-128 votes

5 reasons why Gold will unfortunately be worthless AFTER the collapse of the dollar.

I predict Gold and Silver will have no value after the dollar collapse for 5 main reasons probably nobody has ever heard of. Yes we all know precious metal prices will skyrocket from now until the dollar collapses but afterwards it will be as worthless as a paper weight. In history it used to be true that gold would regain itself as currency again after a paper currency collapsed but it wont work this time and I'll explain the reasons why.

(Reason 1)
With no currency, with what are you gonna sell your gold? The amount you paid for your gold before the collapse will by a long shot not equal the goods and services value, you'll have to trade it for after the collapse and no one will want it because it wont really serve any purpose during this time. Meaning for example most people will be forced to trade $1000 worth of gold for $5 worth of food. Well people might argue "You can use gold for electronics and other things." I say who's gonna work at the electrical plants without a paycheck? The only electricity being made are survivalists who own windmills in their back yard and seriously how many of you have those?

(Reason 2)
People will argue, gold will have to return to currency. I argue, who's gonna mint all those gold pieces for free? Remember when the currency collapses nobody is getting paid anymore so why would US mint workers waste their time working for free? Everybody is gonna be busy guarding their food supply. Food will be the new currency. People who are not self sufficent will end up having to help people who are in order to survive.

(Reason 3)
The government wont create a new currency. Everybody thinks the Illuminati will introduce the "Amero" at this time. Those people who are the Illuminati network won't do anything without getting paid. They are going to be hiding in their Apocolyspe bunkers that they paid billions of dollars to reserve a room in the mountains. Once the dollar collapses everything and I mean everything will shut down. The gasoline will dry up in 2-3 days, food will dry up quick, nobody will work a job including the goverment workers. In these conditions the last thing on people's minds will be fancy jewelry or precious metals. The first thing will be how can they eat another meal and live another day. Everyday, people will get shot/killed for stealing food. You can't eat gold you know.

(Reason 4)
The dollar is currently the worlds reserve currency. The reason in history for thousands of years that gold always returned it's value after a paper money collapse is because it happened in a time when world reserve currencys didn't exist. What this means is formerly when one country's currency died, another would just take over. However in this case, the currency currently dieing is the currency that all other countrys currencys are backed upon. Meaning if the dollar dies here, it takes down every countries currency that based their own currency's buying power or value upon the dollar.

(Reason 5)
Manufacturing and mass production stops. With nobody working because their paycheck is now just worthless paper, gold will cease to have a material or useful purpose. I mean seriously, what are we gonna use it for?

I would suggest this. Buy gold for now and hang onto it for about 6 months. Then immediatley sell it just before the dollar completely crashes when you notice inflation going through the roof and buy as much seeds and non parishable foods items as you can and bury it in containers in the ground to hide it. Remember people will be getting killed over food so you'll be able to get anyone to work for you in payment for food. Nobody will have any reason to want gold after the collapse. I predict when it happens this may very well be the end of money all together and the beginning of what Gene Roddenbury tried to portray when the character Captain Picard said "There was a time in history when the world gave up on money and decided to all work together for the common good." Those who survive who be forced to live by this method. Meaning we will all become farmers and fisherman to feed our communities.

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Martial Law... Military

Martial Law... Military Reserves... Do you really think the nuclear plants, wind farms, coal plants, and solar will just stop in a few days? Plans are in place to protect needed assets and keep the systems they need in place. (I stress they need) In fact Obama just signed executive orders to seize everything and we can be forced into labor (if I understand it correctly). I would think the UN would set up bases at key locations such as these power plants.

Question is will this be seized for our good or to keep the power structure in power. My bet is on the power structure. The way I understand the NWO see's a need for the world population to drastically drop. This works well for such an agenda. These seized assets will not be for the average person. Americans in general don't fit the mold for the NWO citizen we are to stuck on individual freedoms and such. A few key epidemics in large cities with little to no medical utilizing the FEMA coffins diminishes the need for such a large supply chain.

Bill Gates: He basically owns Monsanto. Without him the world has no seed. The hybrid and GMO seed can't be saved year to year do you realize the power in that? That seed is worth more than all the gold.

Many preppers seem to think it is going to be like little house on the prairie. It's not. It's not going to be like mad max. (it may be lawless for a time in fact part of the plan appears it will need to be lawless for a time so the people left accept what comes next). It's going to be much more like Nazi Germany. All one has to do is watch the White House to get a good sense of what is going on. Look into continuity of government.

The end game is a utopia with a handful on top and just enough surfs to serve them and not use up all the worlds resources. As it is many of these elite are more or less in prison. Constantly having to watch their back. Surfs protesting and such. Most of us are just a bunch of useless eaters using up the worlds resources causing them a nuisance.

Republicae's picture

Yes, yes…I’ve read all the

Yes, yes…I’ve read all the commonly promoted conspiracy theories that you have, but you still seem to be locked up in that narrow view without grasping the scope of what I am speaking about when explaining just what would happen during a systemic, not a localized collapse, but a systemic collapse of the economic and global supply chain.

