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Lawyers Confirm All Delegates Are Unbound!

Lawyers Have Confirmed What We Knew The Whole Time! All Delegates Are Unbound!

http://youtu.be/SkNO90HPaw0



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RNC Rules take precedence over State Law

Democratic Party of United States v. Wisconsin: the national party’s rules take precedence over state laws because as a private organization, a political party has the constitutional right as a free association of individuals to set its own rules. State laws interfering with that private process violate a political party’s First Amendment rights.

Delegates who vote consistent with RNC Rules cannot be punished by any state law.

Here's a news blurb discussing the case, but better yet read the case itself. It's on point regarding this issue.
(http://ivn.us/2012/05/14/gov-romney-worry-less-about-rule-38...)

Great link! Thanks!

I maintain that "anyone who is a delegate not already bound to Ron Paul, and plans to vote their conscience or abstain, needs to consult a competent attorney with election law experience in their own state before going to the convention." And, legal advice shouldn't be taken from websites. I believe this is much too important not to be absolutely certain that what that article says is true. However, that article is very encouraging! I'll be posting it to my site.

Considerations for the 2012 U.S. Presidential Race from the Mind of a Political Independent-Use this tool to educate the unconverted and prove support for Dr. Paul among Independents.

Agreed

Agreed

We Need To Stop Posting Our Petty Arguments Here..

Let's all strive to become better people. There are enough bad in the world..

Grumbling and quarreling about petty arguments and statements is a waste of time and energy.

We need to grow friendships not fiendships for liberty..

Like Michael Nystrom once said before, and I agree with him, if we can't say something nice, then don't say anything at all.

...and from now on, that goes for me as well..

In All Lawsuits, 50% of the ATTORNEYS LOSE

An Attorney is a step down from an establishment politician. Most don't know their head from a hole in the ground and ALL think THEY are right.

Best to rely on the rules, national election laws as they govern the conduct of political party primaries and precedent. A random attorney's opinion is just that, an opinion. In All Lawsuits, 50% of the attorney's involved LOSE their case.

Galatians 5:1
It is for FREEDOM that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.

just had to correct you...

in ALL lawsuits 50% of attorneys involved WIN their case!

Are you a troll?Why would you tell everyone to play by the GOP's rules when they are breaking them,themselves?I would say this is an obvious loophole to their rules.In that section,it clearly states that they can not coerce your vote in ANY way,& lays out that it is illegal to tell you who you have to vote for.And it plainly says "delegates,candidates for presidential election...".I'd say that's plain english,question answered.
I'm no lawyer,but it sounds to me like ALL delegates are free to vote THEIR conscience without worry of any action against them.And as far as the GOP taking action against them.....WHO CARES!?!?Do you really think the GOP is going to be around much longer,after the way they have represented themselves throughout this process?...not likely......just sayin....

Why did you accuse me of being a troll, & then not explain why?

I have not studied all of the applicable rules in this instance. I'm only warning people not to trust an attorney just because he is an attorney. One is better off without an attorney at all, than to have a bad or lazy one.

As for you correcting me, where is your correction? You think 50/50 odds is worth the risk? Personally, I prefer to increase my odds of winning by knowing the applicable rules of the venue I'm in and all binding precedent rulings. Do you realize that over 200 US Supreme Court decisions have been overturned? Have you ever heard the term "The Lower Court Erred"?

We have neither the resources, nor the time, to do this wrong the first time. We have to make sure we get it right on the FIRST VOTE, however that can be done. We will not get a 2nd chance.

See my more expanded explanation of attorney's below titled "Which is My Point Precisely" http://www.dailypaul.com/236132/lawyers-confirm-all-delegate...

Galatians 5:1
It is for FREEDOM that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.

Dude

What you suggest is a criminal offense. Forcing, intimidating, and blackmailing anyone to vote for somebody else is a crime. Primaries are considered elections by the FEC.

I think you meant to respond to someone else

because I didn't do any of what you've accused me of.

Galatians 5:1
It is for FREEDOM that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.

But the law in question

But the law in question applies to "... any election by the people in any State, Territory, district, county, city, parish, township, school district, municipality, or other territorial subdivision"

This is a civil rights law, concerned with, in its own words: "Race, color, or previous condition not to affect right to vote; uniform standards for voting qualifications; errors or omissions from papers; literacy tests; ..." and how such standards are implemented.

