85 votes

We are one scandal away from the nomination

If there is any fraud going on at any of the caucuses and we can prove it Ron Paul will get the nomination.

Watergate brought down Nixon.

I am convinced voter fraud is taking place. We need to make it our mission to expose the fraud and draw attention to who is behind it.

If votes are being scurried away and counted in private we need to expose that! All candidates should demand that all votes be counted publicly with the media present.

If South Korea can count an entire nation in one evening why can't one small state do that?



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Unless you get a video of Romney

Unless you get a video of Romney running off with the ballot box it will always be irrelevant. The matter would be brushed off in 2 seconds.

www.youtube.com/truefictions

I try to change people every day. Do You?

could this be the

could this be the scandal?

http://www.dailypaul.com/212493/ap-writes-romney-wins-quiet-...

RP is dangerous, so dangerous

30 million hosers here

and we don't publicize voting before all polls are closed and we have paper ballots and we have scrutineers for each party at every poll and we get it all done in one night.

No offense, but the US is not the bastion of democracy that their populace seems to believe.

I love you guys, I love the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, but your government is so infamously corrupt.....

That's why I kep posting that the ENTIRE world NEEDS Ron Paul.

Thanx,

Jason

You can't get clean in a dirty bathtub.

Not likely, sadly

If Gingrich isn't ignored by the "voters" because of his successful marriages and being a flop as "speaker" of the house then it's not likely any scandal will have an effect.

Most of those in POWER have some sort of scandal that they conspire together to save their own hides.

Most voters have successfully proven they're idiots and not influenced by that one thing that matters most- character. To them "character" is how a candidate plays his part in the traveling roadshow theatrical called "Campaigin 2012".

My 2 Cents...

If there is any fraud going on at any of the caucuses and we can prove it Ron Paul will get the nomination.

First, let me start by saying that it's not going to be proven to the level that would get Dr. Paul the nomination. That level of proof would require national party members caught on tape conspiring to change the outcome. The system is setup so that, even when they make it obvious, there are unlimited excuses (someone made a typo, a form was filled out incorrectly, someone lost the data from X precincts, etc., etc.). Most of you already know. Some of you know -- like the kid that hears his parents putting stuff under the tree but still wants to believe in Santa -- but don't want to admit it. We're talking about a system that kills and steals on a daily basis; votes are just politics, part of the game. It's why us old timers don't say Ron Paul can't win (he could), we say they won't allow him to win. There is too much at stake for the ruling class.

Now that I got that out of the way, I want to make 2 points...

1) Your strategy ("We need to make it our mission to expose the fraud") is a good one (more so for exposing the system than "winning" the GOP nomination).

2) Trust me when I say there is a lot more to be encouraged about than there is to be discouraged about.

Just because the system is setup to prevent any meaningful change, that doesn't mean the system itself can't be used to our advantage (to wake people up, to spread the message and to delegitimize the system). Ron Paul's growing support has made it extremely difficult for the establishment to maintain the facade of legitimacy, especially in caucus states where there is some built-in transparency. This doesn't just give young supporters of liberty some real world insight into what they're up against but it also has a positive effect on outsiders looking in.

It's been a long time (almost 20 years) since I came to the realization that voting itself wasn't going to change anything (at least, nothing meaningful) but I still send Ron Paul $$$ whenever he has a campaign and I still go and vote whenever his name is on a ballot (Super Tuesday will be the 2nd time I've voted since Harry Browne in 1996 -- both times in a primary, both times for Dr. Paul). It makes me feel all warm inside when a system setup to maintain the status quo starts getting overrun by people who want to use it for the exact opposite.

That is why the part that Ron Paul supporters play is HUGE and why RP needs to continue his fight within the GOP. As long as Dr. Paul is part of a mainstream party process, it's impossible to completely mute his message. The more support we can get for Dr. Paul and the more light we can shine on the process, the bigger the effect. In other words, keep using the system against itself until someone gets the GOP nomination. After that, who knows what comes next (3rd party, no party, etc.).

