148 votes

Teacher tells student - "You only have 2 choices" UPDATE

I was driving in the car with my daughter, she's in 1st grade and she heard a political ad on the radio, then she told me she had voted in her class.

I immediately became interested..

Me - "Oh you guys did a vote in your class?"
Daughter - "Yeah, I told my teacher I didn't want Mitt Romney or Barack Obama"
Me - " Wow, you really said that? What did she say?"
Daughter - "She said, well those are the only ones you can vote for."
Me - "What? That's not true.. what did you say to her?"
Daughter - "I told her that Im not gonna vote for them, I'll make a little voting place in my room where only people that want to vote for Ron Paul can go there and vote"
Me - "Nice Kiddo"

High Fives immediately ensued

UPDATE:

I went online and pulled up a sample ballot..
I showed her where you vote for president..

O Barack Obama / Joe Biden
O Mitt Romney / Paul Ryan
O Gary Johnson / James P. Gray
O Write In ________________

I said "see.. Gary Johnson, there's another choice right there, and if you don't like those three choices, you can write Ron Paul right there on that line"
She said "Yeah, let me do it"
I said "Well it's just an image you can't click on it, but maybe we'll print it up and you can fill it in"

I'm thinking about putting it in her folder all filled out to take to her class so her teacher can learn something




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CA Parents: CA Education Code Excerpts

Did a little homework. Feel free to make use of this info as you see fit.

-----

District Participation in Ballot Initiatives within Legal Limits
Sources: CA Education Code and www.fagenfriedman.com (educational law firm)

2. General Principles

a. The government must, to the greatest extent possible, avoid taking measures that influence,
adulterate, or frustrate the resolution of issues that the California and federal Constitutions leave
to the “free election” of the people. (Cal.Const., art. II; Stanson v. Mott (1976) 17 Cal.3d 206,
218; Gould v. Grubb (1975) 14 Cal.3d 661, 667.)

b. “A fundamental precept of this nation’s democratic electoral process is that THE GOVERNMENT MAY NOT 'TAKE SIDES' IN ELECTION CONTESTS OR BESTOW AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE ON ONE OF SEVERAL COMPETING FACTIONS. A principal danger feared by our country’s founders lay in the possibility that the
holders of governmental authority would use official power improperly to perpetuate themselves,
or their allies, in office.

3. Use of District Resources for Ballot Measures

a. California Education Code §§ 7050 et seq. imposes strict limitations on the use of district
resources for ballot and bond measures.

b. Section 7054, subdivision (a), states in relevant part:

NO SCHOOL DISTRICT or community college district funds, services supplies or equipment SHALL BE USED FOR THE PURPOSE OF URGING THE SUPPORT OR DEFEAT OF ANY ballot measure or CANDIDATE, including, but not limited to, any candidate for election to the governing board of the district.

(1)

SECTION 7054(a) EXPRESSLY FORBIDS THE USE OF DISTRICT RESOURCES TO SUPPORT OR DEFEAT ANY CANDIDATE or ballot measure FOR OFFICE.

d. In simpler terms, the Education Code draws the line between permissible and impermissible use
of public funds:

(1)

DISTRICT RESOURCES USED TO ADVOCATE a measure or CANDIDATE(S), WHETHER THROUGH EXPRESS ADVOCACY OR IMPLICIT/SUGGESTIVE ADVOCACY, IS NOT PERMITTED.

j.

Can a school district make its facilities available under the Civic Center Act for political
activities?

(1)

Yes, so long as the facilities are made equally available to both the supporters and opponents of the political measure. A school district should not limit its facilities to only
those with its favored political viewpoints. ONCE A SCHOOL DISTRICT MAKES ITS FACILITI4ES AVAILABLE AS A FORUM FOR POLITICAL PURPOSES, EQUAL ACCESS MUST BE PROVIDED TO ALL COMPETING PARTIES OR GROUPS. (Educ. Code § 7058; Stanson, 17 Cal.3d at 219.)

(2)

Note: Use of district facilities as a political forum should be consistent with the requirements of the Civic Center Act, as well as board policies and regulations addressing
this issue.

k. Can board members or district officials be held PERSONALLY LIABLE for authorizing an improper
campaign expenditure?