That's the GENERAL POPULATION's qualifications to vote and ability to vote freely, in GOVERNMENT RUN GENERAL ELECTIONS, when selecting federal officials (and the delegates and electors that take part in the next steps in selecting them where applicable), NOT the internal workings of the parties or the Electoral College.

Another poster has already pointed out that the Supreme Court has already ruled that it does NOT apply to the party's functions. (And IMHO that was the correct decision. Even if the government had the constitutional power to control party internals, the congress was pretty clearly legislating about something else. If they'd WANTED it to apply to party internals they had plenty of opportunity to say so.)

(Even if some politician-appointed judge DID decide he had jurisdiction and the law applied, IMHO he would then be at least as likely to rule that bindings ARE appropriate, on the theory that they constrain representatives to follow the expressed will of the people in a general election, as he would be to rule that binding delegates was prohibited coercion and attempts to enforce binding was intimidation. Then we get a precedent for judicial meddling in party internals AND a decision that goes against us.)

As much as it would be convenient to have this law applied the way you want in this particular case, I don't expect it will happen.

So feel free to talk it up TO THE OTHER SIDE. Or to the Obama administration's Attorney General to get him to ask for an injunction against the Republicans (like that would happen when it might mean Obama would get to run against Ron Paul while setting a precedent to use against them next time around).

But please DON'T try to talk our allegedly-bound delegates into depending on it to protect them from penalties if they don't vote according to the binding. They should be aware of the risks when they (in consultation with good lawyers) make their decisions.

IMHO a more reasonable thing to rely on is past rulings of the Party, and statements of its legal councils, that bindings are a fiction.

= = = =
"Obama’s Economists: ‘Stimulus’ Has Cost $278,000 per Job."

That means: For each job "created or saved" about five were destroyed.

Thank You. You Get it.

& you understand different laws apply in different venues.

Galatians 5:1
It is for FREEDOM that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.

Not quite right

Most lawsuits are settled before trial. Which means most attorneys are able to agree to just get as much from each of their clients as possible without have to do the work of a trail.

When attorneys get invlolved only the attorneys win.

peAce

Liberty = Responsibility

Yes, but in most of those

Yes, but in most of those cases they know they're going to lose.

Which is My Point Precisely in RE: to Civil Law Attorney's

When I do my research on anything, I don't quote anything but THE SOURCE. So, in this case, I would study the applicable NATIONAL Rules and consider the penalties of not following the STATE rules ie, does the state or the National rules allow anyone the power to remove me as a delegate?

Jurisdiction is everything. Rules that apply in one Law, may not be applicable in your situation.

I always research the applicable law in any case I'm preparing to pursue BEFORE I interview potential attorneys to represent my case. It is dismaying & stunning how many want to "learn on your dime". I would never hire an attorney who isn't a certified & practiced trial lawyer before a judge & whom makes his/her money by settling out of court. Those are the lazy attorneys.

When I interview the attorney, I ask him how will he deal with a certain hurdle. This reveals how practiced he is. I've had them get defensive & condescending in order to hide their lack of knowledge. I've had them outright lie to my face. I've had attorney's not inform me of court dates and had them drop the ball. I've had them try to intimidate me into settling immediately so that they can get a paycheck.
It's scary when they don't even know for sure how to perfect a process of service, which is civil court lawsuit 101. If an attorney tells me they have to research it and get back to me, I don't hire them. I don't want to pay them $150 an hour to learn the law on my dime or time. I know other attorney's charge a lot more, but $150 is about the lowest you'll pay for a novice.

My whole point is, do your own research of governing rules at the NATIONAL level, which is the governing venue or jurisdiction and look at any applicable power that the National party permits the State to exert over a delegate at a National convention. Look at case history, & determine if such case applies to delegates in this EXACT position & situation.

Galatians 5:1
It is for FREEDOM that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.

All Delegates

Now to get all Delegates to be Ron Paul supporters!!

Attention please

"Anyone who is a delegate not already bound to Ron Paul, and plans to vote their conscience or abstain, needs to consult a competent attorney with election law experience in their own state before going to the convention." DO NOT TAKE LEGAL ADVICE FROM ANY WEBSITE. Contacting the Ron Paul campaign with questions or concerns couldn't hurt either.

Pay the consultation fee (It's nothing compared to what you've already likely donated to the RP campaign). Get the facts. It's too important not to.

http://election4uspresident2012.weebly.com/delegate-info.html

Considerations for the 2012 U.S. Presidential Race from the Mind of a Political Independent-Use this tool to educate the unconverted and prove support for Dr. Paul among Independents.

