41 votes

Time to tell which Paul supporters are intelligent enough to read between the lines...

Time to tell which Paul supporters are intelligent enough to read between the lines and which will allow their knee-jerk reaction be to abandon Rand Paul and call him a traitor to the cause of liberty.

So, tonight Rand Paul endorsed Romney for president. I think it was a good move on Rand's part seeing as party loyalty runs deep for the sheeple of our country. Deep down, however, I'm sure he knows it will garner exactly zero votes for Romney from the Liberty movement... in fact, with that in mind, I see no danger in the move at all.

After Romney loses in a landslide to Obama, Rand can run in 2016 without being blamed for contributing to the margin that caused Republicans to lose in 2012. I'm sure the faint of heart will abandon Rand, will cry foul play, will call him names, but that's ok. So far, he's given me no real reason to mistrust him. Besides, it's not like he says he agrees with his philosophy (as if he Romney has one) - just that they have similar family values and agree on like 4 policies (none of which Romney will actually do anything about).

In the grand scheme of things, it makes absolutely no difference at this point. No one is going to say "OH! Rand supports Romney?, he must be a true conservative, then" This is obvious Republican politics, and can only benefit the liberty movement at this point. I don't necessarily think it is a VP move, I think it's more far-sighted than that. I'm thinking 2016. Politicians think in terms of 4 and 8 years... constituents think in terms of months... MAYBE years at best... so it becomes hard to keep everything in perspective sometimes.

Let's take a moment and imagine it is 2016. Romney is as McCainesque, not-distant-enough memory and we have an open election for the White House. Rand Paul is nominated to run for the GOP nomination. Formerly a tea-party favorite and a champion for fiscal conservatism in the Republican party, Rand lost much of his support when he went against the party's nominee and supported writing in Ron Paul or even worse, voting third party for president in 2012! How could this man, who carried so much sway in tea party movement betray the GOP? This traitor to the party cost the GOP the 2012 election, and is the reason Obama got another 4 years. No one could ever elect this man. Paul Ryan it is! We must gather around and elect Rick Santorum, and with no incumbent in the white house, the GOP will win and put Marco Rubio in the oval office for 8 years! This is what all the hot heads want, right? Rand to be a perfectly conforming non-conformist in the liberty movement? To be "JUST LIKE HIS DAD?"

What I can't understand is how anyone in the liberty movement can not see how obvious this is. You'd have to be numb to reality to not read between the lines on this one. I for one, will be using this opportunity to separate my intelligent, Ron Paul supporting friends from my irrational, overly-emotional, non-conformist for the sake of non-conformity supporters of paul just because he is anti-establishment friends. I swear, if Ron became president half of these people wouldn't like him any more just because he would, by definition be the "establishment." It truly saddens me to see the lack of trust, and the lack of loyalty so many have.

Trey Stinnett


It is not my intention to say that anyone who thinks that whatever Rands plan is won't work, or anyone who thinks that playing politics won't work, or anyone who says that purist ideology is the BEST way to grow the movement, or anyone who says that the two party system is bunk, or that the only way to restore our liberties is revolution is, in any way, unintelligent. What I AM saying is this: if you are the over-reactors who are posting images of Rand with a for sale sign, calling him a sell out, or a traitor, or "Benedict Rand" you aren't seeing clearly.

We are at war. This war for liberty isn't a game of checkers, it is a game of chess - infinitely more complicated than any of us can know. There are patriots, two of whom I believe to be the Pauls, who are employing vastly different strategies in an effort to effect positive change toward liberty.

The way that Ron gained his popularity was by being ideologically pure, not making bunk endorsements, and not playing party politics. Ron is the ultimate advocate for liberty- a role model for anyone who wants to be a liberty EVANGELIST. However, evangelism isn't the only weapon we have at our disposal.

There are many in the movement, I dare say most, who believe the complete removal of our government is the only way to restore our liberties. There are those who exercise civil disobedience - ignoring unconstitutional laws and being thrown in jail. Those who advocate 911 truth while publicly supporting Dr. Paul despite the negative effects of their association. There are expats, off-gridders, protestors, gulchhers, seasteaders, and finally there are politicians.

