152 votes

The Republican National Party is a PRIVATE Club. So they can do WHATEVER they want, right? Not...so...FAST!

Now that I have gotten your attention with the title... (grin)

The oft-repeated meme about you know..."RNC...private club....not subject to laws"...and other nonsense...is certainly a clever straw man that they can try to hide behind.

But watch out...that straw man is about to be vaporized by the white-hot heat of the TRUTH...and that is:

THE RULE OF LAW IS EVERYWHERE AND AT ALL TIMES.

Its that simple.

Let's say I own a private bank...not publicly traded, and I commit fraud...then I commit a crime...and a felony at that.

Let's say I have a private charity...and commit fraud....then I commit a crime, and a felony at that..

Well let's say we have this "private" "club" that is responsible for electing an officer for PUBLIC office, not to mention for the most powerful position on the planet, the president of the United States...and this "private club"...willfully uses intimidation, coercion, threats, tampering of documents & ballot boxes, lies, corruption, and of course FRAUD of every type...against voting citizens....then they TRAMPLE the law....and commit multiple, MULTIPLE CRIMES (and felonies at that)...with a widespread, massive assault on individuals and their personal liberties and their NATURAL RIGHT to vote...and on the Rule of Law itself.

FRAUD....is FRAUD....is FRAUD....is FRAUD.

Last time I checked, this is not Germany in the 1930s or Italy in the 1920s.

This is the United States of America, for God’s sakes! We are freeborn, natural-right-bearing, good, honest, liberty-loving, flag-waving, gun-toting, property-owning, happiness-pursuing, Americans.

And we ain’t talking about your child’s school’s P.T.A. elections or elections to the board at your local rotary club.

NO! This is the election process of the most powerful PUBLIC office in the world, that of the president.

RNC…"private club"…my rear end!

Hey RNC Establishment: DO NOT THINK that we are going to let you hide behind that meme, that pathetic straw man argument, and that excuse to commit crimes against voting citizens, for ONE SECOND LONGER.

(Not an attorney here...but I have a degree in Common Sense. If you need legal advice, then please seek it).

ATTENTION: THE RULE OF LAW IS EVERYWHERE AND AT ALL TIMES!!!

Period. End of discussion.

CHARGE!!!

;-) Oh, and BTW...Ron Paul 2012.

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

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Or so you thought

"Last time I checked, this is not Germany in the 1930s or Italy in the 1920s.

This is the United States of America, for God’s sakes! We are freeborn, natural-right-bearing, good, honest, liberty-loving, flag-waving, gun-toting, property-owning, happiness-pursuing, Americans."

We are born into debt created by and benefited by OTHERS.
We are Government Privilege bearing.
10-20% good, honest, Liberty Loving.
Lots of Flag Wavers, Yes.
Lots of Gun Owning, Yes.
Federal Reserve OWNS almost all Property.
Jefferson's Pursuit of Happiness refers to Adam Smith's definition of Happiness which is Self Interest and Altruism in tandem. We are no longer allowed to pursue our own Happiness, we are forced to be Altruistic to those we have no connection with and our Self Interest is heavily regulated.

In spirit you are mostly correct, but in practice, we are Slaves to the Two Party/Federal Reserve System.

Has there ever been a case that anyone is aware of where the

RNC or the DNC (GOP or DEM) have ever been shown to NOT BE ABOVE THE LAW?

Where the "defense" of a "private club" did not work in protecting them? Or any "private club" reference in a criminal trial or in any type of wrongdoing,(even civil trial)

THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT IF SO! IF ANYONE KNOWS OF ANY PLEASE POST!!

Before doing a crime or any

Before doing a crime or any fraud, we should think once that we can’t get hide from society for ever. Good inexpensive or reliable lawyer is now rare around us. By the help of a Personal Injury Lawyer Bellevue you can resist with your unfortunate situation that comes suddenly. They are now having been a popular name in the Bellevue as well as in Settle, WA who have been taking care of the personal injury cases and smiles of millions of people in the matter.

robot999's picture

Based on the upward TREND

of BASHING the FRAUD that plainly occurred and continues now...

