17 votes

Please VOTE! Do you believe Ron Paul will End the Income Tax?

This is a little experiment. Below, I'm going to make a three statements and everybody can vote on them using the up and down arrows on the left of each comment. Look for the very first posts on this thread to find them.
"statement 1" "statement 2" and "statement 3"

I'm trying to get an idea of what people here feel about the idea of Ron Paul ending the Income Tax as it relates to the way it is presented in the Super Brochure.

The Super Brochure claims as it's very first bullet point that...

As President, Ron Paul will... End the Income Tax

To me, this seemed like an irresponsible thing to state as FACT in a brochure aimed at people that are not Ron Paul fans already without any back-up explanations. It gives people already skeptical an easy reason to simply dismiss Dr. Paul right off the bat. Ron Paul fans and libertarians may love it, but they are already voting for him.

I am fully aware that he is against the income tax, but if elected to be president of a country 16 trillion dollars in debt, do people here really think that this will happen? The campaign is not putting this long-term goal front and center of the campaign for a very good reason.

Also, stating that he WILL end the income tax is different than stating that he will try to persuade the public and congress that we don't need it. That is not nearly as outlandish sounding. Stating that he WILL do something as president makes it sound like everybody believes he can just make it happen. This is not about agreeing with him or the idea. It is about believing the claim made on the superbrochure is true and the credibility issue that it raises.

There is a difference between his ideals and what he promises to accomplish if elected. Remember, this is not about what Ron WANTS to do, it is about making a statement about what he WILL accomplish as president.

But that's just what I think, what do YOU think?

So, use the left-side arrows to vote up or down on a few questions below.

THEN bump up this entire article by clicking the vote box at the very top so we can get an idea of the total number of people that voted and also attract more people to vote.

UPDATE: Actually, please leave comments on this thread to keep it an active forum topic on the side bar long enough to get a significant amount of opinions on the issue.

Scroll down the the first posts to see the three statements to vote up or down (author will be RedDot). They will be titled "statement 1" "statement 2" and "statement 3"

OK, here goes!!!!

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He is

as close as we will ever get to near ending it.

The hardest thing

is convincing people and showing them what government's role actually is. As Ron Paul states so often "you have to define the role of government." He even states in his books that there is a disconnect going on in people's minds about government's role and the wording of departments and bills serves as a psycological barrier with a lot of people when you talk about getting rid of them.

If you say get rid of the Dept. of Education, the immediate thought is "oh my...he wants to get rid of education! he's a lunatic!" when this is absolutely not the case. People forget that it was only in 1979 that the department came about and we were #1 in the world in terms of education before 1979. Now we are way down the list. The states and communities handled it before and it never should have changed (if it ain't broke, don't fix it!!). You have to break that barrier with people so they have the "ahhaaah!" moment.

The same disconnect is going on with the income tax. Just like with the Dept. of Education above, you have to break the barrier in people's minds that ALL of these departments are nothing but bloated agencies that don't really do anything useful. Once you break that barrier people then begin to realize that if you got rid of these things, you don't need an income tax or a flat tax or a value added tax etc. because you don't need all that extra money anymore to pay for agencies and programs that don't work and do nothing but run up debt.

We are waking up a very large amount of people. It is only a matter of time before minds start changing about how the government should work...only then will you garner the support to get rid of the income tax. Electing RP is step 1 of 10.

The God who gave us life, gave us liberty at the same time.
Thomas Jefferson

Where liberty is, there is my country.
Benjamin Franklin

Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.
G. Washington

"END THE FED"...

...is another one.

IF he has the support of the country...

He will do that and abolish the Income Tax(.)

RON2012PAUL...The r3VOLution continues...
"I always win"
http://youtu.be/Xtl2ZuJpG9M
+GOLD and SILVER are money+

Please Read and Try To Understand The Constitution on Taxation.

Article 1 Section 8: " All Duties, Imposts and excises shall be uniform."
This is in reference to "Tariffs" !
Tariffs imposed slowly would eventually stop over seas outsourcing for manufacturing, and return american jobs to Americans.

2. Ron Paul has promised to repeal the 16th Amendment, because it is against Amendments 4 and 5.

3. My comment: The more you feed a beast the larger it gets until it destroys everything and everybody around it.
This principle applies to every government, since governments don't "Produce" anything of real value.{ Products }

beesting

I agree with Bob below.

It IS possible and likely if certain things happen and I believe he will do it and it IS going to happen if the spending is curtailed.

