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The Official 9/11 Conspiracy Theory

As sold to us by the U.S. Government, the mainstream media, and all the people who bought it, hook line and sinker without a second thought:

Thanks to James Corbett., Patriot for putting this together:

http://youtu.be/yuC_4mGTs98



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More simple math

100 stories plus at about 10 feet....10,000 feet. I know its wrong but it is easy to figure....
10000 feet by 300 feet is 3 million sq. ft. on one side. Times 20 lbs and you get....30,000 tons of live load stress.......what stops that.......

I am not qualified to accurately describe seismic, but I know it governs in a lot of cases.....governs means the greatest stress in the world of science.

Simple math

Add it up, take the entire weight of the building and move it sideways due to wind and how force is on the bottom columns ? Remember, when the building moves, and it does, the entire weight is in motion.

Wind at 20lbs per foot....times 100 stories and 300 feet wide.
Enough force to move the entire weight of the building, which has to be stopped.......

Ever been involved in building, engineering or physics ?

FYI - Concrete can only handle 400o pounds per square inch in compression. For example a Wide Flange beam at approx 150 pounds per foot can exceed 12000 psi with allowable deflection. Your arguments make no sense.

Let see....300 feet by 300 feet is what...90,000 sq. ft. @ 150 lbs is......13 million, 500 thousand pounds.......where I am from that is considered tons and tons...and that is just the live load allowed per floor..6,750 tons per floor just for live loads.......
Your arguments make no sense at all.

?

Jet fuel, kerosene, burns at less than 800 degrees.

The loads for the building also included the lives ones....wind, earthquake, snow, etc....
New York has the same seismic loading as San Francisco, the highest in the nation. An earthquake load exceeds 5 times the weight of the building.

Fact - not one modern high rise steel structured has ever failed due to fire, ever....except three buildings from two planes in less than eight hours.

We had a 70 story building in Dubai burn, engulfed from top to bottom, for 5 days. Not one structural beam or column failed...not one.

Study steel structured high rise fires and see for yourself.

We had a 70 story building in

We had a 70 story building in Dubai burn, engulfed from top to bottom, for 5 days. Not one structural beam or column failed...not one.

Link, please.


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track

The temperature of the jet fuel is irrelevant

The jet fuel burned out in a few minutes. It's function in the collapse was to ignite multiple fires on multiple floors.

It's the heat of all those fires, over time, that weakened the structure until it collapsed. Then, as I described above, once all that mass above the collapsed section was accelerating downward, there is no way the structure below, weakened or not, could do anything other than collapse upon impact.


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track

Link please.

Got a link supporting the idea that jet fuel ignited anything in the building that could reach 2700 degrees.
Your theory that heat and time deformed the steel to the point of failure does not explain the molten steel visible too all.

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.constructionw...

oven

Without sufficient outlet, heat builds up. That's why you like to open the windows in the car after it's been sitting out in the sun for a while. You can be fine standing outside of the car, but get inside of that oven, and on a hot enough day you will soon die. Yet you are exposed to the same heat source. The oven effect is huge. And the building was effectively an oven. Yes it had holes, but so does your Weber bbq. You need some air flow, of course. It was like the perfect storm. I don't know what temperature was reached, but obviously it must have gotten very, very hot in there. If my 40 year old oven can achieve 500 degrees, surely this huge oven could have achieved much higher temps. Yes, 2700 is conceivable.


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track

Like everything with the conventional conspiracy theorists. . .

. . . it's all speculation.

_____________________________
"Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it." -- Joseph Goebbels

speculation

is the first step in creating a theory. Unfortunately the theories are hard to test, because the evidence was sent to China to be "recycled" as rapidly as it could be loaded into trucks. The most unprecedented event in U.S. history, and the government breaks its own laws regarding disaster protocol by disappearing nearly every single scrap of evidence before the first investigative body was even assembled (FEMA).

China? The endless variety

China? The endless variety of truther theories is a sight to behold.

But that would require hours

But that would require hours of symmetrical fire, and that is not what happened that day

Symmetrical fire???

Nothing had to be symmetrical. Random distribution of the fires would do the trick. It didn't all have to weaken symmetrically. It's just that a bunch of it had to weaken, and at some point, probably just one steel beam somewhere, or maybe a joint, failed. That failure is enough to shift force elsewhere, instantly, to weakened structure that is not designed to support the additional mass even if it hadn't been weakened by heat. So it fails immediately, thus shifting to other weakened structures, and within moments you have massive and total collapse. Note that this is not all that different from what is going to eventually happen to our economy once the dollar fails.

