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Why Religion and Morality I think Ron Paul knew this as well.

A interesting website I found and would like to share.
I believe Ron Paul knew this as well.

WARNING this might offend some anti religion or anti moral viewers

VIEWER DISCRETION IS ADVISED!

below is a part quoted from link below

Why Religion and Morality

In 1776, the year Thomas Jefferson drafted the Declaration of Independence, John Adams wrote to his cousin, “It is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand.” There it is again. Why did the Founding Fathers keep pointing back to these fundamental building blocks? Adams himself answered that question in 1798, while serving as president: “Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”

There is the answer! They kept referring to religion and morality because, as Adams said, our Constitution was made only for moral and religious people! Now the question is, why? Why was the Constitution written only for moral and religious people? Why was it inadequate to the government of any other?

Alexis de Tocqueville’s 19th-century observations on the American republic answer this critical question. After touring America for two years in the early 1830s, he returned home to France and wrote his political classic, Democracy in America. Like the Founding Fathers, Tocqueville acknowledged that religion and morality were indispensable to the maintenance of the American republic. Why indispensable? He said that while the constitutional law of liberty allowed Americans complete freedom to do as they pleased, religion prevented them from doing that which was immoral and unjust. In short, Tocqueville surmised, liberty could not be governed apart from religious faith, lest there be anarchy.

Without the moral restrictions of a higher spiritual law, the liberty afforded Americans in the Constitution would be abused. George Washington knew that! So did the rest of the Founding Fathers. That’s why they kept harping on religion and morality. They did not want to see the United States of America self-destruct.

The success of our Constitution does not depend on which political party we belong to—it depends on how biblically spiritual we are!

http://www.thetrumpet.com/?q=8438.7170.136.0

-Ron Paul

My faith is a deeply private issue to me, and I don’t speak on it in great detail during my speeches because I want to avoid any appearance of exploiting it for political gain. Let me be very clear here: I have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Savior, and I endeavor every day to follow Him in all I do and in every position I advocate.

It is God Who gave us life. As He is free, so are those He created in His image. Our rights to life and liberty are inalienable.

http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/statement-of-faith/

http://ronpaulflix.com/2011/05/ron-paul-speaks-about-jesus-c...

"I am a real Christian – that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus Christ."
--The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, p. 385.

John Hancock
1st Signer of the Declaration of Independence

"Resistance to tyranny becomes the Christian and social duty of each individual. ... Continue steadfast and, with a proper sense of your dependence on God, nobly defend those rights which heaven gave, and no man ought to take from us."
--History of the United States of America, Vol. II, p. 229.

George Washington
1st U.S. President

"While we are zealously performing the duties of good citizens and soldiers, we certainly ought not to be inattentive to the higher duties of religion. To the distinguished character of Patriot, it should be our highest glory to add the more distinguished character of Christian."
--The Writings of Washington, pp. 342-343.

Thomas Jefferson
3rd U.S. President, Drafter and Signer of the Declaration of Independence

"God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever; That a revolution of the wheel of fortune, a change of situation, is among possible events; that it may become probable by Supernatural influence! The Almighty has no attribute which can take side with us in that event."
--Notes on the State of Virginia, Query XVIII, p. 237.

John Dickinson

SIGNER OF THE CONSTITUTION; GOVERNOR OF PENNSYLVANIA; GOVERNOR OF DELAWARE; GENERAL IN THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION

Rendering thanks to my Creator for my existence and station among His works, for my birth in a country enlightened by the Gospel and enjoying freedom, and for all His other kindnesses, to Him I resign myself, humbly confiding in His goodness and in His mercy through Jesus Christ for the events of eternity.27

[Governments] could not give the rights essential to happiness… We claim them from a higher source: from the King of kings, and Lord of all the earth.28

granted not all founding fathers had a religion or had a different religion but a lot were Christians.

and some extra sites if interested in reading.
1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkJwwtxGJMs i found this to be a good video. added this here June 25,2012 at 8:00pm

2. http://www.americanheritagealliance.org/heritage7.htm

3. http://americanpatriotseries.blogspot.com/2011/07/faith-of-o...

also a interesting part of a Ron Paul news letter.

