241 votes

The Ron Paul picture is gone...

I know that the Daily Paul is moving past focusing on Ron Paul's 2012 campaign, but did the Ron Paul picture on the right of the DP really have to get taken down? After all, our movement and this website IS still inspired by the good doctor even if it's no longer mainly about getting him elected. And that's all the picture said: "The Daily Paul is inspired by Ron Paul". Now there is nothing about him, not even a smaller picture. Does anyone else feel the same way?

Nystrom Update: Please see my response in this comment, below. Thank you.

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.

Ok, Michael.

You won me over with that comment. I totally understand where you're coming from now and I'm with you on this one. You obviously have a vision for the future and I will not be left out. I worked too hard for our R3VOLution to walk away from the good fight now, over the loss of a picture.

Americans do need a miracle. The NWO will be upon us soon enough. It is indeed the "kind of miracle" that will determine what that change will mean for us and for the world. Keep moving forward to advance the good fight on all fronts and never lose hope.

“It is the food which you furnish to your mind that determines the whole character of your life.”
―Emmet Fox

Take it anyway you

want because I have to go make lunch.

We can all be traveling in the same direction only using different transportation. Good luck

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

I want to understand

what you were saying, though. That was how I read what you were saying, but I don't want to assume that I read it correctly.

I just got an idea.. Advertisement Moneybomb?

It might or might not work. We'd have to organize it all ourselves with no support of the admins, BUT. One of the admins was discussing with a member why there was still an ad with Ron Paul on the right. Because people pay for those spots.. So I was thinking.. What if we did a moneybomb to put an ad of that picture that was removed? I have no idea how much it is to put up an ad, or how long we'd be able to put it there, but it might be effective and help us get our point across.

Thoughts?

__
Formerly Tebowtime195
My blog: http://tebowtime95.wordpress.com
NEWEST BLOG POST: 'The Daily Paul is Inspired by Ron Paul (September 10th, 2012)' - My thoughts on the whole deal with the 'Inspired by Ron Paul' picture being removed from the Daily Pa

Well...

In my time on this site I have met so many wonderful folks...Trevor, Granniewarrior, Treg, Granger, HonorGod, Legalizeliberty, so many more than I can even name...and as you can see from that sampling we all obviously all think differently about all types of things. And that is a good thing.
I've seen this site go thru drama with Laurie, Steve, Trevor, Granny...the new drama with all the infighting between those that want to stay in the GOP, those who don't, those who support Johnson...all this was the same as 2008 when it was stay, move on, or support Barr or Baldwin...

But in all that time the grounding force was Dr. Paul. The fact that no matter what, there was at least one thing we could all agree on....that Dr. Paul was Un-coruptable, solid, and honest. We could always come back to that foundation. That it wasn't about one man...but more about how we wanted every other politician to emulate that honesty.

It is my belief that the Daily Paul has been hijacked. And I don't mean by Johnson supporters, Romney trolls or whatever group there is (that wouldn't be new or unusual) but hijacked by an even bigger "threat".
Dramatic as this might sound....THIS very well could be the issue that splits the liberty movement...atleast as far as this site goes.
After all my years here..and as much as I have always tried to remain upbeat and openminded...my head is hung low and I'm deeply saddened. It was my intention to scrape together some money and become a paid member after November to show my commitment to this site and the movement I found here...but in truth I now feel like this site will be corrupted, taken over and dismantled by those who wish to splinter us and push us back into our solitude.

Silence is the enemy of transparency and goodwill.

I realize this is Manystrom's site to do as he pleases...but the fact that there is silence about something everyone clearly feels so strongly about tells me that this is no longer a community. So while I will not leave the site (unless I am banned) I also will now just treat it like any other media outlet. Never trusting completely...but still watchful of what is being said.

So...much Luv and Respect to you all..Fellow Patriots. I am here..but not "here".

HonorGod was one of my favorite posters, but he left...

because he was fed up with all the BS....unless he came back as someone else.

Michael Nystrom's picture

Thank you

Thank you Jan, for the excellent points you have made in your note, which can help me to explain why I took the picture down.

So while I will not leave the site ... I also will now just treat it like any other media outlet. Never trusting completely...but still watchful of what is being said.

