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Has Porniah Been Used To Destroy Liberty In America? Is Pornography The Road to


Has Porniah Been Used To Destroy Liberty In America?
Has the Porn Industry set Liberty back with the help of the...

"WARNING This article contains information targeting married couples and mature teenagers. You should read it first and then decide if you want your children to read it. Be prepared to answer their questions................"

READ THE REST HERE: http://libertychatter.com/is-pornography-the-road-to-hell-ha...

Many comments have been made by people who have obviously[as is plainly evident] not read the article. It is not about "Banning" anyhting.. or makeing any "Laws" agianst anything... It is an apeal to reason.

Think about it. The sky is blue people! The sky is blue!

:-) lol

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Porno does NOT mean evil in Greek

15 seconds of etymology fact-checking proves it.

And that is a lovely mythology story. I like the one about Zeus sleeping with his sisters and ruining his narriage with Hera with his sin. In Greek Zeus means "the father of Gods and men."I Why would they call Zeus the Supreme leader if it easn't true?!

Guess my Greek dictionary is wrong

nor does something like connotation exist in language Mark. My father speaks Greek. He hung out with NATO forces while he worked for NATO.

Like I said, what do I know? It isn't like also I have to learn Greek for Seminary, that and Hebrew for my 'useless' Masters in Divinity.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

If you have Masters in Div. why are you defending this trash?

This fire and brimstone anti-intellectual fear-mongering fundamentalism does not deserve your defense. I am no expert in theology, but I did have my share of it during my 4 years at Saint Thomas Aquinas High School.

I certainly do not recall learning about Aquinas' 5 proofs of why Satan exists. We were not exposed to Young Earth Creationism propaganda. I dont't even think I was ever threatened with "hell."

I would hope that you could distinguish my attack on this blind religious fear mongering from real philosophical and religious debate. Of all of the religions I have the most respect for the Catholic Church because they do not take the Bible literally. To deny the flagrant contradictions in the Bible and the absurdiity of many of the passages (like the entire Genesis) is a blind denial of reality. One would have to be insane to truly believe and defend the original article.

You may want to rethink your

You may want to rethink your position on that Catholic Church. The individual actions and beliefs of parishioners aside, the Church takes a very strong stance on the side of Biblical literalism. Then again, you also seem to assume that all Biblical literalists are Young Earthers, so perhaps I've fallen victim to a semantic misunderstanding in that respect. Either way, you have at least one misconception about acceptance of Scripture to clear up.

Regarding the Greek πόρνη (porne), there are two definitions. In both ancient and contemporary Greek, the term means "female prostitute." However, the contemporary term has also gained the meaning of "a disgraceful standing or designation," which is roughly equivalent to the more concrete concept of evil (i.e. it can be attributed to a specific object or action). The Greek for the more abstract concept is κακό (kako).

I do not agree with this article 100%

however, I defend the right for there to be debate without shouting/down voting the person down. I mean we all talk about how morality must be a personal thing enforced through advocacy. This person is being brave for advocating this position.

I am a 'young Earth creationist'. This has to be for numerous reasons. Huge leaps of faith (religion) are required to believe in the Big Bang (now rebranded as inflationary Universe Theories). The Big Bang was the only explosion in the universe's history where greater order arose from great disorder or another leap of faith is how matter arose from this explosion when previously nothing existed. Like you said, if you cannot replicate an experiment, then it can't happen. I, of course, have supernatural revelation that tells me the process of how it happened.

Also, humanity usurped its position in the natural world. We have no natural rights if humanity is just another animal competing with other animals. All humans are statists for destroying animals or any life via competition. All that humans are is just a giant monopoly of immoral force, enforcing our dictatorship upon the Earth because humanity is lowered to the level of an animal. In my opinion, you should be glad for the statists if you take this position. They are the true cream of the crop. We should kiss their rings, give them our property, and love our masters. Of course, Christianity's message of the meek inheriting the Earth and humanity's special place in God's creation counter this message.

Rejecting God as creator ultimately means rejecting Christ as Savior. I reject this notion.

Those are a few short comings of the philosophy of modern secularism.

I am also Lutheran. I am currently trying to obtain my Master's of Divinity. A process that is not quite easy to do.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

It's not so simple.... It has

It's not so simple.... It has to do with morals... the base of the human... Imagine if you will what doctor Paul would have to say about porn.... Do you think the Doc would be proud to have his grand daughter in the industry? This is not about restricting it.... It is much deeper...

