17 votes

Real-talk DP - let's make a pact

There are some things that need to be said. I politely ask that you read through all of this before you comment.

I'm an intelligent engineer who has spent the last four years of my life drowning my self in Rothbard, von Mises, and Dr. Paul (among others) and their works. This has lead me to study history intensely, and I'm constantly reading books on terrorism and its history (Dying To Win is excellent by the way!).

But every time I tell someone on this website that I don't believe 9/11 was an inside job--on the basis that our government actually planned (rather than let happen or created the conditions of) the attack--or that the Bilderbergers aren't part of an illuminati scheme to pull the strings of the world, or that Alex Jones appeals to emotion and is wrong sometimes, I get called things like a neo-con, RINO, or troll.

My positions are well though out, and I have given much time to researching any theories to the contrary as open-minded as possible. I, for one, distrust our government and its officials to the fullest; however, I don't buy in to many of the theories some actively push here. This is a personal decision of mine.

I will go as far to say as the government might even have liked the fact that 9/11 happened and even knew an attack of the sort may have been coming. I think good old' fashioned incompetence, bad theory of economics and foreign policy, and a lust for power-grabbing in the case of "national emergency" scenarios has cause our country to decline so much.

But I want to beg the DP community, who stand at the forefront of the liberty movement, to at the very least be courteous and respectful of people whose opinions do not fall in line with yours entirely on matters such as this. We are all on the same team here, and we are better than those who call names and say "well you just don't know the truth yet" or something of the sort. Use evidence and explanation if you truly want to convert someone here, not ad-hominem attacks.

In the end, we have the same basic goals.

Peace and Liberty,
Nick O'Donnell

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the rabbitt hole is vastly

larger and deeper than most care to admit. ones cognitive skills must be tuned in to the Trust Nothing channel. avg. joebobs, one of which you are not, neither have the time nor inclination for exerting the efforts in order to full well grip the slippery realities presented.
my being fully persuaded compared to your being fully persuaded in no way represents fault in stated truths but faults in levels of each souls ability to comprehend mans inhumanity against man. the level of saturation has more and more a heavy desensitizing effect due to mans inherent nature of self preservation wherein the compartmentalization of inhuman/savage/immoral occurrences are subconsciously dismissed for thoughtful processing later, for many that time never comes. I as well
suffer from the buffeting as I'm sure most DPers can attest as well.
wrapping ones mind around events these days is fraught with self prejudice and morays. when evil is good and up is down a mans own equilibrium is steady shakin by the continued onslaught of data, both bogus and true. remember a little error with a lot of truth still is called a LIE!

LOve the R3volution
hang tough sport ,say whats on your heart, comments are a dime a dozen, some will, some want, so what?

Seeing The Forest For The Tree

Yes, 'The Tree' with root firmly planted in ground zero of all evil.

Don't mind the details of the answers, the crux is in the questioning. Be skeptical.


[BTW, Thank you for this excellent thread ... and to you, the participants. This is what I love about Daily Paul, gardening among the grass roots at ground zero of all good, free inquiry.]

Anything is possible...

But I agree that because of our foreign policy, we get attacked, it's cause and effect, or blowback like Dr.Paul put it. As for Bilderberg I really do believe bankers like the Rothschild control it, they have the power, infinite money, and capacity and ambition to carry it out. They have gambled wars and economies since Napoleon's time.

Pretty much...

I am in the same shoes as you. with just about everything you said in the OP, the bad foreign policy was the reason why 9/11 happened, and that's why the by far majority of the suicide terrorists are saudis

"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul

Educate the masses, and win in the end.


I'm almost in the exact same position as the OP on those stated events. And many, many others are as well. We are all on the same team and need to stop nit-picking at the details of within. We need to stand as 1 against the MIC and the massive corrupt government standing before us.

Secret Societies Influencing or Controlling Humanity

About your comment on the Bilderbergers, whether they are or aren't the rulers of the world, keep in focus the obvious: Secret societies in charge of how the people live.

A secret group's name is secondary to its fuction if it influences or controls humanity. Additionally, there might be more such societies than the ones you mentioned. So, it's a good idea to keep in sight the obvious: secret societies and that if they are in charge of the mechanics of life, that's bad.

School's fine. Just don't let it get in the way of thinking. -Me

Study nature, not books. -Walton Forest Dutton, MD, in his 1916 book whose subject is origin (therefore what all healing methods involve and count on), simple and powerful.