This is a good policy, and I recommend it with every site - including the Daily Paul - and pretty much everything in life: Be circumspect. In a free society, that is what you have to do. You have to look out for yourself, and you can't suspend disbelief or judgement simply because there is a picture of Ron Paul at the top of a website.

The site has been through many ups and downs, as you have noted, and the overriding defining feature of the site is community. Between 2007, when I set up the site, until Dr. Paul's appearance on the Tonight Show the other night, the community was united in a singular goal: To elect Ron Paul president. That is now clearly over. Many people are sad about it, including me.

The question is - what keeps us united now? Should we focus on the man, or the message? He has stressed to us again and again, that he is simply the messenger. The message is Liberty.

Dr. Paul was Un-coruptable, solid, and honest. We could always come back to that foundation. That it wasn't about one man...but more about how we wanted every other politician to emulate that honesty.

Not only is it unfair, but it is folly to elevate any human to the heights some here would like to. Some of the founding fathers wanted to make George Washington king. Some here would like to elevate Ron Paul to the status of saint. In my opinion, this is the wrong message to send, not only to our current defenders of liberty, but to any newcomers to the Liberty movement as well.

What I fear is that this becomes - as we have often been accused of - the Cult of Paul that slowly morphs its way into the Religion of Paul. We can see this on full display in many of the comments on this thread. Are these the defenders of Liberty that Ron Paul's has inspired? Is this how we should behave?

Rather than look outside of ourselves - and what we want others to be - why don't we start at home first?

AnCapMercenary was respectful for asking questions in his comment, rather than immediately jumping to the most sinister conclusions of all (Thanks AnCap!), which I am pleased to be able to answer:

1. Who's idea was it and why (to remove the picture).

It was my idea. I removed it the morning after Dr. Paul's appearance on the tonight show. My goal with this project from the beginning was to support Ron Paul's presidential run. On the show, he confirmed, without a doubt, that there would be no third party run. So the original mission, as it were, was complete.

Many people are sad about it, including me. But I believe it is necessary to move on and grow the movement.

2. Why does the notion of 'moving forth with the R3VOLution/Liberty Movement/Freedom Movement, beyond, and post-RP2012,' necessarily entail removing "inspired by Dr. Paul"-picture?

Throughout both presidential campaigns there have been a minority of individuals who tend more towards lionizing the man, rather than promoting his message. But this tendency intensified especially after "Operation Cold Water" in Mid-May, when the campaign clearly put the brakes on the campaigning. Taking down the photo the morning after the Tonight Show was like ripping the bandaid off a wound. It was painful, but at least it was quick.

The very clear message that I want to send is: The Presidential Campaign is over. There will be no third party run, no write-in campaign, no Ron Paul as VP on the Libertarian ticket, no Ron Paul for Governor of Texas 2014, no Ron Paul as Gary Johnson's Secretary of Treasury, no Ron Paul as Fed Chairman under President Johnson, and no Ron Paul 2016. All of these threads did indeed show up on the Daily Paul, and they are all point to the irrational fixation some people have on the man over the Message.

This is not something I want to encourage. It is not the best use of time, resources or talents for this community, in my opinion.

I see the R3VOLution/Liberty Movement/Freedom Movement as much larger than just politics. But people have a tendency to simply emulate and copy, which is why there is such a fixation on politics and running for office among Ron Paul supporters. Yes, this is Ron Paul's path, and he has inspired many people to take that path. But there are the arts, literature, journalism, and business and entrepreneurship of all kinds. There is so much to infiltrate with the message of Liberty! In this way, we can all inspire each other and inspire ourselves rather than always turning back to Ron Paul.

3. Was it that crucial that the 'real estate' taken up by that picture, immediately be used for something else?

No. People on this thread have said that I cleared it for ad space, but that had nothing to do with the decision.

4. Was the removal a purely positive symbolic gesture? If so, then what did the proprietor of this fine site and mods have in mind, to that effect?

What a wonderful question! I believe that of the 250 + comments on this thread, you are the only person to even consider the possibility. Which speaks to another tendency of humans, which is to abhor change of any and all kinds and denounce it simply for change's sake. But not all change is bad.