The ultimate goal of the anti-religious elites is to transform America into a completely secular nation, a nation that is legally and culturally biased against Christianity. ~ Ron Paul

The notion of a rigid separation between church and state has no basis in either the text of the Constitution or the writings of our Founding Fathers. On the contrary, our Founders' political views were strongly informed by their religious beliefs. Certainly the drafters of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, both replete with references to God, would be aghast at the federal government's hostility to religion. The establishment clause of the First Amendment was simply intended to forbid the creation of an official state church like the Church of England, not to drive religion out of public life.

The Founding Fathers envisioned a robustly Christian yet religiously tolerant America, with churches serving as vital institutions that would eclipse the state in importance. Throughout our nation's history, churches have done what no government can ever do, namely teach morality and civility. Moral and civil individuals are largely governed by their own sense of right and wrong, and hence have little need for external government. This is the real reason the collectivist Left hates religion: Churches as institutions compete with the state for the people's allegiance, and many devout people put their faith in God before their faith in the state. Knowing this, the secularists wage an ongoing war against religion, chipping away bit by bit at our nation's Christian heritage. Christmas itself may soon be a casualty of that war.

December 30, 2003

Dr. Ron Paul is a Republican member of Congress from Texas.

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wow, someone voted you down. I voted

you back up. We do have an interesting group here. I agree. I think we should also warn the children about the dangers fundamentalists create. We should have them explore WHY some individuals feel the need to externalize their chosen creation myth and force it on others. I see this as a crisis of faith. They attack individuals that don't feel the same way because they lack the internal confidence in their chosen belief system. They project their insecurity on others and this can be very dangerous and destructive to people and governments.

Thanks!

I see you get voted down also. Anyways! My views tend to be too broad for most. I can see why some here vote me down, and you as well. :)

I believe children should "explore" all religions of the world. I have seen it taught as a course in high school. Most teens find it really interesting. For myself I have studied most world religions and believe all the beautiful truths in every religion and realize most religions also have a degree of superstition and doctrine based on cultural beliefs. The old way is to believe everything the church teaches, blindly, because that is part of how churches work, and it involves power and control over others. Too much guilt and fear involved in it for me.

Christ Jesus is my beloved friend and Guardian Angel, but I cannot in all conscience attend a church. They just get too much wrong and too much indoctrination. Now watch all the down votes. :)

Morals are not derived from

Morals are not derived from religion. Thanks for the disclaimer at the start of the post though!

Huh

Were would morals come from then??

Are you trying to say that us

Are you trying to say that us Atheists have no morals? Are you telling me that the only reason you don't rape kids and murder people because it says not to in that stupid book? Actually, that book says to kill people, even your own children. Dashing babies upon rocks and killing people that don't accept Jesus as their king, selling your daughter into slavery, yeah, these are great moral teachings. If you need a book to tell you not to hurt others then you have serious issues. Sorry, I don't think infanticide and rape and murder are okay, but I'm just an immoral Atheist. If you think that morals are only derived from religion then we can just go ahead and exclude ethical subjectivism, cultural relativism, utilitarianism, deontology, ethical egoism or objectivism, rights ethics and virtue ethics and all other theories because the only possible way for a person to be moral is through religion. Again, I would recommend taking a few classes on ethics and morality. The need for religion to be the basis of morality is due to ignorance of the subject as a whole. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go and be kind to the people I come across today just because it's the right thing to do in my mind, and the minds of the likes of Ghandi and Thoreau. (They were immoral too I suppose)

Another question

Where does logic come from .. the big bang??

