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July 4th 2013 Liberty Day Challenge

Two directions are possible from this moment on as proven by historical precedent. Either be subjected to suffering by Legalized Criminals and be forced to pay all debts collected in that evil enterprise or move in the direction of Liberty.

Make my day.

How about July 4th 2013?

If by that date the American people, as one, have invented, produced, and supplied a number of competitive legal monies, then those American people will take back their power to prosper, at will, for their own and for posterity.

Sign on in spirit or sign on in actual reality, either way the days will move in a direction and the Legal Criminals score their progress with or without your willful participation toward their goal of absolute despotism.

May God have mercy on our souls.

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History can (or may) instruct?

"I suppose if willl does not want to accept the validity of the words legal criminal or legal crime, but still wants to resist those who embody those words, well then, maybe that is still a Friend in Liberty; and maybe the light bulb will turn on."

"I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience. I know of no way of judging of the future but by the past"

Patrick Henry speaking against The British (NOT Patrick Henry speaking against the Con-Con).

http://www.history.org/almanack/life/politics/giveme.cfm

And...

Then there are the people who are exemplified by Will.

Bear,

If I can communicate to someone, you perhaps, I can say that there is a passage in the Bible warning of a wrong, or sin, whereby a person emulates or is jealous of, a solider who is good at killing.

I read something like that in your very welcome Proverbs Topic on this Forum (a Topic that is turning out to be a best seller).

War, as unfortunate as it is, is at least instructive.

Those who profit from war learn what war instructs.

Those who die merely die, and they are not alive to warn anyone - no more.

I thought about that and I do not think that I am jealous of John Boyd, or Werner Molders, Gabby Gabresky, or Robert Shaw. I do have a very high level of interest in Air Combat, so those people, so listed, are of a very high interest to me, and they offer some very important warnings.

Not the least warning is for those who may want to listen to this warning is for the listener to be more powerful, if at all possible, than those other people who WILL kill them for fun and profit.

Do not allow your life to be ending by other people if the only reason for your death is for other people to have fun at your expense. Please?

Who?

Who is going to have fun at your expense, as you die horribly?

You can't see Will, and people like him, or her, pushing children ahead of him, or her, in the line that goes to the meat grinder, as these types of people choose, by their power of will, to move less powerful people ahead of them in the same line?

That is what I see.

There are many other people on this planet.

There are many other people on this planet, look in the mirror, who refuse, absolutely refuse, to allow anyone else (with one exception) to pay the costs of their mistakes INVOLUNTARILY.

Does that make any sense?

Joe

Choices

"You can't see Will, and people like him, or her, pushing children ahead of him, or her, in the line that goes to the meat grinder, as these types of people choose, by their power of will, to move less powerful people ahead of them in the same line?"

Those words bring much for me to think about. You have introduced that concept before, but I had not kept it in my memory. It reminds me of http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007392
Martin Niemöller

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me."
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I will have to set that concept into my mind.
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"Do not allow your life to be ending by other people if the only reason for your death is for other people to have fun at your expense. Please?"

I should probably not publish these words, but I have already told Jeff I will make them shoot me. I am not going to live out a long torturous death. I will fight at the start. So I say, but then there are the children to consider. And I must also consider your very welcome words above about Still. I will reply to those later as I think them over. I have to run now to get my day started in high gear.
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One last thing, it is very hard for me to give up on people…willl for example. I have the gift of mercy, so I have replied one more time and that will be it. MaxK also had some stuff to say that I replied to as well on that post.
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And one more thing, I do not believe it is jealousy at all to admire our Friends in Liberty Fighter Pilots. There is a difference between those words and when one is able to determine which side of the line they are on, like you have reported, well then, all is good. And then sometimes, if we find ourselves on the wrong side of a line, well then, it is only a line that is meant to be stepped over to the side of righteousness.
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Joshua 24:15 KJV
And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve ; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell : but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.

Proverbs 16:25 KJV
There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
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Have a nice day, my friend. Thank you for your words on my behalf.

...

Serious accusations

Thanks for continuing this discussion, I think the topic subtitle is vital.

Man made laws, such as self-government, or government by the people, of the people, and for the people, or other arrangements of words on paper, cannot equal, ever, natural law, or the Word of God (and I combine the two to accommodate anyone other than willful criminals), because humans make mistakes.

Nature is not a word, God is not a word, nature is a power, God is a power, and power is not a word, POWER causes things to happen, things do happen, and if there is a natural mistake made, or a mistake made by God, then I think it is important to avoid confusing such a thing, if it can exist, with a mistake made by a person.

So, again, assuming that nature, or God, can't make a mistake, is an idea, an assumption, that helps in avoiding any confusion as to who makes a mistake, when a mistake is made, and why a mistake is made, by anyone, or any THING.

Nature is thing?

God is a thing?

Perhaps, but the idea here is to know better as to the responsibility that is accountable to specific human beings: along the lines of the differences between Man made Law and those Laws that are beyond the control (POWER) of Man, and therefore not responsible or accountable to a Man or a Woman directly.

Is Will the type that will decide to move other people ahead in line as the line moves toward the meat grinder?

I don't know, and I am making a mistake by claiming that he, or she, is the type, but this is a mistake along the lines of an accusation, based upon available evidence, and the Man Made Law employed by me, chosen by me, is to presume someone to be innocent, to trust someone, to give someone the benefit of doubt, until such a time as my judgement is such that there is no longer an reasonable doubt in this case.

Why does someone avoid further discussion, pleading the fifth, and how much of the concept of avoiding self incrimination is genuine and how much of that concept of avoiding self incrimination is counterfeit?

I don't know.

The instruction of War Veterans is such that they get to where the rubber meets the road and they will either move someone else in front of them on the line to the meat grinder or they will charge ahead along side other combatants, or they will charge ahead of other combatants, or they will learn the lessons already learned by surviving War Veterans, lessons such as Maneuver Warfare invented (or reinvented) by John Boyd.

It is foolish, dangerous, and weak to ignore the fact that our Country has been taken over by enemies both foreign and domestic, and ignoring these obviously, accurately, measurable facts does, in fact, place the ignoramus firmly on the side of our enemies, this is not subject to interpretation or argument, this is demonstrable fact.

What was a Tory Loyalist not many more than 200 years ago?

This is not news.

I cannot reasonably convict Will of the crime of treason, but my words suggest as much, and these are mere words, these are not inventions of products intending to deceive, these are inventions of products (words, sentences, mediums of exchange) intending to discover, as if I were a member of a jury, and I have a Tory Loyalist being charged with lending moral and material support to our enemies foreign and domestic.

Will says Law is not Crime.

He or she is then challenged, please elaborate, does that mean that you will provide the means by which we torture and mass murder because that same Man Made Law orders you to do so?

Is that reasonable?

Innocent victims are screaming as we speak, and the pile of murdered innocent will grow much larger before the sun sets.

What is the definition of the word reason according to this Man Made Law that Will is measurably lending moral support toward?

If it is crime then it is crime.

What is the definition of crime according to people who torture and mass murder the innocent?

Is this line of questioning, seeking to discover Tory Loyalists, reasonable?

Is it appropriate?

Is it soon to be absolutely necessary if it is left to the next generation, passed onto them to do, or not do, and suffer the consequence of willful ignorance concerning the growing number of victims screaming under torture and the growing pile of murdered innocent?

Time will tell?

Will won't tell in time?

Friend or Foe decisions can be made sooner or too late, and that is the type of lesson offered by War Veterans.

I am not saying, suggesting, or even serving me up as an example, citizen, people, moral people, must demand loyalty from each other, or else, since that is exactly wrong, that is the problem, not the solution. My suggestion is to know better sooner, and to triage, to balance the POWER God gave you to make the best of life while that is possible, and provide for all that aligns against you, if possible too.

Will, to me, can be dropped as soon as Will pleads the 5th, which may be the case, or he, or she, may be finding other things to do, who knows, he or she does not answer.

If we find ourselves in trenches, the enemy severing our heads from our bodies if we dare to raise our heads up to look, then we may find Will similarly inclined.

So...if in our mutually inclined position an enemy jumps in our trench and commands Will to shoot us, or die, what does Will do with the gun handed to him at that point?

The Law says, right here, on paper, with the official stamp, OBEY, and do so without question.

"So I say, but then there are the children to consider."

And they learn by the example you set, not that they will necessarily follow your lead, but there is little room for doubt that they are intimately aware of your leaderSHIP.

Which direction does that SHIP go?

I too have busy things to do, and thanks too, discussions are too rare, too many people pleading the 5th?

Joe

Quick Hello plus a question, of course

Hi Joe, Our house guest left this morning with 2 of my Ron Paul books that I had ordered...I figured I wouldn't get them read and he said he would. He is active in the tea party in Colorado, so I am hoping his eyes will be opened to true liberty. He was willing to talk and put up with my rapid fire approach, tho I do not think I have swayed him at all, but maybe just planted some new ideas. He seems to think that foreign policy is to do what ever is in the best intersts of the United States even if that includes "spreading democracy." Maybe he will be able to grasp free trade, friendship and the "golden rule" as well as carrying a big stick after reading Ron Paul. He says he is not a Neo-con. He also professes Christ, so I hope I will be able to work that angle as well.

I am working on my reply to this as well as the other string. I plan on replying to both on the string where we are talking about Still. I am on a field trip for most of the day so I don't know when I will finish, but I just wanted to stop in.

Joe, I am going to drop of a question here. Have you read Ayn Rand's writings? Do you have any thoughts about her philosophy of Objectivism?

Have a great day!

...

No

"Joe, I am going to drop of a question here. Have you read Ayn Rand's writings? Do you have any thoughts about her philosophy of Objectivism?"

I have not read Ayn Rand. No, and I see no point in it, as (perhaps wrongly) I think the viewpoint is amoral.

Amorality, to me, is the stuff of narcissism. I think it is pathological, and therefore destructive to life, not in an absolute sense, such as Legal Crime IS immoral, and therefore Legal Crime is designed, or defines, the willful, and active, destruction of life on earth, rather, amorality is relatively destructive to life when compared with morality.

Does that make sense. I can elaborate when you get more time.

"Have a great day!"

Is that not an example of morality in action?

Please do, too, have as nice a day as you can muster - considering all those forces working to ruin your day.

Help is more than merely appreciated, it is vital.

Joe

One Day

Keeping things scarce?

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/technology-blog/russian-asteroid... :

"Of course, a diamond discovery of this magnitude is almost sure to have a serious downward impact in the per-karat price should full-scale mining operations ever begin."

(I found the link to the story at: http://www.dailypaul.com/255795/guess-who-just-became-the-wo... )

Non Crisis

How can the Legal Criminals increase their power?

Make peace scarce.

Peaceful people will pay any price to get peace.

How can Legal Criminals make peace scarce?

Use the power flowing to Legal Criminals from Productive People (those who actually make more power out of less power) to commit crime and thereby disturb the peace, and lie about the actual purchases purchased with the power to purchase flowing to the Legal Criminals.

That is fraud, in the first place, such as Comprehensive Annual Financial Reports that Report the Accurate Purchases Purchased with the Purchasing Power sent to the Frauds and Legal Criminals who then Purchase Profitable Investments that just so happen to be Profits that Legal Criminals Gain at the Expense (passing on costs) of the Tax Payers who are FOOLED into "providing the means by which we suffer" because "we" believe the LIES told by the FRAUDS who say that "WE" are Broke when the FRAUDS Publish the Seconds Set of Books known as The Budget.

Why, the Juror demands to know, as the employee, the lawyer, asks, why, why, why did you take part in this fraud Mr. so and so, office holder, who happens to be making a killing off this Fraud in Progress, whereby the Tax Payers think they are paying for peace and they are getting Fraud instead, why, why, why, did you take part in this Fraud, Mr. so and so?

No such thing can happen, because the Frauds wrote the rule book, since, at least, 1788, here in America the land of U.S.A. Inc. (LLC), a Limited Liability Corporation also knowable as a Fascist State, so no such thing as peace is allowed BY LAW.

The victims will pay and they can't even question the fact that they will pay.

Peace is made scarce, and the ultimate FRAUD occurs, this Confidence Scheme, as the Victims are made to believe that they are paying to get peace, when they are actually, and accurately measurably, providing the very means by which they suffer, and this is not NEWS.

This is as old, in this country, as 1776, when Thomas Paine first informed The People about this type of FRAUD, in progress, with his best seller, sold at cost, or even Dumped at below cost price, Common Sense.

People are not getting peace when they keep working harder to pay more to get peace, they are instead getting a greater supply of FALSEHOOD invented, produced, and maintained by the people who PROFIT from investments they make with the Power to Purchase, called Taxes, but that is only ONE WAY the power flows ONE WAY, through that specific Legal Monopoly Criminal Fraud Power called taxes, that does not even begin to count the flow of power through the National Level Counterfeiting Power known as The Federal Reserve.

The People want an accurate, sound, and equitable, or fair, or as good for the goose as is good for the gander, or do unto others as you would have others do onto you MONEY, and instead of getting that peace, they get FRAUD MONEY, which then makes sound money scarce, and people will then do anything, pay any price, to get their Sound Money, and the TRICK is to Fool the Fools into believing the the Criminals are doing all they can do to supply peaceful, moral, sound, accurate, and powerful money to The People, if only The People would just work a little harder each day and pay more Interest to the one group who own the Lender of Last Resort, that Legal Money Monopoly Fraud Power, and that is so simple to see because the actual borrowers are NOT The People as The People earn their OWN good faith and credit, The People are the actual lenders NOT the borrowers, The People are supposedly, according to the Frauds themselves, the source of Credit which becomes, like magic, their Credit and our DEBT.