The primary symbology, as I mentioned above, is to communicate that the Ron Paul presidential campaign is over. But every ending is also a beginning. And in this beginning, I think that we have to grow beyond Ron Paul, and express our own individuality in our journey towards Liberty.

During the presidential campaign, I felt that as the owner of this site, I had to be careful not to let anything posted here reflect "badly" on Dr. Paul. Therefore, the 911 truth threads, chemtrail "conspiracy" threads, etc. got thrown into the 'off topic' bin, so they wouldn't appear on the front page. I really felt bad about this, because in a free society, I think people should be able to talk about what they want to. And the way achieve a free society is to simply behave like you live in one already. So I was a hipocrite, like Paul Ryan or George Bush (Ack!) "sacrificing my principles in order to save them."

So the topics of conversation are going to loosen up around here. And in some ways, with a picture of Ron Paul at the top, it could still reflect badly on Dr. Paul, which is not really fair to him. Or at least, some might perceive that it does and start demanding of the mods, and the community in general, as has often happened in the past, "WHAT DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH RON PAUL?"

It is time to grow beyond that. And it is also time to grow beyond the idea of Ron Paul running for president in 2016. I know he said that was a joke on Jay Leno, but some people didn't quite get it. So I want to send the clear message that this is not the waiting room for Ron Paul 2016 or, for that matter, Rand Paul 2016. I've done this for five years, and whoever is running in 2016, I'm not going to be running a site like this for them (unless maybe if Judge Nap decides to run ;).

On a positive note, however, this opens a market opportunity for someone else. Young Tim Tebow has said that if the picture was not returned that, "I'm about to make my own website and go there and actually give RP the respect he deserves." I heartily encourage that, and look forward to seeing your new website! And remember that the most important thing a person has is their word. Especially for lovers of Liberty, their word is their bond. So before you say something, you should think about if you really mean it, and if you do, you should follow up with it.

Others have said they will leave the DP in favor of Hidden Places, which is another website started by a former Ron Paul supporter. And I encourage that as well. For die hard Ron Paul supporters who want to remain focused on Ron Paul, there are the The Ron Paul Forums. I doubt that picture will go away. For those interested in further political activity, there is the excellent Ron Paul Tribune.

And I'm not saying this in a 'take it or leave it, don't let the door hit you on the way out,' kind of way. I'm saying it from the libertarian principle that everyone should do what they want to do and find a place where they are most happy and comfortable.

BTW, now I know what it is like to stand on your principles on on the other side of a 231-1 vote!

I hope this has answered everyone's questions. Thank you for reading this far, and for giving me the opportunity to answer.

Michael Nystrom
DailyPaul.com

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.

Count me among those who want

Count me among those who want Sainthood. If I ever have the money there will be a statue built in a public place.

Ventura 2012

My hat's off to you, Michael Nystrom.

I now understand the story much better and accept that this is the choice that you have made.

Thank you for letting us know your reasons, and thank you for the Daily Paul!

I believe in the freedom to be what we choose to be.

'The Answer My Friend ...

... is blowing in the wind.'

" I would rather see people empowered in their own resources and abilities than fantasizing about what Ron Paul is or isn't going to do."

To underscore the fine points you have made here, Michael, I chime in with a verse. I also wish to draw attention ( in a shamelessly commercial way) to a video which many may have skipped when they thought my thread was not enough about smoke and mirrors by which they have become accustomed during the season of electoral politics.

http://www.dailypaul.com/253092/libberte-where-there-s-smoke

Yes, we may stand down wind of the looking glass or step up, breathe deep and pass through.

Thank you...

for not remaining silent.

Reasons can be digested and thought over...silence just smothers any thought.

This site will always be one of my "daily" reads...and you will always have my complete respect for all you have done / will do for the cause of Liberty.

Blessings and Brightness to you; Manystrom.

Eh Miguel, mi amigo!

Very well written answer.

I understand your viewpoint and I also understand the hurt and pain that everyone here is experiencing. It seems that since May we have just had one glass of cold water after another thrown in our faces, and I think that the lack of the photo was just the latest glass of ice water. No solution, really, except to pick ourselves up and dust ourselves off and realize what the Liberty MOVEMENT actually entails. Elections are a time of high passion and excitement. Growing a new movement, on the other hand is the hard, drudge work that most of us do... but don't always enjoy.

