14 votes

Can Catholics, protestants and atheists stand together for Ron Paul?

In another post, I asked my fellow Catholic brothers and sisters in Christ to ask for the intercession of a certain Saint to help keep Ron Paul safe and continued success. It wasn't long before the thread became a flame board of insults and a war zone. I encourage forgiveness of all involved and unity among people of all different beliefs, that share this critical common goal. As for me, I ask the forgiveness of my protestant and atheist brothers and sisters offended by my call to Catholics to ask for the intercession of a Saint for the common goal of Ron Paul 2012. I meant to start no war among those who share the important belief that only Ron Paul can save this desperate nation.

I sort-of regret going public in a plea to other Catholics, but I thought that the entire concept of Ron Paul meant absolute liberty and freedom to worship as we choose, or not at all. I was a little surprised to find a measure of intolerance, when in my view, Catholics, protestants and atheists alike, should find a way to look past our differences, even embrace the differences and stand shoulder to shoulder for liberty in support of Ron Paul.

The Ron Paul R3volution IS freedom and liberty, which includes the freedom to worship under different faiths, or none at all. I will never come to this forum with any intent to prosthelytize or convert others to my faith. I pray every day that people of all faiths, and those with none at all, can stand in complete harmony for the common goal of restoring this great, but desperate and divided nation. In my view, Catholics, protestants, fundamentals and atheists alike all need each other, because we all need Ron Paul as President, like we've never needed him before.

Who's with me?

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Freedom allows us to both

Freedom allows us to both live out our beliefs and try to convince others to embrace them without the use or threat of physical or legal coercion. That is one of the reasons RP appeals to evangelicals (such as myself), Catholics, atheists, etc. We should welcome debate; heck, I even welcome your efforts to proselytize me. Because most of all I want the truth, not lies or traditions or even my own self-deceptions. That's the world I want to live in -- one of honest and rigorous debate among people of deep convictions.

The role of the federal government is to provide an environment of freedom where such debate can take place, but without getting involved in the debate itself.

"Never talk about politics or religion."

There is wisdom in that old saw, but we HAVE to talk politics, don';t we? And having one's spirituality reflected in their politics is a good thing, but if we can avoid the language of religion it is one less area where we will self-divide. If you wish to make a plea to Catholics to do something, then start a "Catholics for Paul" site or group or something.
I do not like even saying the pledge since they added "under God" and not for the reason most people assume. We are NOT "One nation under God" we are a nation under the Constitution. Nations are a construct of men, we are one earth under God. So imagine how it makes me feel to try to attend a political meeting and have them start with "Bow your heads."
Excuse me? I did not come here for extra tyranny.... My spirituality does not really leave much room for bowing my head for other men.
So my answer is: Yes, if none of them insist on figuring out who is Catholic, who is Protestant and who is atheist.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

your lines 5 through 8 are . . .

profound. I have felt that for some time. That "under God" feels like a mockery to me, for other reasons as well. The idea that *we* are united spiritually is absurd.
So why pretend? But your logic is better; it IS the constitution that unites us.

:)

it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--

Working from your head title

And then from your content I am going to say this is exactly why there is a conflict between ideas.No! let it all go and let's not let the Church,Government or anyone else come between us and the goal of real love and freedom.Please reread your own Sig line my friend and pen pal.

Love.

ATruepatriot.

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

The name of the game is

The name of the game is FREEDOM. We all want freedom. I think it's safe to assume that many of those who promote dissent within our ranks are sent here by our opponents. It's the old Divide and Conquer and politicians have used it for centuries, no, thousands of years.

We all need to develop a little tolerance for those that disagree with us on some issues. Look at how the Democrats/Liberals can build coalitions out of people who have virtually nothing in common. Why is it that we have such a problem working with others who don't agree with us totally?

The time for squabbling among ourselves is over. As long as we fall into this trap we will never prevail. Anyone who promotes division among us is probably working for our opponents. Avoid these people. And make this fact known to others.

