-11 votes

Mobilize a 5 mln-Strong Ron Paul Army with Student Debt "Amnesty"!

UPDATE: I added quotation marks to the word AMNESTY becaue too many posters wrongly equate it with debt forgiveness. What does one call a temporary stay on repayment, though? Not "Moratorium". That means a block on student loan issuance. Amnesty seemed to be the proper word for the temporary stay on repayment. Any ideas on a more proper term is welcome for future discussion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t901d4AiaFA&feature=player_em...

Roll to the very end of the Alex Jones Nightly News Episode featuring Dr. Webster Tarpley. At the end, Dr. Tarpley unveils his main rallying point for the mass strike movement:

Student Loan Amnesty.

Put off the $1 trn student loan obligations, a crushing yoke on every young person working for a better life, until the end of the New Depression. This would be a goal for taking the mass strike movement away from the Koch Bros. and George Soros, while removing all possibility of the divisive right/left paradigm.

This is for Dr. Paul's campaign to act on, and act on swiftly!

By formulating a comprehensive student loan amnesty proposal and publishing it in every student publication and transmission, there ought to be a surge of young activists away from the Obama campaign and to Dr. Paul.

Campaigning for Dr. Paul and getting the word out is more progressive than getting arrested for marching like lost ducklings on the Brooklyn Bridge.



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Refinancing under new terrms

It's probably the best lesson they'll learn from college.

When government officials says the economy is healthy, it might be a lie or just plain ignorance.

How many presumed that the government would not allow them to do something financially irresponsible. Who knew? But the banks are collecting interest on the principle.

If Congress bails out the students, the banks get the money.

Or the students should just pay the loans by refinancing for a longer or delayed terms.

Free includes debt-free!

Who was the debtor?

on these alleged student loans? Most of these if not all, are just as fraudulent as the mortgages; no funds were loaned to the alleged borrower. The funds went directly to the institution, unlike back in the 70s when the funds went (at least some of the time) to the student.

So recent student "borrowers" who pay back the loans do so out of a mistaken belief that they received something from someone other than themselves, when in fact they did the lending.

Phil. 4:13

deferral...

the cost of education needs to be lowered.

students need to turn the situation around - perhaps there should be a concerted effort for education to be gotten through different means thereby financially starving the colleges until they come to their senses and lower tuition costs.

The law cannot make a wicked person virtuous…God’s grace alone can accomplish such a thing.
Ron Paul - The Revolution

Setting a good example is a far better way to spread ideals than through force of arms. Ron Paul

it's called hardship or forebearance

and you can already get this for a year from gov't loans..all you have to do is request it. I did it twice because my salary could not support me and my loans, but I worked hard and paid them off and so should everyone else.

Really bad idea.

You have no clue who Dr.Paul is if you think he'd ever go for something like that. He DEALS with the problems head on..putting off the issue for a later date and pandering for votes is what the other candidates do, including Obama.

You might think "They'll win if we don't do it".. I'd say good, because when everyone is done feeling good about getting what they wanted RIGHT NOW and the economy crashes..which is liable to happen anyway, then those of us who are on the side of common sense will have a better chance to take this country back.

Patriot Cell #345,168
I don't respond to emails or pm's.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=qo8CmO...
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution, inevitable.

Forebearance, I think, is the word

you're looking for.

Yeah, well...I would be

Yeah, well...I would be pissed. I started paying mine back in '97 and did not get it paid off until 2 years ago, after switching it to interest free periods on a multitude of credit cards and struggling like mad to get it paid. If they were too stupid to KNOW they had to pay it back, what were they even doing in college?? AND my student loan interest was 8.75%..so, don't get me started...

Grace period

perhaps.

New Hampshire and Ecuador.

Why is debt forgiveness a bad thing?

I just happen to have this in my clipboard, as I just used it in another response.
There is a long standing precedent for debt forgiveness, it was called "Jubilee" and it is what we need. Forgiveness is almost always good, even of debts. And if a few unworthy of forgiveness accidentally get forgiven in the fray, well, I mean - look at the alternatives.

http://www.biblestudy.org/godsrest/what-is-the-jubilee-year....

Love or fear? Choose again with every breath.

not this thread again

come on now. So do you support forgiving mortgage loans too? How about car loans? How about the computer I paid $1200 for and just had the hard drive crash on after barely a year? These people took out a loan, and if they did not realize there was a risk that there could be no job to pay it back with, then maybe they weren't bright enough for college. They can work extra jobs, quit buying Iphones, Netflix, etc. and do like everyone before them did which was do whatever they needed to pay it back.

