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How did you manage to avoid becoming brainwashable when so few do?

I grew up staring at the tv for hours on end, but I still turned out to be quite the skeptic and critical thinker. I've analyzed my childhood trying to pinpoint events that have caused me to become the person I am, but I'm really not sure. We all grow up basically watching the same movies, eating the same cereal. Is there anything in particular that you guys attribute your independent thinking to?

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Herbert Spencer and Ralph Nader's Dad

The light went on after the first one Herbert s, Ralph's made even more sense
Herbert Spencer:“There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation”

Like the other side isn't all ways wrong..

Ralph Naders
What are you going to do today
believe or investigate

Well being a good little kid at 50 Believe of course.

Then I thought about it.. believing is stupid sheep behavior..
You have to investigate, and question your answers...

Or you will be stuck thinking the government will get a sudden change and stop taxing and giving all the breaks and tax dollars to the owners of the country.. the top .0001 percent.

If we don't get Ron Paul in it doesn't look good. for the OLD USA.. the new USA is just starting.. two family incomes just to pay rent!

I mean think about it a lobbyist like Newt Gingrich can even run let Alone Romney 15% if that... can you say off shore.. we may need to see all his taxes 30yr.. but..
Money seems to Rule

Just want what seems to be missing, Truth and Justice for ALL
What is fraud except creating “value” from nothing and passing it off as something?

By the time I was fourteen

I had many responsibilities which forced me to have a good dose of street smarts at an early age. While I have never had any interest in controlling the lives of others, I have learned to be vehement when it comes to controlling my own. Getting a computer has given me the ability to become even stronger with the wealth of information it affords. For me, the search for truth is so much more interesting and captivating than anything else there is.

Remember the survey of personality types?

That someone did here recently? I believe the vast majority of us here are INTJs. Thinking critically, and being critical of "superiors", and preferring logic over emotion, are all traits of INTJs that would make us less susceptible to brainwashing.

ENTJ here!

Interesting. I'm ENTJ, not that much of difference in the way of thinking I would say, more like a personality trait if you are Extrovert or Introvert. I love being in a discussion, I love talking to people and I love telling stories. I like to be alone as well though. The NTJ, iNtuitive, Thinking, Judging is the same in both.

I have managed to convince two people that I know to become complete libertarians, from being big-government socialist/moderates. I specifically targeted those friends among many, most of who I don't usually talk politics with. Both of these friends are INTJ type of personalities, one has done the test and actually gotten INTJ and the other I'm pretty sure would also be INTJ or ENTJ perhaps.

My father, who have been a hopeless case to convert despite him sharing all the principles of libertarianism like self-ownership and also a lot of historical knowledge and being completely aware that the government is a big fraud refuses to se the implications of those principles. Taxation is not theft, regulations are good, markets are bad etc. An occupy-kinda guy if you will. My father is not at all the NTJ personality, he is probably ENFP or ENFJ. He has not done the test, it is just my guess again.

It is still interesting. It could be the key to unlocking arguments for converting progressives, socialists, occypiers or whatever you want to call them.

I have a hard time believing

I have a hard time believing that. I am an ENFP. And there are plenty of INFJs and INTJs who are just as brainwashed as the next guy. Also, if someone 'did' that personality test here on this forum, then it was most likely the online version which doesn't have nearly as many questions. To truly take the Myers-Briggs Personality Assessment, you have to take it on paper. The online version is substandard. Regardless, the idea that a particular personality type is more susceptible to brainwashing than others is false. Also critical thinking is something that is learned, it is not an innate characteristic. And since when do we all rely on Carl Jung to tell us whether we can be brainwashed or not? *sigh*


Happy Libertarian


Hubby and I are INFJ's. Although we have the "F," we are still independent critical thinkers, We reserve the emotions/feelings for family and friends.

“The only way to deal with an unfree world is to become so absolutely free that your very existence is an act of rebellion.”
― Albert Camus

INTJ here too!