No way has there ever been as much fire volume and heat in a building as there was here, sparked in the first two cases by plane-loads of jet fuel, and in the third by the collapse of the other buildings.


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track

and fires don't burn symmetrically

and steel buildings have burned for much longer than the trade center and bldg 7 and have not collapsed, yet all 3 of these supposedly did.

It's not that,

It's not that I don't believe the government is corrupt and willing to lead people astray, it's that I don't believe the government is that competent! To pull off an inside job that big would require so much planning, timing, coordination and skill that it is mind boggling to think that our government could do it.

Our government can't even balance a budget, to think they could pull off an 'inside job' of this magnitude is just naive.

"Be a listener only, keep within yourself, and endeavor to establish with yourself the habit of silence, especially on politics." -Thomas Jefferson

the government loves debt, they don't want a balanced budget

so your last statement doesn't make sense to me

Sarx,

The government doesn't intend to balance a budget, ever...

What governments ARE good at is destroying things and covering things up.

That is what they do.

2 Chron 7:13-14 if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land.

Here we go

Anyone who disagrees with the 9/11 conspiracy theory gets down-voted and shut out. Sorry to burst your bubble. I am Libertarian and I don't trust the government. I think the 9/11 CR was deeply flawed. I think our government wants power and to keep the people under control. I think hardly anyone cares for the Constitution anymore. I do, however, think the tragedy of 9/11 was the result of psychotic terrorists. I think what we as a nation did afterward, war on terror, invading countries, thousands of lives lost, billions of dollars spent is the result of our corrupt government. I think they used the events of 9/11 for their own ends and for their own power and for their own pocketbooks. But I do not rationally think it was an 'inside job'. And if you can't handle a difference of opinion, you do not understand Liberty.

P.S. We also landed on the moon.

"Be a listener only, keep within yourself, and endeavor to establish with yourself the habit of silence, especially on politics." -Thomas Jefferson

Govt. is very competent...

at justifying its own existence. Have you ever stopped to think that maybe, just maybe it appears to be incompetent at things like balancing the budget because it has no inherent interest in doing anything that we would deem as right. The current governments purpose is only to acquire power and use that power to acquire more. It is merely a system that is doing exactly what it was designed for, only now, it has grown out of our control. It no longer works for the people and is a cancer of humanity that needs to be removed if we are ever going to progress as a species.

Government is inherently incompetent

If you don't understand how and why government is inherently incompetent , you need to learn about economics more, and especially the profit motive.

The official version is that terrorists flew planes into two WTC buildings. Those crashes caused fires, fires that weakened supporting materials to the point that they collapsed, causing an avalanche effect that resulting in a practically sudden collapse of each building. The fires understandably spread to other buildings (like WTC7), where they burned for hours and hours, and, in WTC7, due to sprinkler issues, eventually causes similar structure weakening and subsequent total building collapse. This all makes sense.

No alternative theory makes sense. No alternative theory is necessary to explain what happened. There is film and eyewitnesses of the planes flying into the towers. I watched the second one on live TV. Everything logically and reasonably follows from that. The idea that there was also explosives in the buildings makes no sense whatsoever.

No one can come up with a logical and plausible alternative theory for what happened that comes close to the clear logic and plausibility of the official theory.


"Know what you know, know what you don't know, and understand and appreciate the distinction."

Minarchism
track

?

The Gulf of Tonkin?
WMD's in Iraq ?
USS Liberty ?
Nobody is saying planes did not fly into the building, what is argues is that the planes did not bring down three modern steel structured high rises.

Go watch the video of the towers burning and explain the molten steel falling from the fires ? 2700 degrees to melt a structural steel column, this is proven fact.

Explain why the military lied about the Gulf of Tonkin and the USS Liberty, and then answer your own question.

The one thing the U.S. govt

The one thing the U.S. govt has perfected is the art of ideath and destruction, however inefficient it is in all other arenas The other art form they have mastered is getting a critical mass of 360 million people to go along with their contrived reasons for the death and destruction it wields. 9/11 and the subsequent govt analysis of it leave so many unanswered questions that there is good reason to be suspicious of govt complicity. The freedom of the press enshrined in our Constitution as a means to protect us from tyranny no longer exists as the 5 major corporations that now control all our media are in bed with the megalomaniacs who have no regard for the sanctity of human life and sees systematic destruction and taking of lives as merely a means to an end. What is that end? Totally centralized power and control.

