3 votes

Can We Remove the Income Tax?

Is it possible to remove the income tax, death tax, and cap gains tax by eliminating most if not all of foreign spending? I wondered if we cut all foreign aide and parts of our military budget would we be able to eliminate these taxes?

I thought of this a week ago and thought this is the best way to go because cutting demestic spending would reach to much resistance from the left. Does anyone have the numbers?

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The "Income" Tax

Folks,
The Income Tax, 26 USC, is constitutional. However, it is misapplied through deception and intimidation.
Question: Do you have "income?"
Question: Are you subject to and liable for the "income"tax?
Probably not. But...
The answers are here, and learn the simple truth about the "Income" tax:
www.Tax-Freedom.com
Law firm has researched this and defended people for over twenty years. This will blow you away.

taxthis

You are correct

The Income Tax is 100% constitutional. I am not familiar with the "Tax Freedom" site, but I can tell you that after reading "Income Tax: Shattering the Myths", I now know the true application of income tax.

Please check out the site http://www.incometaxtruth.com and watch the video plus download sample of the book.

You won't be disappointed!

Americans are ignorant of proper application of Income Tax!

There is no need to remove the income tax, because the federal (and State) income tax has not been imposed on most Americans living and working within the U.S.

The problem is that Americans are not familiar with what the law actually says. Granted, it is written purposely in a confusing way, but the law is still out there for anyone to read.

Dave Champion has written a book titled, "Income Tax: Shattering the Myths". The website is http://www.incometaxtruth.com.

The book details actual law, Supreme Court decisions and IRS's own internal documentation. After reading this book, not only you will understand the law, but you will also be very angry for learning the truth.

Dave Champion has not filed federal income tax returns in 20 years and IRS knows about it. Yet, he is not in jail, because he is following the law! There is nothing IRS can do to you if you follow the law.

All we need to do is educate everyone about what the law says, then the system will simply fall apart.

The truth will come out.

Wanton things the taxman does will not harm you?

Innocents punished. Tax law, statute, code, judgment, ruling, opinion, letter... especially related to income tax... is convoluted mess. Muck! ... Raking that sticky muck does not clean it up.

Income tax (aka: the War Tax) ended after WW I, 1918. Our government sent letters out stating as much. The whole imposition of income tax is based on lies. And worse.

What you write is a way many approach income tax. As you approach a villain, can you trust what he has written deceptively in his past, as consolation that wanton things he continues to do will not harm you?

I suggest we clean up this mess... Lest innocents are harmed.

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

Innocents (read also

Innocents (read also ignorant) are punished to create fear. This does not change the true application of law and what it is.

Just like you would not allow a government official to just walk into your house and do whatever he pleases, you cannot be intimidated by IRS. Believe it or not, they are following the law, and they will not touch you if you do too.

There is no proper

There is no proper application of an income tax; no matter how it's implemented, it seizes property without due process or just compensation, it requires people to give testimony that may tend to incriminate them, and it violates the right to privacy.

All taxes should be solely for the purposes of raising revenue for those few duties Congress is allowed to discharge, and they should be raised solely from excise taxes on services and new goods, provided they do not violate the first amendment as a "sin tax". I could support poll taxes if necessary to raise revenue to run elections.

I would also apply these same restrictions to state and local governments, because there's no point defeating tyranny in Washington if we're just going to bring it closer to home.

These are the defining principles of the Republican Party platform; smaller government and very limited taxation, and we shouldn't take any candidate seriously who doesn't support them in full.

True, but

What you are saying is true. The government will always violate the law.

However, in the case of the federal income tax, guess who is enforcing the misapplication of income tax? Americans are doing it to themselves! IRS is nowhere in site.

How many times you were "forced" to sign W-4 or W-2 so you can work? Every time, but when you were signing it did you think whether you are a "U.S. Person"?

"U.S. Person" has a special limited meaning in the law. You cannot apply common English definition to it. That is not how law works, and that is what the ignorance is about.

"Income Tax: Shattering the Myths" explains that to you. You will understand the law, and when you do, we can stop infringing on Americans' rights by not having them sign forms that do not apply to them.

