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What will the collapse realistically look like in America?

We all hear of this inevitable collapse of our economy, and quite possibly our liberties, from just about everybody. What I don't really hear being talked about or asked is what this collapse will actually look like. Things like: will there be mass starvations? Will we be fighting off rioters? Will we just not get to eat out as much, or will we all be living in vans down by the river?

Does anybody have realistic insight into this so we may all gain a clearer picture of what is apparently to come?

Thank you,
Brandon




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On the contrary, a complete collapse will turn otherwise normal

law abiding citizens who aren't moochers to turn to criminal life.

People who don't know how to survive without stealing will resort to all manner of horrible actions to feed themselves and their families.

I wouldn't count on seeing too many people wiped out unless we experience an EMP in the collapse.

If anything, those more likely to die are those who will be victims of the thieves, gangs, and the government goon squads.

During the Great Depression

folks weren't as helpless as they are today. And they didn't have the ginormous police state to deal with. I think it's gonna be ugly.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign: that the dunces are all in confederacy against him. ~J. Swift

It's part of the elites plan

It's part of the elites plan to control where we live, what we eat, where we work, whether we live or die, and what we think. For them to do this, we must be dependent on them and the system. What control would they have if we were self-sufficient?

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Shortages.

There are other good posts here on what to expect so I shall focus simply on what I see as the game plan of the elites.

The central banks will continue to issue credit (QE) at an accelerating pace. The consequence will be burgeoning balance sheets for the big banks while long term interest rates continue to fall. This will cause severe pain in the SME sector of the economies of the world as their long term liabilities increase with the falling interest rates.

Many of these businesses will try to survive by selling off inventory and firing staff but will eventually go belly up and be swallowed by the mega corporations. This will cause a dramatic short to medium term deflation in consumer durables and other goods distributed by SME companies but an increase in the prices of anything sold by the big corporations especially food and energy.

The failure of so many companies will result in massive unemployment and the resulting foreclosure on homes supported by the workers' earnings. There will be a further extreme fall in real estate prices except in the up market homes for the very wealthy who will continue to benefit from the depression.

The decline in incomes will mean less support for credit so bankruptcies will increase. The big banks will continue to prosper from the bond market manipulations and have no incentive to issue credit to SME's or individuals unless they are very well secured. These banks will continue to consolidate their industry and decrease the number of banks available to the consumer. The banks will begin to form rental corporations to rent out the properties they are sequestrating. The government will be under pressure to provide housing benefits to the impoverished former property owners to meet the rental payments.

This will provide a guaranteed cash flow to the banks who will support this move. More power will move to the centre and States will be compelled to concede land to Federal agencies for housing development to meet the demand for low rental housing. This will be provided by the big construction corporations who by then will have swallowed up the SME builders.

The increase in fuel costs will result in breakdowns in supply lines as SME transport corporations fail and during the interim while they are being reorganised into divisions of the big corporate transport networks there will be shortages of every kind. This will also have the effect of putting upward pressure on prices of consumer perishables.

As you can see my underlying thesis is that the central banks will keep on issuing credit that will be used by the big banks to consolidate their industry and destroy the capital of SME businesses that are targeted for takeover by the big corporations that are controlled by the same people as control the big banks. If one follows the outcomes of this activity then the future picture will unfold. It is important to keep in mind that these events will take time to develop and it is in the interim that the pain will be felt at ground level. This is why it is advisable to keep a store of food and fuel to bridge that gap.

The goal of the oligarchy is to force people to accept their final model of government by depriving them of the most basic necessities for a long enough period of time to convince the majority to acquiesce in their plans.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

LOL

Living in a van down by the river!

How I see The Collapse playing out

1) The Fed will continue to (drastically) increase the money supply, triggering hyperinflation.

2) Imports will be greatly curtailed, as few are willing to accept payment in a teetering currency which loses value daily.

3) The people will rush to purchase hard assets before the dollar is rendered completely worthless, first emptying/closing the banks, and then the stores.

4) Without access to banks, most businesses will be unable to make payroll and be forced to close (including food distributors and trucking companies).

5) Food distribution will break down. The people will seek food from local sources, but will find that very few such sources still exist today.

This will lead to a massive humanitarian disaster far worse than the Great Depression:

In the 30's, there were family farms everywhere (many of which were near self-sufficiency). Today, the few farms that do exist are extremely dependent on technology and supplies from outside sources. If a critical part breaks that can no longer be replaced (see below), or fuel and/or grain supplies are disrupted, the farm shuts down.

30's technology was relatively simple. Most machines were composed of basic parts of limited number (the great majority of which were manufactured in the US). Today's machines are very complex and are composed of a huge number of parts from all over the world. Thus, the failure of one part manufacturer (or the cutoff of their imports) can easily trigger the failure of all who depend on that part.