I think the 'NT' attributes are what most RP supporters are if I remember that survey you're talking about correctly.
The 'MASTERMIND' oh yeah.

That's exactly

what I am. Done a while back but yes.


I've always been somewhat of

I've always been somewhat of a critical thinker and involved in politics. I was a Foxtard, though. I ate up the stuff from all the talking heads that bash RP now. But, they did actually say stuff that he promotes (Constitutional conservatism, etc.). I guess that was just for the ratings, though.

Anyway, coming of age to vote (I am now 20), I started getting more active/excited about the presidential election since I could vote this time. I was for Herman Cain because I thought he was the outsider/anti-establishment person. I had heard of RP but thought he was just over in the corner with no real popularity (obviously the wrong mentality to have regardless). I watched a debate in June, and being the critical thinker I am, when RP talked about foreign policy and/or Iran, a light bulb went off in my head, and it just all made sense. The culmination of this new fire I had was seeing the media treatment after the Ames Straw Poll. Since then I've been very critical and skeptic of everything the media does/says, and I have become a relentless RP supporter.

Know Your Inner Self

As a young adult working I have constantly struggled to find out what is the root cause of poverty? Is it laziness? Lack of a Better more Expensive Education? Irresponsible Parents? Our values? Not finishing college? Not being Frugal Enough? No equal protection of the Law? Too much regulation in government? Job Scarcity? Individual state of mind and what influences it? For years these are the thoughts I kept in my mind and most of the time ignored and hope that it will resolve itself. And in that process I kept on looking for more balanced opinion and knowledge and people with the same goal as I am which later I found on the internet through independent blogs, news media, and individual discussions and audience participation because sadly the one that we always watch on TV is very biased and unbalanced. I also would like to know how can the mainstream CNN, MSNBC, ABC, FOX, AL JAZEERA, BBC etc finance all their expenses with minimal or very few commercial. These are corporate media empire that dictates, influence and inform he public at all times. They can make or brake a candidate depends how they want the outcome to appear. They can make you look good or bad. It is not easy to detect the propaganda in the media often times it's hidden via words, discussion even in reporting. Beware of half truths and lies they propagate before you act or say your opinion remember the MEDIA doesn't have to report the TRUTH, in most cases if they are caught and made a mistake they will just say it's just an opinion. I've noticed also that though they condemn some individuals (corruption say Bernie Madoff and the like) nothing seems to be accomplished. It seems that all the social, economic and geo-political problem are the same and getting worse by the day. Knowing all these a stumbled upon RON PAUL and the rest is history. Now it's all clear the splinter in my mind seems to be gone. I have AWAKEN my self from the lies and deceit this world has offered me. I can say that when you seek wisdom it will take time to find it out and Ron Paul was instrumental in helping me accomplish that to myself. You can say that RON PAUL cured my APATHY indeed. 2012 will be the year of real change for LIBERTY, PEACE and PROSPERITY. The real change is coming Ron Paul 2012.

"When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. When the government fears the people, there is liberty."

For me it was...

Even as a kid in school, I remember being taught about the Federal Reserve, the different branches of Government, and the different parties. When I asked basic questions like, "Well if the FED can just print the money why not just print enought pay our debts and be debt free?",and "Why are there only 2 parties?", the teachers couldn't answer these types of questions. I suppose I always felt like political misfit with no home. When George W. Bush ran, I was finally able to vote. I registered Independant, so I couldn't vote for him in the primary, but I did in the General Election. The The George Bush forgot is who I thought I was getting but I was obivously wrong. After 9/11 I jumped on the wagon believeing we were under attack because we were free. After a few years in the Air Force and 2 Deployments to what I call a summer camp for adults, I left the Air Force. Shortly after I became a Defense Contractor and then went back to the same deployed location for a few years. There I met someone who introduced me to Libertarianism. I have to say it was what I was looking for. He warned me specifically that at first it is hard and sometimes depressing. So I went back 8 years and started looking for information that I wasn't given. My friend recommended reading "The Left, The Right, and The State". I started looking into all the things Ron Paul was talking about back in 2007 Primaries. When the MSM and the "experts" they relied on to report the news were starting to look like morons, there was no going back. This for me, and I believe for many others, is a journey that takes time. But like my friend did for me, I have to warn you, its going to be an emotional roller coaster.