It is actually very simple, but people are stubborn. They do not want to learn the truth. They think they know it all!

What do you think of this?

By increasing the number of allowances on your W-4, you reduce the amount of tax being withheld.

This seems like an instant pay increase, but it isn't. Indeed, your checks will be bigger, but you have to be disciplined enough to put a portion (similar to what was originally being withheld) in an account. But if you choose an interest-bearing account, it's worth it.

This also sticks it to the government. When you normally withhold all that money every paycheck, it's like giving the government an interest free loan for which they make interest off of before you get that money back to pay taxes.

Basically, you are choosing to make interest off of your money instead of the government.

Again, to make this work, you need the discipline to set that money aside to pay income taxes. With online banking automated features, this becomes easy.

Employment? What century is this?

You're better off avoiding any line of work in its entirety that involves a W-4/W-2 and is classified as "employment."

Employment is an oddball creation of late 19th/early 20th century industrialism, and it's outdated and useless in the modern information age.

Large governments involved in economic affairs have outlived their usefulness. It's high time we retire such childish and obsolete ideologies.

Just in case anyone wants to

Just in case anyone wants to try this, there are penalties for doing this. You pay fines if you haven't contributed a certain amount at the time you pay your taxes.

Just in case anyone thinks of doing this in order to make money off it. Factor in the fees.

Plan for eliminating the national debt in 10-20 years:

Overview: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2010/09/12/my-plan-for-reducin...

Specific cuts; defense spending: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/more-detailed-look-a

Thanks. You can claim only the number of allowances...

You can claim only the number of allowances which you are entitled.

Just look at a W4's instructions or google it.

Happy free interest!

The US gives very little *directly* in foreign aide

indirectly it gives a lot, such as this war

Anyway, get out of debt and you could then eliminate the income tax fairly easily.

Income tax eliminated multiple times. Warn't nothing to it.

1895 Supreme Court. After 1918 WW I Armistice, Nov 11, 1918.
Etc.

Enjoy history.

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

NO. We need the income tax

NO. We need the income tax to finance the national debt. The only way to abolish the income tax is to abolish the Fed.

Nah! Ain't no proper income tax in the United States of America.

Unconstitutional "Legal Fiction." Foist upon us. No longer needed. WW I Armistice, Nov 11, 1918 ended the war. Cast away by the US Treasury letter after WW I stating the "War Tax" is over.

But, the Income Tax zealots could not help themselves... They sent out income tax forms anyway. Folks, feeling obligated, filled the dang obsolete forms out & dutifully paid tax that never was.

"The Law that Never Was" website includes Income Tax, 16th and Senate, 17th Amendment Ratification Research, and pending lawsuit information about this mess.
http://www.thelawthatneverwas.com/new/theman.asp

State Archives (many troubling & many missing)

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

Let'em eat their cooking! Stir, knead & darn the National Debt.

Ain't needing no National debt. "Sovereign debt?" An oxymoron that even an ox won't pull! "Legal fiction!"

The Fed has been a travesty from the start. Ain't getting better.

  • The Fed gifted $16 Trillion in secret loans since 2007. They refused to admit to Congress & lied that they didn't do such things. Ron Paul pushed their flaming hot denials aside & got them to confess this year. They have yet to repent their wayward ways.
  • The economy is a side show. $15 Trillion annually.
  • The National Debt is a freak show. $15 Trillion, so they say. No public audit of this 97 year old bill.
    The national debt is a freak show!

Yes, Income tax is squandered covering up the National Debt interest (to make it uninteresting to the public eye). Income Tax receipts are shoveled to cover National Debt interest & transfer payments (those that work pay those that don't); not one nickel goes to any service hard working taxpayers expect. See President Reagan administration's "Grace Commission, 1984."