So easy to see?

How tangled does the web go, when even English (a medium of exchange) has been twisted so far as to make bad good?

Good is not bad?

Up is now down?

What did Henry Ford say, among all the very wise things Henry Ford said, what was said on this subject?

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/h/henry_ford.html

"If money is your hope for independence you will never have it. The only real security that a man will have in this world is a reserve of knowledge, experience, and ability."

Are diamonds scarce?

Is powerful money scarce?

No, and oil isn't scarce either.

"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."

I don't know Henry, but it looks to me like you had an interest in keeping the fraud going a few days longer.

Joe

Keeping the fraud going a few days longer...

“People are not getting peace when they keep working harder to pay more to get peace, they are instead getting a greater supply of FALSEHOOD invented, produced, and maintained by the people who PROFIT from investments they make with the Power to Purchase, called Taxes, but that is only ONE WAY the power flows ONE WAY, through that specific Legal Monopoly Criminal Fraud Power called taxes, that does not even begin to count the flow of power through the National Level Counterfeiting Power known as The Federal Reserve.”
What a shame of a sham: People are trying to buy peace by paying for war. Meanwhile those trying to buy peace are made less powerful and those suffering from war are made powerless while those Tax-Stealing, Human-Murdering, Legal Monopoly Criminals purposefully profit from both sides of the peace/war equation in order to become more powerful at the expense of their victims.

And now you show me: “…the actual borrowers are NOT The People as The People earn their OWN good faith and credit, The People are the actual lenders NOT the borrowers, The People are supposedly, according to the Frauds themselves, the source of Credit which becomes, like magic, their Credit and our DEBT.”

So somehow The People have been fooled into lending money and paying the debt on the money while the true debtors steal the power.

Is that what Henry Ford was talking about when he said the people would revolt by morning if they understood the monetary system?

“How tangled does the web go, when even English (a medium of exchange) has been twisted so far as to make bad good?”

Your words made me think of this verse speaking of the last days when the way of truth is evil spoken of with feigned [artificial] words whereby pernicious [wicked] people make merchandise of others due to covetousness [greed]:

2 Peter 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. 3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.

Except this passage is not talking about bankers, but false preachers and teachers.
________________
Last night I listened to The Hearing on the Price of Money Sept 21, 2012: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXSExanbY0Q&feature=youtu.be

It did my heart good to hear Dr. Ron Paul praised and appreciated by his peers and the witnesses.

I think I heard Joe’s Law! At 23 minutes for about 1 minute? Hmm, I think I may have heard a forked tongue by the time he finishes speaking at 28 minutes and some odd seconds…? But I do not know. Although during part of the hearing he does call the public “the sovereign people.”

While the speakers are a bit boring and reading from scripts, I found the information interesting and also heard at about 33:42: "We are the lab rats" being experimented upon by Mr. Bernanke. (It appeared to me that saying those words nearly put the speaker to tears.)

One time you told me what “the lender of last resort” is. But I cannot remember what you said it was and they are throwing that term around a lot and I do not know what it means and you also used it in your reply . Can you tell me again the meaning?

At the end when Congressman Luetkemeyer asked if we should abolish the Fed, the witness seemed a little taken by the question, as if unprepared to answer it, as if he couldn’t believe it was being asked. The witnesses then in the last 2.5 minutes indicate that they think we should/could still have a federal reserve with limited powers as set up in 1913. Sounds to me like those 2 witnesses might have an interest in keeping the fraud going a few days longer (like Henry?)…leading me to ask: Are they ignorant, deceived, or duplicitous?
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Proverbs 22:16; 22-23 He who oppresses the poor to increase his wealth and he who gives gifts to the rich--both come to poverty…Do not exploit the poor because they are poor and do not crush the needy in court, for the LORD will take up their case and will plunder those who plunder them.
_____________
Henry Ford’s words: "If money is your hope for independence you will never have it. The only real security that a man will have in this world is a reserve of knowledge, experience, and ability." ?

What if fools have competitive money for their use? If they are fools will they enjoy independence, or will they ensnare themselves in some way even with that independent money?

What if Henrys words “experience, and ability” were replaced with the words “wisdom and discretion?” and “alone” was added to the sentence:

If money ALONE is your hope for independence you will never have it. The only real security that a man will have in this world is a reserve of understanding, WISDOM & DISCRETION.

I wish I could read Henry’s full text to see what point he was making.

...

Revolting Revolution

___________________________
So somehow The People have been fooled into lending money and paying the debt on the money while the true debtors steal the power.

Is that what Henry Ford was talking about when he said the people would revolt by morning if they understood the monetary system?
____________________________

The word chosen by Henry Ford (according to the quote) was Revolution not Revolt and I think it is important to add that Henry Ford added the words "before tomorrow morning" as in:

"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
Henry Ford

The Revolution takes place overnight, because "our" banking and monetary system depends upon a belief in falsehood, it is a fraud, so all that has to happen is that the victims realize the truth, and that can happen in our sleep, so we wake up tomorrow morning no longer controlled by our own belief in lies, and that is revolutionary in each case, each person who is no longer fooled, they have a personal revolution.

How many revolutions before tomorrow morning does it take to render the lie powerless?

"Except this passage is not talking about bankers, but false preachers and teachers."

What are Central Bankers?

They are false preachers and teachers: they are very high paid liars.

They assume the place of God, as creator, and they assume the place of messengers of the word of God as teachers: which God?

The False God - of course.

"One time you told me what “the lender of last resort” is. But I cannot remember what you said it was and they are throwing that term around a lot and I do not know what it means and you also used it in your reply . Can you tell me again the meaning?"

Lender of Last Resort = Legalized Criminal Fraud POWER

There is no rational or even mathematical, no scientific, and no moral, certainly no spiritual, no intuitive, no logical, no reasonable, and no understandable way to explain a Central Banking Monopoly other than as a crime in progress.

There are two categories of people concerning the existence of a Central Bank Monopoly Power as there are those who know better and those who are fooled.

Those who know better tend to be those who have an INTEREST in keeping the crime in progress, and those who have an INTEREST in stopping it, with few who have no INTEREST either way, since the crime in progress moves vast amounts of power from those who create that power to those who steal it, so almost everyone who does know better has a vested INTEREST in the crime in progress: winners and losers, and the accounts are very precise, with no room for error, exacting accounting down to the pennies.

Those who are victim to the crime in progress have to be most of the productive population so long as the total power supply (fraudulently called Gross National Product and more accurately identifiable as Surplus Wealth) is growing larger, since it takes a very large amount of cooperative producers to supply enough wealth to satisfy the demands of the growing number of criminals made legal.

That has to be understood, in my opinion, since the obvious result is a sine wave (top half?), a rise to a peak and then a fall to an original starting point, and then as a counter to that obvious fact of Rise and Fall (Central Banks are Imperialistic and they always rise and fall, the counter to that is called The Business Cycle, so the Central Bankers have learned how to rotate the crops from one to another field as the fertile ground is used up and abandoned for greener pastures.

The rotation of the crops from Nation to Nation to Nation (3) completes the other half of the sine wave as one Nation then consumes the power produced in the other Nations = World Reserve Currency Status Global Central Bank Fraud Crime in Progress.

Central Bankers rise and then fall one Nation State here, and then they have another Nation State, or more likely 2 more Nations States going up and going down in those Business Cycles. That is how the Business Cycle can keep the human dross rotated and ever fertile for exploitation.

This is a long way off the simple question concerning "the lender of last resort" but it is important to understand the whole picture, not just the symptoms.

Central Banks start out as a few slightly powerful individuals, like Robert Morris, or Alexander Hamilton, as the human dross, the targets, the victims, which are all the productive people fooled, all those targets, all those fools, all those productive people, start paying Interest to the Frauds who claim to be "the lenders of last resort", and then those few powerful people who have managed to convince all those fools of the lie are ever ready to buy off the few people who figure out the lie, or threaten them, or torture them, or kill them.

So look at a straight line:

___________________________________________

That straight line represents normal human investment if it can be assumed that there is no Central Bank working to alter that normal flow of earning to be then put back into investments so as to make more earnings, or to use scarce power to then make power abundant, so that happens, theoretically (or in some historical cases like Holland, Switzerland, The Icelandic Commonwealth, or our own American period between 1776 and 1788, to name only a few illustrative examples of a normal straight line without the INTERESTS of a Central Bank Legal Fraud Crime in Progress), and so the straight line exists not just in theory.

Then a Central Bank Fraud Crime starts and progresses and POWER is no longer used to make more POWER, now POWER is "providing the means by which we suffer" as productive earners are paying criminals instead of investing, and what are the Central Bankers doing with that Surplus Wealth?

The Criminals MUST incorporate the ever growing number of people who wake up, find out about the fraud, and this process of incorporation is like passing out Blinders, Ear Plugs, and Muzzles Made in China, to those people who are waking up to the fraud, like saying here, you, if you go along with this, you can get your own Special Interests Satisfied too, you can play the game with us, but you have to stop worrying about the victims, so here are the tools you need, here is your muzzle, so you stop telling people about the fraud, and here are your blinders, so you stop seeing the true consequences of the fraud, and here are your ear plugs because there will be a lot of horror, terror, torture, and mass murder on this road, and those sounds can be very distracting when we are playing our game.

If you wake up fully, you are either in the club fully, or you are going to be shouting from the rooftops crying FRAUD, writing books, running for office, and raising you level of INTEREST that Central Bankers will have UPON you, and if you get too powerful, you will be disappeared, assassinated, threatened, or otherwise rendered less powerful.

So the straight line begins to grow upward as more and more people are playing the game and that can be measured in "savings" as more and more players are Banking on having their Money make Money, without them having to do anything but rake in their percentage of the take, you know the terminology, they are "living the American Dream" and actually they are merely getting their "piece of the action", as the money does not come from nowhere, it is a Parasite City, it is a siphoning off of earnings that would otherwise have had to have been productively consumed in the necessary competitive investment markets, a.k.a. The Free Market (not the counterfeit "Free Market").

True savings = competitive investments that produce more out of less

Counterfeit savings = Monopoly Banking Interest Payments to "Investors" who are merely subsidized "savers" being paid to play along so as to get along, to "kick the can down the road"

Confusing the two is very easy to do, when most of us have grown up within a culture driven by legal fraud, legal crime, since 1788 here in America, and much longer time periods in Europe (and I don't know much about Asia).

So the rise of the Imperial Central Bank can last 50 years, but it can't last much longer, too many people realize that their "piece of the action" is negative, not positive, so their Interest in playing along evaporates, and the number of actual producers dwindle relative to the number of people whose income depends upon the crime in progress so the peak of POWER moving out of circulation and moving into "savings accounts" starts going the opposite direction after about 50 years, and those "savings accounts" become more and more negative, or DEBT, as the total Surplus Wealth Supply dwindles down to nothing, and then consumption is exactly proportional to production, where no one has anything to consume except that which has already been produced, like the saying "living from pay check to pay check" and then those who still have a "savings account" are looking for actual productive investments again, because they know that their earnings are evaporating or already gone, so they are looking to unload the "worthless paper" onto some poor schmuck who will believe just about any lie you tell them, such as "The American Dream" or whatever works, whichever lie works, because that is the name of the game.

I knew all this when I read Equitable Commerce so that is why I fell on that book like it was more valuable that gold, which it is, because that book can help people get gold, or anything people want, if people would simply learn how to commerce equitably instead of playing the Civilized Cannibalism game.

So, recap:

The highest paid liars claim that the only way to get National Credit is to hire them to be The Lenders of Last Resort, and if you do that, why, as we all know, all our worries will be over, so get back to work, and let the Central Bankers take care of all our money, they are nice people, look how nice they dress, look at all their degrees in economics, so pay, and don't question the fact that you may need money soon, as there will always be a Lender of Last Resort to save you, in those desperate times, so sleep well.

Then POWER no longer flows into competitive investment, now it flows into counterfeit savings accounts, where the idea is to have Money Make Money (Parasite City), The American Dream, if I can reach that Independently Wealthy POINT, always just out of reach for the majority, then I too can be in the club, and I can just hire people to do my bidding, my Money will Pay me Interest Income, for doing nothing other than letting The Lender of Last Resort have my money, on loan?

Do you see how difficult it is, on purpose, to unravel the Crime in Progress, and how important it is to get back to Principles?

Whose Interest is it to pay into the Crime in Progress?

Do you see why I was astounded when I read Mutual Banking by W.B.Greene and that Essay on The Parasite City?

Do you see why those who "Can't beat em', so they join em'" are not INTERESTED in knowing about The Parasite City or Equitable Commerce or The Science of Society?

Do you see why I get negative votes, and personal attacks, and do you see why you are so ready to make false connections to Warren and Andrews?