Actually, the power plants, nuclear plants, wind generators, etc.; will stop within a few days of a systemic collapse of the supply chain. Think about it, what happens when fuel completely runs out due to a breakdown of the supply chain? Well, there is no fuel, no coal being mined or delivered, no water flowing into the nuclear power plant cooling tanks around those fuel rods, not electricity to run those plants, no computer functions. The systemic collapse of the supply chain will make martial law meaningless when the military is unable to function, unable to travel.

You think that this government, which could not even manage keeping itself running during the latest storms in the North East could actually manage and enforce a term of military law during such a period of systemic failure, please do some more research into the matter. Yes, plans are in place to protected needed assets, but those plans, if you actually read them, are based on rather minor disruptions, not a full-scale shut-down of the global supply chain. Just read those plans for government continuity, they are based on the assumption that the supply chain will remain relatively operational. Again, you are looking at a particular picture without either understanding or fully grasping what it would mean to have a systemic failure of the supply chain on a global scale. You are stuck in a little 6x6 frame of comprehension based, it appears, largely upon a narrative that you have gotten from some popular websites.

Obama’s EO will be meaningless if there is a systemic collapse of the global supply chain operations, in fact, it would be relatively meaningless even if there will a collapse of the dollar. While I am sure this illegitimate government would make several attempts at pressing such orders, the fact that within a few weeks of a systemic supply chain collapse everything, including military operations would essentially cease and there would be absolutely nothing they could do to prevent it. Even with fuel and food reserves, the military, without a supply chain operational, would deplete those reserves within a matter of days or weeks at most. That would hardly allow the imposition of martial law across the country would it?

Again, you seem to be basing your understanding on what might be considered an economic dislocation, not a systemic global collapse of economic system corollary with a systemic global collapse of the supply chain. What I am speaking of is completely different than you appear to be able to grasp otherwise you would not be bringing up such froth as you are doing. It wouldn’t matter if the UN were stationed at every single power plant in this country, if there is an economic break-down leading to the collapse of the global supply chain then they would be at those power plants from now to kingdom come and it wouldn’t make a bit of difference because there would be absolutely no way for them to keep such plants in operations within vital supplies which, they would be completely unable to procure by any means after a systemic collapse of the supply chain.

Again, based on what you are writing you simply don’t get it do you? You seem to think that everything will just keep going as before, that a complete collapse of the economic and supply chain will not prevent the elite from pressing their power, but you are still thinking on a scale of understanding that is based purely on some fictional account popularized by some writer on the NWO and elite. What I am saying far exceeds those things. We are not speaking about some economic depression here, something that could definitely be used by the elite as a method of controlled chaos to gain more control and power, what we are speaking about will completely change the dynamics of globalization and change those dynamics into extreme localization, such localization as this world has not seen in at least 200 years.

Localization is not what the elite have planned, it ruins their plans completely and with a systemic collapse that is exactly what will happen, there will be an almost instantaneous localization on a global scale from such a collapse. All their power will be removed within a matter of weeks from such a collapse. Again, you seem to only understand the effects of what might be considered a controlled collapse and the benefits of such a collapse to those in power, but that is not, not at all what I am talking about here…try to get it this time please.

Reading your comments presents a certain type of mental density that is definitely difficult to overcome I see, but once again I will try to impress upon you just what it would mean if there was a global systemic collapse of the supply chain. Those so-called FEMA coffins would rot where they lay if such a systemic collapse occurs, the reason is that there would be no one to utilize them under such conditions as I speak, no way to transport them, no way to bury them once filled with bodies. Remember, once the global supply chain is broken and collapses the ability to transport anything will diminish to zero after only a few days, even with the Strategic Oil Reserves, the ability to maintain any functional operations would be limited to a matter of days. Have you ever read the statistics of fuel consumption by the military in this country alone? Obviously not, for it you had then you might begin to grasp what is being said here concerning a systemic collapse.

Again, you are diverting the conversation away from the subject. It doesn’t matter what Bill Gates owns, it is meaningless under the conditions I am speaking about, his proxy-wealth disappears under such conditions and with the disappearance of his proxy-wealth so does any power he may have.

I have lived during the Administrations of 12 Presidents in this country, I am fully aware of hybrid seed that’s why I have stored heirloom seed for the last 20 years or so. Now, apparently, judging again from your comments, you are still talking about something that does not involve an actual systemic collapse, but it appears that you still have a view of a non-systemic collapse. We are not talking about the same thing here, you are stuck on a narrow view of a non-systemic collapse and think they are the same, but they are not. You seem to think that there will be some sort of operational government ready to impose martial law during a period that it will be impossible for them to enforce such measures. I am not talking about a non-systemic collapse here as you are, I am talking about what happens during the systemic collapse of the economic system and how such interconnectivities will collapse the entire global supply chain operations within a matter of days and how that will totally change the nature of the narrative.

