17 votes

Someone Please Explain Why This Board Is Anti-GJ

Okay, I am a registered Libertarian, voted for RP in the last election (yes, that's right, I wrote him in). It seems he has come close to endorsing GJ, as well. Other persons I know who are long term libertarians (using a small "l" there, notice) all think that the GJ and Judge Gray ticket is the best thing since sliced bread, and are happy that if they can't vote for RP on the ballot, they have the GJ option.

What is the issue or issues that people have with Johnson, other than that he is not RP?

I have heard some say he is "pro war" but that is false - his position is remarkably similar to that of RP.

I have heard some say is "pro fed" but that is false - just look at his site or listen to him.

Some criticize his abortion stance - okay that is a legitimate difference in their ideology, but since both believe in the constitution/limited government, their mutual solution would be to get the fed govt out of the issue entirely.

Some criticize his stance on gay marriage - again, a difference in ideology but again, as libertarians, don't we want the govt, especially the feds, out of this issue? Isn't it done at the state level now anyway? So why is this a federal presidential issue anyway, then?

What then is the big problem?

(please note in advance that if you are a retard and just want to call me a commie, count the number of posts, or say that I am secretly employed by the illuminati/space aliens/al gore/ your mom, I will just laugh at your pathetic stupid butt. In other words, serious, intelligent responses are desired only.)

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"I will just laugh at your pathetic stupid butt."

No further message.

It's pretty easy to figure out

gj would not stop drone attacks in Pakistan or Yemen

http://dailycaller.com/2012/04/09/thedcs-jamie-weinstein-gar...

gj has said that at many places & now he's flip flopping as being Mr anti drones pandering

gj has Roger Stone as his major advisor

http://wredlich.com/ny/2011/12/the-problem-with-gary-johnson...

http://www.garyjohnson2012.com/roger-stone-gary-johnson-for-...

Roger Stone has never been a Libertarian while in the GOP. Roger Stone has worked for many neo con's & federal reserve appeasers. Roger Stone is well know as a junk GOP operative.

http://www.dailypaul.com/242145/article-roger-stone-infects-...

I think a majority here supports Johnson.

It's just that some people haven't made the connection with GJ and need to vent their frustrations. You can't effectively communicate with those in that frame of mind so it seems that only the negative folks chime in. I cannot determine any logic in the concept of a true Paul supporter not getting behind the Libertarian candidate, especially when it's a message we are trying to advance more than anything (which of course is necessary in order to carve the path to eventual change/freedom). The more people there are uniting with Johnson to send a clear message to the masses, the more powerful our voice. Who benefits from anything less? Life isn't getting longer for any one of us, so, how important it is to think about the value of your actions now. We've got mountains to move.

i think it's a matter of

i think it's a matter of people getting caught up in comparing Paul with Johnson, both personally and professionally. This movement is about changing american politics in the right direction, not withholding your vote for a reasonable alternative because you don't agree 100% with everything he says.

I'm voting for the

I'm voting for the libertarian party, not Johnson. Remember, it's about the MESSAGE, not the man, and by voting third party, I'm sending the message that I refuse to vote for the two-party duopoly AND choose another party instead.

you people getting caught up in the differences between the men are not seeing the bigger picture: if there is no libertarian next cycle, we won't have a choice for president, AGAIN. we'll just write-in our favorite guy and split our votes, while the two-party system rolls full steam ahead, rinse and repeat.

Somewhat perplexed

As to why GJ's stance, on those few issues that differ from RP's, are continually raised as the reason to dismiss any inherent advantages.
I think the libertarian RP'ers are trying to tell you it's irrelevant, as he simply 'isn't' going to win.
It's about the platform for the next election cycle, so your not faced with the same dual party dictatorship, marginalising anything that looks like opposition.
Mostly semantics though, as it would appear a sizeable portion of the populace is waking up to the looming economic crisis, and a backlash vote away from the R&D will favor 3rd party candidates.