A Crime in Progress as massive as The Federal Reserve System of Fraud, combined with the Internal Revenue Service Extortion Racket, combined with the Criminal Take OVER of The American Military Forces is a very big POWER struggle that infects the minds of every victim, and there has to be more victims than criminals, it is impossible to gain any power above consumption even if half of the population is victim and the other half is criminal, as if one productive person has to feed himself, or herself, and one criminal, because the criminals can be understood in a phrase "support me in the manner to which I've grown accustomed".

Fat, lazy, costly, useless, powerless (productively powerless), arrogant, impolite, careless, and very dangerous.

What does it take to be a criminal?

How many honest productive people are needed to support one Ben Bernanke in the manner to which he has grown accustomed?

Each level down from the top has to be, in some manner, productive, relatively speaking, and at the bottom, the most numerous number of people are those who actually use productive power, competitively, in the investments of that scarce power whereby the result is, at the end of the day, month, year, time period, there is more power, knowable as Surplus Wealth, accurately measured, so NO, you can't measure Surplus Wealth in Federal Reserve Notes.

Gold makes a very good, competitive, Standard of Value, but it too can be counterfeited as a Standard of Value, so competitive Standards of Value work better than a Monopoly Standard of Value (contradiction in terms?).

I'm rambling this morning, so I need to get back to the questions.

"Sounds to me like those 2 witnesses might have an interest in keeping the fraud going a few days longer (like Henry?)…leading me to ask: Are they ignorant, deceived, or duplicitous?"

What is their investment history?

Put on your Juror Hat, get on the jury, figuratively, and ask the vital questions, because you intend to do your part in fighting crime in as equitable as possible manner, and you have a very good source of POWER in your understanding of the Power of Creation, so, more power to you.

What would you ask of those who are hired to provide what the Juror demands as evidence in a case where, theoretically, you have those 2 witnesses on Trial, themselves, as somehow, by some method, they are presumed innocent, but accused of possible crimes known as FRAUD, and specifically concerning the Central Bank Fraud, The National Income Tax Extortion Racket, and possible links to the Criminal take over of the American Military Forces.

Wouldn't you like to see the investment portfolio?

Are you going to render a verdict based upon the elimination of REASONABLE doubt?

"Are they ignorant, deceived, or duplicitous?"

How do they earn their retirement income?

If they are facing, at a minimum, the evaporation of their retirement income, will they start singing a different tune?

"What if fools have competitive money for their use? If they are fools will they enjoy independence, or will they ensnare themselves in some way even with that independent money?"

Can a fool take part in a something for nothing fraud if someone else is competitively capable of imparting understanding to the fool, in black and white, in numbers in the fools bank account, proving without any reasonable doubt, that the fool is providing the means by which the fool will suffer, and the deal made with that particular devil is only something the devil gets for nothing but lying to the fool, and that the fool only gets the bill, nothing more?

No.

Once the fraud is exposed the number of fools buying into it evaporate. That takes, historically, about 50 years to play out, so new fools are made in a new Nation State, fresh meat.

What happens if the news of the fraud reaches the new Nation State in the schedule before the frauds gain power?

That brings us back to China.

"I wish I could read Henry’s full text to see what point he was making."

That may take some digging.

Joe

Thank you

for removing my name there in your comment below. Afterall, I am checking to see if I am a sniveling coward and I do not want anyone to know my name.

I happen to think this guy knows what he is talking about http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6ktW9Vrv18 And I think we are too fixated on America such that we might be missing the world view.

You will see why I was alarmed about the Warren & Andrews view of marriage and family. It is all apart of culture breakdown so the crooks can take over.

Have you been deceived?

I have been deceived.

But not about Andrews and his work on Love and Marriage. If you can't handle what people do on their own without suffering from coercive (as in deceptive, threatening, and violent) misdirection, including some people loving other people and marrying other people that you think they should not marry, or love, then that is your viewpoint, and neither I, nor Warren, nor Andrews claims to have any say so in your decisions, so long as you are not employing deceit, threats of violence, or violence upon those otherwise innocent people, and then we 3 can point out to you that, perhaps, you are the one deceiving yourself and your victims.

As to the culture breakdown so as to lend moral and material support to the criminals, with or without badges, who employ deceit, threats of violence, and acts of violence upon the innocent, so as to break down the culture, according to me, who thinks that making crime legal is breaking down the culture, well, I'd be out of place if everyone else, and their moms, where busy, busy, busy, ordering each other around, at each others throats, convicting each other without affording each other any defense, and resorting to lies, threats, and violence, as a rule, not an exception, upon everyone in sight, innocent or not, assuming there are any innocent people left, such as children, and in such a world as that, please put me out of my misery sooner.

I don't see ONLY the breaking down of the culture.

When I went to Jury Duty I saw an actually honorable judge, and I saw honest, productive people, and I saw a lot of hope despite all the deceit made legal, all the threats made legal, all the violence made legal, for over 200 years.

Who, exactly, is breaking down the culture?

Warren?

Andrews?

Me?

You?

The Inquisition?

The Crusade?

The Government?

Communism?

The pointed stick?

The Lie?

The reflection in the mirror?

If you can put up a top 10, your best guess, as to which human beings happen to be the most responsible for breaking down the culture would Warren, Andrews, and I be on it, because we are the most deceived among the entirely of mankind from Adam on through the gene pool?

Yes, of course, I have been deceived, and that is why I seek help in expanding my scope of perception beyond my own two beady, shifty, eyes.

This may ring true to you too, there isn't much you can do better than I can in hammering my self esteem into oblivion, and if you find a way, I may get jealous of your exceptional talent.

When people move to insult me, I'm more often than not, well ahead of that game, so bring it on sister.

Why not back up the claims with something I can sink my teeth into, what exactly has deceived me?

I'll check out the link and then get back to work. This stuff does not leave me, so your help is just that, help, and if it becomes too taxing, compared to the Power Struggle I already have going on, then do you think I won't know how to triage?

later.

Joe

Code Blue?

I asked you a question. I told you why I was alarmed and gave you a link to my understanding of how things worked before I began to understand from you. I did not say you have been deceived. I asked. You may want to try on the shoe. Why is it ok for you to hand me repulsive shoes and I cannot give you a shoe to check out?
______________
"This may ring true to you too, there isn't much you can do better than I can in hammering my self-esteem into oblivion, and if you find a way, I may get jealous of your exceptional talent.

When people move to insult me, I'm more often than not, well ahead of that game, so bring it on sister."

Are you saying it is my intention to hammer your self-esteem and to insult you? Why would I do that? Are you planning moves against me? Have not I been a friend, or a help. Now it is subject to triage? Is that a threat? My performance has not been “just right” and now it is on the chopping block?

Have I resorted to injury, deceit and threat to fellow Friend of Liberty who I have considered a Friend in Liberty? Am I now an enemy? Or did I read all of that incorrectly as I so often do?

"This stuff does not leave me, so your help is just that, help, and if it becomes too taxing, compared to the Power Struggle I already have going on, then do you think I won't know how to triage?"

It has not been my intention to be taxing. I am sorry, and I do not have any other words to express those word, just that I feel bad about these words today that have been damaging. If you need to do triage, just please tell me so it can be equitable with no burned bridges or hurt feelings, and I will understand. I especially feel bad about all of this because of all that you have going on and now this. I try to be an encouragement to you and it seems today I have been the opposite. I am really sorry, Joe. Will you forgive me? I have tears, not from laughing.

Decoding Code Blue?

"Why is it ok for you to hand me repulsive shoes and I cannot give you a shoe to check out?"

It is OK, I do it all the time, the shoe does fit, but why does it fit, exactly?

If I am deceived, as I certainly am, then what exactly is the deception, and I need help, since by definition I am deceived. If I am deceived, than I am deceived, so where does the decoding of the deception come from if I am deceived?

If the deception involves Warren and Andrews and in particular the works known as Equitable Commerce, The Science of Society, or the published discussion on Love and Marriage, then the help you offer so far has not been able to decode where I have been deceived by those people and those works.

Voluntary associations, or proponents of voluntary associations, don't include willful deception, since that would be an involuntary association if one person willfully deceives another unwilling person. Can a voluntary association be blamed for the willful employment of deception by one person upon another person?

Does deception fall from the sky?

"Are you saying it is my intention to hammer your self-esteem and to insult you? Why would I do that? Are you planning moves against me? Have not I been a friend, or a help. Now it is subject to triage? Is that a threat? My performance has not been “just right” and now it is on the chopping block?"

It may not ring true to you that people who move to insult you are not as good as you are yourself at insulting yourself. To me, as with me doing stupid things, I don't need help, I can get those jobs done very well all on my own.

That was my point. So, you, Will, the guy three houses down, John Doe, or my sister, bring it on, I'll even paint the target on my back, and we can have a competition as to which insult works best on me.

1.
The insults I create myself insulting myself.

2.
External insults that other people create and transfer from them to me.

That was my point.

"Have I resorted to injury, deceit and threat to fellow Friend of Liberty who I have considered a Friend in Liberty? Am I now an enemy? Or did I read all of that incorrectly as I so often do?"

If you are finding other people very capable of insulting you better than you are at finding your own faults, then do you see that as help or injury to you?

This part of this discussion concerns these public statements published by Will as to my errors in quoting and representing someone and some thing, which to me are as yet not well communicated, so I am not able to know where I misquoted and I am not able to know where I misrepresented, and therefore the help I get from Will is incomplete at best.

"It has not been my intention to be taxing. I am sorry, and I do not have any other words to express those word, just that I feel bad about these words today that have been damaging. If you need to do triage, just please tell me so it can be equitable with no burned bridges or hurt feelings, and I will understand. I especially feel bad about all of this because of all that you have going on and now this. I try to be an encouragement to you and it seems today I have been the opposite. I am really sorry, Joe. Will you forgive me? I have tears, not from laughing."

Tears for any reason are cause for concern, please don't feel bad on my account, especially if the cause is a matter of miscommunication.

If the cause is a matter of miscommunication then I have already proven to be less than capable of working to remedy the cause.

What can be done differently, more competitively, to avoid such things as miscommunication, if that is the cause of the sorrow?

How about a closer look at the principle of taxation?

That may be too taxing?

Would it be counterproductive for me to suggest a remedy if the goal is to avoid miscommunication - if I am the cause of the miscommunication?

Is heaven tax free, and hell nothing but taxes?

When is it a good idea to refuse to pay one tax because other tax liabilities are sounder investments for your limited capacity to pay any more taxes?

If the cause of the sorrow is identifiable, then the remedy is as identifiable?

Joe

No Answers Addendum

This is supposed to be after my reply below this one "No Answers"

At dinner, I am thinking, I am not stupid. I can read. I can answer questions. I can pass tests. What is wrong with me. Why can’t I answer Joe? The first thing that came to mind is that I don’t know if the questions are each stand alone, or if I am supposed to be reading them together for context. The other thing is there is not a right or wrong answer. I see black and white. Grey is difficult.

Grey is not black

Grey is not white

Joe

Fascists and Flags?

What was wrong with the Don't Tread on Me Flag?

http://delcode.delaware.gov/title14/c041/index.shtml

____________________________________________________
(a) Every board of education in this State shall procure the American flag and cause the same to be displayed out-of-doors (weather permitting) on the school grounds of every school house in this State during school hours.

(b) The Department of Education shall procure American flags for every free public school in this State and cause the same to be displayed in every school house in this State during school hours.

(c) The Department shall make drafts, by warrants upon the State Treasurer from funds not otherwise appropriated, of such sums as are necessary to carry into full effect subsection (b) of this section.
______________________________________________________

Note the Fraud Spelled out in the Title:

"Free Public Schools"

Flag manufacturers paying off their Congressman, and business is now BOOMING?

The Communists didn't invent "Free Public Education", it is a Legal Crime Business understood ages ago.

Flags are Tools, useful things, and for what purpose?

What is the message?

No Red States...No Blue States

The Dictator says so (and HIS army)?

So...be thankful that you still have a lesser of two evils?

Really?

Joe

Thank you for a competitive point of view.

I have added a link back to your comment on my Obama Flag Post.

Also noted this on the link you provided:

§ 4106. Failure to require salute and pledge; penalty.

When the Department of Education has procured and distributed American flags in each free public school, any principal or teacher of such free public school who fails to require the salute and pledge as set out in § 4105 of this title shall be fined not more than $50 or imprisoned not more than 10 days.
_______________
With my inability to understand English, I do not understand if I am supposed to answer these questions:
___________________
Flags are Tools, useful things, and for what purpose?

What is the message?

No Red States...No Blue States

The Dictator says so (and HIS army)?

So...be thankful that you still have a lesser of two evils?

Really?
____________________
or if the are rhetorical.

...

Now there is a word ripe for discussion.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/rhetorical

1.
used for, belonging to, or concerned with mere style or effect.
2.
marked by or tending to use bombast.
3.
of, concerned with, or having the nature of rhetoric.

So, to me, the meaning is ONE WAY communication, or a Speaking Monopoly, or Dictation, IS rhetorical?

Throw in a little "bombast" to invent, produce, and maintain a false front on the Dictators Dictates?

If a question is vital, to more than one person, then an accurate answer might be demanded by more than one person.

Example:

"Flags are Tools, useful things, and for what purpose?"

The American Flag has a long history of covering up things, Legal Crime, Dead Bodies: covered up Cannon Fodder or covered up Patriots depending upon your angle of view.

Burning a flag sends a message.