You gotta be joking.

So we send a message to everyone that if you get in over your head you don't have to pay your loans back?

Who else would be lining up for a deal like that.

No, that's a major problem with this nation, we don't take responsibility for ourselves and our actions, nor do we have to when we have an easy out. We'll just make everyone else pay for us.

Patriot Cell #345,168
I don't respond to emails or pm's.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=qo8CmO...
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution, inevitable.

The bottom line as in any Court is ;

what would it take to make each side whole? No more, no less.

A Miracle. Or perhaps

A Miracle.

Or perhaps tabletop, cold fusion if it is cheap enough. Absent that, most of the bubble era debt won't be repaid.

The special issue with student loans, is that they don't get erased in bankruptcy. All that's really needed is to change that.

Then, if you're bankrupt, you're bankrupt. You lose everything you've got, and whoever f'd up by lending to you loses the rest. Simple as heck, if it wasn't for all the busybodies who can't stay the heck away from the lives of others.

Place a temporary stay of execution on the amortization.

I believe this is the proper terminology.
Why not, it would simply apply or not apply the interest accrual. That's fine with me. Kids have been hoodwinked by government facts and figures, on what jobs are in the future. So in some respects the government is at fault to some who used that info.

If you understand the loan industry you will understand that all these student loans only hold a 10% of value demand. So anything above 10% is profit to the lender. The FED makes the rules as they print money so they could discharge at least 90% of the debt less expenses involved.
Those who got their education, certainly owe for what they got.
Home mortgages is another subject.. If you default you loose the home of course. A loan forgiveness value of 90% is also possible because that is what is left after the 10% demand value, less costs and penalty for default on your promise. All loans are only secured by 10% value at any point of origination. So it would be possible. The Bankers are not going to like it. They would stand to lose on the 10% they could have placed towards another loan value.
Good luck with this.
Politics and pandering is what brought us to this point. The Loan institutions simply did what they were told to do, though the loan institutions may have been making the rules for the government and themselves, as they become the governemnt when pandering is involved. Now students and home borrowers are left to clean up their mess.

In any court proceding it is the objective of the Court to make the persons involved whole. No more, no less.

I don't agree with this idea,

I don't agree with this idea, although it surely would help out the indebted college students/graduates a lot. All it really does is shifts the burden of the debt on to the taxpayers.

I'd rather see government no longer guaranteeing or financing student loans and enable student loan debt to be discharged through bankruptcy just like any other debt. Make non-government lenders take the risk of lending college money and if they made bad choices as to who they lend to then it's their problem to deal with.

If student loan amnesty was to happen then I think it should rather be an equal amount to all people. Anyone with student loan debts would have to apply the money to student loan debt first. Then remaining money would be applied to credit card debt, auto loans then mortgages. Anything left over after paying off debts would go directly to the individual. People who have no debt.... well, lucky day for them as they will simply get the money and can do with it as they please. If anyone is going to get huge sums of money, for whatever reason, then it should go to everyone. Some people might not even get enough if their student loan debt exceeds whatever amount is decided on. $100k to every single citizen would be something like $30T. Lots of money, be ready for hyperinflation h*ll. It's a bad idea but we all know the government is notorious for bad ideas. I'd rather see lenders on the hook for lending people too much or lending to people who cannot repay.

...

Sallie Mae makes it impossible to pay back loans

Sallie Mae makes it impossible for people to pay back student loans.

Student Loan Scam - 60 Minutes Investigates Sallie Mae
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7OHrVKNIvw

Those here on the DP who would defend Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac come forward and defend Sallie Mae.

The TRUE originator of any loan in America is none of these

programs . The originator is the Federal Reserve who lends to the Treaury Dept,Who lends to the programs. Expenses would have to go through these entities to figure repayment or forgiveness figures. Nothing is FREE.

So what the kid took out a loan for more than he could pay back?

If the kid worked at a job and saved up to pay for college(like I did) he would not have this problem.

I saw nothing in that video that backs your statement 'Sallie Mae makes it impossible for people to pay back student loans'.

And in what century did you earn enough to pay for school?

And in what century did you earn enough to pay for school? It might not be THIS century. Not with 15-30% ANNUAL tuition increases since the early 90s when PEll grants and government guaranteed student loans became the primary means of affording college.