To carry out a conspiracy,

only a few key people need to be "in the loop".
Do I believe that the US government was responsible for 9/11? No.
Do I believe that there were certain people within the US government who were responsible for 9/11? Too right.
Maybe research Dick Cheney's role in the arranging of war games, his role in changing the NORAD rules, his take over of the chain of command on that day, his lying about when he was, and wasn't in the bunker. It is all far too much of a coincidence, and beyond belief that he didn't have an inkling of what was going to happen.
If there was no inside involvement, it only proves that the billions of dollars spent on defense are wasted, and that the head of every department involved was totally incompetent...although no-one was fired or held accountable for all those deaths.

Okay, I'll play nice but....

If we're both going to be open and courteous please let me know what objections you have with this content regarding 9/11 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lw-jzCfa4eQ

When your intelligent engineering mind is ready to come back for healthy debate, please let me know.



Watch this dry yet astonishing Dr. Robert Beck cancer treatment lecture on Google Video - search "Suppressed Medical Discovery" - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkiX0jJJozk

Thank you very much

I will watch the video tomorrow (I'm off work then, but am very tired right now since it's 11:30 here) and go through each piece of evidence it cites. I will try my best to post either a reasonable counter-argument for it or will agree if my mind is changed.

You've got the right attitude

You've got the right attitude and perspective in debate, Nick. Those things are right. Keep up your rightness.

School's fine. Just don't let it get in the way of thinking. -Me

Study nature, not books. -Walton Forest Dutton, MD, in his 1916 book whose subject is origin (therefore what all healing methods involve and count on), simple and powerful.

Alright, watched it all... twice.

I went through the video, and didn't realize how much research I'd have to do for all the claims made in the video. I had personally "debunked" many of them (most of the B7 structural stuff, anyway) myself before I found this website in my research: http://www.debunking911.com/ They've got some good stuff and some bad stuff, but it takes care of a lot of the most common claims. Because I would literally have to start a website or write a paper myself to show everyone what I found, I'll just list that website as the best source/starting point.

There's a Time, and a Place

...for Everything.

Some will post articles here relating to incredibly weird stuff.
That doesn't portray us as credible....we need credibility.

If that's your point?...Agreed.

I was at ground zero digging out.
But I won't be influencing you via bullhorn.
GOAL: Ron Paul POTUS 2012/Take back our country.

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

common courtesy goes a long way

but, welcome to the internet. people hide behind their keyboards and say rude things.

because you study austrian economics i think you will appreciate this analogy:

bulletin boards like this one are actually a moral hazard. people are generally protected from being identified and therefore behave differently then how they would normally. the only thing that could be damaged is their alias, which is a fictitious entity to begin with. and because people can join this bulletin board on a whim (fiat accounts), there is a tendency to inflate toxic posts. it's almost like a corporation. if the corporation fails, worst thing that happens is you quit the company. if your alias loses respect on a bulletin board, then just stop posting under your old alias and create a new troll. so many people here forget that aliases here are basically not people.

Fiat and Aliases

Fiat: a dictate; a directive or an order; something decreed, as in thou shalt do X or else be penalized.

Your so many people here forget aliases here are basically not people confuses me. You're saying something other than humans created DP accounts and are using the accounts? Again, I'm confused. Please explain what you meant if you want to.

School's fine. Just don't let it get in the way of thinking. -Me

Study nature, not books. -Walton Forest Dutton, MD, in his 1916 book whose subject is origin (therefore what all healing methods involve and count on), simple and powerful.

there is no human-standard

accounts here are fiat.

I disagree, these are people

The people behind these accounts are not nice either. In fact, maybe you are getting a more realistic view here of who they really are and not a facade that they might portray if they had to deal with you in person.

I'd rather hear what people really have to say and not some filtered politically correct nonsense.

Good point. Anonymity invites

Good point. Anonymity invites discourse and repels games (mostly). I think most people on the DP are nice, though. They might be rough and tumble at times, which I think are justifiable, but I bet off line they're courteous usually.

School's fine. Just don't let it get in the way of thinking. -Me

Study nature, not books. -Walton Forest Dutton, MD, in his 1916 book whose subject is origin (therefore what all healing methods involve and count on), simple and powerful.

Again, :-/ What?

All I can say is, please look up the word fiat in the dictionary. Are you after the word fake or different word?

School's fine. Just don't let it get in the way of thinking. -Me

Study nature, not books. -Walton Forest Dutton, MD, in his 1916 book whose subject is origin (therefore what all healing methods involve and count on), simple and powerful.


yeah, i can't help but to say that if you spend even the slightest time reviewing any first-hand account from people who were actually in the WTC buildings during 9/11, you would discover there were exlosives in the buildings. And that those exposives had to have been put there put there several days/weeks/months prior to the planes.

not worth discussing here but find any interview with firefighter bill schroader or any thing from groundskeeper, william rodriguez.

but i kind of understand you. like many of my friends and relativess, to accept something like that would shake your foundation and change your paradigm. it's too big.