If there is a non-systemic collapse then yes, we would have martial law, we would have the UN at our door steps, but what I am talking about, once again, is nothing like a non-systemic collapse, but a total systemic failure of every correlating relationship within the economic supply chain operations, please try to think about it without injecting all those preconceived ideas into the conversation.

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

I think what you may be

I think what you may be missing in the big picture in assuming there will still be freedom. Why would anyone work when no money exists? Again forced labor to keep critical systems running. People will accept this after a period without. The FEMA camps would work well to maintain the work force needed.

When you think of the end game being depopulation with no freedoms and not to save every soul the logistics are not nearly as complex.

The elite have become masters at creating problems and then offering solutions to fulfill the agenda. No way would Americans ever except the NWO agenda with out the collapse. No standing army could accomplish what a collapse can.

Republicae's picture

The picture that is being

The picture that is being missed here is your ability to comprehend what is being said and the distinctions between what you are talking about which, is a non-systemic collapse verses what I am talking about which, is a systemic collapse. Please, try to grasp the differences between the two. Please, try to get past the layer of understanding that you seem to be stuck in and dig deeper than that layer of understanding your comments present.

Once again, I will stress a few of the differences so you might, just perhaps, be able to finally grasp the import of what I am saying and be able to finally make the distinction in your grey matter. It is so blaringly obvious that you still have not come to an understanding between the distinctions being made here, nor do you, based on your comments fully grasp just what it would mean to have such a systemic collapse occur. Again, you appear to be stuck on a MEME layer of understanding that is all too common among too many people here on the DP and the web.

How do you suppose that forced labor could keep critical systems running during and after a systemic collapse of the entire global supply chain? Explain just how such forced labor would work under the conditions that I am speaking of, not the ones that you are speaking of, they are two entirely different subjects, but you don't seem to understand that do you? It is again obvious that you are completely in the dark on the subject of the literally billions of relationships and interplays that must take place on a daily basis for the global supply chain to function. You also appear to completely ignore what actually would happen if there were a systemic collapse of such relationships on a global scale. You are unaware, given your comments, of just how the entire key-hub system within the global supply chain works, what it does and, in fact, just how vulnerable it is to shocks, particularly economic shocks.

I realize I am talking to a wall here, but please try to grasp the differences of which we are speaking, you continue to speak about what could be considered a non-systemic collapse where the NWO elite take control, what I am talking about would make it not only impossible for them to take control, but would completely put an end to their powers on a global scale.

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

For example. Camps housing

For example. Camps housing all shifts of nuclear, coal, wind, whatever power plants could be set up within or near the power plant (as well as other key industry). (The nuclear plants are located on water supplies so they would have no problem pumping water). Supply power to the coal mines, oil fields, and other key industry. The military logistics couldn't get much simpler. They could utilize the delivery infrastructure that exists today (no need to carve out roads, airports, ports, and rails. Once you have a supply of oil the rest is gravy (drill baby drill). If you have slave labor all you need is energy and all else can be accomplished.

Keep in mind we are not talking about lighting up the whole US grid.. Just what is needed to keep a grip. Us surfs can do without in fact that would fulfill a huge part of the agenda. This can be accomplished country by country.

Again you see the collapse taking us to the dark ages... I see more of a Nazi Germany. A bunch of us will die off... a bunch will serve the elite...

Republicae's picture

AMAZING DENSITY! Okay, again

AMAZING DENSITY!

Okay, again it appears that you are simply clueless about what actually takes place if there is a systemic collapse of the entire global supply chain. First, how will anyone get to those camps, how will they be set up, what materials will be used, how will the materials be transported when there is absolutely no fuel supply, no materials or parts supply, no food or water, no air traffic, no rail or ship traffic, no automobile traffic due to the collapse of the entire supply chain? How will the elite forces operate without any resources, no fuel, no vehicles, no water, no power, no communications, no anything because there no longer remains a viable supply chain that would be remotely operational.

Again, you fail, completely and absolutely to understand the portent of such an event on global society, it would be a civilizational shift from what we now call our world into a world that you obviously can’t imagine. You actually think that military logistics under such conditions would be possible, where on earth would the military get their supplies if there was no global and domestic supply chain in operation? Where do you think they would get fuel, get food, water, parts, the most generalized and simple supplies after such an event…do you think that they will simply appear out of thin air because thus far your answers seem to assume such a miracle of providence.

Where would you get a supply of oil if there is no supply chain in operation? No ships, no rails, no trucks, no camel caravans…

Do you think that nuclear power plants would have the capacity to actually function without all the ancillary support systems involved with such operations if the global supply chain collapsed, if you really think about what is involved then your answers begin to border on the absurd don’t they?

How would they utilize the infrastructure that exist today when the entire infrastructure is dependent upon a global supply chain of operations to supply all the necessities of that infrastructure, including all fuel sources for all transportation, all fuel for power plants, including nuclear plants. Where would refineries get crude oil, you say drill baby drill, but how, where would you get the parts for the oil rigs, how could it be transported to the refineries, how could it be refined when there would be no supply of the necessary chemicals, no supply of manpower, no transportation of any kind.

