22 votes

Most RP supporters do not want to DO "by the people".

Over these last two years here is my analysis from experience in Western New York.

I petitioned and became a committeeman and learned much about the inner workings of the party.

Out of hundreds, thousands (?) of Ron Paul supporters in my county of over 140,000 Republicans, I was the only Ron Paul person I know of who is working the party.

No other RP person, and many that are my friends, from the meetup groups, C4L, YAL, Youth for Ron Paul, will get involved in the party. And I have attended county roundtable meetings and reorganization meetings.

It brought me to thinking about Lincoln's quote - ..."that government of the people, by the people, for the people..."

It seems all of these RP folks are FOR "of the people" and "for the people" but they don't want to DO "by the people".

Many told me that they don't want to get involved in the bureaucracy.

So I will start asking them, what is their strategy? I already have heard enough to conclude that is revolves around, - waiting for the SHTF, sovereign citizen, third party, and guns.

From experience with some local Libertarians I have received comments such as "no entangling alliances" and "libertarians want to do their own thing".

I have given up on trying to get these people involved. I cannot just waste my energy anymore. And that is, what I have been doing, just wasting energy, time, and money. This lobbying activism, I had to let go.

***

The bad guys got a hold of this nation because the good people do not want to be involved with "friction" amongst people. They distance from this. The bad guys are basically bullies and then just push past the good folks and take control.

An analogy is, if you ever stood up in front of the stage when a popular band is about to come on. You get as close as you can 1/2 hr before they take the stage. As the band just is about to come on stage, some people try to push their way forward elbowing you aside. If you just let them by, they have bullied their way. But, it is mostly completely stopped by joining with a few around you, and when the bullies start pushing, you scrunch up close together and not let them by.

I feel from some comments with my friends, that they do not get involved in the Republican party because there are too many bullies and they don't want to be involved in the friction.

They make it sound like if they join the Libertarian or Independent party, it is because it is a safe haven, no friction, no bullies.

That is what I have found. The good people are still running away. They need to toughen up.

This is what needs to be solved. How to get folks to realize that they have to toughen up and get involved in the political process. You can join the Libertarian or Independent parties if you like, but eventually your still going to have to deal with the bullies because they are just not going to let other people just walk right into their game unscathed.

This goes for the Independent folks too.

It has me thinking that those that do not want to DO "by the people" want OTHERS TO DO "by the people" for them. They are just complaining. This approach is not libertarian, it is more "modern liberal".

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Do you believe you could reform the Mafia?

You are working for a criminal organization that has resorted to thuggery at least since Theodore Roosevelt (probably since Lincoln). Thugs stole the nomination from Senator Bob Taft at least twice and destroyed Barry Goldwater's reputation when they could not steal the nomination. They actually accused Goldwater's "extremism" as being at least partially responsible for JFK's assassination. This, despite the fact that Goldwater and JFK were friends.

Do you believe you could reform the FED by working for them? Look, if you want to stay with these thugs, do so. However, do not for one minute think the GOP leadership will EVER let us assume power without force. The crooks need to be brought to justice by whatever means necessary.

Constitution says not to do

Constitution says not to do it by the people, although it was written by the people.

The Constitution says to do it by the law.

I think part of it, is that

I think part of it, is that many here are finally starting to realize, even if perhaps only on a subconscious level, that when you really get down to it, the problem at the root of all problems, is "democracy" itself.

Any government; whether a monarchy, democracy or a dictatorship, is basically a social organization. In which attaining a higher rank is a priced commodity.

In all such organizations, if two people both wye for a higher position, the one with the least scruples when it comes to achieving his ambition, will beat out the one with more scruples. Which is just a more formal way of the old saying that "the scum rises to the top."

Because of this, any organization WILL, guaranteed, 100% of the time, be ruled not just by a scumbag, but in fact THE biggest available scumbag.

The only defense against this, is competition between independent entities, each small enough that the scumbag leading any given one, will easily lose his entire organization due to defections, should he indulge in his scumminess to too great an extent.

As long as people have multiple, independent "countries" to choose from with a cheap and simple move, that WILL keep a lid on scumminess. Something NO possible mechanism for "choosing our leader" can ever hope to accomplish.

Good response..

I agree and think your describing our "best" years during the Articles of Confederation.

But, I think Dr. Paul learned that we won't be able to go that deep if we can't get people to move a rung towards the Constitution.

If the plan is waiting for the SHTF, which hopefully we will have moved to back as close as possible to this "competition" era, this is not something I believe we will have good credibility with, currently, when discussing with the zombies.

I went...

to a Central Committee meeting for my county. There is nothing I can do there to become a member without helping to get crap neocons elected, make calls for them or to spend a bunch of money to go to 4 star restaurants to meet candidates.