Newt Gingrich opened my eyes

Imagine that!

After the Contract with American failed to get through even the house, I vowed to not vote for another republican again. This led me to the Libertarian Party and hours of self education. I didn't vote for a republican until Ron Paul in 2008

I felt betrayed by my

I felt betrayed by my stepmother and, over the years, it grew into a general distrust of external authority--doubly-so when I cannot understand with their motives.

I joined the debate team in HS and never looked back.

Doing so trained me to do my own research, ask my own questions, and make and hone arguments. Most importantly, I learned how to argue against positions I personally believed in. This helped me to improve my own positions even more.

I learned early how to read critically and pick everything apart, how to spot logical fallacies, etc.

From 14 years old on, the MSM had no chance to infect me.

It also didn't hurt that I came from a large family that was very self-reliant. Not completely independent, because we all rely on each other, but I learned early on the value of work. I wish I would have learned more about savings and spending, but I think I've managed those lessons on my own by now.

wondering about ancient

wondering about ancient writings led me to the electric universe and saturnian cosmology, which led me to be interested in government obfuscation, comets, monetary policy and Ron Paul

Punk Rock

Specifically lyrics from Bad Religion, Aus-Rotten, Discharge, Defiance, and NOFX.

Also simply having internet. And at a 17 became a fan of Paul since the 2007 debates.

Are you MSM conducting improvement research?

Oh man I crack myself up.

Seriously though... I've always been a skeptic and critical thinker. I distinctly remember as a kid watching TV commercials during Saturday morning cartoons and thinking to myself, "What kids talk or act like this?" while picturing the adults who put them up to it.

And of course, being an adult with the growth of the internet has allowed me to quickly explore every curiosity. Back in early 2007 I happened to be curious about economics. Needless to say that led me to the Federal Reserve which then led me to Ron Paul. And now here I am!

If men are good, you don't need government; if men are evil or ambivalent, you don't dare have one.

My dad and Paternal grandmother

My dad, always the conspirist, took me at 10 yo, in 1971 and showed my a stack (more than 100) of Double Eagles (old $20 gold coins) that he had just purchased. He then explained to me that Nixon had taken us off the gold standard and that fiat money would continually lose value.

My dad also coached me in 1980, my first election about why I should vote Libertarian.

My maternal grandmother told me to never trust the government and related a story about her (8-9 yo in 1917-18), two sisters and mom nearly starved to death in Illinois. Her dad had to work off the books, 50 miles away to eventually feed them. The family was very well off with oil wells, a wheat thrashing business and a hot tar roofing business. Their bank accounts and oil royalties were frozen. Why? Though the family had been in the US since 1743, they had a German surname and spoke German at home and in church.

This is a revelation to me

Everybody's heard of the infamous Japanese "internment" camps in WWII, but this is the first time I've ever heard of any reaction to German-speakers (even though it sounds more like the WWI era). I'm Kraut by blood, or Jackpine Savage, or Pennsylvania Dutch (the Scandahoovian pronunciation of Pennsylvania Deutsch), or German, or Aryan, depending on what level of granularity you're going for in the land of Hyphenated-Americans.

Freedom is my Worship Word!

Lancaster County, PA "Dutch"

It was my paternal grandmother (sorry for any confusion caused). They were "Tunkards", very similar to Amish-Menonite. In winter time, both seasonal businesses shutdown, oil money withheld, garden not growing. They sold their horse to survive at first, then ate all canned goods and root crops. Grandma told me that at the worst, they found some rough oat horse feed in the barn, dug dandelion roots and grubs and made a weak soup, one bowl per day per person.

