-7 votes

A look into the future , a realisation from a non interventionist.

(before you watch the videos they contain violence and blood/gore)

I think everyday about the downfall of america and the slow chipping away of our national liberties. Somebody once said something along the lines of "it wont go out with a bang , but a wimper" I dont believe that the govenment is sinister about this , i believe they are truely ignorant and think that they are helping the country and protecting it. In otherwords i dont see the government as inherently evil , i see the government and its seniority completely detatched from what america is about.

Over the past few days i have been following the story in syria and it has changed my mind about non interventionism. I honestly think these people need our assistance in some way. These people are just like us , only at a different point of their revolution. They seek the same thing we seek , freedom from an oppressive government. Its truely insperational to see these people fighting for whats right. and truely disgusting to see a government with the gaul to kill its own citizens , children even.

here is a quick 10 minute news peice that is fantastic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=SyQIv...

And here is what the people of syria are fighting for (warning , extremely graphic)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=jffUN...

The thing that i took away from this is that yes , we do have the most powerful military in the world , and in some circumstances , where liberty and innocent people in the world are being massacred because of their government , its our job to assist in some way.

take it as you will. Im not for sending out troops in ala-iraq. But im sure a few intelligence agents on the ground marking targets for b2's would help these people take back their country themselves.



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would like to hear more daily

would like to hear more daily paul members opinions on this

All paper money eventually returns to its real intrinsic value, zero. - Voltaire

would like to hear more daily

would like to hear more daily paul members opinions on this

All paper money eventually returns to its real intrinsic value, zero. - Voltaire

all violent conflict has

all violent conflict has blood and body parts and blow up limbs ... the fact that it bothers you is good ... but the immediate emotional response in the form of support one group over another is short sighted and misguided

tons of facts are left out not to mention the hundreds of unknown factors in such a conflict.

helping people as a way of feeling good about something is wrong ... and since we are not advocating empire and ruling people and dictating to them ... you can guarantee no outcome but the replacement of a bad man with another bad man

remember the al qaeda flag flying in libya and the islamists taking over everywhere? how stupid are we?

freedom fighters and martyrs were the ones fighting off the soviet invasion ... and look what they became ... anything different from the soviet tyrants? not really

All paper money eventually returns to its real intrinsic value, zero. - Voltaire

at the end of the day trading

at the end of the day trading one group of mad men for another group of mad men helps no one

All paper money eventually returns to its real intrinsic value, zero. - Voltaire

Really? Why aren't we helping deeply indebted nations?

No Loot? War is a Racket - Major General Smedley Butler.

http://www.economist.com/content/global_debt_clock
What is common between Libya, Iran, Pakistan, Yemen, Sudan? Not enough debt, perhaps.

So the Bankers finance rebels who put pressure on the local government. Local government goes and borrows money to bolster their country's defenses.

In this case, the bankers loaned the US money to create the insurgency in Syria.

Now the blood is running, and the calls go out, "USA must help."

Now the MSM calls on US to the aid of those we put in danger. Those our government has condemned to bloody sacrifice in the first place. MSM calls for us to send the USA, USA chanting morons to the rescue.

Eventually, a war torn Syria reneges on their loans and the banks send in the repo men.

The new Syria, like the new Afghanistan and the new Iraq become dependent. Their incomes are strictly managed. Their liberty is reduced to a simple choice: Bribes or Bombs.

There is no more liberty for Syria at the end of this tunnel than there was for Afghanistan or Iraq.

Being bankrupt ourselves, the US also owes obedience the the Bankers. If we can't raise the debt ceiling, USA defaults.

The OP is in effect calling for the USA to continue spreading our debt enslavement to Syria, Iran and beyond.

Free includes debt-free!

It's good

To have caring and compassion. But what happens when the people are liberated? They go right back to the very same program but under a different name. Some cultures are permanent and it would be a neverending battle and occupation to try. In the end it was a lost cause because of the will of the people themselves.It is like trying to save a woman from spousal abuse,she goes right back to him because she realized she liked it. Human nature we will never change.

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

If you want to assist the Syrian people in overthrowing their

government and laying new foundations for their Liberty and Security, be my guest.

But don't ask OUR government to do it.

At that point, you are using FORCE against the American people to accomplish your goals.

Additionally, there are greater implications when a government takes action on behalf of an entire nation, and merely private individuals take that action.

Witness: the majority of the alleged 9/11 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia. Yet we went to war with Afghanistan. Why? Because the Saudi government is friendly to the U.S. and the Afghanistan government was officially supporting the alleged leader of the plot.

Heed President Washington's warning - it would do us well to avoid meddling in the the affairs of other nations. He said this in the context of what the official foreign policy of the nation's government should be - not what some individuals may find it in their interests or moral code to take action upon.

Thus, if you want to help the Syrians, by all means, do so. But our government and our military should not.

freedom fighters

and martyrs. sounds familiar.
why would our government be interested in helping those that desire FREEDOM?