Rand Paul is a politician. Just because he doesn't move in diagonal lines like a bishop or side to side like a rook does not make him a traitor to liberty! Recognize that we each feel called to employ a different strategy and that in-fighting, name calling, and jumping to conclusions for the sake of your own self-gratification as your own form of "purist" is completely counterproductive and can only benefit the statists.

I am glad to see so many comments by people who can tell there is more to play here. What saddens me I how quickly some are willing to throw one of our own under the bus - especially of something as insignificant as endorsing the GOP nominee over Obama.

I can't stress this enough: We need people fighting for our liberties on all fronts. If you don't think that playing politics is the best way, or even proper (and you're probably right), that's ok. But labeling someone a traitor because they are trying to fight according to the rules, is short-sighted and counter productive. There is a whole sector of this movement who believe that there is only one way to advance liberty and the moment that someone tries a different tactic they aim to tear down all that we have worked for. Don't be that person, please. Be above it. Be smart. Disagree with Rand's strategy all you want, but don't believe him a traitor to our cause.

As always, Jack Hunter says it better than I: http://www.ronpaul2012.com/2012/06/08/ron-paul-is-becoming-s...

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I remember

an exchange between RP and Santorum in one of the debates in which Ron said one of the problems with poloticians and our gov't is that too often they are playing polotics and taking one for the team. I agree with him on that. But it's ok when Rand does it?

If you don't have any ideas

If you don't have any ideas then I guess the only purpose of your post was to insult people.


Agree 100%

RonPaulSwag - Intelligent?

The title to your post is offensive and immature. Do you suppose to have a monopoly on the definition of intelligence?

It doesn't take any great intelligence to figure out that Rand is playing politics. Let me remind you this is the Liberty Movement. It is not a political movement, it is an anti-political movement.

In the course of securing freedom, there is no use or need for politics. Political maneuvering is the child of legalized plunder. We do not endorse the use of political maneuvering because we do not endorse the looting of our brothers and sisters for power.

We do not aim to gain anything from government and its politico. We aim to remove the relevance.

The problem with Rand's endorsement is simple. He clearly believes his political maneuvering is justified for the sake of some gain, personal or political. This is quite plainly antithetical to our goals. It also means he is willing to lie.

Ron Paul's glory was his honor. He didn't come up with Liberty. He isn't a great speaker. He is a decent writer. The reason I could get off the computer and be a delegate for Ron was because I saw 25+ years of integrity.

The movement no longer has a qualified replacement for Ron in this regard. It is as simple as that. Nor do we need one. Which is what we need to really get our heads around.

I wish you the best and forgive your arrogance.

Ron Paul 2012
http://blog.aaronjwilson.com - Political commentary with a groove.
"Living The Dream."

It really is

that simple. You either read between the lines and see that he is playing politics or you accuse him of being a neocon dressed up as a libertarian. I don't fault anyone who disagrees with Rand's tactic, but to call him a traitor to the cause, to call him a sellout is counter productive and short sighted.

I'm glad Ron was able to wake up so many by not playing politics. He woke me up - playing politics would have kept me in the dark. And for that, I will always be grateful. But now it is time for Ron to pass the torch, and he's not passing it to ran. He multiplied the torch and has passed it on to millions world-wide. He has passed it to you, to me.

You can say there is no need for politics. It feels really good to say it. But it has been said for generations. People have lived and died and politics are still here. They will still be here 2, 4, 8, and even 100 years from now. If it weren't for politics, we'd still be under Britain's rule. It was men, held in high regard as good Englishmen who signed the DOI. We need people like Rand, just like we need people like Ron.

Romney is a traitor, Obama is a traitor, George Bush? Sure... but Rand Paul playing politics and being a "team player" may not be what we like as a movement, but hell we don't like government at all. Shouldn't we then, abandon all liberty advocates who run for office? After all, they are the establishment?

I don't know the answer... do we try and regain the country through government? Do we do that through the GOP? Do we just continue to educate people as best we can while the public school system puts millions of children a year through indoctrination? We need people who are willing to fight on all fronts.

As I said in my OP, Rand isn't Ron and that's ok. To Ron be the glory of his honor. To Rand be whatever he is able to achieve with his [dishonor]. I simply refuse to believe that Rand endorsed Romney because he is a traitor to liberty. How unfortunate for him to be stabbed in the back by his brothers-in-arms because he employs politics to advance the cause of liberty in his own way.