The 30's US population was around 125 million. Today, it is 300 million. So even if we all knew how to live off the land, it is questionable as to whether the land could sustain so many without the super-efficiency of today's modern/highly-technological farms.

We used to have a strong manufacturing base (and thus were not dependent on imports for our very survival). Today, we make virtually nothing (and have largely forgotten how to do so). Hence, it will be extremely difficult to "boot-strap" our way back to a technological society.

Americans used to possess incredible know-how:
They knew how to build and repair things.
They knew how to farm.
They knew how to hunt and dress game.
They knew how to preserve food.
How many of us posses such skills today ?

Americans used to be a generally-moral people. Few resorted to violence or theft to get food. How will today's Americans (many of whom feel "entitled" to everything) will respond when hungry ?

My advice ?: GET YOUR LOVED ONES OUT OF HERE WHILE YOU STILL CAN !

To the stay and fight types: Philosophy and patriotism are fine, but they won't feed your family.

And besides, this ain't gonna be no fight for liberty (as many fantasize), but an ugly/brutal fight for survival.

The feds/military will quickly be rendered impotent
(being massively outnumbered by the mobs, and their access to fuel greatly limited), and Obomni will be demoted to the Mayor of DC (or his hidy-hole).

See Smudge Pot's post below for a similar take.

Makin' good sense, BUT ....

Makin' good sense, BUT ....

I fear it will go like this:

The Feds will NOT become quickly impotent, methinks.

Or at least the centralized power structure / the people who have authority / access to the weapons. They'll likely move over to the corporate security forces mentioned in another poster’s comments. In essence, feds will = corporate servants--as they already do--but it will be blatant. National security will exponentially morph into corporate/elite security--again, a process well underway (and one to which people here have alluded). Certain state governors will be useful pawns in this strategy, too. The governments of what I call "federal lackey states" will sacrifice the freedoms of their residents just for power / to be on the winning team, having been promised federal funding, etc. to get them through these god-awful economic times. (Case in point: observe how state governments have by and large been conditioned to be whores for federal money as things stand now....)

I digress. This will likely happen during a time of overwhelmingly heavy-handed martial law. Staggering. The true controllers of our hijacked government will be full of bluster while we all scramble just to survive. They won't have to hide jack squat anymore, because the few people who pay attention and who are dissentious will have already been targeted and made FEMA campers or likely worse ($385M to Haliburton for jails in '06). Plus, keep in mind, the elite plan a kill-off of the population. This WILL happen (or they'll attempt it in earnest) while they still have all the power. Bioweapons or whatever. One shudders to think. Some semi-fictional towel heads will be accused (Or more effectively, patriot groups will be blamed.). But the proverbial wind must be knocked out of the sails of our citizenry en masse. Bad economy isn't enough; we must be dealt a blow so unimaginably crushing and far-reaching that we will all comply with authority, being literally at their mercy.

The mercenaries will be used in nothing less that corporate-authorized strikes on the masses. Offensive military actions. All will be justified. There will be divided pockets of resistance and little more. Do bear in mind that the internet will be turned off. We will NOT be able to coordinate anything, as we’ve lost the old-fashioned abilities / means to do so. Our analog radio frequencies/channels belong to the government. All will be monitored. Those who resist will be, insofar as news and public awareness are concerned, locally—and very quietly—snuffed out. All stories will be spun by state media.

They're arming up to their eyeballs, and when federal/corporate LE, etc. folk are given the choice between starving like the rest of us or taking their pay and clamping down, they'll choose the latter. They're being conditioned to view patriots & regular ol' American folks as the enemy (I mean, sh*t, there was that FEMA training vid in which the *sshole nazi teacher [who should be publicly hanged for treason] refers to our Founders as "terrorists"!). Millions and millions of rounds... and they will be used by someone. Whether it's Xe / Academi / Blackwater-type organizations, etc. or even foreign troops... it will be nasty.
And frankly, no amount of true patriots now in the ranks will make a difference. They'll be indentified ahead of time (like right NOW on Total Information Awareness / FaceBook, etc.) and removed.

This WILL go down. No amount of awakened protesters in the street will make a difference. Christ, look at NORTHCOM. And all those crowd control weapons systems. And drones over domestic airspace. And chemical scanners on the way. No amount of public political outcry will reverse this. Militia groups will make stands but will be crushed by military might (We don’t have missles or anti-aircraft or gun ships, now do we?). The elite are going to FIGHT to the DEATH for what they want; they've waited generations for this moment. That's why it is called ENDGAME. Perhaps the only chance we have to curb it is to literally carry out hits on those elites and people in control, at the very top, whom we can identify. And fast--before their security becomes completely impermeable. But who among us wants to do that?! It's insane! [And I'll probably get "Raubed" for saying it, too.... bye, y'all! TO GOV'T MONITOR: SWORN DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT ADVOCATING THIS, NOR WILL I ACT IN ANY SUCH MANNER! I AM PEACEFUL AND LAW-ABIDING (unlike you).] Plus, there are hundreds of them--or more? A couple thousand? When the first few get whacked, they'll circle the wagons and crack down. They're ready for this, too, you see. They're steps and steps ahead of us (Ha! And they’ve used OUR money to get there, too. Ain’t that a Bee!).