Something to make people salute, almost like prayer, only with out the real God involved, like a False Flag used to hide a False God?

You will salute, since now you can't afford not to salute.

No questions, you will salute.

What is the message? (A rhetorical question from the dictator?)

Obey

What?

Ignorance is no excuse for the Law.

Which Law is that, from people who claim things like "it depends upon what is is"?

I don't think that I do rhetorical. I think that I do blabbermouth ranting, sure, but not rhetoric.

I might be wrong, of course.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rhetoric

?

Did you check the link, read the definition? What happened to Bombast?

Now I'm running around trying to find the meaning of Bombast?

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bombast

pretentious inflated speech or writing

So, to me, I can pick out people that I think I can trust, and I can call them Friends of Liberty, or just friends, and I can ask questions, share questions, and share answers, in the effort to know better, and in places where communication appears to fail, I can ask for clarification.

What is the problem?

English did it?

An example of Bombast or an example of artful employment of English can be provided as the following:

_________________________________
Flags are Tools, useful things, and for what purpose?

What is the message?

No Red States...No Blue States

The Dictator says so (and HIS army)?

So...be thankful that you still have a lesser of two evils?

Really?
__________________________________

ObamaNation, a person, a person that has be fit on top of the Nation, as Fearless Leader, or any name I am at liberty to publish, and escape punishment, this person, so named, ObamaNation, creates a new flag.

OK, I'm curious, is it a new message or the same one?

Obey

I think it is the same old message, and the stationary has been reabricated and the message just so happens to be false.

I won't obey, I know where that path leads.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gadsden_flag

How about that message?

Can it be made true again?

Was there a Flag for the Republic under The Articles of Confederation, or was that Betsy Ross thing just another False Flag operation?

I don't know, so I ask.

Joe

Rhetorical Questions

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetorical_question
"A rhetorical question is a figure of speech in the form of a question that is asked in order to make a point and without the expectation of a reply.[1] The question is used as a rhetorical device, posed for the sake of encouraging its listener to consider a message or viewpoint. Though these are technically questions, they do not always require a question mark.

For example, the question "Can you do anything right?" is asked not to gain information about the ability of the person being spoken to, but rather to insinuate that the person always fails.

While sometimes amusing and even humorous, rhetorical questions are rarely meant for pure, comedic effect. A carefully crafted question can, if delivered well, persuade an audience to believe in the position(s) of the speaker.[2]"
________________________
When I read your questions it is in the light of my understanding of wiki last quoted paragraph:
"A carefully crafted question can, if delivered well, persuade an audience to believe in the position(s) of the speaker.[2]"

I figure you know the answers to the questions already and you are trying to make me think about what you already know. So, am I really supposed to answer your questions point by point. Joe, I am being honest, not a smart aleck. I do not know if each question stands alone, or if they are grouped to be answered in a single paragraph, or if I am not supposed to answer them at all because the answer is a given, but rather am just supposed to follow your train of thought.
_________________________
Honestly, I am about to the point where you told me to read a book last time and I watched a movie instead. I am very tired. I could barely water my plants this morning. Dragging the hose made me tired. I go thru spells like that. It is a beautiful day here(There are lots of persistent contrails though) and my arms and legs feel heavy so I don't dare do much because I need to be able to do what is necessary.
_________________________
Jeff’s car is being driven today by the lady whose husband lost her car somewhere; still unfound. She has a job as one of those in home care people (probably funded by tax dollars or printed Bernanke bucks) and in order to keep her from losing her job we have given her our car for the day. I would have driven her around but my youngest is home sick.
_________________________
My God says this about women:

• Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Equitable?

Now that could be a rhetorical question, as I think it is equitable, but if you disagree, then you might want to say so.
_____________________
I had never head the word bombast before. Interesting word. That was in no way my intent by asking if your questions were rhetorical.
...

Trust in repetetion

I think it can be understood as to reasonable expectations concerning the future by expecting that repetitive things will repeat.

The sun goes down.

The sun comes back up.

We have good days.

We have bad days.

Legal Criminals lie.

Friends of Liberty work to avoid those lies.

The least taxing thing can become unaffordable.

The most taxing thing (loving someone who beats on you) can be impossible to resist.

"• Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

Things that are true are known by those who understand the truth, things that are true may not be known by everyone despite being true.

People who want to know, truly, do things in that directly, including self understanding concerning ignorance, it seems to me, pretending to know doesn't work.

Does it?

Have you tried?

If I pretend to know something well enough, can that be the key to success in knowing better?

I don't see this as an exercise in academic study, if English can convey meaning, I see this as a need to prepare for bad things looming, by knowing how to avoid them as best as possible.

Pretending, to me, sounds like insanity, but I can be wrong, repeating the same thing over and over gain, hoping that it will work this time, despite the fact that all times previous, all other attempts to pretend, to put on a false front, to act like I know something that I do not know, so far, has not worked, so what can I reasonably expect this time?

The best foot I can put forward, in my own personal experience, has been the calculated honest truth, as far as I can tell, to go that way, and take whatever happens.

Short of that I can flip a coin, at times when there seem to be no right or wrong way forward.

Rambling, babbling, and publishing thoughts, while thinking, about rhetorical questions, for example, seems like the right thing to do, because I think I know my own working self better, like right now, recalling how those few moments when faced with no right or wrong way to proceed, flipping a coin, and then finding the wrong result of the coin toss, showing my own ignorance, my own error, my own lack of understanding concerning the direction I truly wanted to go.

In context?

Reply to you in this discussion does not require a coin toss.

Believe in Jesus as having died for my sins does not require a coin toss.

Belief in Jesus as a part of God, son, whatever, does not require a coin toss.

I think it is right for me to reply on this forum so far.

I do not believe that Jesus, or anyone, died for my sins, since I know I will be paying for my sins one way or the other.

I do not have to believe that Jesus, or any human being, any living thing, is a part of God, son, whatever, because I know that God is the creative power of life, by any name, there has to be that power, or there is no life, so what is to be believed when reason works well enough in knowing?

Joe

Mercy

"• Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

I understand this to mean that Christians are all equal. There are no divisions and no one is better than anyone else. They are supposed to act as equitablists?
__________
“Things that are true are known by those who understand the truth, things that are true may not be known by everyone despite being true.
People who want to know, truly, do things in that directly, including self understanding concerning ignorance, it seems to me, pretending to know doesn't work.
Does it?
Have you tried?
If I pretend to know something well enough, can that be the key to success in knowing better?”

No I would say pretending to know would not gain one any knowledge, it would be only a bluff and could cause one to never arrive at the truth. Just like in that Free Love discussion. We both understood 2 different things by the term Free Love and I suppose it may depend upon who is using that term as to what it means? But now that we have talked more I understand better.
_____________
“I don't see this as an exercise in academic study, if English can convey meaning, I see this as a need to prepare for bad things looming, by knowing how to avoid them as best as possible. “

Yes, and that is why I want to understand if what Alan Watt says is true. He said something to the effect in that talk that doesn’t give any answers: that China is already owned by the criminals. He seemed to talk about a lot of the same things you talk about. Does Alex Jones give solutions to the problems? Maybe Alan Watt provides education as a solution?
______________
“Rambling, babbling, and publishing thoughts, while thinking, about rhetorical questions, for example, seems like the right thing to do, because I think I know my own working self better, like right now, recalling how those few moments when faced with no right or wrong way to proceed, flipping a coin, and then finding the wrong result of the coin toss, showing my own ignorance, my own error, my own lack of understanding concerning the direction I truly wanted to go.”

Yes that is why I want you to talk to me. I want to understand. But I am very imperfect and I assume things that may not be meant to be hurtful because I take everything, so it seems, personal. I also want you to know and love my God. But I realize I cannot make that happen. I can only pray for you and hope that at some point I might share something that might make some sense in that regard.

“I do not believe that Jesus, or anyone, died for my sins, since I know I will be paying for my sins one way or the other.”

I am going to cry out for mercy and my merciful God according to his Word is going to grant me mercy because He personally paid my cost because He loves me so much He did not want me to have to pay those costs which will take all of eternity.
_________________
”I do not have to believe that Jesus, or any human being, any living thing, is a part of God, son, whatever, because I know that God is the creative power of life, by any name, there has to be that power, or there is no life, so what is to be believed when reason works well enough in knowing?”

There is hope?

•Psalm 53:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.

When you tell me there is no God, I will believe there is no hope.

...

Learning from each other

"I understand this to mean that Christians are all equal. There are no divisions and no one is better than anyone else. They are supposed to act as equitablists?"

My mind is now infected with this information arriving into my mind from Proverbs, from a Male Speaker, and I have now this sound, as the word "understanding" is said by that Speaker who recorded an audio version of Proverbs.

So, can understanding be accomplished in equitable exchanges, or does one person infect another person with understanding?

Is an infection bad? Is the word "infect" a poor word choice chosen by me the author of this text in this equitable discussion?

"We both understood 2 different things by the term Free Love and I suppose it may depend upon who is using that term as to what it means? But now that we have talked more I understand better."

That goes both ways again, not ONE WAY, not MONOPOLY, but COMPETITION instead of Monopoly, as you became aware of the different meaning of the term: so did I.

You were speaking about rocks, and I thought you were speaking about plants. I was speaking about plants and you thought I was speaking about rocks. We can now speak about either rocks or plants, and we can both understand each other, if that is the goal.

What happens if the goal is deception?

There can be no understanding on the part of the deceived if the deceiver reaches the goal, and it will be the victim that fails to understand as the victim is led to "understand" a lie?

How bad can communication get when deceivers are provided the means by which they make other people suffer for over 200 years?

How unique is it to actually communicate equitably despite all the force of deceit added up into one thing called Falsehood?

"Does Alex Jones give solutions to the problems? Maybe Alan Watt provides education as a solution?"

Education is the solution to the Falsehood problem, but there has to be things done, and there will be as many competitive things to do as can be imagined by everyone, IN LIBERTY, while the opposite is true, it seems to me, that there is only ONE Thing that must be done in MONOPOLY, which is OBEY (without question).

Alex Jones was an avid supporter of Ron Paul, which to me is the same things as saying:

1.
End the FED (competitively)
2.
End the IRS (competitively)
3.
Bring the Troops Home (competitively)

So, Alex Jones, by that measure does offer actionable solutions.

Both Alan and Alex offer competitive information for eager minds, and both are fully capable of WARNING people who may be currently very POWERLESS in their FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY, and their FALSEHOOD.

Many people are culturally powerless as they do, in fact, OBEY without question, and this can be seen, accurately measured, in many ways, not only in Federal Reserve Note POWER transfers, through The IRS, and through the Money Fraud System (QE3? - really?), whereby the absolute need for a powerful defense of Liberty (competition) is replaced by an absolutely powerful Criminal Government POWER.

We want Liberty, so we pay to get it, and the money is spent to supply us with Crime made legal instead of Liberty.

The victims pay into their own demise, and that is a very seriously powerless condition for victims to be in, and the news is worse, not better, as a former victims begins to look into the TRUTH of these FACTS.

So...to me it is vitally important for anyone, any Alan, or any Alex, to add actionable solutions to the ongoing stream of very bad news that is getting worse by the minute.

If Alan speaks about the worst people, the most Evil people, the most powerful people, already in control of China, overpowering the Chinese Government Power, then that is very bad news.

That is the worst news I've heard in a long time, how can there be worse news?

That means that there will be World War III, if that is true, and if there isn't a cooler head among the most powerful to stop it.

I had hopes, and I still do have hopes, that China is still, as yet, not fully on board with the Money Monopoly Power; a power that currently has the False Front known as The Dollar Hegemony, or The World Bank, or the International Monetary Fund, or whatever multiple False Fronts have the same common denominator which is Federal Reserve Notes.

Those most powerful people will have no problem, at all, because they cause it to happen, no problem at all in moving their Gold, their real money, their legal titles, etc., over to Chinese Banks when they switch from a Dollar Hegemony to whatever new World Reserve Currency Power they create, because they can, and because that is what they want, and because that is their routine, their Method of Operation.

Unless...

Unless there are as yet to be fought battles among the most powerful whereby they do not ALL agree to follow their own script, the obvious progress through World War III will go on as planned if they ALL do agree.

People OBEY (without question) the IDEA that these things are random and that the authorities, "they", are doing all they can to stop it, if only "we" send them enough Federal Reserve Notes, or whatever the current Fraud Money is at this time and place.

Some send their children off to "spread democracy" too, not "just" Federal Reserve Notes.

"When you tell me there is no God, I will believe there is no hope."

Nothingness for eternity is the end goal for the godless?

Why does that make perfect sense to me?

I have a chore to do, and this is not edited, but there are other threads to work on too.

Later.

Edited

Joe

Competition and Understanding

“My mind is now infected with this information arriving into my mind from Proverbs, from a Male Speaker, and I have now this sound, as the word "understanding" is said by that Speaker who recorded an audio version of Proverbs.
So, can understanding be accomplished in equitable exchanges, or does one person infect another person with understanding?
Is an infection bad? Is the word "infect" a poor word choice chosen by me the author of this text in this equitable discussion?”

Infect: contaminate, poison, pollute, taint

Impart: inspire, impact, stimulate, instruct

I suppose what is “is” is in the heart of the messanger as well as the recipient?
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“That goes both ways again, not ONE WAY, not MONOPOLY, but COMPETITION instead of Monopoly, as you became aware of the different meaning of the term: so did I.”