I know exactly what Ron Paul would say.

He would say that everyone needed to mind their own business and what you do in your own home is your own business because your home is your castle and you should feel safe in your castle.

If you know exactly what he

If you know exactly what he would say about porn what would he say? Above you made no mention of porn... So what would the doc say he thinks of porn? Do you think he would advise you to have your kids enter into the industry? Just exactly what would he say? all ears..


people have moral standards and advocate them. If you feel guilty reading this, you have condemned yourself.

We in the liberty movement should just silence and censor any talk on any form of advocating any morality. Hedonism ftw!!!! YEAH!!!! Reminds me of a song that I usually associate Amerika by. Oh yeah this one.




That is America in a nutshell.

Edit: I like the image used at the end of the vid. Ethics and integrity... obviously those are jokes in America, hedonism is the only way to go.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

It's a bit like gay marriage

It's a bit like gay marriage - if you don't approve, don't marry a gay person. If porn offends you, switch it off or find something a bit classier.

Online Pornography Helping Lower Rape Incidents, Study Says


Excuse me while I go masturbate to some of it.

Lets use some reductio ad absurdum

Obviously if this study is true (I doubt it is), then you should argue for the legalization of Child Pornography. Also, moral judgements based on what people fap too is bad as well (according to the hedonists). Hey, it would keep the incidence of child rape down if this study is accurate. I mean most prostitutes begin their lives as such when they are 12~14, so why not? No harm (as you may define it) comes to the child. (I of course believe harm comes to the child the same way harm comes when looking at 'regular' pornography. Harm occurs). I doubt you would consider this a violation of the NAP.

It isn't like moral decadence is a sign of a fall so, go fap away. The Eldar would be proud.


Of course, people can chose their moral leaders, and who their moral enforcers are. I dare not let the government be the morality police. I want there to be competition because I just have a tiny hunch that a Lutheran/traditional Christian point of view will win. It has before.

OH I found a song for you. I am sure you would like a couple of the **** yeahs! (I of course take this song to be a parody on how ridiculous 'the great America' is)


May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Happy to know that is the

Happy to know that is the best you can do... would hate to have you procreating

"Is pornography the road to hell?"

LOL! Let me clear a few things up for you chastity belt enslaving bible thumpers...

There is no such thing as hell. The concept of hell was created by religious and political hustlers to scare feeble minds into obeying their authority. The devil is a figment of the imagination. There is no physical evidence of the existence of a devil and there never will be. There is no sane reason to even suspect its existence, only childish gullibility about the supernatural and lack of mature intuition of reality.

You know what breaks up families more than anything else in the world? INTOLERANT RELIGIOUS FANATICISM. I have met many people who are estranged from family members because of their fanatic religious beliefs (far more than any pornography addiction).

But we can't talk about this epidemic though because speaking honestly about illogical religious superstitions is too offensive! Sex (in all its forms) is literally the most natural human behavior (along with sleeping eating). Suppression of sexual activity and thoughts is barbaric and unnatural.

This article is disgusting.

Man that Jesus Christ

had tons of authority on Earth. He was just in control of those masses. Also, the Temple authorities loved him because he got all those dupes to give them all the money. They loved him so much that promoted him to chief rabbi. By scaring people into believing in Hell, Jesus lived a long life on the backs of the poor.


Jesus Christ was rejected by the Temple authorities precisely because he called them hypocrites and that they were going to Hell for being falsely pious. He called people to be perfect like His Heavenly Father by loving your enemies and blessing them. Man, that Jesus Christ was some lunatic intolerant religious fanantic that he even died on the Cross for He so loved the world.

Also, Jesus was homeless, not even having a bed to rest in. Man, that is my hero, a homeless hobo. I am sure your heroes are much better and richer than Him.

Mark, do not insult my faith or my intelligence. And of course, haters gonna hate.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

If you support the messages and accusations in this article

than I am not sorry for insulting your faith or intelligence. I am suspicious that you just read my comment without reading the article, as you are normally reasonable. Do you endorse the following paragraph?

"If you isolate yourself in a room and indulge in pornography, you are not sick; you are evil. You are having intercourse with a computer, or with the pages of a publication. In effect you are having an erotic experience with the editor—probably another man."