I had heard stories about the possibility of good patriot infiltrators trying to recapture control of our government… coinciding with something about Tesla-esque free energy being made available, but I regret to say I don't think they are true. I mean, WTF?! It's getting too late in the game to do anything. The time to act has nearly come & gone already. So sadly I don't believe we can count on any internal coup which reinstates the Republic in any way resembling a semi-peaceful transfer of power... as much as I wish it would happen.

The best efforts will be merely reactionary. There will be much suffering.

Too much writing, and sorry to be negative. I want nothing more than to be utterly proven wrong! And I will not give in or give up; au contraire, I’d rather jump into a pit of fire than submit… but it terrifies me that I will have the opportunity… because it will definitely be like a pit of fire.

What would the Founders do?

you make good points

And it could go the way you describe.
But i think (hope?) that they'll be hobbled by:

1) Their tiny numbers:
To impose martial law, they must have country-wide support at the local level. But decades of incessant media conditioning has split the country into red/blues, and only one side will be in power when TSHTF. The other will look upon the USG (and it's supporters) as the enemy (or at least w great suspicion). e.g. I can't see many conservatives (esp southerners) joining Obama's Brown Shirt Brigade. But I can see them undermining it at ever turn.

2) A lack of fuel:
Their big/bad toys eat it up, and it's a BIG country.
They'll have great difficulty obtaining more without a working infrastructure.

3) Their blind stupidity. They can barely dress themselves, let alone organize/impose martial law in such a large country.

Ah... now that IS interesting...

I see your point. The right v. left paradigm they've pushed so exhaustively may actually hinder their strategy. To where people's programmed distrust of one party or the other may not only prevent them from docile cooperation but may also fuel resistance. Hmmmm. But I think their efforts will (as they are already) be bipartisan; I mean, they'll really go to extraordinary lengths to up-sell the need for the scenario. We are a national security state after all, regardless of rep. or dem. in office. That budget only expands, and so, too, does the march toward utter rescindance of Constitutional authority and/or civil rights ultimately quicken. Clearly, it's the only "cause" that unites most of our *sshole federal government representatives: fecking us out of our rights to and freedoms from... under the bitterly comically played out guise of preserving our own safety. Dissenters in gov't could easily be Daschled or, much worse, Wellstoned into silence/compliance.

In order for the type of emergency (for which martial law could be sold as a necessary response) to come about, seriously bad stuff will need to happen / be instigated (to state the obvious). The economy still needs to tank to the required intensity level, which may take a little while longer? It's why I worry about a large scale false flag scenario--a direct attack on national security from within, a la hyper mass casualty event and subsequent destabilization. Like something big in DC.... mini nuke (blame Iran) & utter destruction of capitol buildings with some politicians inside, etc. Where they can then have carte blanche to kick arse and take names. Real shock 'n awe stuff. (Ha! Maybe the Federal Reserve Building will collapse [from a bag of popcorn burning in the microwave and resulting fires, presumably] neatly into its own footprint right before the audit... like WTC 7, what with all of the government and securities offices and the investigation into Enron, et al. LOL! Sorry.)

Conjecture is king.

But to your point, I agree: no, people won't roll over just cuz the prez says so... and gets his community organizers suited up... that would be almost laughable!

I think they can do more damage (and more competently) that it may seem. But I suppose I do forget at times precisely how friggin' big of a place this actually is. But that can work just as badly against patriots as well.

Anywho, let's hope you're right!

What would the Founders do?

I appreciate your take

But you said, "GET YOUR LOVED ONES OUT OF HERE WHILE YOU STILL CAN!" My question is - go where? I seriously can't think of anywhere to go where things will be any different. I'm not trying to be smart here - just wondering if you had a specific place you're thinking of moving to?

When the American spirit was in its youth, the language of America was different: Liberty, sir, was the primary object. - Patrick Henry

I will be staying put.

I am well off the main road and with a fair amount of land. Lots of timber and a good sized Garden. I am armed as well and am on good terms with the neighbors who maintain their own gardens.
My thought is move to the country well off any main roads if you are not there already. Cities are bad and close to the city limits is just as bad.

It is not a perfect solution but it is all I can offer.

good question - sorry i don't have much of an answer

Family obligations demand that i stay here (can't convince them to buy extra fn beans, let alone leave the country :-().
But i heard Paraguay is nice.