When he says things like that, he's hoping, or thinks people understand and will use common sense.. Unfortunately, that's not the case most times. People are waking up though.

Patriot Cell #345,168
I don't respond to emails or pm's.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=qo8CmO...
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution, inevitable.

Ron Paul stated during his New Hampshire Town Meeting...

on Sunday that the income tax wasn't going ANYWHERE until he streamlined government.

He was just stating a Truism.

All others who talk about ending or decreasing taxes either don't really understand the source of those taxes, or lie about ending them.

I don't see any

I don't see any page with "three little arrows" or any link to any such thing, or even the usual "read more" link.

What's up with that?

Freedom is my Worship Word!

He will create a climate that

He will create a climate that will allow it to eventually go away. Decrease spending, decrease or liquidate debt, and the Income Tax will eventually not be necessary. Excise taxes and the like sufficed before 1913. I see no reason to doubt it could work again.

We are not going away and will remain long after Dr.Paul. the movement, the revolution will grow and with it, the understanding that any such slavery must, by necessity, be eliminated.

As Ron Paul supporters, I

As Ron Paul supporters, I think we are all aware of what you've stated, but the question was Do YOU believe Ron Paul will end the Income Tax? And I don't think this means in the long run. It relates to the super brochure stating, as though fact, that if Ron Paul gets elected he will end the income tax. The brochure does not include any of your statements, and it is going to people, unlike all of his supporters here, that are not aware of any/many of the statements you've made above.

It leads a voter who has no/little knowledge of Ron Paul to the conclusion that if he is elected he is promising to end the Income Tax.

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"Ehhh, What's ups Doc?" B.Bunny "Scwewy Wabbit!"E. Fudd
People's Awareness Coalition: Deprogramming Sequence

You get it.

You get it.

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Yes.

Yes.

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Not Immediately

I think it's something that he will propose and start trying to lay the groundwork for but I honestly don't believe it can be done in even one term. It's going to take a lot of spending cuts, planning, and buy-in from Congress before it happens.

I think that it will have to be done gradually as we get our spending and debt in order. Maybe incremental cuts as we straighten things out and require less income at the federal level with an end goal of eliminating it entirely. I just don't see how it can be done "cold turkey" with as much debt as we have that needs to be paid off first.

Truthfully I think alot of Dr. Pauls plans will need to have a foundation laid first and then be gradually implemented because we've buried ourselves so deep into the status quo and developed a lot of bad habits and created a lot of bad policies.

I agree.

I agree.

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I believe he will. He's said

I believe he will. He's said so several times before.

http://RonPaulHemp.com - Quality Ron Paul shirts and apparel made from hemp for the Ron Paul Revolution. Original articles and news on Ron Paul, marijuana, hemp, the 2012 GOP race, and liberty!

YES

AS in he will propose it and document the IRS tax code to the American people, then shut down the IRS and END the FED!

That is why I support Ron Paul.

There is no Left or Right -- there is only freedom or tyranny. Everything else is an illusion, an obfuscation to keep you confused and silent as the world burns around you." - Philip Brennan

"Invest only in things that you can stand in front of and pr

For starters, you can't promise minor improvements and expect to

get elected.

You have to go for the jugular and then do your darnedest to make it happen.

If you fall short, you can always blame it on a deadlocked Congress.

Second, President Paul CAN effectively end the so-called Income Tax immediately upon taking office. This is because the tax, or rather, tax(es), from Subtitle A & C Title 26 (aka the "Tax code") are being illegally applied to everyone without exception when the law as written only applies to a VERY SMALL subset of the population.

Thus, President Paul can order the IRS commissioner via the Secretary of the Treasury, to ONLY pursue tax claims against those the law is actually imposed upon, AND to order them to educate all Americans, especially businesses engaged in withholding just who and who is not covered by present law.

Sure, it would set off a media firestorm, but he'd be in the right and he could do it. So it's not a false or unachievable claim.

Yeah great.Do YOU believe he

Yeah great.

Do YOU believe he WILL end the Income Tax?

I'm not discussing technicalities here. I'm discussing the promise made in the super brochure. Not whether he can or can't or if it is a good idea or not.

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Ron Paul was asked in the

Ron Paul was asked in the debates if he expects to end the income tax. He replied no, he would like to TRY to get it down to 10%-15%.

If the super brochure is going to be mailing out to such a large number of voters, they should at the very least not make such outlandish claims that mislead the people.