We have been doing it for over 4 years here at DP

we have are little spats over underware and stuff but otherwise its cool ; ^ )

Patriot News
http://redpillpost.com
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LOL!

You've said something truly funny; thank you!

:)

it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--

Yes, they can!

My liberty group has Christians, Catholics, Mormons, Atheists, Jews, etc. Religion or faith is not what unites us - the pursuit of freedom is! We all respect one another's beliefs and we don't try to convert each other. We all work together wonderfully. Every meeting is opened with a prayer and a reading from the Constitution.

"Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, nothing is going to get better. It's not." (Dr. Seuss)

I'm with ya brother!

I am Catholic and I pray especially for the intercession of Mary, by the intimacy she shares with her Son she may pray for our most ardent proclaimer of God's objective truth. That the messenger of free will, the principle of non aggression, and natural law be protected by God's divine intervention.

Mises.org
Know your stuff, learn real history and economics @LibertyClassroom.com

RP

Last time I checked he was not running for Pope, Head Pastor, or Head-honcho secular humanist.

Therefore, I think all should be able to make an exception in this case :)

donvino

This is something I posted on another forum

I am an athiest.

This was a comment I had made to someone who said I might not support Ron Paul because he believes in the bible and not with "logic and reason":

I never brought up the evolution point. Why? Because even though Ron said he doesn't believe in evolution (although in a book, I think he did come around), he wouldn't use religious belief/position to influence his logic and his positions.

That's what I love about Ron Paul. If you take away the bible, his positions and the logic/rationality behind those positions don't change.

What I fear about a candidate who uses the bible as his main source of "reasoning" is that if you took the bible away, and said he could not use it to justify his positions, there would be no logic or rationality behind his positions - such as the case with Rick Santorum or Michele Bachmann.

Candidates like Bachmann seem like they would absolutely support insane positions if the bible claimed it, even though the logic and evidence would contradict it (such as Iran having a nuclear missile, lying about translated documents, and other such non-sense) Those kind of candidates absolutely scare the hell out of me. They will never get my vote.

Politicians who are religious have to learn to separate their religious beliefs with their policy positions. They are not running for the office of "President of the United Theocracy of America", they are running for the president of the United States of America - and the oath only talks about supporting and protecting the constitution - not the bible.

As long as Ron Paul keeps that straight, he will always have my vote. And from my view, he has done that magnificently for both campaigns.

Sure

I'm a Protestant Christian, but I stand with Atheist and Catholic Ron Paul supporters all the time. I mean, you can't really like the Deist Jefferson (and I do) unless you have the ability to support someone who's religious views, or lack thereof, you don't share.

I wont pray to a dead sinner for intercession, though. I'll just pray directly to Jesus Christ.

Other than that, I love you, man!

Ron Paul 2012! This is possible!

The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt

Or...

Pray to the Father, in the name of Jesus Christ.
grant

splitting hairs

Yay! Splitting hairs time!

The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt

Count me in!

As I posted before Thomas Jefferson rejected the orthodox Christianity of his day, yet somehow the country was still founded. Jefferson quote:

The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.

more great Jefferson quotes:

http://jpetrie.myweb.uga.edu/TJ.html

They already do, don't they?

They already do, don't they?

Can they?

Yes, absolutely and unequivocally, if they understand that his candidacy is about the ideas he presents and not about him, RP, the man.

I believe he would concede this.

Will they? That is the $64,000 question....

"For having lived long, I have experienced many instances of being obliged, by better information or fuller consideration, to change opinions, even on important subjects, which I once thought right but found to be otherwise." - Benjamin Franklin

Thread

I didn't see the thread, but no matter what it said...

I've got not problem standing with stark raving mad lunatics if it means standing for Ron Paul.

I don't care if that's atheist, protestant, catholic, muslim, satanistic, heathen, pagan, wiccan, or even democrats.

I'm just happy to be standing for Paul.

Eric Hoffer

As an Atheist I am all for

As an Atheist I am all for people using whatever method they can to advance the message of liberty to anyone that will listen.