I know

Morals came out of the big bang .. just like the software (brain) that runs your hardware (body) .. So morals come from what YOU believe to be right

"So morals come from what YOU

"So morals come from what YOU believe to be right"

Heeyyy, now your getting somewhere.
You see, the problem is, people want to argue about something that they know one side of. Many of the people posting in this thread aren't debating,they're proselytizing.

Huh

Were would morals come from then??

Not all the founding fathers shared in your beliefs.

Thomas Jefferson removed all the super natural aspects from the New Testament and created his own bible, The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth.

http://www.angelfire.com/co/JeffersonBible/jeffbsyl.html

Jefferson did not view Jesus as divine but a morally superior human that improved upon the Jewish religion.

Thomas Paine who stoked the flames of revolution on two continents with Common Sense and later The Rights of Man was not religious.

Believe what you want I'm am not trying to stop you. But whenever I see someone take a partial Jefferson statement out of context to peddle their dogma I feel obligated to correct it. Have a good one.

deacon's picture

zerofriction

you are correct about the jefferson bible
now correct me if i am wrong,but isn't that the same bible
used in the swearing in process?
deacon

If we deny truth before your very eyes,then the rest of what we have to say,is of little consequence

Thomas Jefferson

Would have objected to people calling his "Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth" a "Bible". It was meant to simply be a study of Jesus's morals for his own personal use. Not to remove supernatural aspects of the Bible.

He always identified himself as a Christian. There were a few times in his life where he struggled with his faith, most notably at the end of his life where he began to reject many orthodox doctrines of Christianity. This was due to a religious movement, led by some of his close friends, that took root in his area around Charlottesville. It was very anti-Calvinistic, so much so that it rejected nearly everything that Calvinism embraced, such as the Trinity, the Virgin Birth of Jesus, the inspiration of the letters of Paul, etc. Jefferson was strongly affected by this. Had he lived a few years longer he likely would reverted back to orthodox Christian beliefs, as the movement died out only a year or two after his death.

Don't believe everything you read about the Founding Fathers, especially about Jefferson. Much history about them has been rewritten.

Thomas Paine you are correct about. However, his criticism of Christianity and belief in God was strongly rebuked by other Founders, particularly Ben Franklin, arguably one of least religious Founders after Paine.

“It is not our part to master all the tides of the world, but to do what is in us for the succour of those years wherein we are set, uprooting the evil in the fields that we know, so that those who live after may have clean earth to till." -J.R.R. Tolkien

One founding father

That is ONE of founding fathers ... How many were Pastors? .. Thomas Paine was sent packing back to england after he slammed Christanity .. do your research

Paine was sent back to

Paine was sent back to England because he was continually begging Congress for money. He was our very first welfare case. (Tom Paine Revolutionary by Olivia Coolidge)

Blessings )o(

This is true and reveals

the fundamentalist's historical fantasy. Our Founding Fathers warned us they would try to corrupt our social and government infrastructure with their primitive interpretation of their chosen creation myth. This pattern is common in history. Our Founding Fathers were intelligent and spiritual men. They understood the importance of keeping your faith private and sacred.

"We have no government armed with

powers capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, and licentiousness would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other" --John Adams

When the Founders spoke of religion and morality like this, they meant Christian.

Denise B's picture

Thank you for this post.

I find it sort of ironic that many people on this site and elsewhere will hold our founding fathers up in the highest esteem, except of course when it comes to matters of their faith and religious beliefs. Especially because it was their religious beliefs and faith in God that drove them to do much of what they did.

I also find it perplexing how people can make the argument that morality can exist outside of a belief in God and His statutes. The greatest proof of that is all around you. For the past 50+ years there has been a systematic removal of God and sound biblical teaching from society in general...our children in general are no longer taught biblical principles and agnosticism and atheism is rampant and what has it gotten us? Corruption is rampant in all corners of our society from all levels of the government to the court system to big business to education, wherever you want to look not to mention the social repercussions in a world eithout God...droves and droves of unwed mothers (the vast majority of welfare recipients), broken marriages, elderly parents with no one to care for them - most of today's welfare recipients can be directly linked to the breakdown of morality in our society.