I'm sorry but the people here don't want me there and don't want to listen to new ideas. Sure they give me a smile and say we're open to everyone but when it comes down to it, who is going to vote for me in 2 years to become a member???

Do you expect me, a guy with crazy hair and a septum piercing to set up voter registration booths with Johnny Neocon, go hand out flyers for candidates I don't believe in, go to fancy steak houses when I'm a vegetarian?

I mean I don't understand how to take it over. And as far as I can tell I'm the only RP person to have ever even shown up there.

Just some honest questions for you guys. I see a bunch of RP bumper stickers in my town but not one person at the committee meetings.

There are work arounds.

I don't do anything for the party. They know what I stand for. I have two websites that shows them for what they are.

Did you read your country rules? Are all positions appointed or do you have to petition to get elected?

I have only petitioned.

My next encounters will be questions concerning the RNC, electorss, and the new rules. I ask the questions to my county chair, his "assistants", the state party attorney, and the state chair. Let them know you are there.

Now you don't have to get on the committee to make a difference. It is about showing up and professionally, putting them on the spot. Use your knowledge of the RNC happenings, and ... question.

Your there to, hmm, ... learn from them.

Check out the info on my sites. The first is how I got started. I was really hitting them hard after my third meeting. But then know I know my stuff.

If you want specific help pm me, and we can chat.

Thank you..

the bylaws are right here: http://saccountygop.com/gop/?p=1013

We have Regular, Ex-officio, Alternate and Associate members.

I believe the easiest way would to become a Regular Member. Which is voted on in the primary for each Supervisor District and that is two years away.

The other way is if a member leaves or get's kicked out, then the vacancy must be filled by appointment of the Central Committee.

Right now I'd have to either become super politically savvy and network my way into a vacancy once available or to wait 2 years and walk around my District and run in the election.

The thing about accepting an appointment is that they can

dump you. Since I petitioned as a "Committeman" and not "a member of the county committee", they can't because I am elected. It could be, I don't know. This is something that is being discussed in NYS via http://newyorkcommitteemen.org/lawsuit/lawsuit.html and the committeeman lawsuit.

Here check out my www.WNYRepublicans.com website. This is one of my strategies. It is a site that teaches on the problems with the party and the solutions. They don't know how to handle this.

I have a whole section on how to do the committeeman process. It may not be the exact like your rules, but I am sure it is close. And, it is great inside information. You will be ahead of them.

If you can appointed, then do it. But don't worry about. Attend meetings, meet people, get some rapport going, ask someone what issues really bother you, and then educate Liberty on that topic. After a while, you will get respect because your friendly, have good information, and showing an interest in your nation.

Watch who their players are, remember there names. Another good thing is to get a good relationship with the secretary/person who answers the phone (you always want to get in with that person).

Oh, and, have fun doing this stuff. I relish it. They can't out intellect me, don't let them stress you out. I got more stressed out from the Liberty folks. lol...

***

Another interesting aspect, which I would like folks from other states to look into, is, that party did its power grap back in 1909-1911. They repealed the "George Washington" clause, and replace it. This is what took the power away from the committeeman (the people) and gave it to the party.

So the power folks set up the party structure before they did the Fed. It is all there on the site.

Here is my site describing my first 6 months in the party. Some good stuff here.

www.CheektowagaRepublicans.com

Okay..

So I'm a bit confused because we don't have committeemen. We have committee members and then committee officers which are the Chairman, 1st&2nd Vice Chair, Treasurer, secretary and finally parliamentarian. Both the officers and regular members are elected except for appointed seats.

So I'm guessing this "committeemen" position is the same as a regular member on my county. This stuff is confusing!!!

Who lives in Sacramento that know's this stuff or on is on a committee that has similar rules? We need a site like that for our county!!!!

Do you have a town committee?

We have a town committee, then the county committee, then the state committee. Look at the link at the top menu, see the rules of the different committee?

For us, when you become a town committeeman, which is what I am, you then are "automatically" a county committee member. However, us Liberty folks don't go by their term - member of the committtee, we just call ourselves Committeeman like before 1911. Study the committeeman links and you will see images of the tow different petition sheets. We do not use the party's petition sheet, we do our own.

Yes, you need to hook up with some folks in your county/state.

The party does not know how to deal with me. I try to always be one step ahead of them. Then do not know what I will do next, or what questions I will ask. In a very poor analogy, it is like I am Dr. Paul and they are Bernanke. I ask questions on the rules that they probably have never been asked before. So they fish for answers, which I then question them on later. It's fun.

Another person and I started this site www.VeteranShowdown.com. This is so we can control debates.

I announced these sites with a handout at a county roundtable meeting and they are just swirling. You see, I am putting out there like I am the all-around Top Republican and they are not.