When I started attending state college in 1992, it was $700 a semester. When I graduated in 1996, it was $2300 a semester. Today? Its like $8000. Come on. Something's severely wrong with this system.

Grads are being throttled by this usury and inflationary scam, and people are saying "let em die!" like in the debate.

"Cowards & idiots can come along for the ride but they gotta sit in the back seat!"

I went back to school when I

I went back to school when I was in my 40's and graduated in 1996, December. I got some grants, worked delivering pizza, and got student loans. By having good credit I was finally able to keep transferring the balance to credit cards with no interest introductory rates. My interest had been over 8% and that loan was going NOWHERE after paying on it 8 years. Once I started doing that, I made progress and finally, about 3 years ago, paid it off. If those little twirps get their loans forgiven I will be PISSED. It is like buying a home at a high interest rate (for me) and they need to realize that they will have a LOAN they chose to get, that has to be paid off! Where is the wrong in that? If they too stupid to know they have to pay a loan back, then when they graduated were they not smarter? If not, then maybe they have a point....

Just like housing easy loans

Just like housing easy loans = higher prices.

So you probably think everyone that bought a house with a loan in the last 10 years should have their mortgage erased as well?

This kid signed on the dotted line for the loan. This lazy kid wanted the easy money to pay for an overpriced degree. So what?

If less kids went the easy money route then colleges wouldn't be able to increase their tuition every year.

ps. I went to a community college($18 a credit if I remember correctly) for 2 years then transferred to a state college because that's what I could afford at the time. Not that it mattered anyways, the business I own now has zero to do with anything I went to college for.

Couldn't pay off my mortgage if I wanted

I bought a home on mortgage in 2006. I recently found out that if I walked in and laid down every last dime that I owe on this place that I still could not own it, because as of 2007 my mortgage company who holds the lien no longer exists, though I have been paying my monthly mortgage to a "collection company" working for my non-existent lien holders debtors, and has no authority to transfer the lien to me.
I could pay it off but I won't own it, and I can't sell it.

So you tell me, should I continue to pay monthly payments for something I'll never have legal right to claim? Or should I pay the price for my "easy money route" of working 20 yrs saving for a downpayment and mal-investing? Or am I victim of fraud and my deed awarded to me if for no other reason than the lien holder does not exist and property possesion is 9/10ths of the law? You probably call that "mortgage forgiveness" or "mortgage amnesty" - I call it compensatory and punitive damage award.

I'm not a lawyer and I'm sure

I'm not a lawyer and I'm sure others here could answer your questions better than I. A few questions I would have are:

How does a non-existent company hold a lien on your property?

Can the 'collection company' take your house if you don't pay them? Do they hold title/deed?

Personally I'd have a tough time justifying paying a monthly mortgage to a collection company working for my non-existent lien holders... but I doubt I know all the facts in your case.

Mortgage Company went belly-up

** How does a non-existent company hold a lien on your property?

The company I took out my mortgage with went belly-up in the housing market collapse. Same company holds 1 out of 10 mortgage liens in just my county alone.

I wasn't even notified that the company went out of business. My monthly mortgage payments remained the same. The company letter head on my monthly statements changed. When I asked about the name change I was told "we collect the payments for your mortgage company". When I call my mortgage company telephone number these people answer the phone - so I thought nothing of it. It wasn't until 2 months ago that I received my monthly statement and my mortgage payment had increased 50% overnight. Turns out this "collection agency" paid my yearly property taxes before I even received my tax bill in the mail and then billed me for it, informing me that I'm supposed to be maintaining a tax escrow. Tax escrow was not part of my contract with my mortgage company - I chose this mortgage company and paid a higher down payment specifically to not have a tax escrow - so I could pay my own taxes and keep my right to withhold my property taxes if ever I needed to protest my taxes. This is how I knew something was afoul. To bring my mortgage payments back down to normal I wrote a check to my so called mortgage collection company for payment of my taxes. I then heard the story about the local family of a soldier killed in action, who went to the court house to pay-off their home only to find out they couldn't - so I went to the Recorder of Deeds in my county and found out what millions of homeowners in the US do not yet know - 75% of mortgages issued between 2000-2009 (97% of mortgages issued between 2005-2007), the deeds can never be transferred.

