-51 votes

Bound Delegates Are Bound

The RNC Legal Rep was misquoted. The quote has been widely circulated based on a blog post. However, it has been shown more recently that she was not quoted correctly. The part about delegates becoming free agents was not part of that correspondence and was somehow added by the blogger and put in quotes. Here is the correspondence. Her comments definitely do not say that delegates are free agents. The understanding they basically come to is that rule 38 was not intended as a way of stopping states from binding delegates. It's just that the RNC isn't going to step in enforce the binding, and they leave it up to the state parties. The RNC only steps in and overrules the states if they are breaking national party rules (and the act of binding delegates does not break national party rules). If your state doesn't force you to follow their own binding rules, then you're allowed to vote for anyone you want (even if that person isn't being nominated).

http://republicanselect.blogspot.com/2012/05/rnc-counsel-on-...

Federal Law? Federal law on the binding of delegates. Were you hindered or intimated to vote for Romney during the primary or caucus vote? If not, that is the end of that. It has no bearing on the interal mechanisms of the party after the vote.

Historical example? In 2008, there were a few people who abstained or who voted for Romney or Paul, but in all cases that I've been able to find, they were never bound in the first place or originally bound to Romney or Paul. Show me a delegate in 2008 that was bound to McCain based on the vote and by his/her state party rules but who didn't vote for him. Please don't try naming the Utah delegates.

And as a side note, no one really cared what delegates did in 2008 since the roll call vote was so completely lopsided and the result was never in doubt. States may not have cared enough to do anything even if their rules were violated - and that's completely acceptable according to the RNC. That doesn't mean they wouldn't care enough if the vote was closer. But regardless, show me an example of a case of a delegate breaking binding in 2008.

In 2008. ALL delegates in Utah were bound to Romney.

Then Romney dropped out and released his delegates, and all of them were unbound. The state committee tried to force all of the delegates to vote for McCain, and a couple objected. That's what prompted the letter. And the words often quoted actually weren't even in the response letter from the RNC.

Utah delegates weren't trying to break binding to McCain. The Utah delegates were fighting to be allowed to vote for the person they were originally bound to.

A comparable scenario would be the delegates in Kansas, 33 of which are bound to Santorum. If Santorum releases his delegates they will all become unbound. The state cannot FORCE them to vote for Romney, though they're allowed to if they want. They're allowed to vote for anyone they want once they're released. Utah was trying to take an extra step and re-bind the delegates, and the RNC told them they can't enforce that. One should not take that to mean that delegates can't be bound in the first place, especially since the actual letter says quite clearly that states can bind delegates and enforce that binding.

RNC Rule 15? The RNC specifically allows state GOP as well as state legislation to bind delegates.




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I think

that what has gone on in these primaries and caucus's has done more to wake people up that our guy has done in his 30 years (not for lack of trying)

I really think if RP cannot get the nomination he should run as 3rd party and fuck the GOP. It is unlikely many RP supporters would vote for Romney even if RP endorses him.

If he should endorse Romney in the end we will all know its about Rand that's for sure.

Lets all remember Ron Paul is still just a man, albeit a great one, but still just as human as the rest of us.

We all know deep down inside they will never let him win. But by God what a fight we will give them. We really did force them out of the shadows to show the corrupt and slimy scum bags they all really are.

How many

Subway sandwiches were you paid to post on the DP?

BMWJIM's picture

I'm ONLY BOUND by my heart, mind and

Soul. The rest can go straight to heck! LoL! I will vote as I see fit with God as my guidance! Nothing more, nothing less!

Jim

1976-1982 USMC, Having my hands in the soil keeps me from soiling my hands on useless politicians.

Campaign Confirms

The campaign email just confirmed my delegate count..

According to Rule 11, if a candidate is supported by a third

party, such is the case in Nevada, while another candidate is still in the race, then that candidate can be kicked off of the ballot, no delegates for Mitt.

This is definetely worth looking into. 11a and 11b. This is all what I have heard and what I have seen posted. If this is true, Nevada delgation needs to take this up soon. Team Nevada has supported Mitt Romney and it is not the Republican party.

Why...?

Blaze, honestly why do you come on here, waste loads of time writing up all of theses bogus arguments and posts, trying to convince Ron Paul supporters that they "have" to vote for Romney? The fact that you're only a three week member here is a pretty big give-away that you're a Romney supporter in disguise, and I have no idea WHY you put so much time into these posts, wasting not only yours but those who read them, when it's obvious you aren't going to change anyone's mind.

At this point it would probably be more beneficial for you to come out and say why you support Romney, because then we might at least be able to debate and discuss things with you. As of right now, you're just wasting loads of time.

Why are you so obsessed with

Why are you so obsessed with our delegates??? The other day it was a post where you wanted our delegate count, and now you want to try to convince us that all of our delegates are bound. Our delegates will vote their consciences. Isn't that good enough for you???

Blessings )o(

According to the 2010...

GOP national rules, delegates can be bound by their state GOP as you state.

However, no where in the rules does it state this binding is to be enforced.

It's a loophole of sorts, the kind you will see in many legal documents.

Yes, the state can bind, but if you do not follow the bind, so what? No repercussion is stated in the rules, so technically, no binding exists.

because anyone person party

because anyone person party or state that tried to enforce such a rule would be violating federal election law.

Newsflash

Paul delegates aren't fighting to go all the way to Tampa just so they can lay down and vote for Romney because of some "rule".

Paul delegates will vote for Ron Paul, rules be damned.

Because that's what Paul supporters do: go into the enemy's house and smack tyrrany in the effing face.

With a lead pipe.

You are wrong ...

So we are wrong about RNC rule # 38 and delegates being unbound based on RNC rules ?