Understanding the true extent

of the deceptions is not known, over the course of researching I have learned a lot of brave people have died trying to expose the corruption, may these brave individuals have not died in vain.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

I got sober

4/11/2006 was the last time I put alcohol or a drug in my body in order to alter my mind or mood. In order to do that, I had to surrender my old ways of thinking and that was not easy, even when the alternative was suicide. Becoming open minded and willing to try on new ideas was the biggest challenge I have ever had to overcome.
A friend challenged me on the official version of 9/11/2001 and the rest is history.
On a side note, when I first saw my contacts on Myspace posting Ron Paul posts, I thought it was a distraction and told several people to stay focused and stop posting Ron Paul nonsense.

Matthew Edward Hayward



i was always a marijuana

i was always a marijuana activist... I was awake in my belief that 'govt. doesn't have any business with regards to what I ingest'...

i was just fighting for marijuana rights (really it was the basic principle of freedom) ... but i had no idea how bad the problem of our current system was until i came across a youtube video of Ron Paul (in the debates) back in October 2007.

After watching Ron Paul in the debates my mind was set on fire... and I researched everything i could.

it's been an amazing amazing AMAZING journey.

The slogan press on has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race. No person was ever honored for what he received. Honor has been the reward for what he gave.

- Calvin Coolidge

This was a big issue for me as well

It is a fight worth fighting as are ANY and ALL individual rights that anyone holds dear.

http://shelfsufficient.com - My site on getting my little family prepped for whatever might come our way.

http://growing-elite-marijuana.com - My site on growing marijuana

The Money Masters

I had no idea how deeply corrupt our world is until I learned about the nature of money. My first glimpse into that was a video called "The Money Masters".

I always distrusted the news media because of how it reported on a subject I'm an expert in: computers. I figured, if reporters can't get simple facts straight in articles about hacking, what are the odds they're any better in other areas where I can't tell how accurate the reporting is. I know my logic was a bit flawed there, but it did lead me to be quite a bit more skeptical than any of my family or peers. That said, it was a shock to discover that I knew so little truth about something as commonplace as money.

Moved from a rural grade

Moved from a rural grade school to a much bigger highschool. Started noticing how the school was set-up and ran like a prison.

“Enlighten the people, generally, and tyranny and oppressions of body and mind will vanish like phantoms at dawn." --Thomas Jefferson

when I opened my eyes

I grew up in Utah in a 99% Mormon small town. My mom was raised southern baptist and my dad was Mormon. They never pushed me to be either. Without the pressure to conform from my family I saw how hard the "church" worked to keep everyone believing. They had weekly mass meetings with important people in the community leading the meetings. They bore their testimonies, developed levels and awards for the members. Encouraged not questioning anything.

I ended up being an Atheist after trying and rejecting the "faith". ever since I look at things a bit more skeptically. And the government is just a different form of religion to me.

they don't like individualism, the only way government or religion for that matter have any power is through collectivism.

Question your atheism

as much as you questioned your faith and you might turn out to be agnostic like me. Truth is, no one really knows for sure what the hell we're all doing here. May as well be some "great-mind". Besides there's a difference between being theistic and one who follows the dictum's of organized religion.

I started off Catholic, then became a full out atheist, now I'm more Socratic/Spinozan by choice. Just remember, it's always by choice.

Answer to post: I became the way I am by always questioning everything, including my former atheism.

p.s. reading Jefferson never hurts.

"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself." - Thomas Jefferson

Agnostic vs. Atheist

I agree that we are all actually agnostic if we really are honest with ourselves. Even the most devout christian doesn't really know 100% that they have the only truth.

I just call myself Atheist because it is very close to my position, and it is a shorter explanation usually.

I don't think that I know 100% though, I always try to stay open to new info.

I will have to try reading Jefferson, do you have a certain book that you recommend