38 votes

What will the collapse realistically look like in America?

We all hear of this inevitable collapse of our economy, and quite possibly our liberties, from just about everybody. What I don't really hear being talked about or asked is what this collapse will actually look like. Things like: will there be mass starvations? Will we be fighting off rioters? Will we just not get to eat out as much, or will we all be living in vans down by the river?

Does anybody have realistic insight into this so we may all gain a clearer picture of what is apparently to come?

Thank you,
Brandon

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Good crack at it

Good crack at. I gave credit and added to it above.

Very well said

I believe it will not be The Crash, but instead The Great Slouch. Life will get harder, one day at a time, until we are so used to high prices and shortages that we will not remember what it was like to own multiple tv's, multiple cars, vacation homes (or even have vacations!).

This will not happen overnight. It will happen over years. Because it will be slow, people will adjust and life will go on, however meanly.

I fear that the People will get used to their chains and will not long for freedom, because they won't remember it.

It depends on if you live in the city or rural

just watch the series: Jerico, it's probably fairly accurate. Some people probably will die, mostly people living in cities who do not know how to provide for themselves. Small towns, people will probably take care of each other better.

Tom W.

Do you guys remember the TV

Do you guys remember the TV series Dark Angel?

That's my idea of what America may look like after a collapse.

Don't worry

As the dollar collapse, they will have a electronic currency already set up and ready to go. First it will probably be a type of credit card, then movie to a type of bar code that they tatoo on your hand, then the government owns you. All other type of physical currency will be illegal.

Don't Worry?

Are you being sarcastic I hope?

skippy

lol

NO, I'm being serious! DUH! Of course I am being sarcastic! HELP ME, I can't stop being sarcastic! lol kidding
In all seriousness, yes, I was being sarcastic. This stuff really scares me.

lol

Haha

Ya, I saw that! I couldn't stop laughing. lol thanks for sharing. :)

"then the government owns you"

When bartering with debt notes created from nothing, technically, they already do.

True

True, but I think they will really start cracking the whip. It's scary to me.

I have more faith in humanity

I have more faith in humanity than this. Maybe not Americans, but some place will stay free.

Maybe New Hampshire..

If the liberty movement really focuses on the north east, New Hampshire, Maine, Vermont and maybe Conneticut, we can keep that part of the country free, and maybe secceed like Lakota did.

Catalysts

I think the shape of the collapse will depend on the catalyst for the event. If a bomb goes off, panic may ensue and the government may have to step in to restore order, causing protests and internments until one side has all the control. Either we win or we end up in the camps.

The more likely scenario I believe is inflation and unemployment. The fiscal cliff will likely result in more defaults. The government's response will be to buy more debt. Our government is also seriously dependent on income taxes and excises from things like gasoline, tobacco, etc. As people become unemployed, both sources of revenue for the government will decline. Count on the government to try and make up for this shortfall in some way or another. To me, this means a second fiscal cliff (FC2). FC2 will likely target upper middle classes and higher, as those will be the ones with money to be taken.

I think that during this phase, people will be moving around to any area of the country that they think is better. This could take the form of people moving to areas where they can live in meager accommodations on a farm, trading labor in exchange for some food and shelter.

As inflation goes up, basic government programs like foodstamps, TANF, etc., won't keep up with inflation. Government will either have to limit their level of support for these programs or continue to raise taxes on those left to be taxed. I think the excess taxation will make trading labor more appealing. If you make $100 an hour and pay 90% of that in taxes, would you not be better off to get $11 an hour in equivalent food and shelter?

It is at this point that things can get pretty hairy. You have more people opting out of getting paid in Dollars since that all goes to the government. This is where faith in the dollar comes near to an end. It doesn't buy much and the government takes most of it. What happens at this point is pretty confusing. The government will not tolerate "under the table" type work and will crackdown to restore what they are losing in taxable revenue. I think we'll hear stories of communal farms being raided by government thugs and asset seizures. After a few of these, it might start getting violent. The government will start having curfews and controlling people's movements. Expect to see regular roadblocks that are mostly "asset audits" to see if you are suspected of unreported income. Looking poor might not be a bad idea if you have anything.

The other side of the confusion is the what-if scenario of the government being unable to support their troops. If the government can't keep you fed, would you stay or go AWOL? Some troops would desert, some would probably steal from people at the above "asset audits" to keep for themselves. Paying troops in dollars also wouldn't let them buy much. Over an extended period of time, distrust in the dollar might even lead to it's outright rejection. Anyone with dollars might be suspected of being part of the government.

Over the long term, I think the large governments would be unsustainable and would diminish to very small functions and may even cease at some point. During that transition, quality of life would be low. The following restoration is another topic altogether.

