220 votes

Ben Swann Update on Affidavit: Do NOT sign!

From Ben Swann's Facebook page:

Massachusetts RNC delegates.. do not sign any affidavit!

I posted last night a letter that has gone out reportedly to Massachusetts delegates requiring that they sign an affidavit stating that they will vote for Romney at the RNC or risk "the pain and penalty of perjury." This is a VERY serious issue. Massachusetts delegates need not take this lightly. I was emailed these quotes by Alison Wright. These are comments by Jerry Davis at Lawyers for Ron Paul:

"1. "It IS ILLEGAL TO FORCE ANYONE TO VOTE ANY CERTAIN WAY...PERIOD!!!!"

2. "ALL of the 'binding' IS under civil constitutional law....VERIFIABLY...ILLEGAL."

3. "We are not even going the rule 38 route, ANY means of manipulating a vote, whether by proxy or by unit, is illegal."

4. "The RNC's use of these rules in their very nature, are illegal, but no-one has brought this to the table yet."VOTE ANY CERTAIN WAY...PERIOD!!!! ALL of the "binding" IS under civil constitutional law....VERIFIABLY...ILLEGAL."

https://www.facebook.com/BenSwannRealityCheck

edit: RELATED http://www.dailypaul.com/235514/what-should-they-do-ma-deleg...




Like this article? Get DP delivered to your inbox daily. Subscribe here:

E-mail address:  

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.

Based on ...

Based on points 1-4 above I would sign this thing in a heartbeat ... make sure I still get to go to Tampa, then vote for RP ....

Question

But won't they just replace you if you refuse to sign it. If it's not legal to manipulate your vote, what difference does it make if you sign it or not?

Sign the paper...

or risk "the pain and penalty of perjury"?

-> http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z270/ludagraal/DoItHeffer... <-

"It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from his government." - Thomas Paine

(╮°-°)╮┳━┳ (╯°□°)╯┻━┻ "RON PAUL 2012 DAMNIT!"

Send this viral people

to everyone in your contacts, you never know where it will reach to.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

I won't vote for Romney..!!!

I think the whole idea of a vote is you get to pick who you want! It would be called a mandate if you have two vote for Mitt Romney. This swearing allegiance to Romney is the opposite of freedom!! It's tyranny slavery and serfdom. Be free my friends be free!!!

"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Albert Einstein

I won't vote for Romney..!!!

I think the whole idea of a vote is you get to pick who you want! It would be called a mandate if you have two vote for Mitt Romney. This swearing allegiance to Romney is the opposite of freedom!! It's tyranny slavery and serfdom. Be free my friends be free!!!

"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Albert Einstein

I won't vote for Romney..!!!

I think the whole idea of a vote is you get to pick who you want! It would be called a mandate if you have two vote for Mitt Romney. This swearing allegiance to Romney is the opposite of freedom!! It's tyranny slavery and serfdom. Be free my friends be free!!!

"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Albert Einstein

Whatever!

What's the GOP going to do, take away your birthday? If you are a national delegate, and your state has some rule requiring you to vote for the preference poll winner, screw 'em. Vote Ron Paul.

What are they going to do disregard your vote? Kick you out of the GOP forever!? ...Who f*#king cares!? This is our one and only shot at saving the Republic.

I for one would ROFL at seeing the National Convention go into conniptions because of this.

Do Not, I repeat, DO NOT go against what your heart says you should do, just because some other group of people says you should do it differently. That sentiment will get Paul the nomination and ultimately Save The Republic.

The best idea all around

Is for just ONE of their delegates to vote for Romney.

The rest vote for Ron Paul.

Problem solved.

Here's why:

The vote is by private ballot. If just one votes for Romney and the rest don't, they will have NO idea who actually didn't vote for him. And they can't give them ALL a penalty because one of them DID vote correctly.

They cannot ask "who did it" either nor would anyone be compelled to answer because the vote is private.

This puts the power SQUARELY with "the people" to enforce the rules of voting and doesn't allow the state to have any upper hand whatsoever.

You haven't been to a national convention before....

...you really should not speculate about this.

Oh, OK....

Mr. FBI man......you must have checked my google amassed records to determine that, right?

Whatever.

LOL!

I'd send them back this

http://www.dailypaul.com/235542/mass-delegate-affidavit-solu...

Doesn't state you'll vote for mitt affirmatively, also points out the flaw in their B.S. affidavit and puts the ball back in their court.

http://www.facebook.com/RonPaulExploding - RON PAUL IS EXPLODING!