We MUST be doing something RIGHT by fighting back with the lawsuit!!!

The level of the fight (trolls seeking to discredit / propagandorize the PLAIN LAW) proves that they are running scared. This should inspire you to add your voice to the lawsuit ASAP! electionfraudremedy.com

"Government is the entertainment division of the military-industrial complex". - Frank Zappa

It is one way, not THE way.

Only time will tell if fighting back with a lawsuit will achieve the desired end results: Properly run elections and Parties that follow their own rules.

Full court press. A millions of people supporting liberty in millions of unique ways.

Free includes debt-free!

It is a Breech of Contract Law

One possible way to eliminate the issue of private V public is to look at the contract angle. Contracts are legally enforceable without regard to the public or private status of the parties to the contract.

The GOP made an offer to the public. They said that anyone who followed their rules would be allowed to become a delegate and possibly achieve party leadership.

Thousands of citizens accepted the offer. Offer plus acceptance equals contract, enforceable by law.

The delegate candidates spent their hard earned money and limited time in good faith to follow the rules. Some of them succeeded. However, the GOP allegedly refused to carry out its part of the deal.

In another words, the cries of the delegates are that the GOP breached the contract. They also cry about fraud in there, somewhere, as well as the assaults and other tricks used to avoid the GOP's duty of having to fulfill their contracts.

Even though breech of contract might look like a good legal avenue to pursue, I would leave it up to the lawyers to determine the best grounds for their legal action. They are the pros who make a living at this game.

I am not a lawyer but I have had a long time keen interest in litigation tactics. My quick, cursory reading of the lawsuit indicated to me that the lawyers found a federal regulation which might be the best way to pursue this case. The part of the code that I read eliminates the argument of private V public, so it does not appear to be an issue in this situation, even with a federal claim.

By the way, natural law from God and "rule of law" is not necessarily enforced by the courts. It was part of the original intent of the Constitution but it is not the driving force anymore. But, thankfully, contract law is still enforced by the courts.

Gene Louis
http://www.survivaloftheslickest.com/
Supporting a Needed Tool for Government Feedback:
A Citizen-Operated Legal System.

How Private?

How private is a club that takes public funding, I believe Dr Paul said something in the neighborhood of 18 million Tax Payer Dollars just for the Republican National Convention alone!

18 MILLION DOLLARS!!! And we're not even allowed to have the simlitude of a debate, or any form of open discussion about what we need from our next Presidential candidate, or what qualities this candidate may need in order to win in a national election.

So either it's public, or it's private, but if it in fact private then pull all public "Tax Payer" funding from it, because we shouldn't have to fund something in which we have no public say in!!!!!

Just my 2 Cents,

Marvin Hutchison
Hamlet, North Carolina

Oops.. mispost... deleted

Oops.. mispost... deleted

To commit fraud doesn't there

To commit fraud doesn't there have to be a contract? And for a contract there has to be some "consideration" by both parties. If there are some dues paid directly to the GOP at whatever level, then there is a contract between the individual that paid dues and the (local, state, federal) GOP. Otherwise, there is no contract, and therefore no legal fraud.

sharkhearted's picture

Legal Positivism....

Once you grasp that you have been grasping at straws by buying into the legal positivism drivel....your eyes will be opened!

No one is above the rule of law.

And if the law or rule or reg...violates natural law, then it is no law or rule or reg...at all. It is null, without authority, and unenforceable.

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

Contract Law

I recently researched contract law. I think a case could be made that an elected delegate, or anyone allowed to vote at a Republican caucus, has entered into a verbal contract with the RNC. Contract law apparently doesn't require one to have a literal contract.

"Last time I checked, this is not Germany in the 1930s"

It may be time to check again.