I have three suggestions: You, and others, can take them or leave them. But you might find them helpful.

1) I would SO love if the Logo at the top was "Peace, Gold, and LIBERTY" instead of "Peace, Gold, and Love". The reason is that Dr. Paul never gave ONE speech without making it clear that his main concern was restoring LIBERTY. We call ourselves a LIBERTY movement, and frankly, true Liberty would solve all of our problems. (I found it marvelous, by the way that the chemical chart sign for gold is au.... that is PERFECT.)

2) Perhaps, over time, you could make clear in the masthead that this website was originally inspired by the writings and speeches of Dr. and Congressman Ron Paul... and have some sort educational "Ron Paul Library", or "Liberty Library" where people could go to read and see the BEST and most educational of the Ron Paul videos. I say this because we have all learned SO MUCH about the liberty philosophy from listening to the good Doctor. And newcomers could learn as well from really listening to his educational and informative speeches. (not every 3 minute appearance on news shows, but rather his true speeches, given to assembled masses)It could also list the books he has written, and perhaps even link to the other liberty forums such as Lew Rockwell, Mises Institute, etc.

3) Finally, for those who need a little more "Paul", there is a website called www.ronpaul.com, that puts up EXCLUSIVELY any and all Ron Paul news and videos. That may help with some of the withdrawl that many of us are feeling. It helps to keep track of what our dear Doctor is up to, and where he is appearing.

Me thinks you should sit back and have yourself a fine Tequila this afternoon, Michael. Thank you so much for providing this forum, and may we all move into the future with as much resolve and determination and patience as our hero, Ron Paul. There is much work to be done.

Hasta luego, mi amigo.

Thomas Jefferson: “Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just, that His justice cannot sleep forever."

Viva La Revolucion!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmaTNf4YhEs

Peace, Love, Liberty

I think that would be best. Gold really has no value when put up against those 3. Imho.

Peace Gold Liberty. I honestly thought that is what it said

till you pointed that out! (we see what we want to see I guess). Then again, love is liberty, isn't it?

Michael, I agree with every word you wrote EXCEPT 'Ron Paul shouldn't be or become (paraphrasing here excuse me- will edit if possible) the patron saint of Liberty. I believe that he is indeed the Patron Saint, for lack of a better term, of the New Liberty Movement. This is the key argument of my 'keep this the Daily Paul' article/rant that is linked below for anyone else curious about it.

Now I think I'm done arguing about my opinion of this website which isn't mine...

9-11 was a panda job.

down-voted

The 2012 Presidential election has 58 days to go. Clearly you've never played any football - the game aint over until it's over, my friend in Liberty. Here are five examples:

1. Romney campaign indicted for accepting foreign contributions ... Romney faces up to 25 years in prison

2. Romney is killed in a freak plane crash... later attributed to a crazed Obaaaaama supporter shining super-strength green laser at the pilots while shouting "you didn't build that!"

3. Romney is struck by lightning, dies later in hospital. Christians worldwide consider this a sign

4. Libertarian Party holds surprise referendum, decides to re-convene their convention and nominate a Paul & Ventura 2012 ticket. Polls show LP instantly in the lead by 7 points

5. Ron Paul surprises everyone by announcing the formation of a new political party called the Liberty Party. On the first day over 1 million people sign up ...

Michael Nystrom's picture

I'm not sure I understand your intent.

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic or serious. If you're being sarcastic, this is humorous.

If you're being serious, this is exactly the kind of unproductive, delusional, fantasy thinking that I wish to avoid having to deal with on a daily basis.

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.

Hard to tell sometimes...

If someone posted "Ron Paul for Emperor of the Moon" I would look twice nowadays to see if he was sarcastic or serious.

On the other hand, are we 100% sure, Michael, that Ron is retired..? Is it wrong to speculate on some office more down to earth, like Senate or Governor?

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

Michael Nystrom's picture

Hi Kevin - long time no see

Hope you are well. Seems like a lot of the old timers are coming back out of the woodwork recently...