"The two weakest arguments for any issue on the House floor are moral and constitutional"
Ron Paul

lindalsalisbury's picture

Naive - another word for ignorance

Have you not been listening? 50 plus thousand dead (drafted) Americans and a million dead Vietnamese when we decided to assist the Vietnamese people.

I didn't bother to watch your videos because not only have I already seen enough blood, I see warmongering propaganda almost every day.

Woe be unto the Russians and Chineese if they ever decide to "help" the American people! Include the UN and NATO in the woe.

You cannot possibly be listening or you might understand the concept of "Blowback"

You waste your time, you waste your life, and you are wasting my time!!!

I disagree

As heartbreaking as it is to watch their government do this to them, if we interfere and help them overthrow their regime, it takes away from their achievment and furthers the impression we need to be policeman to the world. In the end the rebels will win...no one has ever won a war against guerilla style warfare...it cant be done, just look at vietnam, afghanistan, hell the american revolution. We did have some help from the french in the american revolution but that is not what won the war for us, it was us, fighting for our land and life...if we leave them to duke it out with Assad, as painful as it is to watch, they will come out stronger for it. Besides all that, you need to think closer to home....you are taking money from the poor to go kill people overseas...did you not learn anything from Iraq? We took out saddam at the cost of 2000 of our troops and 500k iraqi citizens....for one man? We dont have the right to make another country make that sacrifice for a single dictator...they have to rise up and deal with it, then make laws that they think are best to prevent it ever happening again...we are not the police and we need to stop making people depend on us and the military industrial complex.

technically it was because of

technically it was because of the french that we won the revolutionary war. had the french fleet not arrived just in time , cornwallace would have escaped yorktown and relocated his forces

You forget the little fact that England and France were ALREADY

at war at the time.

Are America and Syria already at war? No. Thus intervening on the side of the Syrian people in opposition to their government, would not be analogous.

France's assistance was strategic in its effect of weakening England's economy through loss of trade. (they were both Mercantile economies then)

England gave up on America in order to focus on France. That was the eventual effect in favor of the United States.

Do not forget though how that eventually turned out for France. England won that war. (with France) France ended up in a revolution of their own. (already brewing, but certainly inflamed as a result of poor economic policy which sucked resources out to fight foreign wars)

Which brings up another point

France helped us because of our resources here, It was a great advantage for them to lend a hand and tap our resources and commerce.

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

France wanted market access for their manufactured goods.

They wanted access to raw materials from the colonies.

England wanted to maintain monopoly control over the import/export markets of the Colonies and collect revenues for the great service they were doing the colonists.

When the cost of maintaining that control exceeded the profits England hoped to realize, Independence happened.

The big mistake of the American Quest for Independence, was taking on a debt. One cannot buy independence by trading debt for conflict.

How did Bugs Bunny outwit Elmer Fudd? Or the Road Runner the Coyote? How did Ali Rope-a-Dope?

Did the burden of the original debt turn US into Fudd, Sam, Daffy, or Coyote in the efforts to pay our bills? Is that why these guys were so motivated to "get the Wabbit."

Was the indomitable spirit of Bugs Bunny and Road Runner a reflection of the original American yearning for individual liberty and the desire to share this story with others? While the grass grows, the wind blows. and the sun shines.

"Ayeh, What's up Doc?"

Free includes debt-free!

Funny how it always...

ends up being about the money or resources. Compassion is never shown unless there is a monetary satisfaction of greed and profit on the other end. Will it ever end? probably not until we are all gone from the face of the earth. I truly wish that the wheel had never been invented,The greed of human nature was a little more controllable at a smaller and more localized level. It is way to big to fail now.

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

And this folks is a prime example of the common misconception

about life.

EVERYTHING is about money and resources.

That is because everything is about survival.

If you don't have resources, and the skills to use them or put them to use for your survival, then you need money (another resource) to buy what you need in goods or services.

If you have neither, you die or go begging at the mercy of others.

EVERYTHING in history is about economics, and economics is merely, "how do I fulfill my unlimited needs, wants, and desires, with the limited resources I have?"

The best way to do that is to realize the "golden principle": I can get what I want, if FIRST I strive to give others what they want - otherwise known as the FREE MARKET.

Without a free market, you will be guaranteed larger than normal otherwise populations of poor and destitute folks who can only subsist or survive on either charity, or more likely before long, forced theft from the producers to those who do not.

The free market, allowed to function according to laissez-faire principles, is the most altruistic system anyone could devise. It relies on, rather than denies human nature. It effectively requires one acts in rational self interest, which the most successful who do so, are doing so not by being greedy or uncaring, but by fulfilling the needs of others VIA THE MARKET.

All too often I see people make the mistake of misinterpreting an individual's drive to meet their own needs by fulfilling those of others, not as altruism, even if self-interested, but as greed. How absurd!