I would prefer to think otherwise about our government, and am not 100 percent convinced of complicity, however the evidence gives me an awful feeling. In addition, we are referring to an entity that dropped not one, but two atomic bombs on a civilian Japanese population to gain global dominance. It was an inexcusable act of terror and evil. Am I really to believe that the power brokers would not sacrifice 3000 to commence an unending, imperial war all over the world including here at home? God have mercy on us!

True, the government is incompetent

But with so many people willing to believe whatever they say, they do not have to be competent. Look at the bullshit they do all the time and folks just obediently accept it. There are very legit questions about that day and events leading up to it and while people debate them back and forth the one entity who should be providing answers stays silent while ridiculing anyone for merely asking the questions. Actually they even stopped the ridicule now that enough obedient citizens do that job for them as well. If there is nothing to any of this then why has nobody in an official capacity ever, even after all this time, taken the questions head on and given concrete answers to put it to rest once and for all? Or will this be like other "conspiracy theories' that are proven true 30 or 40 yrs. later when things finally get declassified and there are not enough people alive from the time of the event to even care anymore?

Yes, congress can't even balance a budget lol

But nobody here is saying the entire congress was behind it.

It only takes a few high ranking government officials to pull off a black operation.

What better excuse to start off a decades long never-ending war on terror?

Or should I say, a war that serves as a trillion dollar piggy bank for oil companies and the military industrial complex?

Well said.....even my most

Well said.....even my most ardent socialist friends do not have that kind of faith in governmental efficiency. The truthers are, in fact, the last true believers in the efficacy of old-style central planning.

The argument that government

The argument that government is too inept to carry out such a complex task is facile and insulting.
A.)It was not government per say. It was more likely very skilled, compartmentalized teams. The make up varied greatly; from Arab patsies, to military and civilian intelligence officers, and high level civilian authority.
B.) Military operations throughout history prove you wrong.
C.) It wasn't perfect and they did screw up. Big time.
D.) Never underestimate the gullibility and stupidity of Boobus Americanus.

"The United States can pay any debt it has because we can always print money to do that." — Alan Greenspan

Insulting to who?

Insulting to who? Government? I plead guilty.

More seriously, we're not just talking here like a typical complex task. We're talking about a project that that is more detailed and multi-layered than the Manhattan Project or the Normandy Invasion. This conspiracy includes three (make that four with building seven) "faked" attacks at different and varied locations: the creation of a bogus terrorist group with a "scripts" for all the participants, the faking of news film showing the jets crash into the towers, and the writing of "scripts" for countless eyewitnesses who have have never talked. That's just for starters.

Heck, if the federal government can indeed pull off that miraculous feat, we'll have to admit that the apologists for governmental efficiency were right all along and we're wrong.

There you go with the same

There you go with the same strawman argument after I just spanked you for using it. The "Federal government" did not pull anything off.
And you're making the rest of it up as you go. I never went into any of those details you mentioned. They are yet another strawman. I'm surprised that you didn't mention ufos and mini-nukes as well.

Don't worry. Like I said, you'll catch on eventually.

"The United States can pay any debt it has because we can always print money to do that." — Alan Greenspan

Okay, I'll play. Who directed

Okay, I'll play. Who directed the "skilled" teams that pulled off this elaborate multi-faceted operation and the cover-up which must have either included massive payoffs or threats?

Of course, you never provided details. It is very easy to make claims and speculate without backing up with evidence by waiving your hand dismissively with the statement that you can't be bothered to deal with "strawmen." Arguing with truthers is like nailing jelly to a wall. No facts will suffice for them because, of course, any contrary evidence was just part of the grand conspiracy.

I've been "playing" this game

I've been "playing" this game with your sort from the start and frankly I'm weary of it. All of the frustration and difficulties you ascribe to dealing with 'truthers' are equally true of the other side. The difference is that once one of your sort finally realizes the truth, they don't ever go back.

"The United States can pay any debt it has because we can always print money to do that." — Alan Greenspan

What "truth?" The number of

What "truth?" The number of, often mutually contradictory, "truths" put forward by truthers almost equals the number of theories put forward for the Kennedy assassination. It was once said that if everyone who has been placed as shooters on the grassy knoll had, in fact, been there the carnage would have been on the level of Pickett's Charge.

The only qualification to be a truther is the ability to make wild speculation and engage in endless castle building in the air combined with knee jerk dismissal of counter evidence as fabricated. It is impossible to argue with someone like that. I can see why Scott Horton wants nothing to do with them.