemy would be EVERYBODY. They wouldn't just be fighting an army, they would be fighting the entire population.

Come out of your cave sir. There is much to learn.

It never says that the United

It never says that the United States will be conquered. I don't understand why you are implying that it will.

Are you saying that NO ONE would ever attack us because of our numbers? Your arguments are poor truly. What you are suggesting would imply that no person or country would attack the Roman Empire because they are too many! HAHA! Come on man!

Anyone would be a fool for trying and wouldn't get very far.

The "prophecy" claims that the war will be so bad half the army will quit and the "people" or "boys in the mountains" will have to come save them.

I'm telling you sir, it will never reach that point. The People will begin fighting immediately. They will not let their country be overrun and let the Army be their only defense.

And there is another good reason we have not been invaded. It's called geography.

Any nation with even a hint of the ability to put forth the mechanized warfare needed to invade the U.S.A. has NO WAY TO GET HERE without us picking them off on the way here.

Mexico and Canada, nor anyone in South America has the military capability to invade us. That means the helicopters and tanks you worry about have to be brought here on a BOAT.

We have the largest most powerful navy on Earth counting all of human history. I don't think we are invincible, but it would take a world wide concerted effort to even ATTEMPT to invade the USA and approach the fulfilling of this "prophecy."

And then, it would never reach the point of half the army deserting because we were losing so bad.

Might I suggest your faith that should be in the American people has been misplaced into Joseph Smith? It seems you put an inordinate amount of stock in Joseph Smith. He was merely doing trend analysis. Today, that trend analysis says something different because the times are different.

Had someone tried to invade the U.S. DURING the Civil War, yes, he may have been right. (but still not a prophet)

Now? Forget it.