Playing politics to gain Liberty is like fighting terrorism with bombs and torture.

I will not pretend to know *what* is motivating Rand to play politics. It doesn't matter to me.

You are right, we have had politics for as long as men could put words into media. Liberty is, in fact, the greatest pursuit of humankind. It will take more than Ron, Rand, or Rockwell for such a paradigm shift. Our success depends on our integrity. Rand is going down a path I can not follow and I do not support.

So long as the parties (the party) is in power we won't win the politics game. We just use the election process as a platform to educate. Only by removing the consent of the governed will anything actually change. At this point, not even a violent revolution would work. It would only fail and solidify the power of the state.

Our only choice is to live the life of Liberty. To withdraw our consent and to show others the way. Sure, keep voting for responsible, ethical, and honest liberty candidates... it is the means by which we can educate. Hopefully, in 25 years we will have bred 100 Ron Paul's. Rand just isn't the guy.

(sorry if that was a little disjointed, I am on my way out the door.)

Ron Paul 2012
http://blog.aaronjwilson.com - Political commentary with a groove.
"Living The Dream."

The whole point of being honest and truthful

is not having to "read between the lines" and have "faith". When our last constitutional right of being allowed to have guns is taken away I guess in "the big picture" or what we don't understand is that they are doing it for our own safety. Wake up.

I completely agree

that being overt, open, and honest is a very effective tactic in the war for people's minds. And Ron Paul has gained all of his popularity by employing this tactic.

Doen't make Rand a traitor for choosing a different route. Our movement needs soldiers on all fronts, Rand is not Ron Paul. And I am thankful for that. Perhaps you're the next Ron Paul or maybe I am... perhaps there are 10,000 other Ron Paul's all over this nation, gaining position from city council to state rep, even mayors, sheriffs, and congressmen. We need more Ron Pauls. We need more liberty advocates in positions of power. What we don't need is to jump to the conclusion that advocates for liberty are just wolves in sheeps' clothing because they make political moves.

That being said. We should keep an eye on Rand. As we should keep an eye on Ron and anyone else who intends to garner our support.

The campaign has been subverted

This video makes clear what I have suspected for some time now - there are enemies in the camp. Rand has been influenced as well. Trygve Olson is the subversive, working covertly through Jesse Benton. These two MUST be removed.



She makes ridiiculous implication

Ron Paul was never in this for money. If he was he could have lined his pockets for years with lobby money. His campaign accounts for every singe receipt. They even log receipts for less than a dollar. I can see why this woman is not longer in charge of Ron Paul's affairs. She had me going for a while.

The one thing I have learned from the DP is

How everyone tries to show how SMART they are or how to point out what COULD or IS ABOUT TO happen.

I find it funny, everyone thinks they know everything while telling others everything they know is wrong.

This is just TOO FUNNY now lol.

What it shows me is that Ron Paul would never have done what Rand did so you can try and justify your brilliance in trying to embrace RAND PAUL ENDORSING MITT ROMNEY and pretend like it is some super uber rEVOLution attack from inside.

whatever trey

http://shelfsufficient.com - My site on getting my little family prepped for whatever might come our way.

http://growing-elite-marijuana.com - My site on growing marijuana

it is a war of multiple fronts

and we have no right to attack each other for employing different tactics.

and some people are just straight-up blind claiming that he is a neo-con and just using the liberty movement. He could ignore the liberty movement and win on the teo-con vote. Do I trust him because his last name is Paul? no. Do I trust him less because he plays politics instead of just using the bully pulpit like his father? Yes. However, I refuse to simply jump the the conclusion that he is a "turn-cloak" or a "traitor."

Expecting Rand to be Ron is your first mistake. There are hundreds of thousands, maybe millions who are working their way into positions of government with liberty in their hearts. Rand occupies the highest position of anyone in the liberty movement, forgive me if I give him a little leeway with playing politics.

None of us know what could or is about to happen. But you'd have to be blind not to see that Rand is just playing politics. And if you disagree with playing politics, that's ok. Just don't call the ones on our team who are willing to traitors.


It's not about loyalty for me, loyalty is a two way streets
and I feel like we have been traveling down a one way street lately.