Besides, who is going to work those power plants, do you think that suddenly workers will simply work for nothing…oh, that’s right you believe that the elite will force them to work for nothing, but how? First of all how will the elite command anything when the entire command structure of the government, the military, the civilian authorities and yes, even FEMA are rendered completely non-functional because they have absolutely no mobility due to the collapse of the supply chain. Untold billions of relationships within the supply chain failing within days would completely crush what we call civilization today.

Thus far you have yet to provide an adequate rebuttal to the subject I present, you keep falling back on your argument that, quite frankly, doesn’t even approach the subject I am discussing. Again, if there is a non-systemic collapse then yes, I can see a type of scenario that could relate to what you are saying, but you have failed to address what would take place under a systemic collapse which, I have tried to address but you have simply not grasped as yet.

You obviously don’t understand what a systemic collapse would mean, the billions of interconnections within not only the financial systems, but every system around the world in the global supply chain. You don’t realize just how dependent every single daily function of not only government, but the military, every industry, and every person is on the global supply chain, once it collapses all that dependence is instantly voided, but there are few, precious few fall-backs in place that would rapidly reverse such a collapse. There are no real redundancies in place to restore operational society once the global supply chain collapses, if you can actually show me such redundancies instead of providing fictional narratives about what you believe then by all means do so, but give me facts about it, don’t just provide feeble assumptions based upon a particular view.

The facts about the global supply chain are absolutely astounding, particularly in the face of a possible systemic collapse of that system, along with every other system related to it.

Oh, and if you don't mind, please stop using a word (surf) that refers to waves and start using the proper term which is "serf" referring to slaves, essentially. It is always good to know a definition of a word that you are using in order to properly convey the subject you are speaking about in such discussions. Of course, it doesn't surprise me that you would use surf to mean serf based on your commentary.

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

Republicae's picture

It is again, doubtful that

It is again, doubtful that you will even come close to understanding what I am about to write, but I’ll give it yet another shot. The elite powers have created a system, their own system that they most definitely depend upon for all their power and wealth. It has been in actual operation for a few generations now and has performed to their expectations, but along with it have come some very interesting contradictions for within their artificial economic system there is virtually no general systematic diversity, no real redundancies that can function properly if there is a collapse within the system itself. They have created a platform for a global economic system, all the countries of the world share that very same platform and the entire system is totally dependent upon the dynamics of credit and leverage to remain functional, but that itself is the systems Achilles Heel.

As such, these credit/leverage dynamics being so interwoven within the global economic system also allow for entrenchments of growing imbalances to mount up throughout the system as ever-increasing credit flows are absorbed. As such, the entire system is laden with debt which, is not just a matter concerning banks or individual countries, but the entire globalized economy. In other words, the entire system is bending from the burden that it created, that the elite depend upon for their power and wealth and it has now reached what could be considered critical mass. The entire banking system has become stagnant, it has increasingly lost all its diversity and activities have been concentrated within a top layer of operations around the world, the mega-banks, the too-large-to-fail banks.

If you look at the actual interconnectivity between all the major banking houses it would, or should, amaze you. All the major banking power-houses around the world are so interconnected that complete disruption within one sector of banking could easily spread to other banking sectors and throughout the global economic system. That is not the best positions to be in if you are one of the elite depending on such a system for your power and wealth. They have inadvertently removed their safety buffers from the system by expanding the connectivity between the banking houses. Additionally, if we dig deeper and consider the shadow banking system, it is even more susceptible to shock waves that could easily create a collapse of the entire system. Thus, such a systemic collapse of the supply chain, due to any disruption or dislocation in the monetary or economic sector would create a societal collapse, not merely an economic collapse as we commonly think of when we discuss such subjects.

Now, why do you think that there has been a huge push to bail-out these banks by governments, it was the only way to actually relieve the stress within the system itself before it collapsed completely. Thus, the elite, again using governments to prop up their power machine, diverted their commercial banking stress onto sovereign countries in hopes to save their precious banking systems and their power. There is however, a major problem with the whole scenario, it is not working and they honestly have no solutions that can adequately keep the entire system solvent. I’m not talking just about monetary solvency but power solvency as well. If you read research papers published by the elite think-tanks around the world as I do, you would begin to see a pattern that is unmistakable and that pattern is one of abject panic among the elite. Panic about a system that they have worked generations to prepare and implement falling apart before their collective criminal eyes.

They have essentially now coupled sovereign financing with the banking system in a way that has completely removed all safety nets for their system itself, there would be no possible way for them to prevent the spread of an economic contagion once it began in earnest. That is why they are desperately trying to save the EU, but are failing at it completely. The EU was their brain-child, their grand experiment of the globalized community, it was their vision for the rest of the world, a system of global governance that superceded all nationalized boundaries and national law, replacing it all with a globalized legal and economic system, but it has failed and failed relatively quickly in economic and monetary terms.

