192 votes

A call for unity between Paul supporters and Johnson supporters.

I have seen the war between Ron Paul supporters and Gary Johnson supporters and I think it is rather silly that people in this movement have such a hard time following Ron Paul's advice. It is pretty simple to me.

We can not force our goodwill on anyone, we can only set good examples and hope people wish to emulate us. --Ron Paul

My suggestion would be that if you support Gary Johnson, fine support him. That is what freedom is. If you support Ron Paul, fine. Most of us here do support Ron Paul and have for several years. If you support both fine, but lets stop eating our own.

The goal should be to grow the liberty movement not divide it. Great movements are always destroyed from within, not the other way around.

I have seen the arguments from both sides and many statements are misguided. The whole notion that some claim they are turned off on Gary Johnson because Johnson supporters are trying to cram Johnson down your throats is the same excuse where many called people that didn't support Ron Paul sheep because, those people claimed they wouldn't support Ron Paul because Ron Paul supporters tried to force Paul on them. Do you see how silly that argument is?

How can anyone force anyone else to support someone?

My suggestion would be if you are not going to support Johnson fine, don't result to name calling of Johnson supporters, this makes you no better than the people that did the same thing to Ron Paul that pisses us off. Talking to people in a civil manner goes a long way, insulting them is counter productive and will accomplish nothing more than to isolate people that may share many of the same things you support.

You may not like the people you are working with, they may not like you, but we are all supposed to be working towards the same goal. So why don't we start with the things we agree on first and worry about the rest later?

Michael Badnarik said this best: We agree with each other about 98% of the time on most issues but, we spend 98% of the time b!tching, complaining and arguing about the 2% we disagree on, this is why nothing gets done, and he is correct!

You don't like a post? Don't read it, it is easy to ignore posts and comments. You don't have to agree with people but you do need to find a way to work together to grow the movement and attempt to effect real change this country needs or we will accomplish nothing. Take the high road and let freedom work for a change.

For the record I have not given my support to Gary Johnson although I did spend some private time with him at Paulfest in Tampa because I was paulfest staff and had access to Gary. My vote is just that MY VOTE! I will not tell others what to do with their vote -- please don't tell others what to do with theirs. Set good examples and educate them in a civil manner, you will win more people over that way in the long and short term.

If we continue down this US vs THEM attitude we only divide our numbers even more. I prefer to follow Ron Paul's example of integrity and I hope you will as well.

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Competition helps all around

Right now the Democrat and Republican parties can simply work together to maintain power. A third party means they have to deal with actual competition - they'll have to change their tactics. Most importantly, they will have to stop ignoring the general population if they want votes. Our voices would influence policy again.

You don't have to change parties to vote libertarian. I think fixing the Republican party is still the smart thing to do. We need to replace the cheaters and unconservatives with principled, thoughtful people - locally, and in congress and the senate.

I't true, a stronger LP would be competition for Republicans in future elections, but wouldn't they also be competition for democrats? Look at all the independents and dems who were ready to vote for Ron Paul this year because he supports the policies they care about most! More competition will prevent all parties from resorting to the corrupt practices we see now.

NJ

Here's the problem though.

If our strategy is to "become" the Republican Party as quickly as possible in order to take on the Progressives in the Democratic Party, we're not going to want a feisty, annoying third party yapping at our heels, competing for our votes. The Libertarians may be our allies now, but, when we become the Republican establishment, if the Libertarian establishment doesn't disband their party and join our revolution, they will become one of our political enemies. If we help them become strong now, we will regret it later. Kind of like we regretted helping Saddam Hussein become strong militarily.

It's not about "LP

It's not about "LP candidates" as you're implying. It's about waking up the American people that that status-quo really is the same in both parties... which is exactly what would happen with Johnson on the national debate stage showing a huge contrast between himself and Obamney... and in turn, showing how they're the same in the worst ways.

If Obama and Romney were on the stage alone the nation would focus on trying to find their minute differences.

Add in the fact that 46% of American's want a 3rd choice that isn't "one of two evils" and 60-80% of American's are willing to consider a 3rd party candidate.

Times have changed given the internet and social networking. Without it, Paul's support wouldn't have more than doubled in 4 years.

Ross Perot won 19.6% of the popular vote in 1992 and because his movement had no way to hold onto traction or organize the way we do... people became more cemented into the "3rd party/better candidates can't win" belief and more accepting of "only a choice of two evils". The numbers being historically high for a 3rd party this time around would destroy that misconception completely... and even if the GOP wanted to alienate us again in 2016... 3rd party would be there... no problem.