___________________________________________________________________________
"Bipartisan: both parties acting in concert to put both of their hands in your pocket."-Rothbard

sharkhearted's picture

You are correct! I was just making a rhetorical point.

But I agree with you....1000%!

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

Maybe not so rhetorical...

Try Mexico 1909. The analogy seems to fit a little too well. I highly recommend this great 1952 film to everyone concerned with Liberty. It seems like all of us, including Ron Paul, are characters in this movie.

Here are some clips. (Sorry about the ads. Fortunately, they are very short.)

Judge for yourselves:

http://www.tcm.com/mediaroom/video/350826/Viva-Zapata-Movie-...

sharkhearted's picture

Here is the simple argument that is being missed by some:

ATTENTION: THE RULE OF LAW IS EVERYWHERE AND AT ALL TIMES.

End of story.

(But it is a beautiful story!)

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

Ron Paul GOP Trolls are not above the Law

They are not allowed to be delegates because they want to.

There's your natural law

sharkhearted's picture

Do you not understand...Natural Law??

Natural Law precedes and pre-exists any man-made decree.

Like the Law of Gravity and the Laws of Thermodynamics...It just is.

And....

No delegate...or voter...or otherwise...can be FORCED (the key word is "force") to vote against their conscience...EVER.

Period. End of story.

I would think...if you like things like the Constitution, and the Age of Enlightenment, and that people like Jefferson, Paine, Locke, and Henry....were onto something.

So...the idea of Natural Law is not trivialized as you so put it. Maybe you are mistaken??

Giving you the benefit of the doubt.

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

Ron Paul TROLLS crash the GOP and then blame the GOP.

Ron Paul explained, that to win, he needs us to become delegates, and to do that, the way it has been ESTABLISHED, is one attends central committee meetings. Even better, one gets a seat on a central committee. But it seems that because there are empty seats, delegate positions were open, and so people who never went to a committee meeting, showed up at a convention and basically, did as little as possible to become a delegate.

They don't know they rules, they don't know the by-laws, they frankly, don't care, because the only reason they are Republicans is for Ron Paul, like me, except, I got a seat on a central committee, and I know the by-laws, and I am now, the ESTABLISHMENT.

Where oh where are my Ron Paul Republican rEVOLutionairies? Why aren't they here with me? Here is a GOLDEN opportunity being lost.

I see people here telling other people here, "Oh Mr. 2 Hrs TROLL!", Hey Newbie", "Get Lost Mr Two Weeks and one day!"

Maybe the GOP ESTABLISHMENT, those who attend those GOP central committee meetings, feel the same way about Ron Paul 3 month old Republicans who never went to a central committee meeting to save their city from a NWO?

Golden Rule, Karma, whatever you want to call it, busting down the GOP doors, calling them names, because of what YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU, YOU who are so ALL very important and special, and YOU don't need to go to central committee meetings, because YOU don't need to do anything but show up for two seconds and take a seat in a political party YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE.

So where do WE, central committees, L4RP, and YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU go from here? My guess is NWO, because as brilliant and wonderful and awesome as YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU are, you don't have plan B (oh that's right, you're going to write-in Ron Paul, or vote for GJ, because YOU didn't exactly do Plan A (which was get on a central committee), and instead of being RESPONSIBLE for more than 3 months and two weeks, TROLLING the GOP, you crashed the party and BLAMED them.

When I say YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU, I'm not pointing to Chris, because Chris here has gone further than most here, and has been respectful, and I feel his pain. I feel all the delegates pain, but I also feel the pain of the people who may be wrong to YOU, but are really good people who care. Sure there's some bad apples in the GOP. But there's allot of nice people too.

I wish we could have actually been more like Ron Paul, who has attended many central committee meetings, met Republicans, followed the rules, was compassionate to everyone, even those that didn't exactly deserve it.