Submitted by Mark Twain on Mon, 09/06/2010 - 01:08.
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/143510#comment-1530467

    President Reagan asked innocently, "Where do all our income tax payments go?" He created the "Grace Commission" to find out

Even if those villains stir their liquidity, oxen won't drink it. Even a baker kneads it & throws it in the oven, oxen won't eat it. Even if a tailor darns it, measuring account with it is folly. It is admittedly elastic. Not good for even measuring. Cannot mend a hole with it. Their dang dollar concoction won't hold water. It makes an awful mess.

We'd best start cleaning.

  • End the Fed: Loaning you blind since 1913.
  • End their payment system... They are the payee. Income tax, since 1913.
  • End allegiance to the 16th & 17th Constitutional amendments. False flags waving to a dismayed public. A fog. A farce, since 1913.

Oxen are willing to help haul the trash. Maybe use 20 mule teams through the hot spots. Get this country Borax clean!

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

Of course we can remove the

Of course we can remove the income tax if we are willing to cut spending.

Please consider there are many ways to stop a wrong.

There is no proper income tax in the United States of America. See, "The law that never was." US court case pending for years. The government seek delay, upon delay.

Learn where income tax payments go. Learn why they pay the interest on the "National Debt." Learn why you cannot pay off the "National Debt" with "National Debt" receipts (Federal Reserve Notes).

Fed Reserve makes stealth loans to banks, foreign & domestic to the tune of $16 Trillion (2008-2011). The total exceeds:

  • $15 Trillion annual measure of our economy, GDP.
  • $15 Trillion summation of outstanding "Nation Debt."

Something is grossly amiss.

Would you cut cloth with an elastic measuring tape?

    "An Act To provide for the establishment of Federal reserve banks, to furnish an elastic currency, ..."

Shipwrights & other carpenters use study measuring tapes made of steel. Why are prices measured with elasticity in liquidity? Why are accounts of such elastic liquidity held to account? To whom doth the bell holder toll?

End the Fed: Loaning you blind, since 1913.

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

No. Quite simply, our

No.

Quite simply, our military + HS spends about 1.1 trillion per year.

Add the debt to that and you would surpass the amount brought in by the income tax. Not counting estate tax, the CGT, or the corporate tax.

People also forget, that the 16th amendment does not grant Congress the power to tax...it just allows Congress to tax without apportionment. That was the main reason it was passed. That too, taxes on income had been considered constitutional long before the 16th amendment's passing...see the taxes enacted on the mid 1800s. Issues with apportionment came with taxes like property tax, corporate tax, dividend tax, etc.

Even if you consider income taxes to be direct taxes, they could still tax us, but not inviduals; they would tax states. States would have to come up with the money. This kind of policy would enormously benefit states like California, Maryland, Mass., New York, etc. and hurts states like Arkansas, Mississippi, Kentucky, etc.

Plan for eliminating the national debt in 10-20 years:

Overview: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2010/09/12/my-plan-for-reducin...

Specific cuts; defense spending: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/more-detailed-look-a

Yes. Quite simply. There ain't a proper income tax here.

Best wishes on your study.
http://www.thelawthatneverwas.com/

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

Accepting that the study was

Accepting that the study was true, 42 states ratified the amendment if my memory serves correctly. If four of those were fradulent, then 38 still approved it.

In any case, income taxes had long been considered constitutional.

Plan for eliminating the national debt in 10-20 years:

Overview: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2010/09/12/my-plan-for-reducin...

Specific cuts; defense spending: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/more-detailed-look-a

Wrong! Counting bunches of wrong, ain't making right!

Please study the matter. There is no proper income tax in the United States. It was, is & will be wrong.

Please see Supreme Court decision, 1885. Tossed out the income tax. Ruled against it 5 times.

After WW I, the US government, yet again quit the income tax. They wrote letters to income tax payers saying the "War Tax" is over.

Please enjoy & benefit from your study.

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

Which case was this in 1885?

Which case was this in 1885?

Plan for eliminating the national debt in 10-20 years:

Overview: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2010/09/12/my-plan-for-reducin...

Specific cuts; defense spending: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/more-detailed-look-a

1895. Eliminated income tax of 1894.

Please enjoy your study.