Really, isn’t it strange that 2 people could think they are talking about the same thing when each one has a completely different meaning. So, you were as unaware of my understanding as I was of yours? I never considered that you could be unaware.
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“What happens if the goal is deception?”

I say if the goal is deception that it would be equal to infect or to poison.

“How unique is it to actually communicate equitably despite all the force of deceit added up into one thing called Falsehood?”

I say if the goal is equitable communication that it would be equal to impart or inspire.
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And I appreciate your part in this equitable communication. If I have heard you right, you want competition. I need understanding because there is much I do not understand.
____________
“If Alan speaks about the worst people, the most Evil people, the most powerful people, already in control of China, overpowering the Chinese Government Power, then that is very bad news.”

I would like your thought on this: What if communism were used as a change agent to remove and replace power? (I think Alan Watt also said in that talk that the same people responsible for the Bolshevik revolution also funded the French Revolution.) Did not those revolutions remove monarchies? What if those same money brokers funded the Chinese communist revolution? Didn’t the Japanese invade China in the WW? I wonder if they were a “softening” agent? I wonder who funded Japan? Anyways, it would make sense to me that populations have been purged, divided by civil war etc and monarchies removed so as to soften or prepare each population to accept a single monopoly currency and world government. So it would make sense to me since, China has seen revolution and purging that it is already under Legal Criminal Monopoly control. Maybe that is why we are “softening” the power holders in Middle East? Maybe they have become aware of what the Criminals are doing and have resisted, so even though Criminals (thru US power) have installed governments Criminals are toppling them and installing new government powers that they will go along with the Criminal scheme.

“That is the worst news I've heard in a long time, how can there be worse news?”

How about this, I have heard Alan Watt say in the past that the Control Brokers are only allowing the US to be a power broker until the Middle East is taken down. Then we will be taken down. I don’t know if that is true or not. Just what I remember him saying last year when I was listening to him. Makes me think that while we are softening the Middle East, we are being softened. We are paying for our demise and a lot of our soldiers and their families are being ruined psychologically. But then again I am very convoluted in my thinking whereby I want to connect dots which I unfortunately did to my error concerning Warren. I think you used the word “fond” and I said no, not me. Well, maybe me, but not on purpose, but drawing incorrect conclusions is not a nice thing to do to anyone. Thank you for helping me to see.

The other thing, I only caught a brief excerpt from Glenn Beck talking about prisons on the California border being breeched somehow (I think it was future tense). It made me think of what I saw in that Gaddafi show that upset me so much. (I have a few grey hairs showing now. I know they weren’t there until I saw that Libya clip. I suppose I have earned them though.) You know they set prisoners free and those were the thugs who tore up Gaddafi. Anyways I was changing radio channels and I didn’t get the station long enough to hear exactly what was being said, and not that I trust or listen to Glenn Beck, but the information gave me pause.
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“Some send their children off to "spread democracy" too, not "just" Federal Reserve Notes. “

Yes that reminds me of the conversation on the other thread where language is used to deceive and weave a tangled web where by the good faith of The People somehow becomes the credit of the Legal Criminals while they have somehow convinced us that it is our debt. Although…JTK is not convinced it is his debt…less Power for the Legal Criminals? Anyways a lot of people who send their children off to spread democracy do so thinking it is a very patriotic and honorable thing to do…have they been infected?
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So does that Male voice speaking the Proverbs influence, inspire, impact, stimulate, impart, and effect you, or is it a poison whereby your mind has been infected?

...

Quick reply then details

Proverbs, to me, is a treasure, more valuable that gold and food, because understanding includes understanding how to get gold and food if either is wanted or needed.

Details:

"I would like your thought on this: What if communism were used as a change agent to remove and replace power?"

That is a trap. Communism is a False Front hiding Legal Criminals, and as soon as Joe McCarthy starts trying Communists (presumed innocent but definitely on trial) the Legal Criminals know better, and so they put on their McCarthyism hats.

"(I think Alan Watt also said in that talk that the same people responsible for the Bolshevik revolution also funded the French Revolution.)"

That is another trap. The False Front is this false image that there are the same few people sitting around the same table and they are never discovered so the whole concept of "Conspiracy Theory" is insane, saying the same things, never any result. The truth can be known, and I think that the names of the worst Top 10 people change as to which actual individual person is the most powerful criminal, which has to be someone connected to Legal Power in some manner, so the most powerful criminal is going to be a Legal Criminal, and you had better know, and certainly the most powerful criminal know, that his or her position is not going to be held forever, it will be subject to the second most powerful criminal, and that is the name of the game.

Might makes "Right" (a Fraud because only God Might truly knows what is right)

Conspiracy is not a theory: Conspiracy is roughly analogous to Might making "Right", or Legal Crime, or The Business Psycho, or Central Banking, or whatever word works best if the idea is to know better. The most powerful individual human being can take part in the financing of all sides that result in the willful invention, creation, and maintenance of World War, and the result is more power flowing to those people, including the most powerful among them. Does the one most powerful one among the most powerful group wear a special hat?

I don't know.

I don't get the memos, but logic, reason, and understanding does not come up with a term "Conspiracy Theory" if the concept is to convey the facts, the term "Conspiracy Theory" is a very accurate measure of falsehood, who says that term meaning to willfully cover up an ongoing conspiracy?

What is The Federal Reserve System?

Do you claim that The Federal Reserve System is morally legitimate use of power and do you claim that anyone intending to report the facts about The Federal Reserve System is someone who is a fool, someone who falsely believes a "Conspiracy Theory"?

Do Pots call Kettles Black? (question begging?)

Sure.

Is The Federal Reserve System a crime in progress made legal?

No, someone might say, in all honesty too, that is a contradiction in terms?

Why did someone write the fable about the Naked Emperor who wore no clothes, was that a "Conspiracy Theory" too?

How is falsehood accurately measured?

Start talking to someone hired to run a government office. Find out.

How about the National Debt Clock? Who claims that the numbers on The Official National Debt Clock are anything but very accurate measures of falsehood?

How about The Budget Reports, who claims that those are anything but very accurate measures of falsehood, willfully reported by criminals, as the criminals who report The Budget are also hiding their Comprehensive Annual Financial Reports, which were once accurate, and are now being falsified (covered up with yet another layer of falsehood?), certainly, since Walter Burien blew the lid off that crime in progress (but who listens)?

"Did not those revolutions remove monarchies?"

Monopolization works the way it works, and it works on criminals, and it works on victims, so there may be many criminals, Monarchies or whatever name works, and then a deal is made to Incorporate the process of making crime legal, to make a deal, to split up the territory, to make sure that none of the Legal Criminal Competitors go too far in showing how The People can use scarce power in the work required to make power abundant, because that would never do, it can't be allowed, because then the victims could learn by that example, they can voluntarily unite into a Voluntary Union of Former Victims, World Wide, and then Legal Crime would no longer pay very well, as the number of ready victims shrink down to nothing, and the only victims left are the criminals themselves, and they eat each other down to the last two, and then the last one eats the second to last one, and then what, the last Legal Criminal goes to work at McDonalds?

That is how that works, and it is not a "theory", it is how that works.

Why has Switzerland been allowed to go unmolested through 2 World Wars so far? Will Switzerland be excused from World War III? Where will you go on Vacation during World War III, while everyone else if armed to the teeth, ready, willing, able, and currently at each others throats?

Switzerland?

Which money do the most powerful people use to store their personal savings accounts?

You don't think they use Fraud money do you?

Which government do the most powerful people use to keep a good vacation spot always available despite these "worst of times" that they buy with their stolen loot?

You don't think they use Despotism do you?

The most powerful people use the most powerful tools to accomplish their goals, and the counterfeit things are "For Public Consumption".

How does that not make sense?

"What if those same money brokers funded the Chinese communist revolution?"

I do not know much about China, but I know that the answer to that question is that similar (if not the same) money brokers did, in fact, fund the Chinese Communists and you can look into what happened to Chiang Kai-shek.

I did a quick search and found this:

http://www.usdiplomacy.org/history/service/history_chinahand...

________________________________________
“The pro-Communist group in the State Department… promoted at every opportunity the Communist cause in China.”

Senator Robert A. Taft (R-Ohio), quoted in Dean Acheson's Present at the Creation
_________________________________________

Chiang Kai-shek was, apparently, more dangerous to the most powerful people than "Communism", or what: expendable?

"Didn’t the Japanese invade China in the WW?"

I've repeatedly linked Anthony Sutton's studies of Wall Street financing Germany and Russia to cause World War II, and it is likely, in my view, that similar things were done between Dollar denominated POWER and Japanese POWER, and the story line is very familiar.

Germany was resource poor, or isolated, as was, is, Japan, and therefore weak, vulnerable, or power-less, in the face of Aggressive Invasion by a large powerful criminal military POWER, so German leaders and Japanese leaders gained much currency with the idea of "Preemptive War" (False Front hiding Aggressive War for Profit) as a means of fooling the tax payers to go along with doing what Legal Criminals do best, so you see, a Chess Piece can be a very bad person sent on a very bad mission, while the very bad person may even be fooled himself, or herself, into a false belief that what they are doing is necessary.

To save the children.

Spread Democracy.

Whatever works.

"Anyways, it would make sense to me that populations have been purged, divided by civil war etc and monarchies removed so as to soften or prepare each population to accept a single monopoly currency and world government."

That is reality. It only appears as if one Nation is disconnected from another Nation, so as to create the False Front that covers up the true facts, we are one people, one hegemony, right now it is The Dollar Hegemony, but the victims are UNDERSTANDING the true nature of the game, so it is time for a Reset, to scramble things up, start over, and the False Front will have a new name, but it will be the same thing. A new Top 10 may hold the top most powerful positions, most likely, but the Game remains the same, that is why Wars are necessary, again, were the victims to be IN LIBERTY for too long, too many former victims, then Liberty would take over - fast.

The Legal Crime business, it seems to me, is least Powerful as they spend their POWER (stolen power) to finance Global War, they are least Powerful since they are spending everything they have to make Global War happen, and they are "betting the farm" on Global War happening, and if it does not happen, it is Game Over for them, and they know it.

This is the time to OPT OUT, when Legal Crime is at the weakest point, before the switch to a New Reserve Currency Power. I think, but I can be wrong of course, that the last time Liberty was relatively the most powerful against Legal Crime was just before The Civil War, in the mid 1800s, as the Central Bankers were almost at the end of a rope, a Hangman's noose, because America could have taken off, out of their control, had they not done something very drastic, to Reset their hold on America. From the wider world view The Civil War was a minor Boom and Bust Purchase. Much was going their way in France and England, on schedule, but I think that America was a tough cookie, and here is where I find so much hope: I think China isn't going to go along as planned by the most powerful evil people.

I can be wrong, of course, but my viewpoint is as competitive as anyone's on the planet, and that may be why so few people are willing to challenge me.

This is why I say that you have no idea (nor do I) as to how valuable your contribution in this discussion is, in measurable fact, but we may find out soon.

"So it would make sense to me since, China has seen revolution and purging that it is already under Legal Criminal Monopoly control. Maybe that is why we are “softening” the power holders in Middle East? Maybe they have become aware of what the Criminals are doing and have resisted, so even though Criminals (thru US power) have installed governments Criminals are toppling them and installing new government powers that they will go along with the Criminal scheme."

That is my view.

In the face of so much bad news, it is wrong, very wrong, to "grasp at straws" and settle for false hope, but those words you just typed above, to me, are very reasonable words, good for something.

"We are paying for our demise and a lot of our soldiers and their families are being ruined psychologically."

That is demonstrable, and very well accounted, in such works as the work done by Anthony Sutton, to name just one source, so it is beyond "theory" and it is very near the point at which almost any juror would find the presumed to be innocent people, are guilty, beyond a reasonable doubt, and it is much more than mere Treason, it is The Worst Possible Crimes that can be committed by any human being upon any number of human beings.

"Thank you for helping me to see."

Thank you for helping me to see.

"Although…JTK is not convinced it is his debt…less Power for the Legal Criminals?"

Power flows in many ways, so it is a good idea to stop "providing the means by which we suffer" in every way possible.

Each victim injured injures each other victim each time, there are things in the Bible instructing this understanding - we went through that at some length already in this very long discussion.

"Anyways a lot of people who send their children off to spread democracy do so thinking it is a very patriotic and honorable thing to do…have they been infected?"

Yes, and my use of the word "infected" concerning the voice I have now in my head, the male voice saying "understanding", so often, is welcome, and therefore not an "infection", and my word choice was poor, it was my factious nature behind the word choice, and I should know by now that such Liberties with Language does not compute to the listener, often, so the actual result of the word choice is opposite the intended result - literary blowback?