So, while us old timers feel bad for those who are just coming to the realization that the system can't be fixed (because it's the system itself that is the problem), there are major, positive accomplishments being made.

We need to take the lessons from each caucus and adapt, increasing the pressure on the establishment. If people in caucus states could organize volunteers in each precinct to stay long enough to capture and report vote counts, it would make it that much more difficult for the establishment. Imagine the scenario in Nevada if one RP supporter in each precinct had reported their precinct's total. The results would have started spreading via social media Saturday night, reaching more people than the cable news networks which would then force the establishment's hand and/or make the illegitimacy of their process that much more obvious. The establishment is used to having it easy; that's why they're prone to slip up whenever they're challenged. We made it hard in Iowa, even harder in Nevada so now it's up to Colorado and Minnesota RP supporters to take it up another level.

Doesn't matter.

The MSM would write it off as sore-loser crackpot theories, and the old folks that get their news from there would nod in agreement. Nothing would be done.

I don't play, I commission the league.

Vote Fraud Caught on Video

This is a reminder of what we are up againts and how the game is played. You don't like whats happening. Do something about it. This movement is about liberty and we still have it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txoLlfrBENk&feature=mfu_in_or...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVUf9Ef8Ufg&feature=mfu_in_or...

Thanks For The Video

Something is fishy there,

Your Welcome

Your Welcome

Check the Math

After finally getting the results I took the figures that the media had last reported and the new figures and in my mind the results that they attribute as 100% can't be possible.

This is the GOP reality's own figures

60,000 projected voters = 32,894 ACTUAL voters = less than 55% of projected voters voted

Sunday morning with 1268 0f 1800 precincts reporting

Romney = 11,822=47.6%
Gingrich= 5,623=22.7%
Paul = 4,619=18.6%
Santorum=2,749=11.1%

Monday morning after 100% of precincts reporting

Romney = 16,486 = 50%
Gingrich = 6,956 = 21.1%
Paul = 6,175 = 18.7%
Santarum= 3,277 = 9.9%

Correct me if I'm wrong but with 532 more precinct votes, and only 8,081 more people voting from the largest precincts in the state that out of all of these people, Ron Paul's PERCENTAGE ONLY WENT UP FROM 18.6% to 18.7% ?? His final percentage after 532 precincts AND 8,081 voters WENT UP ONLY .001% ??

Would someone please verify these numbers and percentages because IF these are correct, THIS IS STATICALLY IMPOSSIBLE!!

Please prove me wrong

The Problem Is Democracy

1 Man 1 Vote is an illusion out of Orwell's 1984 that we have a say in our government. Power should not be given to our representatives through 1 Man 1 Vote. This concept is communistic in nature and antithetical to individual rights because it demands an equality in the political marketplace.

I would argue that until we dump democracy for a better system that enhances the rights of individuals rather than groups, we are going to fail in our quest to get real change. To do this, I think taxpayers should control how people are elected. This should be considered over democracy just for the wonderful audit trail it would provide for us. In this system, taxpayer's contributions in taxes would determine their "voting power". The more you contribute, the more say you have in your government.

If you don't contribute anything at all and you feed at the public trough, well then tough, you don't get a say. The idea that democracy should operate just like communism is the reason why our political system is corrupt. If the payers rather than the receivers controlled the system, everything would be different.

Madison said "democracy is the most vile form of governemnt"

Its a Republic, at least that is how it started. Democracies fail because the majority vote benifits from the common, that allways fails. Then to attempt to correct the problems the people elect a dictator to solve it. I guess we are near that point in our governmental evolution. It takes a revolution to unseat a dictator.

Madison Was Right

I completely agree. I only wish there were more like you in the liberty movement because if there were we might get real change. I don't see how we are going to be able to get out of the spot we are in without complete and total system failure.

There has to be a better way of sustaining our Republic! Democracy failed Ancient Greece and it failed the Roman Empire. Are we ever going to learn? Why not proportion power based on your contribution? How is the gvt going to get too big if everyone knows their influence to make this happen requires more money from them? If you put the power in the taxpayers hands, you may guarantee small gvt forever!