Critical Thinking > Emotional Thinking > Pseudo-Intellectuals that Saturate DP
Utilitarianism > Consequentialism > Deontology > Egocentrism
Making people feel "troll'd" with the truth > being an intentional troll > acting like one naturally

See my edit...

...

And voting for Romney?

Helps us how?! LOL. Seems my plan at least teaches the GOP a lesson.

Edit: At this point I'm a bit too intoxicated to really make the greatest of arguments... I think the dynamics may be different in the next election... but regardless teaching the GOP they cannot win without us is something we should attempt to accomplish this election season.

RP republiCANs will teach the GOP

Those of us that are in the GOP, fought for Ron Paul, have not forgotten what the RNC did. We are not running away, but remaining seated. Our popular vote is in the GOP. We don't have to cheat. We will teach the GOP a lesson because we are the future.. Rand is bringing Hemp Farming to Kentucky.. Romney and Obama are not talking about that when they talk about energy. So we have challenges IN THE GOP. It's a good fight. Romney doesn't represent us, but we represent Romney, of course this is backwards and one of the things we will cahallenge Romney. Why does Obama have to challenge him?

Voting Romney empowers the GOP, our party, which puts the fight for hemp within the GOP, president to majority. I think the Democratic Party needs the lesson.. Obama is the worst president to date.

Not necessarily off topic. I

Not necessarily off topic. I found this on facebook. It made me laugh. http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=192943074172322&set=a...

LETS JOIN HANDS

Do NOT make your vote irrelevant!! Vote for the candidate who is already on the ballot - Gary Johnson.

Lets grow up and not whine that GOP snubbed Ron Paul. We NEED stick it to the GOP!!! Lets NOT split up our votes.

That's the argument I made...

Vote for whoever is on the ballot... if neither is on the ballot then write in Ron Paul.

But apparently voting for Johnson isn't appealing to the 9/11 truthers because Johnson paid respect to our troops. Like somehow that makes him pro-war. *rolls eyes*

Oh and then he's oh noes CFR! When I can't even find any evidence of this, so then they reframe things so that he's "dancing with them". Because apparently he must be part of some vast Koch brother's conspiracy blah blah blah. Give it up, this site is full of trolls and truthers who probably lost all of their brain cells eating lead paintchips when they were kids.

And if that's not the issue he's "pro choice", well you know what? Functionally his position is EXACTLY the same as Ron Paul's, leave it up to the states.

You'll get nothing but emotional demagoguery and strawmen arguments out of these agitators.

Was Never Sure about the whole CFR Thing

Nice post, agree wholeheartedly. I never understood how Johnson was CFR either. If you really look at it, Johnson and Paul are extremely extremely similar, especially like you said about the abortion. Leave it up to the states. Johnson and Paul just happen to personally be on opposite sides of the issue, but policy-wise they want the exact same thing.

Gary Johnson paying respect to our troops

IS SOMEHOW EQUIVALENT TO ENDORSING WARS!!!!! - What an idiotic thinking?

If thats the case, is RON PAUL ENDORSING WARS BECAUSE HE RESPECTS AND TAKES MONEY FROM THE TROOPS????????????

I agree with you

I am on the same page as the author. We must not give up. Stop the bickering. Here is what we need to do next

http://www.thelonestarwatchdog.com/2012/09/08/now-the-conven...

You people are a bunch of

You people are a bunch of damn fools. Ron Paul described Gary Johnson as wonderful and asked his supporters to take a look at him. I am a Gary Johnson supporter and I also supported Ron Paul to the best of my ability.

I invite all of those who love liberty to join us in voting for Gary Johnson (and Rand Paul, Kurt Bills, Justin Amash, and Ted Cruz), for those who don't you are free to go and make your vote irrelevant.

Ron Paul gave us his opinion. Will you listen?

Ron Paul has more knowledge of the election process than any of us. Do you value Ron Paul's opinion? Consider his view on how to make your vote have an impact.