You are deluded if you think

You are deluded if you think we make nothing. We still make all kinds of parts. There are dozens of machine shops in my city alone capable of making any type of part you can imagine. What we do not manufacturer in this country are electronics. In the event of a collapse there will be a resurgance in the electronics industry to make necessary circuit boards. I myself can build a circuit for a certain purpose easily enough...but it wont be as pretty and will likely be physically much larger than an equivalent from China. The point being that its not our manufacturing capability that is lacking, the danger in a collapse comes from the disruption in supplies....if people are deprived of easily available food for just one week civilization will simply collapse. People will take their guns and rob other people for food, survival will quickly trump the basic kindness of man and some will use force to take whatever they want. What is the quote...3 square meals is all that stand between civilization and anarchy. On the other hand...maybe people these days are so dependent on government maybe they will just starve to death before surviving on their own. Hurricaine Katrina was a good example of what will happen though I guess.

I can hunt and dress game :)

I can hunt and dress game :)

Southern Agrarian

First 12 hours after collapse of the dollar

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-U1pBFYliE8

"Its easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled."
Mark Twain

It's been collapsing for 20+

This futuristic collapse of the American system has been going on for at least the last twenty years. Remember when Ross Perot (I) talked about that great sucking sound of jobs going overseas in 1992. The media (SNL debate skits) really made people laugh about it.
The price of gas is going up because of the decline in the value of the dollar, not supply and demand.
A few years ago, the average American family had around $8,000 in credit card debt...I'd venture to say it's almost doubled that nowadays. When people are using credit cards just to pay basic utilities to make it till next paycheck, and I know many that do, the collapse is going on right now in every neighborhood in Amerika.
When society has lost all it's freedoms (and we're there already) then total tyranny is usually right behind. That's what NDAA is for, so the Government can identify and detain those "trouble makers" who refuse to accept the "new system" of doing business.

Severe

survival pressure!

The creation, production and fair exchange of values is the business of evolving consciousness, love and life.--Craig Johnson

Dmitry Orlov wrote a book

Dmitry Orlov wrote a book comparing what's happening in America to the collapse of Russia. He says it will be much worse in America because the Russian people all had gardens, a place to live provided by the government and mass transit. Trends Forcaster Gerald Celente says the collapse is ongoing right now. More and more people are losing their jobs. Millions are receiving food stamps. Multi-generations of families are now living together. Crime is getting worse. At some point, America will resemble Greece and Spain. The value of the dollar continues to erode. Some of the people who still have jobs don't seem to notice what's going on yet, while their neighbors are suffering. America will have hyperinflation sometime within the next few years.

Yeah and it gets worse for us according to Orlov

Orlov points out that the soviet system where housing was guaranteed prevented mass evictions and the soviet system of food distribution continued long after the state had dissolved. This softened the impact of collapse bigtime.

Here we have no such help. Without money in this society, and given that it won't collapse overnight as in some places, there will be evictions and starvation. Food stamps won't exist as they do much longer and unfortunately our government has no methods of direct distribution of basic staple foods to people.

Get your preps together! Learn historic food storage and preservation methods and the science that makes them work now, start saving money and the future

Sure. Plenty of examples recently.

If you are wondering if it will happen suddenly, not really. It's happening right now.

First, people become agitated and riots begin. As economies grind to a halt, "public servants" decide service isn't paying and they begin first to try to uphold the power of the regime with all tools at their disposal: police and military.

This usually inspires further fragmentation and factionalization of the society including it's police and military. This leads to civil war, and those with power concentrate on preserving it. The people are left to themselves.

At first, things like having your own farm is great but then it just makes you are target. A man with a hunting rifle won't last long against a trained squad-level firing team and his land is now working against him: he's too far from his neighbours and his neighbours are concentrating on defending their farms and families but they are next.

Gold and silver hold buying power for a while until food runs out, then the only metal worth anything is "lead" and military grade weapons, and these simply because they give you a chance to obtain and keep possession of food and water.

Mobility then becomes key. Can you get away from violent areas and to areas with food and water?

The very young, the very old and the infirm begin to die in large numbers. Mass starvation becomes a factor. Life becomes cheap, survivors become numb to suffering. Profiteers and black marketeers can profit handsomely. And often the people will put their faith into madmen, religious zealots, what have you.

By this time the USA has ceased to exist as we know it but the corporations will be outfitted with their own armies protecting their own resources and they will be the new nation states. Unrestrained by any power, they become the new power, but this will be a feudal paradigm as corporations compete for natural and industrial resources. And that is what we'll be left with with no clear roadmap out.

Get your preps together! Learn historic food storage and preservation methods and the science that makes them work now, start saving money and the future

very succinct

smudgepot!
It captures/sums up most of what I have read on the subject.
From 'Failed State' analysts to 'testimonies' from eye witness accounts.
Well done and accurate.