5 votes

Q: Do bound delegates even get to vote at all?

I've heard that bound delegates don't even vote at the convention. Instead, what happens is that each state chairman counts all the bound delegates according to how they are bound, then has the unbound delegates (including those released by candidates who dropped out) vote, and then announces the results accordingly.

AFAIK, a bound delegate does not get to vote, at least in the first round, regardless of who she or he supports, and that's not a violation of any law or rule.

Anyone know otherwise?

***UPDATE***
BEST ANSWER:

Best answer is from optimystic (thanks!), who points out rule 37(b) of the RNC rules:

"(b) In the balloting, the vote of each state
shall be announced by the chairman of such state’s
delegation, or his or her designee; and in case the vote
of any state shall be divided, the chairman shall
announce the number of votes for each candidate, or for
or against any proposition; but if exception is taken by
any delegate from that state to the correctness of such
announcement by the chairman of that delegation, the
chairman of the convention shall direct the roll of
members of such delegation to be called, and the result
shall be recorded in accordance with the vote of the
several delegates in such delegation."




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very important

to elect an RP supporter as the delegate chair for your delegation. He/she is in charge of counting the votes and handing them in....

All of the stealth Trolls are

All of the stealth Trolls are coming out of the word work like cock roaches.

There is no Left or Right -- there is only freedom or tyranny. Everything else is an illusion, an obfuscation to keep you confused and silent as the world burns around you." - Philip Brennan

"Invest only in things that you can stand in front of and pr

There are no "bound delegates" and you know it

and you are doing nothing but trying to stir the pot.

Federal Laws Proving Binding of Delegates Is Illegal!
http://www.dailypaul.com/236908/federal-laws-proving-binding...

November 6th 2012 I voted for Dr.Ron Paul
"We must remember, elections are short-term efforts. Revolutions are long-term projects." ~ Ron Paul

No bound delegates? Tell that to the state chairman!

Yeah, I know there are no "bound delegates" and you know it, but what matters is whether the state chairman knows it!

It's fine if the state chairman himself is a Paul supporter, but as far as I can tell a Romney-supporting state Chairman, in, say Nevada or Washington or CO, etc., can just announce delegate numbers based on what he believes the binding rules/laws of his state require him to announce.

That said, I think we're covered by Rule 37 (b), as stated below:

"(b) In the balloting, the vote of each state
shall be announced by the chairman of such state’s
delegation, or his or her designee; and in case the vote
of any state shall be divided, the chairman shall
announce the number of votes for each candidate, or for
or against any proposition; but if exception is taken by
any delegate from that state to the correctness of such
announcement by the chairman of that delegation, the
chairman of the convention shall direct the roll of
members of such delegation to be called, and the result
shall be recorded in accordance with the vote of the
several delegates in such delegation."


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track

very good question

we should get to the bottom of the actual procedure followed.
even if a Paul delegate objects to the state chairman declaring all votes for Rmoney, what are the chances his objection will be held valid by the Convention chair ?

----------------------------
Dr.Ron Paul's 2002 Predictions
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGDisyWkIBM

The chairman of each state...

...tallies votes each round in his/her delegation.

In round #1 each bound delegate has three choices:

1. Abstain

Result = No Vote Tallied

2. Vote and vote for bound candidate

Result = Vote Tallied for Bound Candidate

3. Vote and vote for another candidate

Result = Vote Tallied for Another Candidate. Delegate gets harrassed, mobbed, cast out, etc., when they return home.

Whatever the tallied result is is what the chairman announces on the floor from his/her state.

=8-)

Conservative AND Libertarian!!!

Is this what you know or hope?

Know or hope?


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track

optimystic's picture

Rule 37 (b)

of the RNC states:

"(b) In the balloting, the vote of each state
shall be announced by the chairman of such state’s
delegation, or his or her designee; and in case the vote
of any state shall be divided, the chairman shall
announce the number of votes for each candidate, or for
or against any proposition; but if exception is taken by
any delegate from that state to the correctness of such
announcement by the chairman of that delegation, the
chairman of the convention shall direct the roll of
members of such delegation to be called, and the result
shall be recorded in accordance with the vote of the
several delegates in such delegation."

As a shade tree parliamentarian, I would say that the chairman of the convention is required ("shall") to tally delegate's individual votes and over ruling the state delegate chair. Good news!

rule is simple

the rule is simple, but lets say a Chairman declare that all its delegation is for Rmoney, and some Paul delegate objects to that declaration, what are the chances that his objection would be noted and the roll call done for that delegation ?
is it possible to get the Chairman of the RNC convention - i think it would be very hard.

----------------------------
Dr.Ron Paul's 2002 Predictions
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGDisyWkIBM

optimystic's picture

Yes, we need to get the Chair

A vote for the chair is essential because it will let us know our voting strength right off the bat and if we are successful putting a coalition together to elect a FAIR chairman we have a real shot at the nomination. I would suggest asking Robert Bork to chair the convention. Anyone else here old enough to know who he is?

tamtamfreedom's picture

I can't say for sure...

but this sounds about right to me. They will just simply not let them vote and count them as a vote for Romney. I know in 2008 they just ignored the Ron Paul votes, even if the chairman announced them, it wasn't announced on TV

You're probably right

2008 information from http://www.thegreenpapers.com/P08/R.phtml, had 2380 total delegates (1191 for majority)

The "hard" vote count had 1331 McCain (55.9%), 199 Huckabee (8.4%), 146 Romney (6.1%), 20 Paul (0.8%), with 519 uncommitted (21.8%) and 165 available (6.9%).

If you were watching on TV, what you would have heard was: 2372 McCain (99.7%), 5 Paul (0.2%), 2 Romney (0.1%). Note that Huckabee and Romney released their delegates and that almost all of Ron Paul's votes were ignored: "The 5 Paul votes from Alaska, 4 from Oregon, 4 from Washington, and 2 from West Virginia were not at all announced aloud by the Chair, but the 2 for Romney from Utah were. Indeed, none of the votes for Paul were announced from the Chair and Paul lost 2 votes between the floor and the Chair (re: West Virginia)."

After what happened on the floor, there were some corrections made to the official vote tally which was published as follows:
2343 McCain (98.4%), 15 Paul (0.6%), 2 Romney (0.1%), 20 not voting (0.8%).

In short: whatever delegate count you're using is probably going to be far off from the first round result. Votes that don't go along with the GOP establishment will be ignored and those of the losing candidates will be pushed with the pre-designated winner.

Good question.

Good question.

The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire. - Heinlein

Anyone know?

Anyone?


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track