CASTING WRITE-IN VOTES
"I don’t think that’s very productive. Supporters can do it, of course, but in most of the states it won’t count. And if they can change the rules in a primary and not count all the votes, imagine what they could do with write-in votes!"
http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/21556.html

VOTING THIRD PARTY
Listen to Ron Paul's press conference for third party candidates.
September 10, 2008 (excerpt) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1LMoWqXrE4

It's clear to me that Ron Paul considers third party votes more advantageous to the cause of liberty, than write-in votes for him. It was never about Ron Paul, remember?
When a third party's voting numbers rise significantly, the FEC (and the media) are forced to deal with them respectfully in the next election. I don't mean from a psychological standpoint - I mean legally! The FEC cannot cheat as easily as the private, GOP club can. Suddenly, the Republicans and Democrats have to respond to competition! COMPETITION! The views of the grassroots will matter again. Without Paul on all ballots - this is the single most powerful role we can still play in the 2012 election!

We can't elect Ron Paul, but our votes can still accomplish something.

NJ

Lets support Gary Johnson to advance our cause folks

A divided house cannot stand.

Quit

telling people who to vote for.

No true Paulian

is going to listen to these "community organizers".

Quit

telling people to quit doing that.

Free and Brave
or Cradle to Grave
You can't have both

Lets NOT fight amongst ourselves

GOP is laughing at us. First, they stomped us during the convention. Now, they are enjoying the post game show watching us fight amongst ourselves!!!

Calling Gary a war monger is not right. This shows our stupidity..

What else are the Gary

What else are the Gary Johnson campaigners planing on doing other than spam Ron Paul forums? I can see that if he didnt have highly questionable views, but he does. Were not sold on his foreign policy and were not sold on voting for the lesser of two evils philosophy, let alone three evils.

This must be the new lp.

This must be the new lp. Might as well be scumbag republicans/democrats with representatives like bob barr and this phoney:

'Libertarian' Presidential Candidate Gary Johnson: Warmonger‏

Posted by David Kramer on September 7, 2012 03:30 PM

Statement issued by Gary Johnson on the tenth anniversary of the false flag attack on the United States sheeple:

“As we all pause this weekend to remember the events of September 11, 2001, our thoughts are with those who lost their lives, those who saved so many lives, and a nation that showed its greatness in countless ways. 9/11 and the days after were a time when ordinary Americans did extraordinary things. Our thoughts and our gratitude are also with the amazing men and women of our military who are putting themselves on the line every day to keep us safe. The fight against those who would do us harm continues today, and it is a fight we must carry out with the same determination that was so magnificently displayed by the heroes of 9/11.”

September 7, 2012

The statement by Gary Johnson that the men and women of the military are "amazing" and that they put themselves "on the line every day to keep us safe" shows once again that he doesn't have clue what a real libertarian is. Romney, Bush, Obama, Biden, Clinton, McCain, Palin, and the rest of the warmongers have all made almost the same statement.

Two more thoughts:

I wonder if U.S. troops would still be "amazing" if they went house to house killing "suspected terrorists" in Johnson's neighborhood?

Are the U.S. who bomb wedding parties and cut off body parts and urinate on dead bodies "amazing" too?

The world is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good things is my religion. Thomas Paine, Godfather of the American Revolution

I used to like Lew Rockwell...

Until he started talking like a truther... great way to marginalize the Liberty movement.

Its nice to know that lew

Its nice to know that lew rockwell's site can see through Gary Johnson. Bob Barr 2.0

lew rockwell's "site" can do

lew rockwell's "site" can do that? That's gotta be quite a developer who can do that.

The world is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good things is my religion. Thomas Paine, Godfather of the American Revolution

how can any vote be wasted

if it is cast for liberty?

Freedom! Forever!

When it is

"flipped" to a vote for Romney or Obama, that's how. But I guess those guys won't consider it "wasted". They will appreciate your participation.

Our vote is lost if we are not united.

Gary Johnson may not be perfect candidate in the world but he is the closest we have on the ballot compared to obama or romney. Why do you think Romney campaign is fighing in many states to keep Gary Johnson off the ballot???

Vote for Romney - Get 8 years of war, formally endorse to silence our voice....
Vote for Obama - He will be sleeping in Hawaii...

Not Voting for the Lesser of Two Evils

Johnson, Romney and Obama are all war mongers. I can't in good conscience vote for any of them.

That being said, it is not my business how other people vote and I won't hold it against someone if they for some reason think that one of these candidates is trustworthy.

I keep seeing this claim that Johnson is a war monger...

Please prove it? And don't pretend that thanking the troops is somehow war-mongering. *rolls eyes*

You're doing nothing but demagoguing.