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Sharia Law in the UK? Too Much Muslim Immigration?

What are your thoughts about this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hKEd6rzbeg

I am thinking that the Mexican illegals (Catholic mostly) are not so bad after all.

Treg

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wolfe's picture

...

"I see what you're getting at, and I've considered as much, but when you have a woman saying "Yes I'm judging you" simply because the other woman wasn't wearing the "proper" attire-- that SCREAMS religious extremism to me."

The problem is that yes, that could qualify that as religious extremism. But on the other hand, we have politicians calling for the death of Muslim Extremists... Do you see the issue with that? So, they are wanted dead simply because they have what deem as an incorrect viewpoint and because we want them to be like us or not be at all.

"Agreed, and that was pretty much the point of my original post. Apparently that makes me a Nazi, though."

By force is the key here. They can scream all they like, but we are the ones doing the killing.

"Could you kindly point out where I've done this? I bet if I said "White Christian Zealots drive me crazy", I'd get five up-votes. (They do, BTW)"

I didn't mean to imply that you had, it was a general statement using a general "you", I apologize for the confusion. My statement was that was being done through media propaganda like this. Further, I dislike religious extremism in any context. I however do not call for eliminating any religious extremists from society, and that is where the line to be drawn is important.

The Philosophy Of Liberty -
http://www.thephilosophyofliberty.com/

wolfe .. you wrote...

"Further, I dislike religious extremism in any context. I however do not call for eliminating any religious extremists from society, and that is where the line to be drawn is important"

Yet, may I assume, you would support a free society trying to defend itself from an outside aggressive invasion, yes?

Well, by allowing for an immigration policy that grows religious extremists, then is that not attacking and killing our free society from the inside? If the new immigrants are one 1) not integrating 2) growing more in numbers and 3) not intermarrying then as any historian can tell you, it will end badly for the native population. Just ask an American Indian from any tribe. Just ask the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank. As a side note, because I read biology a lot, I find it now almost offensive when any ideology/religion says "You can only marry our kind, or you are dead to us". The Jewish people and the Muslim people have suffered thousands and thousands of years under this horrible anti-liberty notion. It should be the first sign of trouble between peoples. Its been made even laughable by DNA evolutionary science that tells us how close brothers they really are. From Japanese & Koreans to Jews & Palestinians & Iranians...the list is endless.

Perhaps the answer for Open-Ended Libertarianism and the West is this: Open up, lighten up, or we cannot coexist.

Treg

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wolfe's picture

Define invasion...

I am of course 100% open borders. An invasion doesn't imply conquering so you would first have to define that for me, before answering whether self defense would be appropriate.

Pockets and communities are free to develop according to their own interest, including stupid/insane extremism. The violation comes when attempting to impose that on a non-willing party which can/should be met with force.

Just because you think they should do a thing, does not give you the right to make them do a thing. You can believe that they are self-destructive, bigoted, awful people, as much as makes you happy. So long as you don't attempt to use force to stop them from being self-destructive, bigoted or awful.

The Philosophy Of Liberty -
http://www.thephilosophyofliberty.com/

Reply

"The problem is that yes, that could qualify that as religious extremism. But on the other hand, we have politicians calling for the death of Muslim Extremists... Do you see the issue with that?"

Of course I see the problem with it, but at the same time I'm not going to excuse hardliners for well, being hardliners. I certainly don't want to see people put to death for their faith, though.

"So, they are wanted dead simply because they have what deem as an incorrect viewpoint and because we want them to be like us or not be at all."

Like I say, I personally don't wish death on any Muslim, extremist or not. I realize that the endless wars are a huge part of it, and that ending them would be a win/win.

"By force is the key here. They can scream all they like, but we are the ones doing the killing."

I can understand them protesting say, the US Embassies throughout the Europe (which is completely justified), but the way I see it, there is simply no excuse for trying to push one's religious views on another. Are they using violence? For the most part, no, but I'd consider chanting "fuck the UK" to be using intimidation, which I consider to be force.