PEOPLE...Please Wake Up....Think about the Cause/Effect...Sigh

With all due respect to Mr. Swann (heard he was a college graduate as a teenager), it DOES NOT matter what they can or cannot force on you.

The only thing that matters is the END GAME. Sure, if you sign it and vote for RP, you may be breaking the law. So the first question is, "What is the penalty (if any) if a national delegate signs it and votes for RP"? HOWEVER, if you DO NOT sign it then the question becomes, "ARE THEY or CAN THEY take your spot and give it TO SOMEONE else? If YES, then you are playing right into there hands by not signing it. This is about DELEGATES and if you aren't going to Tampa anymore because you wanted to make your Liberty stand based on a silly piece of paper and potentially lose your national spot, then in my opinion, the big picture strategy is being lost.

"What is the penalty (if any) if a national delegate signs it and votes for RP"?

"ARE THEY or CAN THEY take your spot and give it TO SOMEONE else? If YES and you don't sign it, then you are playing right into their hands.

I would guess they can strip you or at least plan to if you don't sign it or they wouldn't have sent it out in the first place. Think before reacting. Get the facts and never underestimate "the MAN" when he trying to stick it to you.

Which is EXACTLY why I'd use

Which is EXACTLY why I'd use this solution:

http://www.dailypaul.com/235542/mass-delegate-affidavit-solu...

Puts the ball back in their court.

http://www.facebook.com/RonPaulExploding - RON PAUL IS EXPLODING!

This affadavit

is for identity. The Mass RC has already disqualified the delegates that submitted provisional ballots so they could fudge the votes in some districts.

I spent all afternoon reading. Mass general laws allows for bound delegates for the winner of the primary on the first round. The RNC requires the states to send a list of Certified delegates. Other states also require a signed notarized affidavit of identity. Thats what this form is! As far as the bound vote goes, Yes the delegates are bound by the laws to vote for Romney on the first round, however they cannot bind every single delegate. The state RC is supposed to send a list of the bound and unbound delegates to the RNC in Tampa. You would think they would have done this and sent notice to the delegates as far as who is bound and who is not.
I am telling you they are deliberately misleading the RP delegates by not telling them to get these forms notarized and submitted so they can disqualify them and appoint the alternates that are Romney supporters.

Steve Parent is the one who wrote to Ben Swann to tell him the key is in the by laws of each and every State Republican Committee. If the State has laws to bind the delegates on the first round of votes for the winner of the primary than it legal as long as they appoint so many unbound delegates. This is where they are playing fast and loose. They are using our ignorance against us.

If you think these bastards pulled shit at the primaries, and the caucuses what do you think they will try to do to the RP RNC delegates? We can't file law suits with every state. Someone needs to get this to a parliamentarian before we loose our Massachusetts delegates.

Steve Parent?

Are you freeking kidding me? DO NOT START THIS AGAIN ON THE DP.

Steve Parent has NEVER been an officer in the GOP.
Steve Parent has NEVER been to a GOP national convention.
Steve Parent has NEVER been a national delegate.
Steve Parent has NEVER run a campaign.
Steve Parent has NEVER worked on a presidential campaign.
"Steve Parent" is a pseudonym. The person who calls himself "Dr. Steve Parent"'s real name is not Steve Parent. I.e. he's not even a real person. He's got the wool pulled so far over your eyes you can't tell your @#$% from your $%^.

Like I said. He, his shadow and his troll fan club has been gone from DP for awhile and we've done BETTER THAN EVER WITHOUT THEM.

DO NOT START THIS NOW

(Bracing myself for the onslaught of neg votes that comes from the shadow SGP fan club when posting anything critical about the psy op called "Steve Parent")

Ignore...

...FBI, don't play into it. Don't feed. Just some friendly advice.

So much misinformation

Other states do this so that's what this form is. And you should get it notarized because other states do it. And one state can enforce their laws on another state because that state says so. If anyone is crazy enough to believe this stuff than your never going to get enough delegates.

Kids under age can't be held libel for any contract they sign. All the delegate has to do is get a kid to fill out and sign the delegates name on the form and mail the thing in. This gives you the option of denying you signed it when your at the convention if that option is needed. It also gives you the option to say you did sign it if that option is needed. You have months to think about this but the form needs to be in the mail NOW so it's there by the deadline.

Mods is it time...