Most people are more receptive of information coming from a safe place such as shared ideology or religion so of course the best way of reaching non Ron Paul supporting Christians is for other christians in our movement to reach out to them since they for the most part speak the same language and bond on more levels.

I know I am guilty of having participated in some of the non constructive religious debates on this site in the past but have left it alone for a while because at the end of the day we are all spreading the message of Liberty to a wide array of people who are reached in different ways and each person reached is very important.

Besides, what's the point of being for Freedom and then get offended and argue when somebody else is using their freedom?

I'm Catholic, most of my

I'm Catholic, most of my friends are Catholic as well. I told them about Paul, and virtually every single one of them likes Paul. Freedom unites us all. We religious don't want things forced upon us that are against our beliefs and our private hospitals, etc. and I know athiests/seculars feel the same way vice versa.

So, the solution? How about just raw freedom for everybody? :) yahoo

I'm an unapologetic Atheist.

I may wholly disagree with you about your beliefs, but I think you should have the right to believe whatever you want to. I think we as Ron Paul supporters should put aside our differences, as hard as that may be (I admit I have difficulty not calling out religious nonsense), and focus on the here and now; We need to get Dr. Paul elected.

We can only be kept in the cages we do not see. - Stefan Molyneux

You are a function of what the whole universe is doing in the same way that a wave is a function of what the whole ocean is doing. - Alan Watts

The correct answer is!!!

God does not exist.
The word, to exist, like many words has been given a perverted meaning, (as has the word "gay" which used to mean happy, but now is an extra word used to describe homosexuals.) The origin of the word exist is made up of two parts, the first part "ex", means to come out of, the second part "ist", comes from the latin origin sisto or sistere, which means to stand or in other words, be the source of.
For a theist, God has no source, but is the source of all creation, therefore God "Is" and does not come out of "something".
The universe exists, the sun exists, people exist, governments exist and even Santa Claus exists. Many concepts exist, in fact every "thing" exists, but simple existence does not make some "thing" true or real.
As part of the creation many creatures exist, and unfortunately out of some creatures, given, by God' the power to create, evil and sin have been brought into existence.
To believe that God "exists" is to believe that God is like all other gods and is merely a product of man's creation. To believe that God is a product of man, is to believe that nature, made up of all mass, energy and light, has always Been, is the source of, Is and always will Be. To believe that God is not real, is to believe that nature is the source of all things, a self sustaining Creature, in theological, terms and non existing. Which do you believe, in God or the Creature?

grant

appreciate the . . .

intelligent thought about language and what it means--

it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--

Thanks.

Glad someone does...
grant

Dude, of all threads not to start up the flame wars...

By your definition, I think god(s) exist(s). He/she/it/they is/are man made.

You should really direct your intelligence towards something for Dr. Paul.

We can only be kept in the cages we do not see. - Stefan Molyneux

You are a function of what the whole universe is doing in the same way that a wave is a function of what the whole ocean is doing. - Alan Watts

No problem.

That is your choice, just want to make sure you have a clear understanding of your choice. We are still brothers who support Ron Paul, right?
Ron Paul 2012
grant

O absolutely. I don't hate you.

I'd love to buy you a beer or a drink of your choice. Ron Paul/Liberty is what's important right now. The rest is just details. I'm still your Ron Paul brother. :-)

We can only be kept in the cages we do not see. - Stefan Molyneux

You are a function of what the whole universe is doing in the same way that a wave is a function of what the whole ocean is doing. - Alan Watts

Take you up on your offer.

Just as long as we can talk about Religion and/or Politics.
Take care.
grant

Hah what else would I want to talk about???

You don't happen to live around Chicago do you?

We can only be kept in the cages we do not see. - Stefan Molyneux

You are a function of what the whole universe is doing in the same way that a wave is a function of what the whole ocean is doing. - Alan Watts

That's the spirit!!!

Ann Arbor, but currently out of the country. Will be back only in April. 'Til then I'll have to toast you from afar.
grant