Joe

Author of Proverbs

For Sunday I thought you might enjoy the finding out how the writer of Proverbs received wisdom. (Solomon is the writer of Proverbs. Solomon is the 2nd son of King David and the woman Bathsheba whose husband David had slain in war. The first son died.) It is a single chapter: http://www.biblestudytools.com/kjv/1-kings/3-audio.html

Solomon also wrote Ecclesiastes which contains the words in the song Turn, Turn, Turn. (Audio if you would like to hear it: http://www.biblestudytools.com/kjv/ecclesiastes/3-audio.html ):

Ecc 3:1 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven: 2 A time to be born , and a time to die ; a time to plant , and a time to pluck up that which is planted ; 3 A time to kill , and a time to heal ; a time to break down , and a time to build up ; 4 A time to weep , and a time to laugh ; a time to mourn , and a time to dance ; 5 A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together ; a time to embrace , and a time to refrain from embracing ; 6 A time to get , and a time to lose ; a time to keep , and a time to cast away ; 7 A time to rend , and a time to sew ; a time to keep silence , and a time to speak ; 8 A time to love , and a time to hate ; a time of war, and a time of peace.

Byrds:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mm4tac864TA&feature=watch_res...
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Alan Watt talks a lot about the Royal Institute of International Affairs Great Britain, and the Council of Foreign Relations as being the power brokers steering world affairs and quotes Carroll Quigley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carroll_Quigley , Tragedy and Hope, alot and says those brokers have 50 year business plans just like companies and corporations have business plans.

http://www.amazon.com/Tragedy-Hope-History-World-Time/dp/094...

I found this information regarding that book in the text on that page:

"Millions of copies of these books came into print, and the conservative movement changed forever.

Copies of Tragedy and Hope began disappearing from library shelves.

A pirate edition was printed.

Quigley came to believe that his publisher Macmillan had suppressed his book.

Dr. Gary North, the esteemed economic commentator and historian has an interesting discussion of these curious facts in the chapter, "Maverick 'Insider' Historians," in his book, Conspiracy: A Biblical View, available on-line."
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I am just throwing this stuff out there, not arguing. Do you think that the information by Carroll Q. is a False Front/Trap? I do not know anything about it.
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I will finish reply later, you do not need to reply to this. I am just putting down a couple of rough thoughts. If I understand you right you are saying that the Carroll Quigley view of history is a false view.

...

The pace is quickening?

Someone in another thread appears to be interested in the discussion we two have been maintaining for some time now. I don't know if the individual will have an interest in the Spiritual angles of view that are absent in my work, the angles of view that you bring to the table, but the interest communicated so far can be found here:

http://www.dailypaul.com/256080/sound-money-reading-list-add...

As to Carroll Quigley, and many other Friends of Legal Crime, their work, their offerings of information, I can place that stuff in the same category as Federal Reserve Notes.

Their kind invents, produces, and maintains STUFF worth much to them, as they want that STUFF to "go forth and multiply".

It is very destructive stuff, it is lies, half truths, misdirections, and it leads everyone, including them, to a torturous life with a horrible end, some of the victims on that path are more comfortable than others, and those who are relatively more comfortable than others on that path my call themselves The Rich and Powerful, or they may call themselves The Authorities, and they may call themselves Fried Chicken if they want, but they are still victims along with everyone else as their poison infects humanity.

That is the stuff likened to cancer.

How true is it? When the bill collectors show up at the door and they demand a pound of flesh, literally, then the full measure of how true that STUFF is, IS.

What is news?

http://www.ushistory.org/paine/commonsense/sense2.htm

"Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer. Government, like dress, is the badge of lost innocence; the palaces of kings are built upon the ruins of the bowers of paradise. For were the impulses of conscience clear, uniform and irresistibly obeyed, man would need no other lawgiver; but that not being the case, he finds it necessary to surrender up a part of his property to furnish means for the protection of the rest; and this he is induced to do by the same prudence which in every other case advises him, out of two evils to choose the least. Wherefore, security being the true design and end of government, it unanswerably follows that whatever form thereof appears most likely to ensure it to us, with the least expense and greatest benefit, is preferable to all others."

Since then, since 1776, it has been proven, demonstrated, and it can serve as a legal president, whereby government can be competitively voluntary, and in that light, with that NEWS, there does not have to be a choice between two evils, there can be a choice to avoid evil all together, since government can be voluntary.

Is that NEWS?

Is that type of NEWS reported in books written by Carol Quigley?

"I will finish reply later, you do not need to reply to this. I am just putting down a couple of rough thoughts. If I understand you right you are saying that the Carroll Quigley view of history is a false view."

Are there errors and omissions?

If so, what appears to be missing, and is the missing information worth anything to anyone?

Joe

Public Consumption

(This is the reply I was working on this morning and when I copied and pasted it in my reply above I got the 403 error. Seems you and I were both working in the same place at the same time. That must also be what happened yesterday, except I hit reply before you? I am sorry Joe, I know I do not ususally update my stuff, but I thought since I said I was not finished yet you would not answer yet. I work in Word so when I get a 403 I still have my words, and when I do not work in word I always highlight my text and ctrl C (copy) before I hit save so if something happens I still have my text ready to paste again. I think it is resident in Notepad that way if I remember right when I do Ctrl C. Anyways, I hate that I ever make you loose words. I hate that I lose your words because I expectantly look forward to reading your words and then to have them lost is my lost, but probably not as painful as yours since it is your effort that is lost.)
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I opened that link with HS. After the last bout with willl, I have thought maybe it better that I not look into your public conversation so that it does not interfere with ours. That willl thing was strange. You know I am always ready to come to your defense in other posts and I could not for the life of me understand what willl did that was so wrong because he did not do it with mean words like on that Rothbard/Menger post, but rather with subtle (invisible to me) Parthian arrow. And I am not as understanding as you are in the subtlety of conversation and dictating words. I also noted how willl asked you for help and then turned on your help. Perhaps that was part of it? I see the new person you are speaking with also asked for help and you cleared the air right away. I do hope it is equitable. One thing which may have alrady been touched upon between you two, is that you have helped me see that competition or parallel currencies is very necessary regardless of what type of currencies is being used. The Fed is using paper and when paper is used by the monopoly it can be printed to fund anything...which is why I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended...like WWIII. I am still trying to iron that out in my mind. How do you keep Criminals from using a plenteous supply to buy what they want even if there are parallel currencies?

Leading me to this question…what do you think about bitcoin?

I sent your link yesterday to from here http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2757031 and noticed you had an up vote last night. Connecting dots as I so like to do, I was hoping that the person voted you up after I directed them to you.
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I noticed you quoted Paine. Something I have been wanting to ask: Didn’t Ben Franklin subsidize Paine? Was he a hired “gun?” Is that why he went to France? Was he a revolutionist writer? Did he get mixed up with the wrong people? Is that why he was kept in jail in France? Someone…Jefferson or Henry, I think maybe Jefferson, started going along with the Constitution because he feared French Revolution coming to the US, or something to that effect. Do you know what I am talking about?
I think Connecting Dots may be a competitive thing to do, however, it can get one into a lot of trouble when dots are missed or unseen or construed to mean something they are not. That is why I appreciate your help. You know a lot about dots and even know where they are hiding. Was Franklin a good guy?
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“That is a trap. Communism is a False Front hiding Legal Criminals, and as soon as Joe McCarthy starts trying Communists (presumed innocent but definitely on trial) the Legal Criminals know better, and so they put on their McCarthyism hats.”

I was meaning that the Legal Criminals use Communism to achieve the ends to their goals. Is that a wrong view?

What does it mean for the Legal Criminals to put on their McCarthyism hats?

“That is another trap. The False Front is this false image that there are the same few people sitting around the same table and they are never discovered so the whole concept of "Conspiracy Theory" is insane, saying the same things, never any result. The truth can be known, and I think that the names of the worst Top 10 people change as to which actual individual person is the most powerful criminal, which has to be someone connected to Legal Power in some manner, so the most powerful criminal is going to be a Legal Criminal, and you had better know, and certainly the most powerful criminal know, that his or her position is not going to be held forever, it will be subject to the second most powerful criminal, and that is the name of the game.”

Alan Watt talks a lot about the Royal Institute of International Affairs Great Britain, and the Council of Foreign Relations as being the power brokers steering world affairs and quotes Carroll Quigley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carroll_Quigley , Tragedy and Hope, alot and says those brokers have 50 year business plans just like companies and corporations have business plans.

Are you saying that the Top 10 do not work together and have a business plan to take over the world, but are rather in constant competition as to who will take over the world?

If that is the case, then perhaps what Alan Watt speaks to is the business plan of one group of the Criminals in the Top 10?

How does the view that the Jesuits are the king pins work into all of this. It is not that I am wanting to know specifics. I am trying to set a frame of understanding to help me place pieces. I suppose to connect dots which I am very fond of doing.

“Do you claim that The Federal Reserve System is morally legitimate use of power and do you claim that anyone intending to report the facts about The Federal Reserve System is someone who is a fool, someone who falsely believes a "Conspiracy Theory"?”

I do not think I claim that at all. I think you have shown me that it is Crime in Progress. So in your mind is the Federal Reserve one of those Top 10 Criminals vying for power? As if the Federals Reserve System is a person, but it is as you have taught me, a thing. So there are Criminals within that system; there are Criminals that use that system’ there are Criminals who benefit from the power stolen by that system’ there are Criminals in charge of that system. Are those Criminals the Jesuits?

“Monopolization works the way it works, and it works on criminals, and it works on victims, so there may be many criminals, Monarchies or whatever name works, and then a deal is made to Incorporate the process of making crime legal, to make a deal, to split up the territory, to make sure that none of the Legal Criminal Competitors go too far in showing how The People can use scarce power in the work required to make power abundant, because that would never do, it can't be allowed, because then the victims could learn by that example, they can voluntarily unite into a Voluntary Union of Former Victims, World Wide, and then Legal Crime would no longer pay very well, as the number of ready victims shrink down to nothing, and the only victims left are the criminals themselves, and they eat each other down to the last two, and then the last one eats the second to last one, and then what, the last Legal Criminal goes to work at McDonalds?
That is how that works, and it is not a "theory", it is how that works.”

To recap for my understanding and repetition so that I might remember: Criminals will in competition with each other also divide, conquer, reorganize, and reset the stage in order to keep the people from understanding how to gain power.

“Why has Switzerland been allowed to go unmolested through 2 World Wars so far? Will Switzerland be excused from World War III? Where will you go on Vacation during World War III, while everyone else if armed to the teeth, ready, willing, able, and currently at each others throats?”

“So if someone looked at travel into Switzerland during the WW’s one could find out who the Top Criminals are?”

“Switzerland? Which money do the most powerful people use to store their personal savings accounts?”

Didn’t a lot of the Jewish people who were trying to save their family money put that money or gold or whatever it was into Swiss Accounts (or safety deposit boxes)? And then those same people ended up in Concentration Camps and then dead? Seems like I remember reading something about that as a teen or young adult. Does that ring any bells for you? I wonder what ever happened to those accounts.

“Which government do the most powerful people use to keep a good vacation spot always available despite these "worst of times" that they buy with their stolen loot?”

Who is in charge of the Swiss Government, and why are they the “chosen land?”

“I do not know much about China, but I know that the answer to that question is that similar (if not the same) money brokers did, in fact, fund the Chinese Communists and you can look into what happened to Chiang Kai-shek.”

We have a friend from Taiwan visiting here along with a Taiwanese National. We were talking about her country and China. Taiwan does not compete in the Olympics because China will not allow them to. That was news to me. I thought the Olympics were open and fair games for all the world to participate in. I guess I already knew better, but I didn’t think a country would keep another country from participating. Anyways, it seems that the Chinese leaders were allowed to escape to Taiwan during the Chinese Communist revolution. That is weird isn’t it? I wonder why they were not killed…some kind of deal made?

“I did a quick search and found this:
http://www.usdiplomacy.org/history/service/history_chinahand...
________________________________________
“The pro-Communist group in the State Department… promoted at every opportunity the Communist cause in China.”
Senator Robert A. Taft (R-Ohio), quoted in Dean Acheson's Present at the Creation
_________________________________________
Chiang Kai-shek was, apparently, more dangerous to the most powerful people than "Communism", or what: expendable?”

So one minute McCarthy is screaming RED and the next minute there were pro-Communists in the State Department. Was McCarthy a friend or a foe? Really, I am very confused about all of this communism stuff.
_________________
“…so you see, a Chess Piece can be a very bad person sent on a very bad mission, while the very bad person may even be fooled himself, or herself, into a false belief that what they are doing is necessary.”

Like Gaddafi? Was he a bad person? Did he do bad things to the people in Libya in addition to bringing some equity? It seems to me when I watched that video that he was spreading the wealth of the land among the people of the land. But maybe it was only for certain ones? Was he a religious sectarian killing one group of Muslims while empowering his own group? Seems to me that could serve someone’s purposes in addition to his own…connecting dots, again.
“That is reality. It only appears as if one Nation is disconnected from another Nation, so as to create the False Front that covers up the true facts, we are one people, one hegemony, right now it is The Dollar Hegemony, but the victims are UNDERSTANDING the true nature of the game, so it is time for a Reset, to scramble things up, start over, and the False Front will have a new name, but it will be the same thing. A new Top 10 may hold the top most powerful positions, most likely, but the Game remains the same, that is why Wars are necessary, again, were the victims to be IN LIBERTY for too long, too many former victims, then Liberty would take over - fast.”