There is a growing unease within the halls of the elite power that their reign is rapidly coming to an end, all one need do is read what they are saying to see that it is not only true, but that it is the most pressing topic of concern among their think-tanks. The elite think-tanks expose a great deal about the inner-workings of the NWO, but apparently few people take the time to actually read what they are discussing and the tone of such discussions. If you did then you would quickly see that there is a growing sense of panic among those who we call the elite for they are realizing that there is an ever-increasing inability of their interacting systems to absorb and then displace the real risk within their system.

The financial system they created is the heart and lungs of their beast, and judging from what they are writing, what they are discussing the beast is having some major difficulties pumping blood and oxygen to the lungs of this criminal beastly monstrosity. So much so, that there is a generalized fear breaching the ranks of the elite that their precious system will indeed collapse under it’s own unwieldy weight.

They have even considered a subject that would once be considered Anathema to the elite and that is gold, but judging from their writings that is the very last thing that they would reinstitute and they readily express their contempt over the monetary commodity in their writings. In reading their papers, the internationalists, the global elite are now trying to think of ways to incorporate gold back into the picture, but because gold as a monetary regime would completely hinder their overall goals they cannot allow it to actually operate as money in any competitive way with fiat currency. They see gold as a hindrance to the system’s performance by creating what they view as unacceptable constraints on economic policy and politics.

They fully realize that gold would demand a type of discipline that would limit the role of banking within the economy, that it would handicap what they view as the flexibility of the modern economic system, as well as their ability to maintain the political status quo around the world. They do not see gold playing a role as a policy indicator or having a major role in the daily functions of economics. They consider gold only to be a hedge against the declining values of the world’s major fiat currency regimes and the reason for that is because gold generates no yield like government bonds do, in other words it is not encumbered with a debt obligation therefore it is not suited to function as money or even a reserve asset when depended upon solely as a monetary unit. They hate gold in economic terms and the whole idea of gold money, that will be their undoing.

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

This elite created system you

This elite created system you speak of is not the end game for them. It is a stepping stone. They are not happy to simply control the money. It appears they need to dominate every inch of the globe.

I see the big difference in our thinking... You feel this collapse is an accident and I see it designed. "Why do I think government bailed out these banks?" To bankrupt we the people as designed. Do you really see it an accident that lest than 600 people of our government couldn't come together and do what was right for our country? They just couldn't get along so we end up here at a total collapse? Come on this is by design and brilliant design to keep millions sleeping while it was done.

You see the EU as the elites failure... I see it as a plan working nearly perfect. The people of the EU are being told to align constitutions, everything being taken away from the surfs and handed to the elite. It is a huge consolidation of wealth. The surfs won't be able to feed themselves leave alone fight off tyranny.

Republicae's picture

Oh, I had no doubt about the

Oh, I had no doubt about the difference in our thinking from the moment I read your first posting, it was quite obvious and also appears to be quite common, but it is build upon something that takes a great deal of faith to believe when compared to the evidence that is overwhelmingly present in today’s society and economic world. Now, how do you know that what is happening is simply a stepping stone, what evidence do you have to support your beliefs? Surely you must base those beliefs on hard evidence rather than pure conjecture, so provide me with actual evidence as to the steps that have been taken by the elite to gain control of the entire globe? Surely, you must know what you are talking about because you certainly put forth your thoughts as though you are standing on solid ground, so defend your stance if you can, but do so with actual information not merely assertions which, are meaningless.

You are still unable to make your argument with anything remotely approaching a convincible stance, in other words you are far from making your case, you have provided no ample evidence to support your assertions, no rebuttals that are meaningful and on subject.

The bailouts of the banks and industry had little to do with bankrupting the people or this country because this country has essentially been bankrupt since the 70s and has defaulted on its entire debt at least three times during the last century, so that argument doesn’t quite hold water does it? Do you know what happened in 1971 when Nixon closed the gold window? He reneged on all debts owed by this government and instead paid those governments with what amounts to a worthless paper money substitute.

As far as the EU is concerned, what do you actually know about what it happening there in economic terms? Can you explain what is happening or are you once again simply stating something because you happen to hold a certain belief pattern, one that is common I assure you. How do you explain, for instance, what is and has been happening in Brussels concerning the EURO and the sovereign debt crisis as it is playing out currently, what is taking place that makes you think that it is all by design, surely you must have a very detailed answer to support your beliefs otherwise your beliefs are baseless, are they not?

Also, your beliefs simply don’t stack up when judged against the facts of economic laws and monetary mechanics. You seem to believe that the economy is simply something that can easily be managed and manipulated without consequences, that is not the case. In fact, if you look the economic decisions of the billions of people on the planet, then you would quickly realize that it is absolutely impossible for any force, whether it be governments, central banks or the elite to actually manage it. There are so many permutations involved that it is beyond the scope of our human minds to even conceive how to manage, much less control economic factors within the world on a global scale. They have not been able to do it even in this country, much less the world. Tell me how you think they can gain control, certainly not by any method you have stated thus far. You have not given any mechanism that would override even the most basic laws, not only of human nature, but also of economics.