And as I've stated before, most of this systematic elimination of God from our society was driven by the very same PTB who seek to also take our rights away and enslave us. Doesn't anybody see that it is foolish to believe that these wicked people are wrong about everything else they do, but somehow when it comes to destroying biblical principles and banishing God from the public square, well, that was done for our own good to free our minds from ancient superstitions....really? ...really?

Blinded and hypocritical.

You say that people basically like to ignore the fact that the founding fathers were religious. And then people like you ignore the fact that extremely bad people like Hitler were Christian. How do you defend that?

Now, you are making the claim that someone cannot have morality unless he believes in "God and His statues." Obviously you are referring to a Christian God and no other. This concludes that no other person in the history of the world could have been a morally good person unless according to you they believed in the Christian God and His statues.

How do you account for all the morally good people that aren't Christian? Do you just look away and act as if it doesn't exist?

I'm agnostic, but I consider myself an extremely moral person. I've chosen the higher road, not because it was easy (it was quite the opposite), but because it was right. My common sense and conscience dictates to me what is right and what is wrong. And I don't need people like you telling me that I'm doing it wrong because I don't follow your religion.

If you refer to http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2575992 you'll realize that there are other people out there who say and believe the same things as you except they follow another faith. How does it feel knowing that someone "knows" in their mind that no one can be a morally good person unless they follow buddhism?

Denise B's picture

Technically awl,

what I am saying is that in my belief system, Christianity, the very idea of morality itself and what is determined to be moral proceeds directly from God Himself and His laws. He is the standard bearer and most of what you would call "natural law" can be traced back to the Bible (which predates any of the other religions). The problem with morality proceeding from man's own mind alone is that it changes from culture to culture and who really gets to say what is moral - headhunter didn't see any problems with what they did and the Mayans didn't see any problem with sacrificing children - do you see the problem. So based on my belief system, we are all born with the capacity to do terrible things, all of us without exception and God is the only thing that restrains us, sets standards for us and saves us from ourselves.

That being said, I am not telling anyone that they HAVE to agree with me, and I certainly have no intent on forcing anything upon anyone (if you feel that my having an opinion at all is forcing something on you, that I contend that you are wrong). It just really aggravates me when people pretend that they are so open minded and "evolved" and love liberty blablabla - and then turn around and call anyone names that doesn't agree with them and seek to have people that they disagree with silenced or belittled. I respect your right to believe whatever you want to believe and I simply ask that you do the same. I have no problem with discussing these beliefs with anyone, if that's what it is, an honest, civil discussion. The problem comes in when there are those that want to rewrite history and attack or silence people who disagree with them. I haven't called anybody any names, yet I have been called a "fundamentalist", "extremist" and told I was suffering from a "mental disorder" just on this post.

And I am also sorry if my beliefs hurt your feelings, truly I am, but in a truly free society that respects freedom of speech, you can be pretty sure that on occasion your feelings will be hurt. I don't dislike you, I just believe what I believe and respect your right to do the same.

You have a right to own opinion.

My feelings were not hurt by your opinions and I don't think you are saying anyone has to agree with you. But, I do think you are saying that anyone who doesn't live according to your moral code (the one of the Christian Bible) isn't living a moral life and I kindly disagree. You made mention that different cultures will have different morals and while this is true, it's also true that different religions have different morals.

My whole point is that YOU should be open-minded to the fact that there is not strictly an absolute RIGHT and WRONG. Everyone has their own views and I think it's hypocritical to say "My way of thinking is the only way of thinking - you're wrong because my religion says so." You believe your religion just as strongly as anyone else and it's ignorant to think that your way of life is morally better than someone of a different religion. You BELIEVE Christianity is the one, true path. If it was factually the one, true path then most everyone would be Christian instead of branching off into other religions. But, it's not fact, making any statement like "morality can only be defined through MY Bible" a false and incorrect statement.