I don't think your friends will mind leaving.

But I understand and of course respect your opinion.

As I said..

Carry on as if this never happened.

TAMPA or bust!

Jane Aitken, 35-Year Veteran Teacher
Ron Paul 2008 Consultant
GOP Woman of the Year 2009
Founder NH Tea Party Coalition (NOT AFFILIATED WITH ANY FAKE 2009 GROUP)
Founder USPEINetwork @ Yahoo (Nat'l Edu Activism Group)
Board Coalition of NH Taxpayers

Lew Rockiwell made a telling

Lew Rockiwell made a telling comment today,"... you cannot change the Mafia from the inside..."

If my need to be RIGHT is greater than my desire for TRUTH, then I will not recognize it when it arrives ~ Libertybelle

I am intelligent enough to know a threat when I see it.

NDAA, torture, murder, permanent imprisonment without charges, endless wars, collapsing world economy, ecological disasters. Did I forget anything. Politics as usual is SUICIDE. Have you thought about that?

Nicely Done! What you think of this?


"We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience"—Pierre Teilhard de Chardin


Yet another you're not intelligent unless you agree with me argument. Unpersuasive.

Its not a matter...

of whether or not you agree with the strategy, it's about how you handle your reaction to someone employing one different from you own.

Here is my follow up: http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2533544


I hope you don't call ducks chickadees because when someone endorses someone else, it's done because he agrees with the endorsed.

BTW, I think it's a way to bully people when you say they aren't intelligent, especially people you've never met.

if only it were that simple

you know better than that. People endorse people as political favors all the time. It's annoying and I wish it weren't that way. Of course, I wish we didn't have political parties either. Hell, I wish we didn't have a government. Still doesn't make Rand a traitor.

I apologize if you feel bullied. I am simply pointing out that an intelligent person can easily observe that there is more to play here, that Rand is endorsing Romney as a political move. You can disagree with the tactic all you want, but to say that the man is a traitor because he plays politics while occupying the highest elected federal position in the state is down right dumb. Yup, dumb.

Really ronpaulswag?

What in the world have you been smoking?

" In Thee O Lord do I put my trust " ~ Psalm 31:1~

I up voted you for your

I up voted you for your reasoning. It is true that by bucking obamney's nomination, it will interfere with rand's future in the party. This, however, is obviously predicated on still believing in the GOP, or that it is the route to liberty. I for one can hardly believe that.

Third parties are always poopoo'd. But the GOP was once one.

19% or less think obamney's, either of them, is capable. Ron is no longer seeking his congressional seat, thus, has no need to follow any binding agreements he may have had in 08 for partaking in primaries.

He should just run as Ron Paul.

i'm not sure I agree

that using the GOP is the way to go. But I'm glad we have someone fighting that battle in case it is.

I respect everyone in the movement. Ron Paul most of all for always sticking to his convictions and always telling the truth, and I stand with the .5% of the population who support him.

Maybe we can start a 3rd party, maybe we can overthrow the government, maybe we can get to 10% of the population waking up by running more and more bully-pulpit candidates, maybe. But I'm not calling them saints, or the guys playing politics traitors anymore than I am calling expats and opt-outs deserters.

Respect for everyone - except those who are calling Rand a traitor.

Should I clap because he took one for the "team"

...Ron Paul defines that as being "Fake" . . .

A good way to defend your freedoms: www.libertymagazine.org

What did Ron Paul have to say

at the Texas convention yesterday? Before all these Rand posts flooded the site.



A majority of our regulars do not understand this and prefer that our liberty candidates needlessly isolate themselves from the Republican party, making tons of enemies along the way. Rand's approach is to stand on his principles while making sure he cannot be marginalized by the establishment. He is taking a brilliant approach and will certainly make his father proud.


know that is exactly what the virtual reality of the tv world says. In my actual experience of the caucus system, it's been the Establishment Republicans who are rude, who cheat, who lie, and are nasty. Have you been through the caucus system?

When did anyone say anything about the caucus system

Or if RP/Romney supporters were being rude? If I had to guess, I'd put all my money on Romney ppl being the instigators. RP supporters don't go around looking for trouble and we have principles.


don't really understand what you're getting at. People generally don't make enemies by not being involved with them.