The Ultimate Debate we setup a few months ago was a candidate against the party's favorite. Here I am announcing a debate, with a flyer, against their guy, at their meeting. Priceless!

Hummm...

So I believe there are town/city committees and a county committee. But I don't think every single city within the county has their own committee. I went to the county committee meeting. Members from the town/city committees attend the county committees also.

So I want to be on the county committee. I talked to the party representative (one who answers the phone/email) on what to do while I was there but got little info except that I have to run in my precinct. But I don't know what docs to file or when to file them.

I went to the county elections site and there is no information on how to apply to run as a party committee member.

So this is what I think have to do. I have to obtain the current member of my precinct's petition and basically copy the format. Then get the necessacary signatures by using a list of registered republicans in my precinct.

Submit it and If I filled it properly I'll be on the R ballot for that position in my precinct.

Then I spend my time looking at that list of R's in my precinct and knock on doors and let them know about myself and positions and ask for their vote.

If I win I'm a member and if not it'll be the other person running.

That site is very informative!! I remember hearing I need to gather up signatures for a petition but they did not have a templet.

It's as if they have nothing written down, and only people in the know become members.

When I say, staying one step ahead ...

I didn't ask the party how to petition. I guess we have been fortunate here that some folks over the last 6 or 8 years ago, starting figuring all this out.

Follow my insturctions on How to Become A Committeeman. Things are in a certain order. The whole plan of attack is there.

If like here, the board of elections will have what you need.

When you ask the party, they will most likely not give you anything. That is there game. The also will not answer emails.

Keep records of the date, time, and everyhting you did with them. Save all emails. Even thought they never respond.

Each thing you do, where they showed no integrity, is a card you hold. They may only be deuces or fives, but later, it is knowing when and how to use them. That is why, I think they don't want to mess with me.

Another thing is, ask questions to the state party attorney. They don't want to lie.

When I play my cards, I then reference all those contacts, and make them look like what they are, Soviets.

***

Anther story. I asked about the state convention for endorsing US Senate candidates and stated I wanted to go to it. Now remember, they don't announce this stuff so they were wondering how I found out about this convention. I contacted the state attorney, their secretary, my county chair, his executive director, and the state executive director for chairman Cox. Asked them all the same questions. Each one gave a little more infomaation thann the next. So by the time I called the county chair and exec the second time, they knewe, that I knew, about the guest inviataions ... I said to put me on the guest list and I will be at the converniton in that city.

They never sent me the guest form. And you have to show i.d. to enter.

So I showed up. I waited until the place was crowded at the registration table with a long line. I waved to my chair and the exec. When it was my turn, they couldn't find my name. They asked and I told them I was a guest. They asked by whom. I stated by our county chairman Mick, right over there. She started looking around at her fellow workers, and the people in line were wondering what is going on. All of a sudden a lady came out of the blue and told the lady, - He's al right. Let him in. I showed no i.d., had no form, they gave me Guest dog collar, and I was in.

Be a James Bond, and be one step ahead.

fairly decent and intelligent people don't like

hanging out with ignorant, cruel, stupid people.

Its as simple as that.

And the kindness "treat them like they are children and help them learn thing" has gotten old for me. Sitting in GOP meetings since Ron Paul's Rally for the Republic Political training has been literally sickening to me. Listening to how they would say things like,

"I heard on Hannity..." or

"Let's just turn the Middle East into a glass bowl..."

"They are just animals over there. They hate America."

"teachers are the problem!"

I can't take it anymore. I'm done. I disaffiliated yesterday.

I can't stand it. Especially when I heard a Ron Paul delegate from Maine say, "They want us to bend?! Soon they will bend to our will!!" That's just as scary to me.

Since early 2008 I have been holding monthly, open to all political persuasions, free meetings at the local library to discuss current events and how they relate to The Constitution. I quickly learned that people did not read so I began showing films and finding guest speakers to discuss issues that Ron Paul had been addressing during his 2007/08 campaign. Although most in the audience knew that I was Ron Paul supporter, the mention of Ron Paul as a personality was fairly seldom over the past 4 years. The Freedom Is Fundamental Book Club and Discussion Group started with 7 members and grewn to over 120 (local only) members. www.meetup.com/freedomisfundamental (look through the past meetUps and see what we covered)

I got elected as an alternate delegate to the RNC most likely because I knew my neighbors via the bookclub (not because of GOP involvement - they really didn't care for me)

I am totally burnt out from seeing first hand how fixed and made for TV all this political stuff is. My state was THE ONLY PRIMARY STATE to actually elect Ron Paul delegates with 25% of the popular vote. I think this is because of people just talking to each other. Lord knows that the Ron Paul campaign was not doing ANYTHING here in the state.

THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO DO IS KEEP TALKING TO PEOPLE.

I think my flights back and forth to the RNC when I was engaged in lighthearted, good conversation with the people sitting next to me was the best use of my time that week. I saw light bulbs going on over their heads. And I think that is really what it is all about - what the goal should be. The US (and most of the world) is in a "dark age" in terms of Liberty right now. Once enough mental light bulbs are on - the rest can't help but see the light.

I guess the integrity I am looking for is,

what is the plan then?

I learned to discuss the Articles of Confederation as education but also had to accept that if the people are having much difficulty accepting the Constitution, to not even pursue trying to convince people that we have to go with the Articles - now.

If people are waiting for the SHTF, I would appreciate to here people say it. That can be respected. But to not want to work for governing, diss it, and not have a plan, it is then just complaining.

Bump.

.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

Those of you who argue that

Those of you who argue that getting involved in GOP activism is the only way to contribute to the liberty movement, well, you have a failure of imagination.

There are many ways to contribute that doesn't require spending time with neocons, or bothering folks via cold calling. There's research, education, writing, producing videos, blogging, commenting on MSM web stories, letters to the editors, and just plain one-on-one discussion with family, friends and aquaintances.

I don't say this to discourage anyone who want's to go the GOP route, but for crissake, you guys gotta knock off the " join the GOP or you're not helping BS".

Let everybody find their own way and encourage them to do so rather than trying to guilt everybody into playing house with the close-minded troglodytes that make up the mainstream GOP.

Nothing's going to happen for us politically anyway until we have greater numbers. Increasing the number of liberty minded voters should be a goal, along with increasing the number of liberty minded folks in the GOP.

Never trouble trouble til trouble troubles you. Fortune Cookie

Talking about governing.

I believe a lot of people start by doing a sign wave, then they start informing people to be aware, then they usually ask - what can I do that has more involvement.

In the end, the nation still has to be governed. If the good people don't put the effort in, then the bad guys have a free reign. That is what happened and that is what we have.

We have to govern.

Or, we have to convince our

Or, we have to convince our fellow humans to vote only for those who will more or less just leave us alone.

All I'm saying is your way isn't the only way to help.

Never trouble trouble til trouble troubles you. Fortune Cookie

It's not my way.

It's about who is going to be the "those" and help do the work to get "those" in office.

Go for it! I'm all for you

Go for it! I'm all for you getting involved. Run! Convince me you're a libertarian, or even just a liberty oriented pol and I'll not only vote for you, I'll work on convincing my family and friends to do the same, and if you really look good, I'll even contribute some money.

Just stop with the holier than though crap if I don't choose to spend my time in the same manner.

I've been an activist, 30+ years ago. I've done my time and my head is bruised from banging it against the wall, trying to convince folks who aren't ready to hear the message.

I'll do my thing and you do your's and neither of us downgrade the other, how 'bout that? Sound kinda libertarian?

Never trouble trouble til trouble troubles you. Fortune Cookie

Yes.

Then let my post not be targeted to you. However, I am sure it is giving some others folks something to think about.

I plus'ed you back up, someone downgraded you.

Here's an easy one for people to do:

Buy some clip-on bicycle lights for 2-5 dollars each. Donate them to their local police dept. to give to people who don't have headlights for their bikes. This way they can be protecting and serving while avoiding writing a ticket and sending people off without the safety of a light which isn't a very nice thing to do.

I saw the best minds of my generation, destroyed by pandas starving hysterical naked

-Allen Ginsberg

egapele's picture

A clear sign of a failing Republic

when an irate minority does not have a voice. I guess we all have to start getting a little louder.

Thank you

.

If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.
James Madison

DONT GIVE UP

Skip the libertarians. They are a complete waste of time.

GET TO KNOW YOUR NEIGHBORS.

Canvass your precinct with a list of 10 liberty oriented questions. Find the 80%+ers. Then get to know THEM better. Start an email list. Update them on local goings on in politics: bond issues, school board issues, GOP party meetings, whatever.

They will appreciate you for it. You wont believe how much. You will gain so much respect. Then you have a base to work from. You'll learn who your true PERSONAL allies are and then you can work together to get party officer and central committee slots.

KEEP GOING. Just do it on your own and quit trying to herd libertarian cats. It's a complete and utter waste of time.

I mean just think through the math of it. If the libertarians joined the GOP, we'd OWN it by now. But they can't. Because they cannot play on a team if their lives depended on it (which it does by the way, they just don't realize it yet and wont, unfortunately, till it's too late.)

I have done well in my district.

I am talking more about getting "us" to get out there and do the same. I spent much time trying to get our folks out there and do the same. That has just been a horrible experience. I am obviously not happy with the RP folks in my area.

I left you a pm.