We need to establish a legal

We need to establish a legal defense fund for Ron Paul delegates immediately.

or...take the penalty like a champ for liberty

instead of paying for lawyers. The law is written in black and white, just read the definitions of the us code mentioned in this video, and then read the damned thing! Stop being afraid! stop looking to others for answers go what your heart tells you, IT IS YOUR GOD GIVEN RIGHT if you dont fight for your right to vote as a free human being no body, government or any other entity which coerces you to vote a certain way is the greatest enemy of democracy and this republic, people died for these principles and now were here shaking in our boots for some unknown consequence. maybe theylle kick you out of the party, maybe theylle fine you, WHO CARES if we dot win this battle we will be fined and taxed to death! where is the sense of urgency people! "if you make yourselves sheep the wolves will eat you"!

For the record...

This is NOT an attempt to dissuade delegates from voting conscience or abstaining. It also has nothing to do with "shaking in our boots." I completely support the spirit of your post. I simply want delegates to be FULLY informed, to know EXACTLY what they are getting into, and to be as EFFECTIVE as possible on the floor of the RNC.

If delegates know the state-and-local-level consequences, then they can weigh them carefully and make intelligent decisions which resonate with their deepest values and convictions. Also, if they consult an attorney expert in these matters, then they can really know what they are doing. Knowledge is indeed power. Go in with your eyes open. Go in prepared.

Considerations for the 2012 U.S. Presidential Race from the Mind of a Political Independent-Use this tool to educate the unconverted and prove support for Dr. Paul among Independents.

Exactly - people are much

Exactly - people are much more effective in resisting intimidation tactics when they know exactly where the the law protects them and where it does not.

AMEN brother!!!

AMEN!!!Finaly!Someone speaking straight truth!!!

great post!

that link is full of info...thx...the best thing I saw was study the bylaws.

I am Ron Paul.

Zenmunk

Where can I upload the Delaware GOP Rules? I have them on PDF

Attention All Delegates! Break your "Binds" and vote for the Constitution in Tampa! Ron Paul 2012

Excellent!

Well, you can go to a site like http://www.docstoc.com/ or http://www.viewdocsonline.com/ and upload the document for free, and then provide me with the URL to the document so that I may add the Delaware GOP Rules to the list on my site. Alternatively, you can email me a copy of the PDF file, and I'll take care of it. Let me know. Thanks!

Considerations for the 2012 U.S. Presidential Race from the Mind of a Political Independent-Use this tool to educate the unconverted and prove support for Dr. Paul among Independents.

Delaware GOP Rules

http://www.viewdocsonline.com/document/4amjvp

I would like to add this caveat: I found this floating around on the web through a general google. I did not, after repeated requests for return calls or emails from the Deleware Republican Party (I have their parliamentarians ph. number) and the Republican National Committee who I would assume would have copies of all states bylaws.

If by some chance someone finally answers my inquiry, I will make sure what I receive from them is the same as the one I uploaded here although it does appear to be legit.

Attention All Delegates! Break your "Binds" and vote for the Constitution in Tampa! Ron Paul 2012

Awesome!

I added it to the list. Thanks so much for your help!

Considerations for the 2012 U.S. Presidential Race from the Mind of a Political Independent-Use this tool to educate the unconverted and prove support for Dr. Paul among Independents.

If that document is

If that document is copyrighted material, a person who would want to ensure it remains downloadable despite any takedown threats would probably want to upload such a thing to multiple torrent networks... if such a thing were to be done by someone...

second!

second!

Bumping!!!

For President Ron Paul!!!!

Romney vs Paul

So far the hard numbers support Romney winning by a landslide. But that is if the vote was held today based on the delegate ratio of those delegate seats that have already been decided. There is still over 1000 to go.

In my opinion, the remaining time until Tampa is crucial for the Paul movement to

1) gather new delegates
Local effort at state conventions. The Paul campaign has had mixed results so far and fighting the old guard GOP continues to see limited gains.

2) influence soft Romney delegates to flip to Paul.
This will require an effective media campaign in the MSM to reach out ot Romney delegates to vote for liberty. I applaud those that organized the Paul Festival a few days prior to the main convention. Bravo! Everyone loves a good concert and party. It will be a great opportunity to flip some hearts.
Liberty

We are like the mechanism of a watch: each part is essential.