Agree about dumping democracy but

What if we abandoned the illusion of government authority all together and instead worked to build a voluntary society? Don't you think that would go further in promoting individual rights?

I Agree

The taxes should be requested and if people decide to pay them then that would be their representation in the gvt. All taxes should be voluntary. If you do not pay, it should become a matter of public record. That should be the only "punishment" allowed. For example, if the gvt requests that you send in a check representing 10% of your income, and you pay only 8% that should be a public record.

But how does the government

But how does the government come up with its 10% rate? The government does not respond to market forces. And why should you have to pay a lump sum to get the services you want and be stuck having your money pay for the ones you don't want as well. People should be free to chose the services they desire and shop for them in the market to get the best service/product and the best cost. There is nothing the government does that can't be provided in the market place. Lets also not forget that for the government to know if you pay 10% of your income or not it has to track your income. Why should I be subjected to such an invasion into my privacy?

Agree Here Too

I think you are right to point these things out. These are very good observations on your part.

The government is the taxpayers so the representatives that are elected by the taxpayers would decide what rates to request. So these representatives would come up with the tax rate to impose. This will probably be a laddered system like it is today(rich people paying higher percent than poor) but since the taxpayers will have control over elections my bet is that it won't be as onerous as it is today.

You are probably right about the market being able to do everything. However, I myself don't mind the gvt taking care of roads and infrastructure. I don't like paying tolls at toll booths. I don't like private entities knowing where I am all time because I paid a toll somewhere. It would seem to me that roads are the least of our problems. Our problems are the wars, the FED, and the welfare. The thing is you aren't going to get a lot of people who are on board with the anarcho capitalist thing. The question is what moves you in that direction. I think giving power to the taxpayers may do the trick.

With regard to the privacy thing, which would you rather have? Would you rather have the freeloaders deciding how taxes are raised or taxpayers themselves? I am suggesting we look at the means to the end rather than the end itself and just see what happens. It would be a grand experiment and we won't know how it turns out till we try it. I am just suggesting that we try something different.

Thanks for your reply. You certainly have an impassioned response with lots of good points.

I think i agree with you on some of the basics here

I agree the voluntaryist society will require steps, and certainly any thing we can do to inch the government closer to that society I support( e.g. my support for Dr. Paul). I think my question would be this: If the purpose of having a government is to protect our rights, how does the individual have their rights protected by a government that does not represent them because perhaps they don't have the money for taxes? If those who make the most influence law the most won't that open the door to the rich making it legal to infringe on the rights of others? (Please note that I recognize that the government today does a poor job of preventing this. I'm just curious to learn more about your proposal.)

I Would Say History Is the Proof

Democracy is an illusion that is meant to make you think you are free. When you believe the story-line that democracy makes you free, you accept your slavery. It is much better to realize you don't have a say or have very little say than to think you have more say than you actually do.

The real power in our society lies with the elites who can afford to buy politicians. The elites and the politicians like this system so both of them lie to perpetuate it. They lie by giving you a choice between a red apple and another red apple maybe grown on a different farm. They never give you the choice between a red apple and a banana or a pineapple.

When you know you don't have a say, your option is to revolt and protest. Americans don't do this as readily because they think they do. I don't have to go through the history except refer you to some literature by a guy named Hoppe. See here http://www.lewrockwell.com/hoppe/hoppe4.html and see here http://www.lewrockwell.com/hoppe/hoppe23.1.html.

If you read these 2 articles as I did, you may come away with the belief that the West has stepped back and become less civilized by going to democracy rather than monarchies! I don't think we should go back to monarchies though. I think we should move to where the people who contribute get say proportional to what they contribute relative to everyone else. This would at least restrict the growth of the welfare state and allow the poor to realize the truth and that is the fact that they have very little power if any.

I guess, in summation, I am looking for a system that would promulgate truth rather than deception. The audit trail benefits alone are enough to justify changing to it. Vote fraud would be thousands of times harder to achieve. It would be so hard that the cost benefits of vote fraud would make anyone thinking about doing it not do it.