As for the anti-GJ sentiment, possibly a case of two groups of fervent liberty supporters that simply won't give an inch, and leaves no middle ground for informed discussion.
None but Paul vs GJ is the best alternative.
Plus a little 'those pesky libertarians are coming here poaching our votes'. No need for trolls, it's all happening here.

"Hell is empty, and all the devils are here" (Shakespeare)
RP 2012~ Intellectual Revolution.

Foreign Policy

HUGE FOR ME!
http://libertycrier.com/politics/gary-johnson-neo-con-libera...
I notice the little things,for starters posts for Johnson started way before Tampa was here.!!!!!DING DING DING!

23% "Fair" Tax

collected at the federal level can be added to the list. But number 1 for me is his unwillingness to protect life:

GJ differs from Ron Paul on the vey essential element to protect liberty. RP says "Unless we understand…we must protect life, we cannot protect liberty."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkAsLPrnJGc&feature=player_em...
----------------
Ron Paul introduced Sanctity of Life Acts in 2005, 2007, 2009, 2011
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctity_of_Life_Act
"The Sanctity of Life Act would have defined human life and legal personhood (specifically, natural personhood) as beginning at conception,[7][8] "without regard to race, sex, age, health, defect, or condition of dependency."

Therefore, your statement that "their mutual solution would be to get the fed govt out of the issue entirely." Is false unless of course states have the right to murder innocent human life which would include the born and unborn.

If Gary Was This Big Libertarian then why did he not take

poll position ahead of ron paul when they ran? Shouldn't his record ( which you say is just like ron ) be more than enough to get him ABOVE RON PAUL?

If he is just a younger version of ron paul ( which should be a positive since rons age got brought up plenty ) with the same "inline with the constitution" stances that he supposedly will follow as president why didn't he catch fire until AFTER ron paul dropped out?

Shouldn't there have been plenty of liberty voters screaming GARY JOHNSON and him have his own rallies without needing to co-op the ron paul rallies held?

BTW

I wrote in Ron Paul here in California as did everyone else in my family. It isn't that I am against gary but rather FOR liberty and ron paul gets MY vote versus voting for the lesser of three evils.

Other candidates besides ron paul brought on their own excitement and gary seems to just try and collect the "leftovers".

http://shelfsufficient.com - My site on getting my little family prepped for whatever might come our way.

http://growing-elite-marijuana.com - My site on growing marijuana

I think alot of the confusion is because Libertarians come here

and act surprised that the "dailyPAUL" is not pro Johnson. It is a fact that Ron Paul is not in the race any longer, it is a fact that Johnson doesn't have a chance to win, some may well vote for Johnson, some may vote for Paul, some may well vote Romney, but one thing is for sure this isn't the dailyjohnson and therein lies your problem. Like Dr. Paul said, he doesn't control the liberty movement, and I can assure you one thing 100% for sure, and that is GJ supporters do not either. To each their own and let the cards fall where they may, if GJ is the great savior then where is his dailyjohnson site promoting liberty for years and years? Where were his supporters in 2005-2007? I think it is great that there are alternatives to the status quo, but to ask why people at the dailypaul might not support Johnson on this "board" is because GJ is not RP. Since neither RP or GJ can or will win it is a losing battle, why not head over to Redstate and sell Obama for 2012? You might be met with the same type of resistance, and I am one that is considering voting for Johnson. Lastly I would just say the special comment you made at the bottom of your post will not help your cause in the least. You feel free to come to the DP and post your opinion, yet when people challenge it (and rightly so since this is not a Gary Johnson related site) then you will be met with resistance, and people might just "laugh at your pathetic stupid butt."

Always remember:
"It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds." ~ Samuel Adams
If they hate us for our freedom, they must LOVE us now....

Stay IRATE, remain TIRELESS, an

Make your case

So we clear the air. First, just to let you know, I'm not a GJ supporter..I support Liberty, and freedom of choice, and of course Ron Paul's philosophy.

I'll direct this question to the following members, including one other that isn't here yet.