Mods is it time to get rid of this "just another genius" idiot?
Check out his comments and you will see that very rarely has he ever got anything but massive down votes. He is not contributing anything but discourse and division, it is time to say goodnight Gracie.

RickStone

The word is LIABLE you idiot. Not Libel.

You are confusing two legal terms, Libel and Liable. With each post you enforce my initial impression of you. You are a door knob. Children can indeed be under contract and be held liable (not libel) but that is beside the point. I just hope know one actually takes your advice. Not only is what you are advocating ridiculously stupid, it's also illegal!

You are a TROLL!

Do not sign!

So many new trolls

I know I don't post a lot here, but I have been active in the liberty movement a long time. I have doubts on any advice coming from members who have been here less than 2 weeks.
Just my 2 cents...

"Rule Number One: Obey ALL rules!!"
Ron Paul 2012!

Sign it or not, it's hot air...

Hah, I dare the Romney fools to do anything; to have the affidavit is the first order of illegality in opposition to the RNC Rule 38 (you don't have to wait for it to be given, it's already given in the form of a RULE--take it, it's there), then to make someone sign it under an "or else" pretense is cohesion, then to lie to the delegates by inferring they can't be a delegate or vote if they don't sign, is misleading and misrepresentation of the Rule. That piece of paper means nothing with ink or without, and I dare the Romney camp to take anyone to court for it.

The best is to sign it, vote your way and if they come at you, you say: "Yeah, well that was before I read the RNC Rule 38 and that nullifies the affidavit; the Rule is the rule, your affidavit is not. I have to follow the rules as a delegate--my activity is governed by the RNC Rules. If you have a problem with me following the Rule you need to take it up with the RNC; as a diligent I followed the Rule. You could do whatever you want but I will have to drag the RNC and use the Rule to back me up--I'm just following the Rule." Sometimes acting and talking simple in the general's seat can go a long way.

I say: if you can't make it better, don't make it worst!

Sign, but don't sign

Okay, I'll try to be more diplomatic about this, Ben says DO NOT SIGN, and I agree with him, DO NOT SIGN these papers yourselves delegates, BUT DO HAVE SOMEONE ELSE SIGN your name on these papers for you AND TURN THEM IN. Let someone else fill them out, sign your name, and then mail them out. That way all you Ben fans out there are happy, because the delegates didn't sign the paper, and the delegates will be happy because they will still be selected to vote even if they happen to be voting for Ron Paul. Is every body happy now. Delegates only need to deny signing the paper if anyone at the RNC brings it up, and they have their REAL signature to prove they didn't sign it, leaving the RNC looking guilty like they might have forged this paper which will make them stop arguing about the whole issue once they figure out they've been had and realize they're the ones who are going to look like the culprits who forged these papers.

Your are an absolute DOLT!

It scares me that there are people as dumb as you out there.

Oh, and I forgot to mention.

If you delegates do have someone else fill out and sign your name to these papers, and mail them in, if the RNC says you signed this paper say NO YOU DID NOT, SAY YOU DIDN'T SIGN IT, YOU REFUSED AND MAILED IT BACK TO THEM. That way the RNC will look like the guilty party who filled out your paper. And you can tell them you don't like them accusing you of signing a paper which you refused to sign.

Do Not Sign

Plain and Simple!

It DOESNT MATTER if you sign it or not.

It is entirely UNENFORCEABLE. It is impossible to be convicted of perjury (though it's possible you could face a charge) on the cited grounds regardless of whether you sign or how you vote in Tampa.

Period end of story.

I would strongly suggest...

... that any of our Massachusetts Liberty delegates who are considering swearing falsely to this affidavit first consult with a Massachusetts attorney who is experienced in that state's election law and its criminal law. Unless you meet those qualifications, FBI_Exposer, please be more cautious about the statements you are making. Thanks.

P.S.: I have posted more expansively on this topic here:

http://www.dailypaul.com/235514/what-should-they-do-ma-deleg...

A Constitutional, Christian conservative who voted for Ron and stands with Rand

It is not enforceable. End of story.;

Perjury is lying under oath. Signature on this paper is not under oath.

Secondly, there has to be cause or DAMAGE. What was the damage and to whom was caused damage if a signatory of this paper decided afterward to vote for someone else?

It's as simple as that.

No judge will uphold this case. It's swiss cheese: inter alia the 1st amendment, and constitutional guarantee (in writing in the constitution) of a (small r) republican form of government.

Again, one may face a charge or summons. However, one will NOT face a conviction or loss in court, were it ever to go that far.