Now, that makes sense of a Revelation passage from the Bible where it says no man will be able to buy are sell if they do not have the mark of the beast. Maybe the final reset will require a pledge and a chip so as to remove the people’s (as well as vying criminals) ability to do anything even if they do understand the plan of the Criminals. It is very strange for me to see the world as all connected. Do you mean we are connected from the Legal Criminals point of view? Do all nations seem themselves as connected? Seems like in that Alan Watt talk he spoke about how countries are labeled by the Royal Institute as according to their vulnerability to subversion.

“…I think China isn't going to go along as planned by the most powerful evil people.”

Me: "So it would make sense to me since, China has seen revolution and purging that it is already under Legal Criminal Monopoly control. Maybe that is why we are “softening” the power holders in Middle East? Maybe they have become aware of what the Criminals are doing and have resisted, so even though Criminals (thru US power) have installed governments Criminals are toppling them and installing new government powers that they will go along with the Criminal scheme."
You: “That is my view.”

So is China one of the Top 10 and the leaders there are trying to assume Top Role so as not to be dominated by whoever is at the top of the banana pile right now? Do leaders of nations become powerful and then do not want to submit to further control by the higher powers? If so, say there is this “business plan:” Part of the plan has to deal with continual vying for top position. Are you saying the “people” of China are not going to put up with the new dollar hegemony or are you saying the “leaders” of China are not going to put up with it?
_______________
“The most powerful people use the most powerful tools to accomplish their goals, and the counterfeit things are "For Public Consumption".

I want to know, do you think what Alan Watt talks about is “for Public Consumption?”

Alan Watt talks a lot about the Royal Institute of International Affairs Great Britain, and the Council of Foreign Relations as being the power brokers steering world affairs (or maybe think tanks for power brokers) and quotes Carroll Quigley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carroll_Quigley , Tragedy and Hope, alot and says those brokers have 50 year business plans just like companies and corporations have business plans.
http://www.amazon.com/Tragedy-Hope-History-World-Time/dp/094...
I found this information regarding that book in the text on that page:
"Millions of copies of these books came into print, and the conservative movement changed forever.

Copies of Tragedy and Hope began disappearing from library shelves.
A pirate edition was printed.
Quigley came to believe that his publisher Macmillan had suppressed his book.
Dr. Gary North, the esteemed economic commentator and historian has an interesting discussion of these curious facts in the chapter, "Maverick 'Insider' Historians," in his book, Conspiracy: A Biblical View, available on-line."
___________________
I am just throwing this stuff out there, not arguing. Do you think that the information by Carroll Q. is a False Front/Trap/Public Consumption? I do not know anything about it.
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You mentioned Sutton a couple of times. I am connecting dots…are you saying that I should try to read Sutton so as to get an understanding of how all this works? I think that is what you told me to read the first time I asked you about taking Liberty Classroom. I remember you talking about reading (I can’t remember the guy but he had the name Lucifer in a lot of his book titles) one of his books online and you did not like reading an electronic copy. I think I feel the same way about reading on line. It is tedious and then it is also hard to bookmark my place in between readings…but that is the very first thing you directed me to read, and I have failed to do it.
_____________
“literary blowback?”

Literary blowback, interesting term. I just wanted to make sure I understood where you were coming from since it was not definitely understood from the context. You can use the word infect if you want. While it has a negative connotation, I think an infection is also something that kind of takes over or fights against what is resident so I can see perhaps that idea being contextual. Like in Romans 12:2 Be not conformed to this world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind. Infect = renewing transformation? Probably I would think of Scripture more as an antibiotic.

...

New Reply

"The Fed is using paper and when paper is used by the monopoly it can be printed to fund anything...which is why I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended...like WWIII. I am still trying to iron that out in my mind. How do you keep Criminals from using a plenteous supply to buy what they want even if there are parallel currencies?"

That is another area of complexity that is covering up the crimes as if anyone other than the criminals have an INTEREST in making UNDERSTANDING scarce.

Again the POWER Struggle viewpoint becomes PRINCIPLE to UNDERSTANDING.

As I see it the question concerning the scale between too scarce and too abundant is halfway covered in Equitable Commerce as Warren lays out the definition of The Problem known as the supply meeting the demand for things.

If the supply does not meet the demand then The Problem can be called scarcity.

Who says scarcity is a problem?

Josiah Warren spends no time claiming that anyone is in the wrong, more so the effort by Warren is to be neutral about Right and Wrong PEOPLE and be more concerned with accurate UNDERSTANDING of the problem and then offering a working solution worked out in actual reality - not "Theory".

To get the supply to meet the demand therefore assumes that that is what everyone wants, which is false, so the Equitable Commerce Solution to the Problem only works for people who want the supply to meet the demand, and Equitable Commerce is anathema for people who prefer that there are plenty of beggars (willing to do anything) for a small portion of the supply of needful (or desired) things.

"I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended..."

Again there is a failure to recognize the fact that some people consider scarcity to be necessary to make people beg for mercy - so to speak. How twisted can a mind become if a mind is led to believe that everyone wants the same things, such as justice, love, equity, and how much more twisted can a mind become when those who thrive on injustice, hate, and iniquity, are making and enforcing the rules that the beggars are paying everything they earn to make things right?

While the authorities are making things RIGHT for them, the victims are paying more and more to make things RIGHT for them.

What is Right?

Might?

How confused can it get when an assumption is made that everyone wants the same RIGHT?

"I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended"

In other words the idea is to make POWER scarce for criminals?

So, naturally, the solution is to hand over all the POWER in the world to the criminals so that the criminals can do the right thing with all that POWER?

Who is being fooled?

Who is doing the fooling?

Everyone is a fool, including the very few people who somehow manage to have more power than almost everyone else combined?

Your thinking does not work out without your thinking requiring an assumption concerning who is wanting what when they report their reports on why they are doing things.

"I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended"

Cut off MY nose to spite MY face? I want to suffer without needful things so as to make needful things scarce for the criminals?

No, that does not work out. That is like saying that there is an Overpopulation Problem and my solution is to kill all the useless people while, as it just so happens, I have 12 kids, or more, some I don't even know about, at all, I have no idea that I actually have 24 kids, no idea at all.

The Parasite City explanation by W.B. Greene can be ignored, if you wish to ignore it, but if you prefer to understand it, then how can you not see the fact that INTEREST is one thing when there is a Legal Monopoly Money Fraud POWER, and INTEREST is another thing when there is more than ONE way around the Legal Money Monopoly Fraud POWER, so that the Abundant Supply of Victims are made Scarce as more Former Victims Opt Out of the Legal Money Monopoly Fraud POWER?

Interest in a Legal Money Monopoly Fraud Power is ONE thing, and the INTEREST flows in measurable ways, such as the creation of a Parasite City in that case, so long as there are an abundant supply of ready victims.

Make victims scarce, by understanding ways to opt out, and what happens to the Parasite Cities?

Total Economic Collapse?

No.

What happens is interesting since interest is no longer an exclusive POWER commanded by the few over the many.

"I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended"

How about another change of your sentence to make my point more obvious, if possible?

Your sentence:

"I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended"

A competitive improvement suggestion:

I think maybe some people say money should be unlaunderable so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended.

So...naturally, if someone like Warren or Spooner (to name just 2) suggest the use of accurate (unlaunderable) money there is an army of intellectuals, paid well, to shoot those messengers before the message becomes abundant?

You can always fall back on the Power Law or Joe's Law in any of these cases of thinking concerning Political Economy Problems. If Understanding is made scarce, who understands the reasoning for making understanding scarce, and who doesn't understand the POWER of making understanding scarce?

Making Productive POWER scarce isn't the same thing as making Destructive POWER scarce but only if UNDERSTANDING POWER is not made scarce.

In other words: If you fail to understand the difference between a criminal and a victim then you may think that Destroying the POWER that enables a criminal to connect to a victim is WRONG.

Is is a Destructive and WRONG use of POWER to create several competitive Legal Monies, and is WRONG use of POWER to create several competitive Legal Governments, BECAUSE doing so will DESTROY the ONE LEGAL MONOPOLY MONEY POWER?

No, but if you are led to believe in falsehoods then you may abhor the idea of LIBERTY because you are made to think that it is wrong to invent, produce, and maintain competitive choices SINCE doing so injures criminals who make a living from deceit UPON the innocent, terrifying threats of violence UPON the innocent, and horrible violence UPON the innocent.

Poor, poor, poor, criminals, will suffer so much, if we take away their destructive power by avoiding them altogether?

Do you see how up-side-down that thinking is, how Productive Power is made into Destructive Power because Understanding is made so scarce?

Who makes understanding scarce?

Everyone?

Everyone is demanding stupidity so much that there is a, like magic, a sudden, and God like, steady supply of stupidity raining down from above?

No.

Deception is necessary for violent people to be "all they can be" if they choose a life of crime.

"I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended"

Really?

I think that many people have bought into the notion that the Legal Money Monopoly offers a piece of the action for people who will invest in the Legal Money Monopoly, to "join' em" because you can't "beat' em", and every month you too can get a check in the mail, something for nothing, and if you are really good at playing the game you too can become Independently Wealthy following a few simple rules, so that your Central Bank account gains enough Zeros in it, so that Money makes Money, for you too, and all you have to do at that point is to watch the Money in your Account grow all by itself, so get to work, work harder, and harder, and watch your progress toward Financial Independence as you too become Independently Wealthy.

What is the number of dollars now, required, to be Independently Wealthy TOO?

You join the club too, so you work, and work, and work, and save, and save, and save, and your Federal Reserve Sanctioned Bank Account reaches the magic number, and now you can retire comfortably, and your flow if INTEREST covers all your costs, all your electricity, all your food, all your transportation fuel costs, all your shelter costs, all your clothing costs, all your education costs, all your insurance costs, all your medical costs, all your legal costs, all your maintenance costs, all your cleaning costs, all your security costs, all costs, all covered by your personal, individual, independent, INTEREST payments, TOO.

You too can play the Monopoly Game.

What is the number now?

How many dollars are required in your saving account now so that you too can be Independently Wealthy, and you too can continue to live in the manner to which you have grown accustomed during your working life, only now you don't have to do anything productive for EVER?

What is the number?

How many zeros are needed?

If counterfeiting, or inflation, or Quantitative Easing, is 10% and your Interest rate is .3%, then how many zeros do you need?

if counterfeiting, or inflation, or Quantitative Easing, is NEGATIVE (taking money out of circulation), and your Interest rate is 20%, then how many zeros do you need to be Independently Wealthy?

You know math well enough, you don't need to hire an accountant, you don't need to hire a lawyer, you don't need to hire a well dressed high paid Liar, you don't need a Central Banker, you need to know if you are reaching your goal or moving away from your goal in the Game of Monopoly, so what is the magic number TODAY?

How many zeros do you need TODAY to be IN THE CLUB TODAY?

13 zeros?

6 zeros?

Is this too taxing?

So now there is a wild scramble to hide money from the tax man, moving capital, flying capital, capital flight, flying to SOUNDER investments, because being in The Club isn't so much fun anymore?

Welcome to Bust, but don't fret much, Halliburton Stock is going up, and wonderful, profitable, Independently Wealthy WAR is soon at a Theater Near You?

Really?

Really?

"I think maybe some people say money should be scarce so that it cannot be used to buy anything criminally intended"

Why do I get down votes?

Why is attacking the messenger almost as easy to do as breathing?

Is everyone as bad as everyone else?

No.

How many people are, what is the term, you will recognize the term when I offer it to you, how many people are now Upside Down on their "Real Estate" investments?

Obviously, measurably, they are not In-The-Club.

They worked, and worked, and worked, and they get their reward for failing to understand the Name of the Game.

What name?

Dare anyone even mention the name, or will mentioning the Name of the Game be libelous?

Legal Crime.

Go ahead, get on the ballot, tell people, see what happens. I dare you.

Many people listen, there are many people who stop and think, and then they get back to paying off their debts.

Really?

"I am still trying to iron that out in my mind. How do you keep Criminals from using a plenteous supply to buy what they want even if there are parallel currencies?"

Un-launderable money has a certain quality to it, and it costs less to who?

If money were as powerful as electricity, for example, could it be counterfeited, could it be laundered, could it be used to shock people into submission in ways that are untraceable and therefore the attacker of the innocent is unaccountable?

"Leading me to this question…what do you think about bitcoin?"

I was once given a homework assignment that I have not yet done, and I'm running out of time, and energy, where I have a guitar as homework now too, so I may not get to the assignment dealing with the age of Wild Cat Banking.

Competition in Banking isn't competition if the products sold are lower in quality and higher in cost compared to the other products available, but, and here is the vital point, when Fraud money is the Standard of excellence, how easy can it be to produce something of higher quality and lower cost?

If there was a demand for knowledge and understanding, for example, and instead all there was in The Free Market of choices nothing but falsehood and misdirection, how smart would someone have to be to tell a few words of truth, and in essence Free the Slaves?

I don't have to have a 30 year degree in Political Economics paid for by my Independently Wealthy Fund of Interest, costing hundreds of thousands of Units of Federal Reserve Notes, collected by the Harvard University Accountants, to Smell a Rat, and then write a few words concerning the smell of those rats.

Bitcoin is a Wildcat Banking experiment, a Black Market product, it is lie Pay Pal, Amazon, E-Bay, and it is only tolerated because there is a War going on, and soon all that will be wiped off the face of the Earth, and the "volunteers" will be begging for mercy at the gates of Asia, where the new World Reserve Currency POWER will be located, for awhile, until the need arises to hit the reset button again, in a century or so.