PollMan
rp4pres
Pauling Is My Hobby
AllPaul
thelastbill
1777free4all
Wisdom Strategies*

To make things easier on everyone involved, given the time frame to the upcoming election, so some can move on to more serious matters,
I would ask this particular group of DP members:
Would you be so kind as to post up, in 200 words or less:

A. Why you appear to hate Gary Johnson, the Libertarian party and anyone that supports either.
B. Why you seem so persistant, condescending and outspoken against any and every single thread that has anything to do with GJ.
C. Why you apparently continue to spread mis-information, dis-information, and berate others that are trying to have an informed discussion on the GJ platform.
D. Why you seem to feel the need to up-vote your own posts and down-vote others, then accuse the GJ 'trolls' for doing the same thing.

Seriously, here's your chance to state your case, so we can get beyond this ridiculous in-fighting. Up to you...

"Hell is empty, and all the devils are here" (Shakespeare)
RP 2012~ Intellectual Revolution.

A. I don't hate him. Just

A. I don't hate him. Just dislike him because he is a fake. B. I reply and down vote with a contrary tone because I can. Just like how Gj trolls with multiple accounts do to bury the truth. C. Why do gj trolls downvote and run from the truth? D. I've never upvoted my own stuff. See answer to b and c.

The end.

A: Nice loaded question. I

A: Nice loaded question. I don't "hate" Gary Johnson, I just don't trust him because of views he has publicly espoused. I don't "hate" the LP, I'm a registered Libertarian who would like better candidates to vote for. I don't "hate" Gary's supporters, I just condemn the people who try to bully and harrass me into voting for him.

B: I'm sorry if I come across as condescending sometimes, it's just that I've lost patience with seeing my favorite website devolve into one-sided bickering. I'm outspoken because GJ isn't who he says he is, and I'm shocked at how many informed voters on here have just blindly followed GJ without weighing the pros and cons. Speaking of condescending, it's YOUR side who has referred to Ron Paul as a "fraud" and to his supporters as "Romney operatives."

C: So actual quotes that GJ has said are "disinfo"? Wouldn't that make Gary a liar?

D: Nice accusation without proof. Meanwhile, at least one GJ supporter was proven by the mods to be using (IIRC) 7 accounts just to upvote GJ supporters and censor all criticism of GJ.

I don't play, I commission the league.

I'm not going to say you're

I'm not going to say you're employed by space aliens....

...But it's aliens.

tasmlab's picture

Ron Paul is an inspiring, emotion-provoking, magical leader

Ron Paul is an inspiring, emotion-provoking, magical leader who:
- Makes people want listen to him speak for hundreds of hours of video, despite hearing the same thing over and over
- Makes people want to drive hundreds of miles to see him
- Makes people eyes tear when he speaks, or when the crowds chant his name
- Inspires people to put giant lawn signs, stickers, shirts etc.
- Inspires some to even get RP tattoos
- Makes people want to consume book after book
- Makes people send in quantities of cash for an impossible campaign
- Etc.,

Ron Paul is magic and it's near impossible, today, to imagine a better, more inspiring, emotion-provoking message-carrier for the cause.

Gary Johnson is just a superb libertarian Presidential candidate with some ideas way more reasonable than anybody else running.

And he's got my vote.

But who is dying to send him check or even wear a t-shirt? Who wants to drive six hours to hear him talk? Who wants to watch TV interview number 2,345 because 2,344 just wasn't enough?

How could people not get hot and emotional over his presence here?

Peace!

Currently consuming: Harry Browne, Free Domain Radio; JT Gatto and Holt; Wii U

I think the difference

I think the difference between our views is that I see the need for practical action and practical voting to prevent our nation from falling into catastrophe and both Mitt and Barack are bad news. Ron is no longer a factor, beyond Campaign for Liberty and whether or not he chooses to support Rand as a candidate in 2016 (assuming for a second that he wants to run). So the practical answer points to voting for Gary. If he's able to throw some gravel into the gears of the war machine, so much the better.

