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Zerohedge: Tungsten-Filled 10 Oz Gold Bar found in Manhatten Jewelry District

It is one thing for tungsten-filled gold bars to appear in the UK, or in Germany: after all out of sight, and across the Atlantic, certainly must mean out of mind, and out of the safe.

However, when a 10 ounce 999.9 gold bar bearing the stamp of the reputable Swiss Produits Artistiques Métaux Précieux (PAMP, with owner MTP) and a serial number (serial #038892, likely rehypothecated in at least 10 gold ETFs across the world but that's a different story), mysteriously emerges in the heart of the world's jewerly district located on 47th street in Manhattan, things get real quick.

Moments ago, Myfoxny reported that a 10-ounce gold bar costing nearly $18,000 turned out to be a counterfeit.

The discovery was made by the dealer Ibrahim Fadl, who bought the PAMP bar in question from a merchant who has sold him real gold before. "But he heard counterfeit gold bars were going around, so he drilled into several of his gold bars worth $100,000 and saw gray tungsten -- not gold. The bar was filled with tungsten, which weighs nearly the same as gold but costs just over a dollar an ounce."

read more (and photo evidence) http://www.zerohedge.com/news/tungsten-filled-10-oz-gold-bar...

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This isnt exactly that new

This isnt exactly that new but is still something to keep in mind. One thing though is that it isnt that hard to discover a fake even without drilling. Gold has a specific atomic weight and comparing that to the volume would give you a pretty good idea if its correct or not.

To climb the mountain, you must believe you can.

Look at the periodic table

It's not so easy to find tungsten this way. There *is* a reason why counterfeiters choose tungsten.

They may be close in weight

They may be close in weight per volume, but not exact and anyone who deals in expensive amounts is probably able to afford the precision measuring device that can easily detect the difference.

To climb the mountain, you must believe you can.

Disinformation?

From jsmineset.com:

"Jim Sinclair’s Commentary

My opinion is this is disinformation. The diamond district in NYC is Hassidic Jewish.

Nobody cons those guys."

I agree with Jim Sinclair. The physical market is getting tight. This is one way that they try to curb demand for physical gold.

Gold Dust Bugs

With modern technology it should be easy to carry gold dust around in portable, personalized dispensers with miniature scales that measure both quality and quantity. The possibilities are endless.

just hope its not windy?

just hope its not windy?

A nation of sheep breeds a government of wolves.

No Kidding!! :)

That could be a problem, but lighting a cigarette was also problematic for smokers until the market developed special lighters as a solution. :)

Not being a gold "expert",

Not being a gold "expert", this is exactly what I thought would eventually happen in a hot gold market. I suspected more "corked gold" would be coming from China or India.

just pointing this out: since

just pointing this out:

since gold bars are essentially never melted down, what difference does it make if the bar is truly solid gold or just believed to be solid gold (aside from the fraud aspect)? money only has whatever value the individual places on it.

or to put this in a metaphor: if a fraudulent gold bar is traded, unbeknownst between to people, is anyone affected?

So counterfeiting is okay and

So counterfeiting is okay and affects no one? You can't be serious.

i never condoning

i never condoning counterfeiting, i'm just saying the object has the value of whatever people place on it, for the object has no inherent value.

Duh... No it does not have an existential value!

You are forgetting the manufacturer, who made it with 'X' ingredients, but fraudulently sold it as 'X x 100' ingredients! That is fraud since it deceives and steals in one fell swoop! Never mind what people thought about it down the chain!

Stick with reality folks!

it does to the person who

it does to the person who eventually has it refined. I work for a refiner and we melt everything that comes through the door to ensure we have one homogenous piece of metal to assay.

A nation of sheep breeds a government of wolves.

Buyers beware...

How to spot a fake:
http://www.dailypaul.com/255425/guide-how-to-spot-a-fake-gol...

A good way to defend your freedoms: www.libertymagazine.org

More Regulation! Track Buyers and Sellers!

I can see it now: the Gold police.

What do you think? http://consequeries.com/

Yeah! Better yet, make it a

Yeah! Better yet, make it a division of the FED and make everyone send their gold in to be checked and stored, and they can send back certificates in return.

Hold on, puking...

End The Fed!
BTC: 1A3JAJwLVG2pz8GLfdgWhcePMtc3ozgWtz

dont forget to add an

dont forget to add an embedded RFID and GPS

Your comment gave me a good laugh...!!!

Darn... RFID and GPS in the gold bars...LOL....!!!!

thats good, usually I try to

thats good, usually I try to find a way to laugh instead of cry at the ridiculousness we endure

All they would need

to do would be to accurately weigh it. And then put it in a bucket of water, and calculate how much water it displaces. That would easily show any discrepancy. If they wanted to increase the weight per given volume, they would have to add something heavier, like Lead, along with the Tungsten, but the volume still would not be just right.

Let the buyer beware!

Lead is a lot lighter. Tungsten is very similar.

Gold has a gravity of 19.32, tungsten is 19.25, lead is 11.35. At the shop we use seventy lb. bars of tungsten for balancing crankshafts and I can attest it is waaaay heavier than lead.

"Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty" TJ

Use a magnet.

Tungsten is ferrous, and will stick to a magnet. No need to drill the bar even.

Josh Brueggen
Engineer
Entrepreneur
Gardener
Jack of all Trades
Precinct Commiteeman Precinct 5 Rock Island Co Illinois

Ummm...no

Tungsten is a chemical element with a density very similar to gold. The term "ferrous" generally indicates the presence of iron, another chemical element. Tungsten alloys can be magnetic but will not have a density similar to gold. Many solids on earth are weakly magnetic, such as tungsten, however weakly magnetic materials are commonly referred to as non-magnetic in comparison with ferromagnetic materials. For example iron oxide is greater than 100 times more magnetic than tungsten. An object made of tungsten would not respond to a magnet.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/tables/magprop.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tungsten

These reports are saved and come out every time Gold Rallies.

It being used as a tool to suppress gold and metals in general. Post articles everywhere about forcing sellers to drill the gold in a spot you chose. Have Ron initiate legislation to make sellers to be bonded How about the creation of jobs , Open your own metals verification store. A spin is needed here.

Just the tip of the iceberg most likely.

Guess it's a good thing I can't afford to buy 10 ounce gold bars.

I wonder if coins are suspect too.

Although maybe the effort with 1 oz coins may not be worth the reward.

But then again maybe it is.

I'll stick to 1/2 oz coins or smaller. Bigger premiums but safer I presume.

"We have allowed our nation to be over-taxed, over-regulated, and overrun by bureaucrats. The founders would be ashamed of us for what we are putting up with."
-Ron Paul

Yup

Gotta be careful with gold bullion coins too:

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/rust-discovered-bank-russia...

END THE FED 22nd SEP

come on guys.. its coming up quick we need this on the front page.

Here is a link to my post, but if you don't like it make your own up or vote someone elses up.. I don't care simply get this on the front page.

http://www.dailypaul.com/255310/international-end-the-fed-da...

hmm

Jewellery
Goldman
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Diamond

Luke 3:38
Isaiah 43:3-5

Cyril's picture

FUNKY !

FUNKY !

... of a story.

Thanks for sharing.

I knew I can't trust gold. j/k

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.

http://Laissez-Faire.Me/Liberty

"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

The jewelry district is where

The jewelry district is where you'd expect this to be discovered. That's where the gold bars actually get converted into something else (even if it happens that THIS one was slated for reselling rather than jewelry manufacture.)

= = = =
"Obama’s Economists: ‘Stimulus’ Has Cost $278,000 per Job."

That means: For each job "created or saved" about five were destroyed.