Bugs in the machine's picture

You're suggesting

That we should strip poor people of their voting power, and we should give rich people (who may find ways to pay less of a percentage of income in taxes, but still larger dollar amounts than the average people) more leverage in the election process than they already have via SuperPACs?

I'm not happy either with the influence of money in politics, but I certainly don't think this is the way to solve it.

By claiming there is no conspiracy, you prove to those who believe in the conspiracy that you are part of the conspiracy.

One Other Point

If poor people didn't pay taxes in a voluntary system, yes they would lose their right to have a say. However, they can send in money if they want and if they do their representation should be proportional to what they sent in along with everyone else.

So, relatively speaking you are correct but if you meant they would be stripped of all power, you are wrong.

The reason why this system would work better is if you study monarchies you will see that tax rates never went over 20% and rarely over 10%. This is because everyone knew that the king was in control and they did not have a say. If the king took things too far, the blame could be laid squarely on his head.

In a democracy, we blame ourselves. This is analogous to the rape victim being blamed for rape because they dressed too sexy. If only you would have voted for the other guy you wouldn't have such a horrible system! This is pure collectivist brainwashing in my opinion.

What you said in a different way

So you're suggesting that we should allow some people to have more than others, to each according to his need! We shouldn't allow people who earn more money to have things that poor people don't have. Why should we let people keep their money?

I am not happy with the influence that money has in the marketplace, but I certainly don't think some people should be able to buy things others cannot.

Ron must call them out, not for fraud alone but

For treason and high crimes as well.
Face it my friends, the way we do things, the quite and steady approach is just exactly what the RNC and the propaganda media expects from Ron. They've geared up their incendiary machine to counter Ron, to make Ron Paul and the constitution of no effect.
Without a doubt fraud in this election cycle is rampant, I though so in Iowa, but after Nevada I truly believe so. But the silence from Ron Paul is deafening, his campaign mimics crickets and we his staunch and dedicated campaigners scratch our collective heads but steadfast we continue onwards.
I must make a frightful observation, if we ( meaning Ron and the core campaign ) don't change tactics soon, there is no way we'll even get recognized at the convention on the platform, let alone get the nomination. The well oiled and criminal enterprises known as the NeoCon RNC/ GOP and the treasonous propaganda machine we call the MSM have seen to this result being fact, before this campaign started. All that we are getting is tired and furious, it's time to charge with the LIGHT brigade.
What do I mean " charge with the LIGHT brigade"? I mean it's time for Ron Paul to spill the beans on the evils he's seen in 30 years on the Hill, the Names, documents, all the back room deals, all the deliberate treasons, each and every one. LIGHT as in truth, and Ron would in no way hurt his chances in doing this, like any traitor supports him anyway, and what he's doing now is of no effect where it counts, the hearts and minds of the massive numbers of sleeping sheep.
What exactly does he lose by opening Pandora's box? Not one thing, rather in doing so in a manner the MSM could not ignore or cover up, say during a Live TV debate with a simultaneous and massive document dump on the Internet, emailed to every registered Republican nation wide, every media outlet, and to every other email we can accumulate would have a stunning and serious effect upon the RNC/ GOP/ DNC and the propaganda machine of the MSM.
In conclusion, it's imparitive to change the narrative, from calm solutions, to calm revelations of high crimes and treason.

Drew, by the very grace of GOD through the blood of Christ Jesus.
"there shall come after us men whom shall garner great wealth using our system, and having done so shall seek to slam the door of prosperity behind them." George Washington

Posted in another thread....

My gut tells me that without a doubt the vote was tampered with in both Iowa and Nevada and most likely in all states so far. You say, "move on" like it does not matter? How do you make changes in this world by moving on when an injustice occurs? There is a villain here that we can identify and that villain is the Republican Party. The Republican Party can not exist without voters. I believe that we must boycott them and let them know we boycott them because of their treatment of Dr. Paul. That means across the board, we do not vote for ANY Republican candidates and we do not give them a dime. Except for Dr. Paul that is. It is one thing for a candidate to have to beat the other candidates but Dr. Paul is also up against the media and his own party. I say lets dismantle the Republican party with our protest and show the crooked bastards that they should not tamper with the vote of the American people.