What if I secretly look at the naked image of my wife in a mirror? Am I having intercourse with the mirror? What if my wife draws me a naked picture of another woman? Am I a sick pervert for looking at that pornography?

This is bat-shit insane. I hope you would not drag Jesus' name into this.

I endorse people's right to speak

even if I do not agree with it. I do not agree with all of what this article says no. Humans are fallen creatures. We need God's grace. If your repentance is sincere, then you are forgiven. That is how I would advocate the move away from Pornography. Do you even know what the Greek word 'Porno' means. Porno means evil, literally. Then again, what do I know.

I drag Jesus' name into this because He mentions Hell, and obviously, he was not some super rich dude yucking it up on the backs of the poor. In fact, Jesus condemned such actions from ever taking place (which is why I do not like most mega-churches and glory/decision theology). You are the one who called into question the motives of people who talk about Hell.

I am merely defending this person's right to post without having all the hedonists in a tizzy, even if I do not agree with some of the arguments/rhetoric.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Article must have hit close to home

"whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her has committed adultery with her already in his heart." Matt. 5:28
"I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes." Psalm 101:3

It's likely that multiple contradictions to those passages

can be found in the Bible.


I don't take the Bible seriousness enough for it to have any influence whatsoever on my opinions. Why would I be intimidated by Biblical threats if I don't consider them legitimate? There is not even close to being a universal agreement on the translations, let alone the interpretations.

Mating is a part of life. Being attracted to a potential mate is impossible to avoid. No human being has ever completely eliminated fleeting sexual desire. And why would you? There is nothing wrong with it. (Unless of course you literally follow the Bible, which brings us full circle).

I look forward to seeing your

I look forward to seeing your daughter on the big screen maybe even with your grand daughter... for you this is all good right?

Logical Fallacy

Burden of Proof, you can do better Mark.

There are no contradictions in the Bible. I have read the Bible and have read various materials on the subject (of alleged contradictions). I am studying to be a theologian. I know my stuff.

Here is an example of Burden of Proof 'contradictions'

Tell me how many people died in the Civil War. Various historians will quote you drastically different numbers. Yet are any of them wrong? Thus this is why Burden of Proof and lolBible contradictions are irritating for people to answer, because they are dealing with a logical fallacy they can never win.

I do not dictate to you how to be a Dentist. Do not dictate to me theology. That is my realm.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

So my theological opinions are invalid?

Based on my experiments I have concluded that there is no devil and there is no hell. I'm pretty sure I am up-to-date with the latest peer reviewed research on the matter.

"The study of theology, as it stands in Christian churches, is the study of nothing; it is founded on nothing; it rests on no principles; it proceeds by no authorities; it has no data; it can demonstrate nothing; and it admits of no conclusion. Not anything can be studied as a science, without our being in possession of the principles upon which it is founded; and as this is the case with Christian theology, it is therefore the study of nothing."

Thomas Paine

Cyril's picture



"I have concluded that there is no devil and there is no hell."

And it's a perfectly reasonable conclusion. Depending on the premises one can use.

You may have overlooked something, though.


Sure, the mere existence of shared concepts or symbols such as "hell" or the "devil" doesn't imply in any way the absolute "existence" of the objects denoted, even on grounds of means of observation easy to be agreed upon.

As another example, the imaginary Pink Unicorn is also a possible concept one can come up with. And at any time T, if we assume your/our shared science performant enough to enable for an comprehensive search thru all the living species on Earth, you might as well provably verify, eventually, that even though the name, adjective + noun, Pink Unicorn, DOES exist (in our language and ontology of discourse), the tangible entity it denotes DOES NOT.

Now for the issue:

In that process, unless I am missing another scientific methodology you might use(?), you/we are generally bound to making the Closed World Assumption.

This is expected, since in the scientific method, models / modeling of finite knowledge play such a crucial role, besides theories, and initial observations, experimentation, verification by further data capture, refinement of the models, loopback, etc.

And I do make the same assumption, when it's about science or technology.

But here's the thing :

I cannot speak for other Christians, let alone other believers from other religions, re: the path they follow towards their own personal faith, but the ONE thing that I can speak of and WE ALL have in common during our INTERPRETATION of our sacred texts (be it transmitted, in ongoing elaboration, or rediscovered, etc) is ...

well ... we just DO NOT make the Closed World Assumption. Consciously or unconsciously, we don't. I, for one, have conscience and certainty that I don't, anyway.