The states think they are being cleaver by getting around this rule by not binding the entire group of delegates from each state . The states always have at least one delegate unbound and it is usually three unbound delegates (- 3 party leaders - or the state's 117 unbound RNC delegates that are not a part of the primary election process at all . ) So the states declare that they are not enforcing a Unit Rule (RNC rule #11) in anyway . Therefore , Rule #38 does not apply to elected delegates from each state to be bound .

The RNC's provisions on the Unit Rule make it clear that delegates are not bound to vote according to how most delegates from their state of voting delegates can vote according to their own judgement and conscience . . .

This is a interpatation from the RNC's own legal counsel . In 2008 , this very issue came up in Utah where a delegate did not want to join with the rest of the state and vote for John McCain and demanded that instead , his vote would be cast for Mitt Romney . McCain won Utah in 2008 with 62% of the vote in the primary . Instead , that delegate demended that his vote be cast for Mitt Romney .

Now listen people , in that delegates fight to cast a dissenting vote , Jennifer Sheehan , Legal Counsel for the RNC plainly stated in a letter to Nancy Lord , Utah National Committeewoman , several weeks BEFORE the convention , " The RNC does not recognize a states binding of National delegates , but considers each delegate a ' free ' agent who can vote for whomever they choose." ... And ... " The National convention allows delegates to vote for the individual of their choice , regardless of whether the person's name is officially placed into nomination or not ."

( The delegate process was designed to entrust a group of voters with the power to override the popular vote in each state in order to ensure that the best candidate is chosen. )

Listen again people , The Republican and the Democratic parties are NOT government agencies . They are Private Organizations ! , so voting within a party is not bound by election law !

The Truth in the rules have always been there , we have just allowed ourselves to have them interpated by the RNC instead of our own common sense .

The wording of rule 38 is

The wording of rule 38 is quite clear on its meaning. Rule 15 makes it clear that the states can bind vote if they so chose. Now rule 38 basically says that even if they are bound by the state, the individual can vote as they wish regardless of a states binding process.

The key here is how the RNC will try to interpret the binding process. They can choose to disenfranchise the next generation of politically active people(LAGOP anyone?)... or they can honor our wish to vote as we please.

Besides, this is exactly what the delegate system is in place for.... so we don't have another Hitler or something winning purely on the ignorance of the mostly uninformed masses voting for the most articulate person.

To add to the "article" you linked... I see what you are saying, in a sense.

If Ron Paul does not have at least 5 states with a plurality of BOUND delegates he will not be placed on the Tampa ballot. So even if us RP people vote for RP then it basically counts as a abstention, at least on the first round of voting.

Now as to the issue with delegates actually being bound, from what i understand of that "article" they ARE NOT bound, but their first vote wont count on the 1st ballot.

Anyways... let's just hope to god romney does NOT have 1144 delegates on the first round. If he does not then there is an awesome chance we will win the nomination.

And if we don't win... HA... we already won.
LIBERTY IS POPULAR AND MORE ALIVE THEN IT HAS BEEN IN A LONG TIME,
More time will only add to our power as the corrupt run this whole country into the ground

Tools of war are not always obvious. The worst weapon is an idea planted in the mind of man. Prejudices can kill, suspicion can destroy, and a thoughtless, frightened search for a scapegoat has an everlasting fallout all of its own.

Delegates are bound...

bound to vote for the only real conservative and statesman left in this country! Screw Mitt and horse he rode in on...like that puss would ever climb on a horse!

The bold effort the present bank had made to control the government ... are but premonitions of the fate that await the American people should they be deluded into a perpetuation of this institution or the establishment of another like it-Andrew Jackson

Kinky!

Kinky!

No state will bound delegates ..

RNC rules.

who do you support?

what is your goal?

freedomdreemzz

They arent bound

They arent bound, and even if there were legal repercussions, which there is not, then President Paul will pardon you once he gets inaugurated :)

they're not bound even though

they're not bound even though they are? anything to back up your statement? did your red th post?

Use logic

Ignore fear mongering.

logic is exactly what this

logic is exactly what this post is

sharkhearted's picture

NO.

It is not.

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

troll

troll

Haha Blaze have you ever thought of Comedy?

Your Funny BlazeofGlory!

Its funny to witness A completely delusional ignoramous label a Freedom loving Patriot on a Freedom loving Partiot site a troll.

Good work with trying to convince people who are no longer ignorant of your viewpoints

HAHA

a completely delusional ignoramus who accurately counted how many delegates we have as it was just confirmed by the campaign email. the only delusional ones here are people like you who reject reality

Wow, No really, Wow

You just dont get it.

I feel sorry for you.

sharkhearted's picture

Is that all you can say?

When you have been outsmarted...all you can say is call someone a troll?

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

I don't give a good goddam

I don't give a good goddam about rules and I never have. Unfortunately, I won't be going to Tampa. Could've gotten the votes if I had lied and said Romney, but... Nuff said. But I would hope that, like the name of this wet blanket that keeps making asinine posts, Ron Paul delegates would go out in a "Blaze of Glory," and tell the establishment to go f uck itself. Can we get some big time TV coverage guys? Like maybe a 10 minute chant of "End the Fed" during primetime coverage? BET IT ALL, BABY.

the campaign has stated one

the campaign has stated one of their goals is to get a formal vote for ron paul, but that depends on having a plurality in 5 states. sure our supporters there could act like that but it would make us look bad and ron won't want it. he has made that very clear through the recent campaign statements. and just because my posts are objective and not fanciful that doesn't make them asinine.

sharkhearted's picture

Doesn't make them credible either, though.

You continued sophistry with me when I challenge you with logic on every answer, and you can't even give a straight answer, hardly qualifies for "objective".

OK maybe in a cowering, tail between the legs, sheeple sort of way.

But that's it.

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

cool story

cool story