On the other hand, are we 100% sure, Michael, that Ron is retired..? Is it wrong to speculate on some office more down to earth, like Senate or Governor?

I think that if he's not, he'll let us know in no uncertain terms. Until then, I'm not going to read anything into things he hasn't said. I've never once heard him talking about running for governor.

Is it wrong to speculate on it? That is not for me to say. It is not something I want to encourage. I would rather see people empowered in their own resources and abilities than fantasizing about what Ron Paul is or isn't going to do.

But of course when people want to speculate about that kind of stuff, they come here to the Daily Paul. However, I'm just not going to be shy about throwing cold water onto those kinds of ideas anymore.

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.
Debbie's picture

I agree, it's hard to tell sometimes . . . I don't know if the

2016 remark was totally a joke or not. Maybe it was . . . we'll have to wait and see. I don't think he'll run for any other office, but he's not retired from the liberty movement. Lew Rockwell said Ron has many exciting things planned for us. Ron is not going to let all the enthusiasm and momentum he started for liberty go un-channelled. RP has never said he won't still be involved, in fact he said he would stay involved. I think he will still be the leader and guiding hand of our movement.

In regards to the picture, I would like to see it stay, however, if Michael is now going to allow other types of postings on this site such as 911 or chemtrail stuff that he (wisely) didn't allow before, then I can see his point of not wanting that type of stuff to be associated with Ron Paul. I'm sorry to see the picture go, but if the site is going to be opened up to those other types of subjects,then I would have to agree it is a prudent move.

Debbie

seriously, Nystrom

... what the fuck is your rush to end this campaign 58 days early? Whose side are you on? I'm sick of all the "pragamatists" and their closed-minded version of "reality".

The game of football is a lot like life: you go out there and try as hard as you can... do your best ... and you simply never give up ... never surrender... never concede. As soon as you concede, you have lost. Don't be a quitter, Michael.

FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT TIL THE END and you just might win . . .

Michael Nystrom's picture

Why the need to swear?

What is my hurry? I prefer the reality based world, as opposed to a delusional fantasyland.

This is not a game of football. When one lives in the reality based world, one understands that. Maybe it is true in a football game that you never give up and never surrender - I don't know. I've never played in the NFL. You?

But I have noticed in blowouts, when it is 55-7 in the fourth quarter, the losing team tends to play its backup quarterback and 3rd stringers - both to give the benchwarmers some time, as well as to protect the star players so they can come back to play another game.

I would say that politics is more like poker than football. Poker is a game of skill that also involves a goodly dosage of luck, not to mention incredible skill, calculation and psychology. Football is brute force.

The Ron Paul campaign is over. Time to face up to the facts. Unless you plan to be voting for him in 2028 as well.

Sometimes you knock on the front door and it doesn't open. Pounding on it harder doesn't work, so you might come back later, or sneak in a window, or go through the back door.

You need to be a little for flexible and supple with your intellect. This is not a football game, and brute force isn't going to win it.

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.

Removing a picture

Doesn't fix or prevent any of that. You probably caused more than you were trying to stop by doing it..

__
Formerly Tebowtime195
My blog: http://tebowtime95.wordpress.com
NEWEST BLOG POST: 'The Daily Paul is Inspired by Ron Paul (September 10th, 2012)' - My thoughts on the whole deal with the 'Inspired by Ron Paul' picture being removed from the Daily Pa

rpscallion's picture

And the likelihood of any of this is beyond ridiculous.

I think stuff like this, far reaching futile desperation, is what he was referring to.

is that what you "learned" on television today?

... you make your own reality, my friend in liberty. If you BELIEVE it's "futile" then you will be "rewarded" with failure. If you BELIEVE you can win ... well then you can win. It's up to you . . .

If this is a COMMUNITY

Then why didn't we have a voice in this decision?

PS: For future reference, I am not Tim Tebow. (that is part of the reason why I changed my username)

__
Formerly Tebowtime195
My blog: http://tebowtime95.wordpress.com
NEWEST BLOG POST: 'The Daily Paul is Inspired by Ron Paul (September 10th, 2012)' - My thoughts on the whole deal with the 'Inspired by Ron Paul' picture being removed from the Daily Pa

Thanks for responding at length, Michael.