What I don't expect to happen is some eery world where people with guns are running around stealing from others in some post-apocalyptic world. I think poaching from farms and ranches will increase and those citizens smart enough to be armed can find employment as guards on such farms and ranches. The better protected of these will be the ones that resist government crackdowns on labor bartering. Since we have a small population of gun owners with real weapons, I think there ought to be some good job opportunities for farm mercenaries. If you would rather guard the farm than pull the tomatoes, I suggest getting some firepower and learning how to use it. If you live in a state that permits Title 3 weapons like Nevada, you might want to pay the $200 tax if you can get your hands on some quality merchandise.

________________________________________

Right on with the "asset audits"...

Right on with the "asset audits". Those will be regular feature for a while, although as you imply, they won't be feasible to administrate forever, being labor-intensive exercises on the part of gov't.

Bartering and non-reported cash sales are already under assault, even moreso by state gov'ts (i.e.: the recent crackdown on garage sales in where? Louisiana or somewhere south, I think?).

And definitely account / investment asset siezure will occur. People who have invested over the years to fatten their nest eggs, or who assume they'll be able to justly pass down their assets as inheritance to their children are really in for a nasty surprise! Safety deposit boxes in banks are a dumb idea. Gold and silver certificates are even sillier--those things being meant for the most gullible among us!

I think they'll use and further perfect the surveillance system and search & seize protocols already in place for as long as possible for confiscatory purposes. I think they'll really push hard and early with this "program". People who have been above board with investing / accruing assets... and registering their firearms will be the hardest hit (Remember that if you pay the tax, your name is on the list.).

What would the Founders do?

Comedy Relief

Sorry folks...Chris Farley at his best: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbLRqJ3T4DY

I couldn't resist.

Don't know how bad it will be...

In 1988, I thought the world would end, so bought nearly a thousand dollars worth of rations for survival - much of it nasty tasting. Have packed it through several moves.

Finally figured we should do what are good ideas even if there is no crash. Buying food in bulk, and rotating it, eating the oldest stuff first is always a good idea. Have water and other supplies on hand. Be ready for natural disasters, etc. Many people can't go more than a few days without power or going to the store.

I would think those in charge don't want a big collapse. It is said that a successful parasite does not kill the host. They want to rip us off at a rate we will tolerate and not rebel. Question is whether they are smart enough to avoid the death of society.

1988

You must have read the book, "Eighty-eight reasons the world will End in 1988" LOL -- bet they aren't selling many copies of that book anymore!

Didn't read the book....

Was part of religion - Jesus was just about to usher in the second coming and chaos would ensue. Of course, Jesus has been almost coming for hundreds of years now.

A van down by the river...

lol Nice one.

Stagflation and a mixed bag of all of the above.

BUMP

SHTF

Ez

The collapse will be a federal

govt collapse, our huge advantage over the rest of the world is that we have powerful, rich, organized, states. Just stay away from the cities. That is where the chaos will be.

If the collapse comes, I'm

If the collapse comes, I'm moving to Lancaster county and joining the Amish.

You're Right!

I don't know if you intended to but you hit the nail on the head in my opinion. An important question is; Would the Amish even know there was a collapse? I have read comments all the way to yours and think yours is the most important to contemplate. Only once in all the comments above did I see anything that mentioned leadership. Fear and panic would be the biggest danger and the best answer to that is good leadership. I can't imagine that you would see the same result under Obama, Romney and Paul. This is totally my own opinion but the first two would be looking for an outcome that would advantage them and their friends and I don't need to tell anyone here who Paul would be looking out for.

Realistic collapse...

My guess is that we look towards what has happened before. It will probably be a mixture of Zimbabwee, Germany in the 20's, and more than anything the collapse in Argentina about 5-10 or so years ago.

If you want to have an idea read a great blog by Ferfal who blogged right through the collapse in Argentina and has blogged since. I also think he has written some books on the topic of survival.

Check it out at: http://ferfal.blogspot.com/

Don't think so. You are

Don't think so. You are talking about a single country collapse. This has the makings of something all new... a global... No one will be able to bail anyone else out. Well... except for the world bank with the new one world currency and one world government. This will be far more than anything history has ever shown us.

I don't think this will be worldwide

because Iceland has already demonstrated how to avoid the collapse: Arrest, try, and imprison the bankers and complicit politicians. They took this option in 2009 after the 2008 collapse, and they are over with it all and are one of the few growing economies today.

The dollar is the world

The dollar is the world reserve currency... If it goes down so does the globe.....

I just moved to Amish country from California.

I'm already buying a lot of my day to day food direct from some of their farms.

This might be a bit naive of me as I'm not from around here but I'm hoping that I might get to know a few of them enough to where I can help out on the farm in trade for learning how to grow food off the grid style.

Not sure if the collapse will be dramatic and quick or subtle and drawn out. What I do know is that the older I get, the less I want to be dependent upon the system.

Great comments on this thread by the way. Keep em coming!

you know

You can volunteer on a farm today at wwoof.com

His name is Edward Snowden

What is Capitalism?
http://youtu.be/yNF09pUPypw