Thus, Faith is that very special thing living more in our "heart" (emotionally speaking) than in our brain, and which is working inside as well as OUTSIDE of it (the CWA). Therefore, any reasoning that makes this assumption alone IS NEITHER capable to validate OR invalidate what our Faith holds, because there is just no common starting grounds for both types of reasoning to make comparable assertions over the symbols they manipulate, resp.

More crudely: in the CWA one just cannot prove or disprove the existence of God, for instance, among many other difficulties. In my understanding anyway (or, if it were ever possible ... I guess that'd be published already, with either conclusion, no ?)

Another metaphor I found for myself is :

It would be like hoping to ask someone, and obtain an answer, to: "what time is it ?" either BEFORE the person's birth (when he/she is in the mother's womb) or AFTER the person's death (assuming you were born before and you would die after that person).

If you are God, the only way for that person to know that you prior asked him/her what time is it before his/her birth, is to show up and tell so later on, after birth. I would say that this sort of resembles the meeting with Faith for believers. For non-believers, you just never show up, or they can't see you, so they will never know about you, neither of course that you had been there all along, "before"/"after" them (this is where you can't really stretch the metaphor further, I can sure grant that).

Call it non-scientific, for sure, or even silly, if you wish, but the bottom line is your above remark doesn't help to make any point, EITHER WAY, re: what YOU, on one side, and believers, on the other side, UNDERSTAND of the mentioned concepts' meanings and what people actually denote with them, on either side.

Thus, the very premises of YOUR knowledge acquisition and verification processes (in the CWA) are just IRRELEVANT to OUR faith discovery and sustaining processes (in or out of the CWA). And the other way round, too.

Still, I have never bought into the (unproven, btw) opinion that Faith and "usual" science / the scientific method in the CWA are mutually exclusive.

It's very unlikely as one can see using no more than simple common sense : if they were (mutually exclusive), how come I could experience a mix of feelings and reasonings thru which I precisely try to express that both, Faith and science, can co-exist, and per my very consciousness of the same two ? Same question applying, of course, to other scientists, no more religious than I am, though obviously much more competent in their own science domain which isn't mine, and them, too, having no problem to accept Faith, etc.

Granted, there is a non-empty overlap, but that assumption alone (sufficient for most hard sciences) just falls short for Faith to be explained completely and sound to someone who, by choice or by necessity, is confined in it (the CWA).

That's the bad news I thought I might share.


Another interesting edge case, though, is of the Pascal's Wager, which is fairly content with using the CWA, in a purposedly very limited scenario. There, it is used for applying a strategy to choose between having Faith or an absence thereof, from a gain / cost "gaming" PoV, rather than for deciding about a given arbitrary state of knowledge, trying to prove or disprove this or that "fact" in Faith, etc (usually failing miserably, for the very reasons I gave above.)

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

If you only believe in the material

then you are one sad person. Consciousness cannot be seen. How do I know you know right from wrong? The images on your TV are there, but obviously it is an illusion. If your senses can be deceived, how can you trust them?

Of course, I am not a materialist. I am a Christian first and foremost. My loyalty is to my Lord Christ, who then says to love my brothers and sisters as He loved us. Lets talk about a different Thomas.

Thomas Aquinas would disagree with Thomas Paine. I tend to agree with Aquinas' rigorous logic than that of Paine's.


Aquinas basically built modern intellectual thought... go figure Mark.

Easily rebutted. The Church has a great treasure of intellectual resources to help Christians deal with intellectual challenges. My goal debating you is not to defeat you, but to show to my brothers that such resources exist and should be read.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius


Jesus said that!!!! OMG, Mark said not to drag Christ name into this even though in his 5 discourses of Matthew (it was his commentary on the Torah, the first 5 books of the Bible aka the Pentateuch) he comments on the Levitical law of divorce and adultery, advocating an even stricter approach to the law.

Talmudic legalism allowed people to undermine the law by making up excuses. Jesus slams them pretty hard with what the goal of the law was.

This is apart of the much loved Sermon on the Mount.


May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Cyril's picture

Well, I hear you


"You know what breaks up families more than anything else in the world? INTOLERANT RELIGIOUS FANATICISM."

I hear you, as a proud Christian who loves his One True LORD and Savior, Jesus, and His Word, I dislike and I have pity for bigots or religious planners and mobs, as well.