Until you can do that adequately then all you are doing is simply repeating the same MEME that you and others proclaim without ever actually providing any substantial foundation for what you say your believe.

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

What happened in the 70's is

What happened in the 70's is Kissinger made a deal with the Arabs to only accept us dollars for oil..... In a sense our currency stopped being backed by gold and was the only way to purchase oil... Just one example of how the elite play....

No need to argue or prove anything to one another because in a short amount of time we will all see. Ron has mentioned the collapse is less than 10 years off. Your view has us in the dark ages on horses. Mine has us living in tyranny.

Obama just signed an executive order allowing the government to seize just about anything and everything in the name of national interest. It also allows for forced work crews. How do they force it? I guess with they 450 million bullets homeland security just purchased? Maybe for a can of food? These orders and laws are being passed everyday while the country sleeps.

You seem to think that everything will just disappear the same day the dollar dies... I say the government will seize the resources and use them to continue to generate more with forced labor as well as military. Just as Obama's executive order spells out. So yes the resources will disappear quickly for the surfs but, the power structure will still be in place and more powerful than ever.

It is hard for you to wrap around the thought that they are smart enough to use the last of the available resources to acquire more resources? They didn't become the elite from not planing ahead. What do you think these think tanks do? Play checkers? More like chess with the world and we are about to be checkmated.

Republicae's picture

Yes, I have read the Century

Yes, I have read the Century of War and understand the dealings of that treasonous bastard Kissinger however, that agreement was in 1974, the gold window was closed in 1971 for the purpose of defaulting on the debt of this government once again. The fact is that the purpose of closing the gold window was two fold, one was because the debt was accumulating rapidly and the other was purely ideological Keynesianism.

Now, I have never said that there would not be a period when the government assumes an authoritarian domestic policy, that is something I have never said or even inferred, what I was speaking about is not, as I said, a non-systemic collapse like the one you are speaking about, but a systemic collapse caused by a combination of forces that are far beyond the ability to either control or manage once the global supply chain has collapsed. You still don’t seem to understand the difference and that is obvious by your comments. I definitely believe that there will be a period of authoritarianism in this country, we have been heading that direction for decades, particularly if there is a non-systemic collapse. This government lost its legitimacy long ago, voiding the compact of agreement between the States that created it and has usurped the authority delegated to it by that compact.

My contention is that if there is a systemic collapse then there is simply no way for this government, the elite or anyone else to gain control over this country, regions of this country and in particular, not the whole planet. Besides, have you ever noticed the record of war since WWII, they can't win wars, they can't even wage wars with a degree of effectiveness to even claim minor victories. These governments and the elite behind them can't even control cities, much less countries although they most definitely will try. They have a pitiful record of the application of authoritarianism, not only that, but because of the nature of authoritarianism, it is relatively easy to gum up the works once it is in place.

What you fail to understand is the distinction between the two types of collapses, one being non-systemic, in other words a collapse of the nominal systems that function within this and other economies, the other being a complete systemic collapse where all the vital systems collapse rapidly due to both an economic collapse and a conjoining systemic collapse of the global supply chain. You would think that you would get it by now!

Again, you simply seem to not understand the differences between the two types of collapses. In a systemic collapse they will have no means to seize anything in the name of national security or interest. They will have no ability to distribute those 450 million rounds of 40 Cal ammo or any means to transport troops anywhere in the country. Their complete power structure would be demolished under a systemic collapse of the entire global supply chain, I dare say they would not even wait around long to see what happened next after such a collapse.

Again, you readily show that you have either not read or not comprehended what I have been saying. I have said absolutely nothing about the day the dollar dies…nothing at all. There are two different issues we are speaking about here and if you would simply try to grasp the differences then perhaps, just perhaps you would understand the consequences of each type of collapse. The dollar dying would cause a major disruption, but as monetary history shows clearly, other national fiat currencies would readily take its place in the global market place. There is therefore, a complete difference between such a nominal collapse as you are and have been speaking of and what I have attempted to present as something that is all-together different, that being a systemic collapse, not just the dollar but all fiat currencies, all banking, central banks, corporations and everything else due to a complete cascading collapse of the global supply chain mechanisms around the world.

Judging from the information I have garnered over the last 5 or 6 decades, it appears that the elite are actually not that smart, if they were they would not be placing themselves in such a dangerous position as they have done, particularly in the last few years.

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

It's funny you quote Captain

It's funny you quote Captain Picard, considering the mythos of Star Trek occurs after a nuclear holocaust where survival skills would be essential.

Your post is giving me headache

You need to read a little more.

So are you saying that after thousands and thousands of years gold is suddenly worthless with no dollar?

Why did I even comment on this post?

For Freedom!
The World is my country, all mankind is my brethren, to do good is my religion.

This poster

Needs to read a LOT more!

Give us clear vision, that we may know where to stand and what to stand for - because unless we stand for something, we shall fall for anything.
~ Peter Marshall, US Senate Chaplain 1947

If gold isn't real money

then why did we confiscate it in the 30s? Why is Iran demanding payment for their oil in it. Why did Gadaffi demand payment for his oil in gold Dinars? Why does Donald Trump accept rental payment in gold? Why are the prices so vigorously manipulated downward? Why are foreign countries scrambling for more? Why do we have a Fort Knox?