If a NWO is what we wanted, that's great, because the way we're going, that is exactly what we are going to get. Blame and flame away, because YOU are the one who failed, not Ron Paul, not Ron Paul's campaign, not those like me who joined the central committees and took time to get by-laws, read them and follow the rules. I think YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU only have yourselves to blame for TROLLING the GOP in the name of Ron Paul but not doing what Ron Paul did, RESPECT, visit the central committee, learn the rules, follow the by-laws of the party YOU joined.

They ban people on DP for doing what YOU did to the GOP but you shouldn't be banned from the GOP for being a Troll?

Hmmm?

While I respect the point

you are making about "us" invading the Republican party, that doesn't give the party justification to fail to comply with the Voting Rights Act. The Repub's may think of themselves as a private party, but that does not prevent them from coming under the purview of the Voting Rights Act.

From 42 USC § 1971
(only relevant topics are posted here)

(b) Intimidation, threats, or coercion
No person, whether acting under color of law or otherwise, shall intimidate, threaten, coerce, or attempt to intimidate, threaten, or coerce any other person for the purpose of interfering with the right of such other person to vote or to vote as he may choose, or of causing such other person to vote for, or not to vote for, any candidate for the office of President, Vice President, presidential elector, Member of the Senate, or Member of the House of Representatives, Delegates or Commissioners from the Territories or possessions, at any general, special, or primary election held solely or in part for the purpose of selecting or electing any such candidate.

In case you think the state conventions don't count as an election.

Here is the Federal Regulation defining an election, and specifically defining what is a Primary Election.

11 CFR 100.2

Election ( 2 U.S.C. 431(1) ).

(a) Election means the process by which individuals, whether opposed or unopposed, seek nomination for election, or election, to Federal office. The specific types of elections, as set forth at 11 CFR 100.2 (b), (c), (d), (e) and (f) are included in this definition.

(c) Primary election. A primary election is an election which meets one of the following conditions:
(1) An election which is held prior to a general election, as a direct result of which candidates are nominated, in accordance with applicable State law, for election to Federal office in a subsequent election is a primary election.
(2) An election which is held for the expression of a preference for the nomination of persons for election to the office of President of the United States is a primary election.
(3) An election which is held to elect delegates to a national nominating convention is a primary election.

As you can plainly see, ANY operation by the Republican party to elect a candidate for the office of President must be carried out in a manner consistent with the Voting Rights Act. It is absolutely ILLEGAL for the MA state party to require an affidavit under threat of perjury of their delegate voters, as that is either coercion, or indtimidation or likely both. It is absolutely illegal to manipulate vote counts whether in the actual primary, or in the convention held to "elect delegates to a national nominating convention". If you believe, because you have been their longer, that you should have more of a right to go to Tampa to represent your state in a convention to nominate a candidate for President of the United States, you are DEAD wrong. You engaged yourself in an election defined under Federal law. The majority rules those elections whether a person has been there two days, or two hundred.

I believe

That because I joined the Republican Party, petitioned. qualified and because no one ran against me, won a seat on a Republican Central Committee, that is in dire need of seated/representative Republicans, who at my County Clerk's office I signed forms to uphold the Constitution, a 470, and took an Oath to the Republican Party to become a delgate, that I have earned the right to VET candidates and issues because that is my elected job, like ALL Central Committee members, so that gives us the right to nominate OUR candidates.

If you think that because there are open seats, that you have a right to "crash our Party", and think that election laws apply to you, YOU are sorely mistaken. You have the right to vote in primary and general elections, PERIOD. YOU do not have the right, nor have you signed forms and taken oaths to NOMINATE for me, and MY Party, OUR candidates.

NO one has the right to break another persons hands, or cheat. These ILLEGAL acts are injury laws, not election laws, so those who have been personally hurt need to find personal injury lawyers and sue the life out of those who hurt them.