However :

I'd argue this break up you're mentioning isn't quite AS COMPARABLY RELEVANT, in negativity, to WHAT HAS BEEN HAPPENING, AND STILL IS, elsewhere, COMPLETELY OUTSIDE of the family circle, and with or without "religious fanaticism" around.

In fact, LARGELY WITHOUT "Religious Fanaticism" OVER THE ENTIRE 20TH century, FACTUALLY :

Here's the clue.

As for :

"This article is disgusting."

I wouldn't be that harsh, I'd rather say : this article is VERY CONFUSED, and many people are, still.

Refer to my other comments in this thread and the points I tried to make.


"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

Cyril's picture

Interesting, so, when :

Interesting, so, when :

1. I say I love my Lord, Jesus, and His Word

2. I confirm I dislike bigots, superstition, and "religious fanaticism" or religious planners / mobs / you name them


(trying to make the point that NEITHER OF Religious Fanaticism OR Pornography really is a most worrisome issue from my point of view FOR HUMANITY, today)

... I get downvotes without any counter-arguments or requests for clarifications about where I may have offended people in their different opinions or values ?

Does that mean I should have :

I. said that I'm an atheist despising especially the Christian Faith

II. confirmed that I like or don't mind about bigots and superstition or fanatics

III. claimed that government NEVER, EVER kills and is always good


Very interesting.

I must have missed something quite big.

Or ... wait, maybe a refresher about some facts is indeed hurting and not quite welcome here ?

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

How gracious of you

to 'clear a few things up' for us.

And you weren't any more condescending than normal.

Cyril's picture

Here is a link to one of my TOP10 IN THE MOST UTTERLY DISGUSTING

For all to see, esp. those who don't know yet.

Here is a link to one of my TOP 10 IN THE MOST UTTERLY DISGUSTING, REVOLTING "PORN" that makes the sickest PEDOPHILES (i.e., porn amateurs gone SICK and EVIL) you can hate look like nice and trustable people for someone's kids.

This is PORN you can read.

This is PORN about SHEDDING BLOOD instead of lust and copulation.

Well, yes, that makes for a change, after all. HELL, why not ? you'd ask. Yes, it's all about man-made HELL indeed.

So, do yourself a favor and OPEN your eyes TO THE UTTERMOST DESPICABLE LEVEL OF ARROGANCE, DISDAIN, BRUTALITY, AND CONTEMPT FOR HUMAN LIFE that FILTH inside man can go up to, while presenting THEIR HORRORS with polite sophistication :


Before reading :

Make sure your bathroom is available for you to go to sooner rather than later.

To the OP : and yes, THAT above is "PORN" which is

... "Made in the SO-CALLED USA".

THAT is porn I find DISGUSTING, REVOLTING, BRINGING YOU NAUSEA, when you get it before your eyes, wherever that'd be.

Now, here is some hope for a cure against THAT kind of porn, and many other horrors.

Read this wisdom CAREFULLY and ACCEPT IT, EMBRACE IT to improve ourselves :

"The sensitivity of men to small matters, and their indifference to great ones, indicates a strange and worrisome inversion."

-- Blaise Pascal

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

I feel porn is a branch on the tree

I think porn is a real problem in this country. I know a guy who does security at a nuclear plant, and he said that the majority of his job is walking around and firing people who he sees looking at porn on their computers because that is some kind of security risk. These people know that it is an automatic firing offence but they are so addicted they cant go a few hours without it.
I know another guy I used to work with who would cash his check on friday and spend all his money stuffing strippers thongs by the time monday rolled around.
Addiction is a real problem, particularly one that is well known to cause problems in marraige.

I think we already know the problems with pornagraphy, but why is it such a problem with this generation when it has not been a huge one with past generations? I believe some of the problems is delayed adult hood. 70 or 80 years ago, until the begginging of history practically the average age of getting married was 14 and 15, but know its 26 for females and 28 for males.
One of the symptoms of delayed adulthood is keeping children from working as long as possible and making it a kids job to have fun. We have lived the last couple of generations telling young people your job is to be entertained, so instead of being good workers and trying to improve their life and community as they grow up they say hey I am supposed to have fun. Please note I am all for fun, and a good time, but this should not be something that is given from a box, but from accomplishment and growth.
John taylor gatto writes some good stuff about this very subject http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/chapters/2b.htm