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign: that the dunces are all in confederacy against him. ~J. Swift

Fort Knox Maine & Fort Knox Kentucky. Why two?

... Fort Knox was named after Major General Henry Knox. He [commanded] in the American Revolution. He was the Secretary of War and Commander of Artillery. In July of 1844, building of Fort Knox [commenced] in Maine. There is also another Fort Knox in Kentucky.

Fort Knox [Maine] was built to avoid a British invasion that was expected during the mid-19th century. But this invasion never came. British naval forces controlled the lower stretch of the Penobscot River. Fierce and deadly conflicts arose between Castine and Bangor, Maine. The border between New Brunswick and Maine caused a heated dispute between the United States and Great Britain. The Penobscot River was unprotected, which would, in turn, make it easy for British ships to sail on this river. This river would take the British ships to Bengor. Bengor was the lumber capital that was wealthy and unprotected. Fort Knox was built in order to protect not only this attack, but also future attacks.

There were periods of military activity at Fort Knox. During the Civil War from 1863 to 1866, troops were stationed at Fort Knox. With the onset of the Spanish-American War, almost 500 Connecticut troops were stationed at Fort Knox...

Fort Knox, Kentucky, is the United States depository... The gold has a book value of $42.22 per ounce. In January of 1937, the first gold was moved to the depository. The last physical gold audit was during the Eisenhower administration.
http://www.essortment.com/history-fort-knox-21227.html

Annual gold audits are required by law & should be restarted immediately.

Disclaimer: Mark Twain (1835-1910-To be continued) is unlicensed. His river pilot's license went delinquent in 1862. Caution advised. Daily Paul

The Federal Reserve screwed us all!

They got us all thinking in dollar value, this is wrong headed. You have to start comparing one commodity to another to see the real picture. Nothing is really going up in price the dollar is losing its value. We will all see Gold and Silver following oil and other commodities. If it gets real bad whats to stop the Saudis to ask for Gold in return for oil. This could force our Government to start allowing gold and silver as legal tender as a last resort to save themselves.

If Gold is requested for oil the US Government will have no choice but to allow gold and silver as currency once again. Their will be no other way to pay for the oil.

I think your 100% wrong on your post.

Gold standard: because man can not be trusted to control his greed

You answered your own

You answered your own question. "What if the Saudis ask for gold for oil?" What happened to these other folks who tried to trade in gold? (dead ring a bell?) You are right it would force the government.. not to gold but, to attack Saudi Arabia... They would become part of the axis of evil on that very same day.

Saudis aren't stupid!

They look for the USA for protection of their ruthless regime, but they know the era is about to end. Why else have they and the Chinese built the World's largest refinery in Saudi Arabia. The Saudis know the USA is going to become a paper tiger, because of all the debt. I believe their alliance is about to change to China, because the Chinese will become the new super power of the world.

We all may see who is the real super power in the world over Iran. The Chinese have already vowed to protect Iran from a military attack from the USA. The USA being a real chicken hawk will back down when facing a real military army.

When this happens the middle east will tie their oil to gold, and start the real collapse of America. When this happens gold and silver will flourish.

Gold standard: because man can not be trusted to control his greed

True

But also true, is the fact that on the US would be broke with no way to pay for any sort of war.

The payslips of the US military would stop that very same day.

Republicae's picture

Reason 1. Gold and silver are

Reason 1. Gold and silver are currency and are not dependent upon the valuation of fiat paper money to be considered as a medium of exchange. While gold and silver are currently valuated in terms of fiat dollars that does not, in any possible rational way, devalue the monetary valuation of gold or silver in terms of monetary exchange. The point of owning both gold and silver, along with other hard assets, is to be able to use such assets during the time that the fiat monetary system collapses, particularly if that collapse is preceded by a hyperinflationary event, which is becoming more and more likely as time progresses.

At that time, it will be absolutely meaningless what the fiat money substitute valuation of gold and silver are, for the market will determine the appropriate price of goods and services in gold and silver. In other words, the “dollar price” will hold absolutely no meaning, nor will anyone care whether they paid $1000 or $10000 dollars for an ounce of gold at that stage of the collapse game. Again, the fiat price will be meaningless during such an economic dislocation. Thus your reasoning is completely and absolutely incorrect and is based on a linear understanding of money and pricing.

Reason 2. Again, you are making assumptions based on a particular understanding which, is based on your present understanding of the way things work when that might not be the case during a period of economic collapse. First, the market will, as it always has through thousands of years, provide for the services of minting coinage, but even at that there is no need for actual minting of coins since gold and silver are weighted values and thus the market will naturally determine an appropriate weight for a given product or service. Thus, your reasoning behind number 2 in your argument is also incorrect and flawed based upon your lack of market mechanics.