"I didn't mean to imply that you had, it was a general statement using a general "you", I apologize for the confusion"
Ah, I see. Apology accepted, and allow me to extend mine as well for making the assumption.

"Further, I dislike religious extremism in any context. I however do not call for eliminating any religious extremists from society, and that is where the line to be drawn is important."
Agreed. Again, I do not wish harm on anyone, and believe me when I say I wish we'd GTFO of the Middle East and begin what will be a VERY long healing process between our cultures, but in the end I simply can't condone intimidating regular folk. I just wish that, like us here, they'd strike at the "root" of evil (US/UK imperialism) rather than preach about how others should dress.

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Multiculturalism destroys nations

I personally have no quarrel with Islam or those who practice it (save for the hardliners, who I can't stand regardless of what they practice), but seeing every "western" country being turned into some variation of this in the name of racial, religious, and cultural political correctness is infuriating.

When Europe ceases to be of "European" character, I wonder if they'll think all the political correctness was worth it? Was it worth becoming a minority in their own homelands? Was it worth seeing their history buried beneath the sands of time? Was it worth teaching their children to feel guilty for their own genetic make-up? I sure hope so, because that's what they're going to get.

The UK keeps going out of its way to accommodate the flood of Muslim immigrants, and are destroying themselves in the process. THEY should adapt to the UK, not the other way around!

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Your comment

won't be popular with the Political Correctness crowd here.

But it is right on target.
There are still a lot of DPers who are dragging around a TON of Political Correctness baggage.

It's a taboo subject,

but one that should not be, IMO.

Yes, the wars in the M.E. are unjustified and morally wrong, but two wrongs don't make a right. But well, none of this stuff is happening by accident as you well know. Thanks for the support.

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Well, maybe there wouldn't be

Well, maybe there wouldn't be a "flood of muslim immigrants" if the UK wasn't bombing there countries of origin.

BOOYAH!

Except

The wars are hardly ever brought up during many of these protests. What does the Muslim woman calling the British woman "naked" for wearing a not-at-all revealing dress have to do with the wars, hmm?

What does wanting to censor every advertisement in the UK that shows even a little skin have to do with the US occupying the Middle East?

But hey, I guess religious extremism is a-okay.

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I'm saying you cannot expect

I'm saying you cannot expect people to assimilate to a diametrically opposed culture in a short time span, especially if these people are war refugees. However, I am not saying they have a right to overthrow the rule of law of a nation, particularly if they are illegals/refugees.

While it is true

that two opposing cultures cannot simply adjust to each other overnight (point well taken, BTW, +1), I still feel that multiculturalism is harmful to the 'host' nation. I'd feel the same way if it were say, Germans doing it in Japan, Chinese doing it to Cambodians, Christians doing it to Wiccans, etc.

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So are you saying

So are you saying multiculturalism is harmful, even if it's the result of legal immigration?

Not at all

Many immigrants can and do adapt to whichever nation they move to. Perhaps not completely within the first genration, but it's not an overnight process. Immigrants-- even some illegals, tend to assimilate while adding their own take on the culture, while multiculturalism makes is so several wildly opposing cultures are cramped together. It simply doesn't work.

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Can you link to this?

Because so far the only source was a silly blog by Christopher Holton. He's kept pretty quiet outside the Baton Rouge Tea Party since Conservatives are calling him out on his ultra liberal shenanigans.

I believe it was just he and Robin Edwards.

I don't know who those two are

It was a Youtube video that appears to have been since deleted (after searching via google cache).

The incident was over some bus stop ads that were quite suggestive, and a few of the more hardline Muslim groups complained and started with the "women showing their bodies is wrong" stuff.

Again, the wars over there are unjust to be sure, but at the same time I'm not going to turn a blind eye to how I have personalty seen many Muslims treat women, as well as their general attitude toward non-believers. ALL religious hardliners piss me off.

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