This is truly up to the

This is truly up to the PEOPLE that belong to the Republican party--not the campaign, which would look like it was whining. WE need to raise Unholy HELL in these states, storm HQ with calls and visits--ask to see the actual ballots, etc., etc.

I think the "move on" sentiments mean...

...the SYSTEM is too far gone...so, move on with the message of Liberty, Austrian economics, quit killing our troops and using them to kill Muslim children for Israel dammit!!!, and get your money out of paper ASAP before your establishment friends force you onto government assistance, or resign you to go live under a bridge.

We cannot stop this train at this stop and start wasting our efforts demanding that corruption by morally compromised, self-serving Republicans be stopped immediately - the SYSTEM is broken and run by immoral persons.

This is what the REPUBLICANS have done to America since I have been born - which led to Ron Paul running for public office [ http://postimage.org/image/8qprc92o3/ ] - and NOBODY has listened to him because they are under the spell of the Federal Reserve System which is our "American Exceptionalism" since we duped the rest of the known world to consider the credit we give people a commodity; now we use force and murder and voter fraud to sustain it.

When things get THIS BAD, there is only ONE WAY to make a change...and "boycotts" of anything tangible or intangible won't work as long as Federal Reserve Notes are the coin of the realm - Ron Paul's campaign uses FRN's to fund his efforts!

The crooked bastards will get theirs for their wrong doing - how that will come about - who will meet out severe judgment upon them remains to be seen; in the meantime we have to "move on" with the campaign in other states - proving vote fraud will not bounce them from power overnight, nor put Ron Paul in the White House; we fear he would be assassinated if he won the White House by any other means of winning the Republican nomination and beating Obama in the general election.

We are all just venting some frustration here - just be thankful we're still FREE to do so, and we haven't been imprisoned for our dissent, or free speech on the internet!!! We have already boycotted the Republican Party, that is WHY Ron Paul conservatives do not run virtually ANY county executive committees in these United States; we're tired of dealing with these duped enemies of the Constitution - so we've studied their rules for this contest, and right now we are still relevant enough to irritate them and get some attention to our message - BUT all they know is FRN's; and until that thing is thrown off completely and ALL these criminals are imprisoned or dead, these "crooked bastards" will keep doing what "crooked bastards" do - which is selfishly pursue their own way with NO regard for the innocent, the patriotic, the selfless, or the CHILDREN they KILL, starve, and indebt!!!

I see a pattern.

In Iowa, they had 8 precincts "not reporting"? What's up with this? Nobody even called into question as to "why" they were not reporting. Did the dog eat the paperwork? Did a flood wash them all away? Nobody even asked. Now, in Nevada, all reports show Newt crumbling. Even in the late night Jewish caucus sponsered by his billionaire money backer, when they called out the results, you only heard Newt called a couple of times. Yet, he pulled a second place over Paul? I don't think so.

alan laney

Voter fraud has been taking

Voter fraud has been taking place since elections were invented, it hasn't managed to bring anyone down yet.

You have to get enough of an overwhelming majority that even voter fraud cannot win it for them.

The other option is to run as an establishment candidate and then shaft them when you get into office... and that may be in the works already.

Well if the scandal was

that Romney. Gingrich and Santorum got caught in a gay love triangle...

THEN we'd be one scandal away from getting the nomination. :) Right?

But look, it's almost common knowledge (if such a thing can exist in our ignorant country) that Bush stole the 2000 election and probably 2004, but nothing came from people knowing there was vote fraud.

Strangely the illusion persists that the elections are fair because...well, this is America, land of the free, home of the brave, and that cr*p only happens in the Third World.

I don't know what to say other than that . . .

*we* are being 'played'--

Dr. Paul knows this and is doing his best to wake as many people up as possible.

it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--