Reason 3. Is not even worth commenting upon, (but I will anyway) and is based upon something that simply cannot be successful under the circumstances of which we are speaking. Fiat currencies, in order to be introduced or maintained for any length of time, must ride “piggy-back” upon a know value otherwise there is not process of imparting value to the fiat currency regime. All fiat currencies that are introduced simply as a replacement for a failed fiat currency tend to fail extremely rapidly themselves because of the lack of confidence that already exists within society over the last failed fiat regime. Since such confidence is lacking there is no power to maintain the new introduced fiat currency within the society, thus if fails. Thus, your reasoning on number 3 does not take into account several things, one being the history of fiat monetary systems and the other being the mechanics of such systems as they relate to the political economy.

Reason 4. Well, that has nothing to do with how the market determines the monetary uses of gold or silver, particularly during a fiat monetary collapse. Additionally, since markets tend to become localized during such collapses they also tend to place valuation upon the given resources of that locale. Thus, your reasoning in number 4 ignores the market processes, which are not necessarily dependent upon a given currency and as such, the currency of a given locale will prevail during such a collapse. If there is no gold or silver, for instance, some other valued commodity will eventually arise as a form of currency.

Your final suggestion is based on a total ignorance of what actually happens during an economic collapse, how markets arise despite government attempts to squash them, how gold and silver or other commodities displace the official failed currency as a medium of exchange within the market. While I agree that it is important to stock up on food, non-hybrid seed, ammo, and useful trade goods, I also know that it is equally important to hold an amount of gold and silver for the period that will precede the collapse, for it is during that period when people will, in fact, not only recognize gold and silver as the only viable means of exchange but it will always be recognized as a value in exchange for goods and services even after a collapse. Thus gold and silver will play an important role in the survival of anyone interested in making it though what will be the most trying period in our country’s history. To ignore these facts is to ignore thousands of years of market economics and monetary mechanics.

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

With all due respect, this

With all due respect, this post is ridiculous. Please do yourself a favor and read up on gold, money and markets. Then ask yourself if an economic collapse equals armageddon. What you are talking about is the latter. Gold will serve us well in the former.

Uninformed post to say the least but we have history

The collapse of the Soviet Union, the Balkan wars, half of Eastern Europe serves us many examples of "what happens" when a state and it's currency fall apart.

Gold, silver and any other "stable" currency become very valuable indeed. However these are eventually superseded by guns and ammo and finally just food, water and ammo. Often by that time, enough people with guns have died that those left all have them. But no ammo.

No ammo=no mobility=no food or water.

A key factor for one author on the subject that simply preserving mobility and being ready to travel fast and light was a survival key in itself. Those who sought to preserve their land or property were often the fist to go, in roughly descending order of value of same.

And yes, gold is portable. Once you are a place where food can be bought, gold will buy it for you.

These are real world scenarios.

There is nothing strange about having a bar of soap in your right pocket, it's just what's happening.

okay then, say you have 10

okay then, say you have 10 $1000 dollar gold bars and you want to buy a $5 sandwich.

hypothetically, it would be wise to trade in the gold for a smaller convenient commodity like cans of soup. so you go to the grocer and trade your bar for 1,000 cans of soup. now you can individually trade these for anything you want, like 5 of them for a sandwich, and the person who traded the gold can purchase/trade something they want with another person, like a new refrigeration system.

...or use a hammer and chisel

and break off a chunk.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign: that the dunces are all in confederacy against him. ~J. Swift

Yes, things will be bad when the dollar collapses.

How bad though is anybody's guess. To make such blanket and absolute statements only serves to discredit you.

There are certain aspects to this current crises that make it unique, but I tend to doubt we will see any Thunderdomes being erected any time soon.

Wrong.

As long as the earth remains, there will be planting and harvest, cold and heat, summer and winter, day and night." Gen 8:22

As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.
Matt 24:37-39

They will say, "Where is this 'coming' he promised? Ever since our fathers died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation." 2 Peter 3:4

The United States will remain the dominant superpower until Jesus comes again. Yes, there will be difficult economic times, and society will seem to be tearing at the seams, but to a large extent, life will continue with enough normalcy that people will be able to ignore the signs of the 2nd Coming.

I'm not sure your timeline is accurate, but....

ultimately the patrick stewart quote WILL happen. We live in an age where we are capable of producing enough food/water/goods for every human. It is only a matter of time as to when people decide they really don't need 5 televisions 3 computers and 2 smart phones just to find out that there is nothing of value to be gained from them. People will eventually judge their worth by their contribution, not their possessions. Then it will truly be a golden age.

Interesting

I gave you an upvote because I think this is worth talking about.

History might prove you wrong, but we may find ourselves entering into a situation never before seen in history...a global, digital, currency. There has always been somewhere in the world where gold was redeemable for cash (or gold was cash). Even with a digital currency, gold will have a value of course. But, will it be easily redeemable, and will it have black market value....probably yes on the latter but I'd be interested in people's thoughts.

History proves this wrong

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"Take hold of the future or the future will take hold of you." -- Patrick Dixon