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

The case of Pollock did not

The case of Pollock did not eliminiate the income tax on wages. It eliminated the income tax on income derived from interest, rent, and dividends. That was what the specific part of the Wilson-Gorman act that the court found was unconstitutional.

"First. We adhere to the opinion already announced—that, taxes on real estate being indisputably direct taxes, taxes on the rents or income of real estate are equally direct taxes.
Second. We are of opinion that taxes on personal property, or on the income of personal property, are likewise direct taxes.
Third. The tax imposed by sections 27 to 37, inclusive, of the act of 1894, so far as it falls on the income of real estate, and of personal property, being a direct tax, within the meaning of the constitution, and therefore unconstitutional and void, because not apportioned according to representation, all those sections, constituting one entire scheme of taxation, are necessarily invalid.
The decrees hereinbefore entered in this court will be vacated. The decrees below will be reversed, and the cases remanded, with instructions to grant the relief prayed. [158 U.S. 601, 638] "

Also, as aforementioned, 42 states ratified the 16th amendment.

Plan for eliminating the national debt in 10-20 years:

Overview: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2010/09/12/my-plan-for-reducin...

Specific cuts; defense spending: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/more-detailed-look-a

1895. Three strikes against. None in favor. It is outlaw.

Outlaw & they knew it.

Strikes: First, second, & third. Wax eloquent about direct tax is unconstitutional; yet, direct tax on a man's labor is as any man senses, is a direct tax. One would have to take leave of his senses to conclude otherwise.

Income tax on a man's wage is about as direct as any individual tax gets. Ask any that are bitten by the levee.

Thank you for presenting the facts of the matter.

And if your recounting 42 states gets you any closer to the facts, more power to you. That 42 includes the following mischief:

William Jennings Bryan got credit for Knox 's vile deeds?
Submitted by Mark Twain on Tue, 09/20/2011 - 17:22.
http://www.dailypaul.com/135952/what-was-the-logic-behind-th...

    Since several states were out of session at the time of the vote, have they been deprived of equal Suffrage in the U.S. Senate because they did not participate in the ratification of this amendment? Is fraud (non ratification) enough to allow a state to declare it null and void in their state?

    No Action taken: Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Maryland, Delaware. No record for Oregon, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Vermont, Washington State.

    [No debate. No vote. Different version. No last paragraph.: California. Etc.]

Telegraph charges by the word. [Stop]

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

As Ron Paul supporters love

As Ron Paul supporters love to say, you can't take a modern definition of a word and apply it to something written in the past. Whatever you feel indirect and direct implies, the founders did not.

Proof that delaware ratified it:

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=F7071FF93D...

If these states hadn't ratified it, wouldn't they have protested? Wouldn't they have said something? You would think that Kentucky would violently and vehemently deny approving the amendment...yet not a word.

Plan for eliminating the national debt in 10-20 years:

Overview: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2010/09/12/my-plan-for-reducin...

Specific cuts; defense spending: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/more-detailed-look-a

I come not to defend the Fed... But to bury it! Shovel or pick?

You are kidding? Speak no... Hear no... See no...

You should enjoy more about the Money Trust & their seditious activity creating a monopoly-money system, complete with an elastic currency.... and other purposes.

State representatives were rightfully horrified.

Popular uprising begging for an income tax? Must I believe the states wanted the Feds to lord over us foisting an income tax?

Feds steal control over state representation in the US Senate? Please reflect on who lied to whom.

States firing back at the Fed: Mc Faddin, Pennsylvania Rep; Senator Lindbergh, Minnesota.

Trees fall near roots. Telegraph charges mount. [Stop]

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

Yes. Simply eliminated after Nov 11, 1918 WW I Armistice.

Best wishes on your study.

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

Don't know for sure, but here's another potential solution

We should push selling federal lands. Surprisingly, Obama has even reportedly been doing this to a small extent. If we could sell federally controlled land & put it back into the private sector where it can make a profit (rather than be a drain as it is now), we could use it to make up the difference for cutting those taxes.

The left would strongly oppose it, so the first step would be for the federal government to control back over to the states. This would allow conservative states at least to sell it, & there would be nothing the leftists could do.