Ron Paul has stated that he favors a flat tax, with the rate being 0%(2008). This does not equate to "I will end the income tax.", it does equate to "I'm in favor of ending the income tax". Two very different statements.

----------------------------------------------------------
"Ehhh, What's ups Doc?" B.Bunny "Scwewy Wabbit!"E. Fudd
People's Awareness Coalition: Deprogramming Sequence

He said the same thing on Jay

He said the same thing on Jay Leno.

Good observations. Do you

Good observations. Do you happen to remember which debate?

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Vote on the three statements,

Vote on the three statements, bump up this topic so we get a tally of total voters, and then leave a brief comment to keep this poll active on the sidebar of Daily Paul for a few hours.

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If we are to believe what he

If we are to believe what he says, then no, he won't end the income tax.

----------------------------------------------------------
"Ehhh, What's ups Doc?" B.Bunny "Scwewy Wabbit!"E. Fudd
People's Awareness Coalition: Deprogramming Sequence

Statement 3

The Super Brochure is amazing, but tries to do too much, often turning off potential voters

Use the arrows to the left to vote up if you agree and down if you disagree.

Make sure to bump up the number at the very top of this post, as well, so we can see the total number of participants and get more voters.

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Sneaky way to try and

stop the Super Brochure. Fine, if you don't like it, don't donate. Leave the rest of us alone who think it's a good thing.

In 2008 people paid over

In 2008 people paid over $500,000 for a blimp to fly around that said "Google Ron Paul". For those who saw the blimp, and did google Ron Paul, there was a abundance of negative information mixed in with the good. For those who don't really spend a lot of time researching who they vote for, and this is a big chunk of the voters, the money could have been spent delivering a positive message without the negative spin generously mixed in.

The super brochure is a great idea, but it should be accurate.

IT SHOULD NOT INCLUDE A LIST OF YOUTUBE VIDEOS AS THE OPPONENT CAN PRODUCE THEIR OWN ANTI RON PAUL VIDEOS, GIVE THEM THE SAME NAME AS THE ONES LISTED, AND WHEN THE VIEWER SEARCHES THE GIVEN TITLE THE ANTI RON PAUL VIDEO WILL ALSO APPEAR IN THE RESULTS.

If the "Super Brochure People" want to include informational videos, that simply give facts about Ron Paul (preferable directly from his own mouth), that's a good idea. But the videos should be hosted on their own site so that the opponent doesn't have such an open shot at presenting negatives while the viewer is seeking the intended material. Direct them to ONE site that host all the videos, videos being hosted on that site ONLY. This makes it much easier for the viewer, and at the end of each video it eliminates that "similar videos links" found on youtube that the follower might follow to undesirable Ron Paul content, and there is A LOT OF IT. And along with the pro Ron Paul videos, offensive language is common in the comments sections on youtube, and that has the potential to turn many away from Ron Paul as it is human nature to associate the supporters demeanor with the Candidate themself.

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"Ehhh, What's ups Doc?" B.Bunny "Scwewy Wabbit!"E. Fudd
People's Awareness Coalition: Deprogramming Sequence

That's pretty unfair, Bub. I

That's pretty unfair, Bub. I have donated to the brochure more than once. You can browse through my post history if you think I'm trying to kill it.

I praise the SB people and I really admire their efforts.

I'm am definitely very concerned about some of the content and how it is presented. I would just like to see a few things changed that I believe hurt Ron Paul more than help him.

In other words, the SB could be so much more effective if a little more thought went into what they write in there.

I don't want it stopped. I want it better. I'm just trying to see if I'm the only one that thinks some lines in there do more harm than good.

Lay off.

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Statement 2

Most voters leaning towards other candidates will read this claim about ending the income tax completely after being elected and think it is foolish

Use the arrows to the left to vote up if you agree and down if you disagree.

Make sure to bump up the number at the very top of this post, as well, so we can see the total number of participants and get more voters.

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Statement 1

As President, Ron Paul will End the Income Tax

Use the arrows to the left to vote up if you agree and down if you disagree.

Make sure to bump up the number at the very top of this post, as well, so we can see the total number of participants and get more voters.

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Would that he could

I wish. Saying he will end the income tax is ridiculous. He is not running for king. He will urge the congress and the people to eliminate it, for sure.

Ĵīɣȩ Ɖåđşŏń

"Fully half the quotations found on the internet are either mis-attributed, or outright fabrications." - Abraham Lincoln