People are always trying

to make Hitler and Stalin out to be Christian.

I think you guys are missing the point...

There are immoral people that are Christians and there are moral people that aren't. That's my point. The person I replied to seems to think ONLY Christians can be moral.

Denise B's picture

No, there are immoral

people who PRETEND to be Christians and are not. True Christians, although not perfect by any means, try to live by the standards that God has set for them. Show me a person who claims to be a Christian and lives in a perpetual state of immorality and I will show you a liar.

Denise B's picture

And I am also saying

that the non-believing people who appear to be moral, are believing that they are moral because they adhere to statutes and laws of conduct that proceed directly from the bible, whether they realize it or not.

Okay, it's been interesting - I've rambled far too long today and need to to go cook supper - Peace!

Agree to disagree.

I don't decide that I'm not going to go on mass killing spree because Christianity tells me it's wrong. It's wrong on it's own merits.

Hitler was a christian?

LOL

He was a Batavsky/Thule occultist and was clear about it in his writing.

One of the forces that is driving the

"systematic elimination of God" is the bigotry displayed by those that believe in God. They have chosen one creation myth, among many, and believe this creation myth should dominate a diverse country's social and government infrastructure. They attack any individual that believes something different. They make up historical fantasies to justify the bigotry. For example, our Founding Fathers made it clear that organized religion had the potential to be extremely dangerous and had no business in government. An evolved individual was capable of keeping their spirituality private and sacred. They openly ridiculed and warned against fundamentalists forcing their primitive interpretation of the concept of a "God" on a free population. They did encourage a spiritual life full of self-reflection. This is MUCH DIFFERENT than the nonsense being spouting by Christian fundamentalists. They have very little in common with our Founding Fathers. If they continue to spin historical fantasies in hopes of forming a "Christian" nation, they will only insure the "systemic elimination" of their chosen creation myth. That is the natural defense of a population that wants to remain free.

Denise B's picture

That's funny because the

only attacking I've seen lately has come from those that wish to silence Christianity and deny the truth that we were founded as a Christian nation. The evidence is overwhelming and if you really want to go there, I can provide hundreds and hundreds of quotes and documents from many of the founders that support that assertion (have you read many of the state Constitutions lately?) - in fact I will create a separate post with them if you're interested in seeing them. Christianity is the only religion I see being attacked at every level and on all fronts, especially by those that love to preach the need for "tolerance", when the truth is, they wouldn't know what tolerance was if it hit them on the side of the head. What they realy mean is tolerance for only the things that they believe in and censorship for everything else (quite simply it's a case of the pot calling the kettle black).

And where are all these "evolved" individuals you are talking about that maintain moralistic behavior without guidance from God? Who's morals? They certaintly aren't anywhere to be found in any position of authority in this country right now. And exactly which of the following precepts from God's law do you consider nonsense?:
Do not kill
Do not steal
Do not commit adultery
Do not bear false witness against your neighbor
Do not covet your neighbors wife or goods
Love your neighor as yourself
Do unto others as you would have done unto you

Oh I know, it's the "You shall have no other God before me" and "Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and might".

The bible tells us that we are all born enemies of God who love our sin and rebel against Him. You apparently, are still in your rebeling stage. I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers.

I'm sorry Denise, you are wrong.

The Founding Fathers were educated, wise, spiritual men. They knew better than to label us a "Christian" nation. They witnessed the madness of Christian fanatics in their time and were very familiar with history. An individual that NEEDS their country to be labeled with their creation myth is having a crisis of faith. We live in a diverse world and this diversity helps generate new ideas. This can be chaotic at times. Forcing a specific creation myth on a diverse environment is unnatural and has led to the destruction of many societies and to the murder of millions. Fundamentalism is a mental/spiritual disorder. The individual needs to re-gain their faith before they project their fear on the external world and destroy it.