Oh, and by the way... I'm going to be wearing my Gary Johnson t-shirt on voting day.

.

here are a few reasons why.

1. GJ believes in creating an entirely "NEW" taxing structure called the "fair Tax"
2. Has decided to accept public campaign funding paid for from the public dole, then runs his PUBLIC CAMPAIGN in massive debt. GJ asked for more money from the FEC/public, and when he did not get it, he SUES the FEC/Public WITH OUR OWN MONEY!
3. Ignores one of gvt's most important mandates, to protect innocent life where ever it may be found. "If gvt wont protect innocent life, then who will?" Ron Paul
"How can one expect gvt to protect liberty if they refuse to protect innocent life?" Ron Paul
4. GJ is for intervention "sometimes", for humanitarian purposes,
5. When asked about war, will take "nothing off the table"!
6. Does not consult the US Constitution. If he did he would not say things like, "nothing off the table", because following he constitution removes MANY things from "the table".
7. Never draws a line of how he came to a certain position, only that he has his positions, but never reasoning "why".
8. GJ attracts the disaffected Liberal, who was left at the alter by Obama. They hate the Tea Party, Rand Paul and all republican liberty candidates because they are liberal dems at heart and find anything republican to be loathsome. They only followed Paul for his non intervention and drug war stand. But never understood, conservative fiscal policy OR limited constitutional gvt, and NEVER will. GJ is the same. Knows he holds certain positions, but cant explain why and neither can his supporters.
9. GJ believes in the private prison industry. He believes incarceration should be privatized.
10. Gitmo Gary believes in the Military Tribunal system, keeping gitmo open, The Federal reserve system and intervention "sometimes", with "nothing off the table"

His campaign will end and he will owe tens of thousands, maybe a million to unsuspecting venue holders and staffers who expect to be paid, not watch their labor and money go into lawsuits to feed the corrupt system.
Paul would NEVER place a lawsuit against the tax payers for not giving him more of their money to run an all ready indebted campaign.
If there was not enough $ support for Paul, he would never have run in the first place. Instead GJ takes public money, and runs in debt- and will leave owing millions, and sue the taxpayers on his way out!lol

It is not that anyone hates Gairie. We hate his philosophies of gvt and do not trust him, based on his record, actions and his language.

"OH NO! He has a SON?" Neoconservatives and Liberals EVERYWHERE!

Rand Paul 2016

There should be no Johnson or

There should be no Johnson or Paul people... there should only be liberty people... united we stand, divided we fall..

If you disagree with me on anything you are not a real libertarian...

johnson is no ron paul or liberty minded especially on LIFE

that is like saying there shouldn't be romney people or paul people there should only be republicans UNITED WE STAND

too funny man

http://shelfsufficient.com - My site on getting my little family prepped for whatever might come our way.

http://growing-elite-marijuana.com - My site on growing marijuana

No, it's not like saying

No, it's not like saying that. Romney doesn't promote freedom... Johnson does..

If you disagree with me on anything you are not a real libertarian...

collectivism?

An individual cannot be divided. A collective can be divided and should fall.

What is the difference between that and a fellowship assembled?

Free includes debt-free!

Two reasons.

Some people see Ron Paul as a GOD. They recognize him as the greatest politician living (which he is) but they forget that its the ISSUES that count - not him personally.

Others resent Gary Johnson - because they see any success he might have as, in essence, Johnson stealing Ron Paul's cookies. Ron Paul BAKED the cookies, then didn't get to eat them. And if Ron Paul can't eat them, Gary Johnson is CERTAINLY not allowed to have a bite.

Nice oversimplification...

but some of us actually did our research on GJ and came away unimpressed... not because he isn't Ron Paul, but because he deviates so much from our movement on key issues.

Furthermore, his militant gang of downvoting and insulting bullies haven't exactly endeared GJ to many people on here.

I don't play, I commission the league.

There is more militant ganging up of UP voters whenever someone

knocks Gary Johnson.

Want proof? Look at the earliest posts in THIS thread.