The GOP is NOT a private club. It is a registered political party that has by-laws, oaths, and rules we agree to follow.

Why should you, or anyone, be able to skip the work and show up expecting to be a delegate when you have no clue what a central committee is, has never been to one, and confuse personal injury laws with election laws?

I hear what you are saying, and many of us are getting

Involved. It is not you alone on the mountain Moses. Regardless the things I quoted prove that you are incorrect. The law specifically addresses nominating conventions. Regardless of how you feel personally, Federal election law does apply at state conventions whose purpose is nominating a candidate for President. If I choose to do what is necessary to participate in the Republican primary process (sometimes register, sometimes just show up) then I have done all that is necessary to afford me the legal protections of the voting rights act. How in your mind do you not consider forcing a qualified voter to sign an affidavit under threat of perjury to not be coercion or intimidation? Also, that point you made about injury law is incomplete. If I am injured during the course of trying to vote, by someone who is attempting to intimidate, or coerce me into changing my vote that person has broken Federal election law and can be charged with that AND any necessary assualt related charges.

Oh look! I'm mister central

Oh look! I'm a central committee! YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU are to be blamed! :P
Get yo ass outta here!

Oh Look Mr 38 Weeks No Nothing Bully

Youu have no reason to be jealous, there could possibly be a seat open and waiting for you.

It's a sad state of affairs,

even the quality of our beloved trolls is in decline.

Free includes debt-free!

Rule of Law

Which law was broken? It's not good enough to just accuse the GOP. Even the GOP is innocent until proven guilty.

Quite honestly, if they did commit fraud, I'd want to know who against. They can't commit fraud against the "public". The "public" is no more frauded by a GOP cheater than they are if the Libertarian party cheated.

I could agree that possibly the GOP members have been defrauded.

Plus, the bulk of your argument is made on the importance of the nomination. Importance doesn't change anything. If they can cheat for mayor of Nowheresville, they can cheat on president.

They're only cheating their own rules. If you set a rule for yourself, and then don't follow it, have you frauded anyone?

If I agree with your point or not is moot.... my point is that you've made a weak case and need to improve it if you're really serious.

The Revolution is not based on weak cases.

sharkhearted's picture

Perhaps Federal Election law will clear this up for you:

You can't get any clearer than this. Please see below...maybe this will help:

42 USC § 1971 - Voting rights
"Intimidation, threats, or coercion.
No person, whether acting under color of law or otherwise, shall intimidate, threaten, coerce, or attempt to intimidate, threaten, or coerce any other person for the purpose of interfering with the right of such other person to vote or to vote as he may choose, or of causing such other person to vote for, or not to vote for, any candidate for the office of President, Vice President, presidential elector, Member of the Senate, or Member of the House of Representatives, Delegates or Commissioners from the Territories or possessions, at any general, special, or primary election held solely or in part for the purpose of selecting or electing any such candidate."
Caucus or Convention.
A caucus or convention of a political party is an election if the caucus or convention has the authority to select a nominee for federal office on behalf of that party.” - 11 CFR 100.2 - Election (2 U.S.C. 431(1))."

~Chris
Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

But

No one has stopped you from voting in a general election or primary election, and that is what that law would apply.

Central committees, whence delegates come, have by-laws and rules, and it's how they protect themselves from being overrun by trolls, because they have a right to protect the integrity of what they took an oath to uphold.

What oath would that be?

Can you write out this oath you speak of. Are you saying a person must take an oath to participate in the party as a committeeman? It is against my Religion to take any oath but to God. Would I be turned away if I refused this oath you speak of?

Yes

When the County Clerk found I had the required signatures for ballot access, and no one ran opposed, so I had won my seat through default, I had to come into the County Clerk's office, sign a paper that I would uphold the Constitution of the USA, I had to sign a 470 http://www.ask.com/wiki/California_Penal_Code?, and I took an Oath http://sun.iwu.edu/~iwucrs/oath.htm