** Can the 'collection company' take your house if you don't pay them?

They can send me a foreclosure notice. They can serve me with an eviction notice. If I didn't know what I know now, and I leave my home upon eviction, yes they could assume legal possession. But now my taxes are paid via my mortgage payments, so if I don't pay my mortgage my taxes don't get paid and the government take my home.

** Do they hold title/deed?

No the title/deed never leaves your county courthouse. A mortgage is a lien on the deed. The deed is in the homeowners name and the mortgage lender puts a lien on the title/deed until the mortgage is paid. If the homeowner sells the house, the lien holder gets paid first and then lifts the lien, clearing the deed for transfer to the new owner.

I could pay off the lien but the lien won't be lifted therefor I can not transfer it. I can't sell it. I can't borrow against it. My credit will always show a lien on my home. I've already paid nearly $50k (will never get back), and still owe 40K or so on this place that will always be a "negative" asset. I did not borrow irresponsibly - I had a attorney go over the contract before I closed the deal. I did not borrow more than I could afford to repay - I can very much afford my monthly mortgage payments. My property value is not under water either - the value went down, but it's still assessed higher than the price-tag I agreed to when I took the place.

Like I said MILLIONS of people are likely in the same boat as I am, most of whom are just not aware of it yet. One of these days, thousands and thousands of dollars in mortgage payments down the drain they're gonna be in for a rude awakening to say the least.

wait...

what happens if you want to leave this property with family in your will? is this house and land not yours even though you paid for it? what about private property rights? surely, there's something about that in the state constitutions, not to mention the federal constitution. there must be a way to fight this.

thank you very much

*what about private property rights?

Thank you very much arielle. I was beginning to think for a minute libertarians had completely vanished from the RP camp.

*there must be a way to fight this.

There is. But it seems the general consensus is what needs to be done is somehow "mortgage amnesty" or "mortgage forgiveness" as if it would be some kind of handout from taxpayers or something. The handout has already occurred when the taxpayers bailed out the sob's that pulled this crap on millions of homeowners like myself. It's not like my mortgage company is gonna take my payments and pay back the taxpayers for the bail-out. No the banksters are gonna get paid twice for our homes -once from the bailout -once again from the mortgage borrowers. I don't want a damn thing from taxpayers - heck I am a taxpayer too. But I have to admit I'm a big fan of entitlements. These entitlements include but are not limited to

1.) Private property rights
2.) Freedom from force and fraud
3.) Contract law enforcement

I'm not asking for a freebie or a handout just my entitlements.

I hear all these uneducated advocates of free market economics echoing how "liquidating the debt and clearing the bad assets" is part of the solution to our current crises... jeez we're talking about potentially millions of properties that will forever have a lien against them. Even if they have already been paid for -in some cases paid for twice - they will forever be classified as negative assets on the homeowners credit.

**what happens if you want to leave this property with family in your will?

Good question. I've wondered about that a lot over the past few months. I have no idea what, or how, to plan for that.

Thanks again arielle.

i thought you might find this article interesting.

nevada is catching on to the scam:
http://www.housingpredictor.com/2011/illegal-foreclosures-fe...
maybe, this is the beginnings of a solution...hope it gains traction.

no authority?

how can that collection agency claim no authority to transfer deeds? didn't they gain ownership when they bought the accounts?--is it the collection agency that owns your property when it's paid off?-- if they don't have the titles, then who does? and shouldn't you be paying them? this is tricksy and false. i beg for a paper trail. i wonder if this information is public record?

edit: why can't the collection agency lift the lien if it's paid off? i think i missed that part.

Right..much less buy

Right..much less buy something I would not own after paying for it. That makes no sense. Sounds like the above company could not prove you even owe the debt if they can not give title when it is paid off..weird!

cuts both ways

much less buy something I would not own after paying for it.

I own it. It's deeded to me. It'll just have a forever lien against it. So after I pay it off, if I decide to sell it the lien holder gets paid first off the top. In that case the lien holder would be paid twice for the place and I still could not transfer the place to the new owner.

**Sounds like the above company could not prove you even owe the debt if they can not give title when it is paid off..

Yes that appears to be the case, but it could go the other way... My biggest concern is I pay it off and someday the lien holder comes forward and claims that I never paid them and it's not their fault that I sent my mortgage payments to the "wrong" company and take my home from me anyway. How convenient would it be if by then the collection company that I sent my payments to were "out-of-business" non-existent and I can't sue them to get my money back? And either way how much will it be costing me in legal fees to straighten it all out - the now mess that was once my American dream?