In short, what's going on here now is "growth pains". You have labored long and hard to make DP the great success it was and, like our Movement, it's time for DP to spread out and grow.

But, please understand that most of us do not deify Ron Paul. We honor him as THE Patriot of our day. He is the one who showed us the way to regain what we have lost in our country, at the hands of the bought and paid for congress and politicos that resulted in what we lost in our own lives and want back. I appreciate that you mentioned Hidden Places, Ron Paul Forums and Ron Paul Tribune as other roads for us to travel to hone our new skills and honor our modern day Patriot, while you labor to build a new, broader, road for us to travel with you, too.

Your response to this thread was much needed and I, for one, VERY much appreciate your reply. I am looking forward to seeing your new vision, AFTER the GJ fever dies down. Having followed Daily Paul almost from its inception, I have no doubt now that you will have great success.

Thank you, Michael.

“It is the food which you furnish to your mind that determines the whole character of your life.”
―Emmet Fox

Michael Nystrom's picture

Thank you Nonna

Thank you for your kind words, and your understanding.

I know that most people don't deify Ron Paul. I do know that.

But there are a small number who do, and they can take over a room, or a website and as they do can make it uncomfortable for others with differing views (including me). I have seen that and experienced it here, not only on this thread but on this site generally, and others as well.

I know that Ron Paul is an inspiration, and he will continue to be. We will all continue to follow him, and he won't be shut out from the site. He will continue to be an inspiration, but I feel strongly that we all have our own paths to walk.

Thank you again for all of your contributions to the site, and I hope you stick around, or at least pop in from time to time.

Everyone is always welcome at the Daily Paul.

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.
the strangerr's picture

Excellent

“My goal with this project from the beginning was to support Ron Paul's presidential run.”

I know. I remember. We discussed it at length. You made this site out of thin air. And you struck a match that started a raging fire; no one, NO ONE, did more to support Dr. Paul or his presidential run.

Excellent answer to the many cries for no change. Excellent in many ways. A toast to you...

Michael Nystrom's picture

User #4!

Wow. Considering I am user #1 and #2, that makes you a super old timer!

Man, I've known you so long, I remember when you only had one r at the end of your name. Where'd you pick up that second one?

Thanks friend. We'll see you on the flip, if not before.

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.

Not trying to make any waves

"The very clear message that I want to send is: The Presidential Campaign is over. There will be no third party run, no write-in campaign, no Ron Paul as VP on the Libertarian ticket, no Ron Paul for Governor of Texas 2014, no Ron Paul as Gary Johnson's Secretary of Treasury, no Ron Paul as Fed Chairman under President Johnson, and no Ron Paul 2016. All of these threads did indeed show up on the Daily Paul, and they are all point to the irrational fixation some people have on the man over the Message."

I wrote one single comment titled "Ron Paul for Governor of Texas 2014?" with a body containing "???" on August 28th, which was subsequently deleted by a moderator, for what reason I have no idea.

It was merely floating an idea, and I don't think it qualifies as part of an "irrational fixation" with Ron Paul, I myself have fought against the deification of him, and I don't like being characterized this way.

There is a tiny portion of people on here that treat him as more than man, and treated him and the campaign as infallible.

But they are less responsible for the current division on here, than the recently registered Libertarian Party types that feel they have to preach the gospel of Gary Johnson and convert every last soul that says "No, thank you".

Many polite refusals, and explanations for choosing not to vote for Gary Johnson, have been responded to with never ending vitriol.

On the removal of the Ron Paul picture, you are right that people should not idolize other human beings, but I think there is nothing wrong with being inspired by great, principled, moral men and aspiring to follow in their footsteps.

The picture never came across as idolatry, the "inspired by" caption laid out clearly what it was intended for.

I wish you would reconsider.

I just felt compelled to reply to this, because it bothered me.

But, thank you for this wonderful site, it has been an invaluable resource for liberty these last few years and I hope it continues to be.

Check out the Laissez-Faire Journal at LFJournal.com


"The State is a gang of thieves writ large." - Murray Rothbard