BREAK

"I noticed you quoted Paine. Something I have been wanting to ask: Didn’t Ben Franklin subsidize Paine?"

Check this out:

http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2921030?uid=3739560&ui...

Subsidy by Legal Criminals is one thing.

Subsidy by Non-Legal Criminals is the opposite thing.

I heard about Benjamin Franklin having a hand in writing Constitutions, he may have even published a competitive version of THE CONSTITUTION, and it was rejected, for what?

If I could study The Articles of Confederation, The Constitution, and Ben Franklin's Constitution, side by side, to see which one affords the Legal Criminals the POWER to make taxes Involuntary, then I can see which author (or authorities) were more or less on the side of Liberty or more or less on the side of Despotism (Legal Crime).

"I think maybe Jefferson, started going along with the Constitution because he feared French Revolution coming to the US, or something to that effect. Do you know what I am talking about?"

It was curious to me to find out that neither Paine nor Jefferson were present during the Philadelphia Usurpation, that Dirty Compromise, that Con-Con, which brings to light a question or two concerning whose side who was on in those days.

"Was Franklin a good guy?"

Franklin had an interest in electricity, shared by Paine? Is that interesting, and can it help answer the loyalty question concerning Franklin?

"What does it mean for the Legal Criminals to put on their McCarthyism hats?"

Remember the idea of setting out to drain the swamp and then finding yourself surrounded by crocodiles instead?

When the outcome of a supposed crusade to move toward some measurable good is the punishment of a whole lot of innocent people, then it may be a false crusade to move toward some measurable good, or it may be that the original intent was subjugated, corrupted, and turned against good people, instead of helping good people.

Legal Criminals are not as dumb as many people are led to believe.

They have ways of doing things that are unbecoming a Friend of Liberty?

Beware of Greeks bearing gifts?

McCarthy could have been a Trojan Horse of some kind, as the Authorities in America at the time had way too close ties with the Bolsheviks they helped finance into World War II, and those Authorities in American at the time were Nazi's or had way too close of ties with Nazis that they financed to cause World War II, and so they knew enough to produced a Red Herring to diffuse any potential Whistle Blowing of those very close ties between American Authorities (National Level) and Communists, and Nazis?

McCarthy could have been an Average Joe blowing the whistle, grabbing the Bull by the Horns, and then his POWER was replaced with counterfeit versions wearing McCarthy-ISM hats.

I don't know, I have not studied those events closely, but The John Birch Society probably has, collectively, studied those events, in great detail.

"Are you saying that the Top 10 do not work together and have a business plan to take over the world, but are rather in constant competition as to who will take over the world?"

What is the name of the game?

How absurd is it to think that the most powerful people "rise" to the bottom of that dung heap, burrowing under everyone else, with lies, threats of violence, and horrible violence, to come to a point where their number is honorable?

Honor among thieves?

That to me is a Patented Absurdity.

We mere moral human beings, chained down with our working conscience, can't even exist in their world, we perish, our souls evaporate, if we get too close to any one of their number, and you know this, and I know this, so how can we pretend to know what it might be like among them?

We can't, but I'm not buying the Honor among Thieves Theory, and if I don't buy that Patented Absurdity, and if I can stand to stand in their shoes, for a slight moment, then what do I see?

I see knives stabbing from every direction, and I see so many lies that it would take an exceptional individual, a genius, of some incredible brain power, to know fact from fiction, and then I start to understand some things.

How does one Legal Criminal tell Friend from Foe?

Can you stand in their shoes, figuratively, long enough to figure out the least bit of understanding?

Who is the best liar?

Who is the best at threatening the most people?

Who is the best at torturing and murdering the most people?

That is an asset, if not a friend: exactly?

What is The School of The Americas?

http://www.geocities.com/~virtualtruth/soa.htm

Can a Friend of Liberty remain a Friend of Liberty if a Friend of Liberty remains too close to The School of The Americas and other manifestations of Evil done by very Evil People - on our dimes and nickles?

Can anyone of those evil people, in National Level Public Office, be hauled up before a jury, presumed to be innocent, but accuse of any crime, and then be processed by the same process that is supposedly due everyone else in America?

How deep do the falsehoods go?

Do we really want to know, or is there a way to opt out instead?

1.
End the FED (easy as waking up having the revolution completed in our sleep)
2.
End the IRS (stop paying and start acquitting each other if Legal Criminals dare to punish us for doing the least taxing thing)
3.
Bring the Troops Home (at least, the very least, stop sending our sons and daughters into those criminal meat grinders called Aggressive Wars for Profit)

How hard can that be for Friends of Liberty?

What is missing?

Not enough people joining the club because "we" can't beat em?

What is the price of Gold these days?

How do I launder my loot better?

"If that is the case, then perhaps what Alan Watt speaks to is the business plan of one group of the Criminals in the Top 10?"

When we wake up after the revolution that occurs over night (the missing element is understanding) and there is a drive to identify (which may be punishment enough) the worst of the worst, would such a Trial by such a Jury be a hot NEWS item broadcast on The Internet, fighting for attention against competitors such as The Bachelor, The Big Brother, and The Survivor National Television Shows?

America's Most Wanted Heavy (not light)?

The genuine article instead of the counterfeit versions?

"How does the view that the Jesuits are the king pins work into all of this. It is not that I am wanting to know specifics. I am trying to set a frame of understanding to help me place pieces. I suppose to connect dots which I am very fond of doing."

So you would make a good juror, if you could restrain your desire for punishment, I suppose, but the POWER, not matter who actually commands it, is only POWERFUL in deceit, again, we can wake up with the revolution over, IN LIBERTY.

We provide the means by which we suffer, so stop providing the means by which we suffer, and we no longer suffer that way, but if we resort to violence, to murder those who formerly had POWER over us, does that help us or harm us?

I don't know, but I see a need to be careful with my soul, not to let it be damaged by my own careless thoughts and actions.

It is a far different thing, in my mind, to be forced by a criminal into a situation where I have only one option left, to kill or be killed, (that is Might makes Right, but that is the criminals game brought to a theater near me by the criminal, and by my lack of knowing how to avoid the situation), to be forced by the criminal for me to kill him, or her, or be killed by him, or her, is far and away different, even opposite, me planning on and then following through with the plan to kill someone else, someone innocent, or someone guilty of anything.

I don't know that it is wrong, and I'm not on a Jury of any kind, and I don't have, and I don't want, the exclusive POWER to premeditatively kill someone guilty of anything, but I can see the possibility, of being among 11 other people, where an idea is plopped onto the table, and the idea is that the guilty person in question, a torturing mass murderer responsible for more horrible deaths than any Natural Disaster, and accounted for more horrible deaths than the worst wild animal, tiger, elephant, locust, and even more destructive than the worst Black Plague, and then some thinking along the lines of remedy, security, and protection against allowing such a destructive thing to exist long enough to kill one more innocent person. I don't know. If it wasn't against the law (Legal Crime) to defend Liberty, then how can such a person manage to survive long enough to perpetrate so much torture and so much murder?

If it is no longer against the law (Legal Crime) to defend ourselves, then criminals are no longer Free, subsidized, and paid so well for torture and murder, and perhaps their fate is to die much sooner when they face armed people instead of having an abundant supply of ready, willing, and able victims?

So...it may be sufficient to merely identify and broadcast the facts concerning those most evil ones among us, and in so doing, their POWER over the victims evaporates, and instead those former Legal Criminals are going to either earn their living equitably or they are going to depend upon charity, or they may just starve to death for lack of care by anyone else.

"I do not think I claim that at all. I think you have shown me that it is Crime in Progress. So in your mind is the Federal Reserve one of those Top 10 Criminals vying for power? As if the Federals Reserve System is a person, but it is as you have taught me, a thing. So there are Criminals within that system; there are Criminals that use that system’ there are Criminals who benefit from the power stolen by that system’ there are Criminals in charge of that system. Are those Criminals the Jesuits?"

Again, putting down the hat worn by the Friend of Liberty, and taking up the job, with the right hat on, where the goal is no longer to remain a Friend IN Liberty, and now we are backed into a corner, faced with Might making Right, in the form of an obvious crime in progress, and we are looking for people who are presumed to be innocent, and these presumed to be innocent people have red hands, soaked with blood, as they were caught standing over a pile of dead people, and they have veins and brain matter drooling out of their mouths, and we proceed to process them with a process that is due everyone without exception, and so what is good enough for you, and what is good enough for the rest of the 11 jurors, as you employ this POWER of Defense, in this ONE case, with this ONE person, the ONE person presumed to be innocent, and you must get, morally, past reasonable doubt, and then you, YOU, as an individual, must gain, the POWER of understanding, sufficient to remedy this Might making Right problem before you, and do you decide to become that which you supposedly abhor, or do you do the Right thing according to instructions offered to you from God, as best you know at that point in time?

Why beat around the bush?

If you have a vital question, then why dig holes just to fill the holes back in, why not try the case, deal with it effectively, and then move on, if forced to do so, because a Criminal insists upon being a criminal, despite the fact that crime does not pay, when the victims refuse to provide the means by which we suffer?

Try the case, any case, but can we be serious about it?

Does it matter if the criminal uses the word Jesuit to cover up the crime, or if the criminal uses the word President to cover up the crime?

Does the criminal with the word Jesuit covering up the crime rate higher on the Top 10 scale to an American, or does the word President, or Federal Reserve Chairman, rate higher on the Top 10 scale of an American?

To an American is there a better list than this:

1.
End the FED
2.
End the IRS
3.
Bring the Troops Home

Is this better to an American:

1.
End the FED
2.
End the IRS
3.
Send Troops to get the presumed to be innocent Jesuits processed by due process in America

Does that make sense?

BREAK

"To recap for my understanding and repetition so that I might remember: Criminals will in competition with each other also divide, conquer, reorganize, and reset the stage in order to keep the people from understanding how to gain power."

Yes, demonstrable fact, and Joe's Law helps boil this down into a sound bite, much like John Boyd can boil Military Power down into a simple formula OODA, or John Boyd can boil Aerodynamics down into a formula Ps = V(T/W - D/W), or Einstein can boil down Physics to E = MC^2 (squared).

If power is allowed to become abundant it will become abundant to everyone, and therefore which group could have power over another group?

It is not possible.

Legal Crime depends upon the fact that power is used to destroy power, to render individual people powerless and therefore produce victims.

Look at the 10 Planks of Communism, look even before Communism, find in each case where power is employed to destroy the power supply, to cut off the flow of power, so as to make one group relatively more powerful than the targeted group.

The power of understanding, for example, is destroy by forcing people to attend subsidized indoctrination centers falsely called "schools", so that understanding can no longer flow from one person to another person.

The effect is not immediate, it takes a lot of time, and it is not Black and White, it is Grey because much of the information (power) can still travel from person to person despite the road blocks called "schools" and there are many examples of how that works.

I found a book in the High School Library titled The Lusitania, and my life changed from Abject Believe in Falsehood because of the understanding published in that book, so I was no longer going to become a complete idiot begging for mercy and volunteering to send as much of my earnings, and my children, to the criminals so that the criminals can harm me more, I would be Grey from that point on, not completely white, not completely understanding, but certainly no longer my worst enemy, no longer caught in the closed loop, no longer begging for mercy and no longer ready willing and able to lick the boots of my masters, providing the means by which we suffer without question.

"I wonder what ever happened to those accounts."

These thoughts to me fall into the same category of Accurate Accounting such as Comprehensive Annual Financial Reports. Someone does know the accurate answer, because genuine financial accounting is precise down to the penny and exactly recording who owns what without any doubt, since there will be a claim made by someone, if someone is still alive to make the claim, and if the account is counterfeit, such as The Budget, then any number desired by the frauds will do, so as to misdirect whomever is attempting to make a claim on any Surplus Wealth stored anywhere.

Someone knows without question, because that is how financial accounting is done. The point I made had to do with this obvious fact that there are at least 2 sets of books, 2 sets of monies, and 2 sets of governments.

1. Genuine (accurate)
2. Counterfeit (deceptive)

Which ones do you think the Criminals use for their own consumption, and which one's do you think the Criminals use "for public consumption"?

If there is honor among thieves, seriously, it has to be accurate, and who better to trust in keeping accurate books, than criminals who have spent their whole lives trusting that everyone else is potentially a victim or another criminal?

If Legal Criminals have a code of honor, of some kind, it may be a good idea to find out what it is, and use it against them, which may be a due process of law, where we can use the workable parts, and throw out the parts that are used to deceive the innocent, threaten the innocent, and harm the innocent.

The common ground between Honor among Thieves and Good Faith and Credit of Friends of Liberty IN Equitable Liberty may be a Democratic Federated Republic with Trial by Jury based upon sortion, and competitive State Governments, or Cantons (Swiss?), whereby there is a competitive balance of Defensive Power always in competition with those who insist upon volunteering themselves to be above everyone else, as criminals choose crime as a means of earning a living.

In other words: If crime pays well, without ready innocent victims who can vote with their feet, then let criminals make victims of each other to their black hearts content, as their despotism may exist wherever the victims run away from, and the criminals stay, which is a far cry from Runaway Slave Laws eagerly enforced by each of the Slaves.

BREAK (AFK for some time)

Joe