(1)

Public officials must use “due care” (i.e., reasonable diligence) in authorizing the expenditure of public funds and MAY BE HELD PERSONALLY LIABLE for improper expenditures
that are made without such due care.

(3)

Violations are punishable as a misdemeanor or felony or by a fine up to $1,000, or both.
(Educ. Code § 7054(c).)

5. What Can You Do to Inform the Electorate and What are Your Responsibilities?

e. Remember: DISTRICT RESOURCES MAY NOT BE USED IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCES TO URGE THE SUPPORT OR DEFEAT OF ANY ballot measure or CANDIDATE FOR ELECTED OFFICE. However, district resources may be used under limited circumstances to provide fair and impartial information on the effects of a ballot measure where the intended purpose is to aid the public in making its own informed decision on
the measure.

My kids voted

Her high school had all the candidates listed including Gary Johnson and Jill Stein. Her teacher did tell the class that if they didn't vote for either Obama or Romney he wasn't counting them. Out of 12 votes 3 went to Romney 4 to Gary Johnson 5 Obama
My youngest will vote tomorrow and write none of the above because only Romney and Obama are on her ballot.

Oh No, They Di-int

Just learned tonight from my 5th grade daughter (her first year ever in public school) that she has received this very directive from her school, with Mr. O and Mr. R the only options allowed for tomorrow's in-school vote. The teacher "taught" (not opined) that to vote for anyone who's not one of the two major candidates is to just throw your vote away.

My little girl--who, in first grade, waved RP signs with me and tromped through the community telling folks about the good doctor, was in frantic TEARS tonight, because she "had to" pick one of the two "main" contenders in tomorrow's school vote. Yes, steam was coming out of my ears.

I was already planning to have a little chat with her principal tomorrow on this topic, when I discovered this DP thread. Wow. I didn't realize just how widespread of an issue this is. And yet...not shocked to hear it. Not shocked in the least, sadly.

Preparing to (respectfully) school the edumacators tomorrow morning. I'll be sure to bring a photocopy of an actual California ballot along with us for her to use. Think I'd better run a few laps around the neighborhood first to blow off excess steam beforehand. Because, right now? GRRRRRRAURRRGGGHHH!!!

I urge you.

Do not run around the neigborhood first to blow off steam! Go directly to the principals office. Let them see how irate we can be!

2014 Liberty Candidate Thread: http://www.dailypaul.com/287246/2014-liberty-candidate-thread

2016 Potential Presidential Candidates: http://alturl.com/mt7tq

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Okay. But Coffee First.

Then, I'll just have to increase my politeness quotient to help balance the ginger in my belly (and the caffeine in my veins)!

Here's a little something I made four years ago...mebbe I should bring 'em a copy. ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpLyUOkhR4E&feature=g-upl

Disenfranchised?

If you think there is even a chance that your vote will be miscounted or not counted and want to participate holding the vote counters accountable, consider participating in this:

http://writeinron2012.com/writeinBlog/mission-strategy/

This project allows voters of Ron Paul, Gary Johnson, Virgil Goode and others to have a degree of accountability if the official numbers show obvious signs that fraud has occurred.

Linda Cross's picture

There really are only two choices in this election:

Write in "Ron Paul" or vote Gary Johnson.

(Lots of GREAT parents on here, proud of you, gives me hope for the future)

If you see something, say something, the government is listening.
Silence isn't golden, it's yellow.

Illegal Activity

It's illegal in California to use public funds or one's public position to take sides in an election.

The Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association is suing several California university teachers (and universities) for doing so on one of our propositions. They used school e-mail accounts and mailing lists to advocate votes, and/or told their students how they ought to vote, or gave assignments to write supportive essays.

This teacher has violated that law (assuming it is the same there) by advocating votes for Obama/Romney.

What do you think? http://consequeries.com/

Two known criminals

And assassin and a cheater with paid thugs.

Free includes debt-free!

Along with a Note that says You're Fired?

I'm not sure that I would put up with my child spending so much time with such a person.

Government run schools...

...usually have teachers that will give a government approved response. It seems most of them are hired on that basis. I so love it when the students can outsmart them and put them on the spot!!! Makes my day!!! Great parenting job Rix4Paul!!!

My son who is a fifth grader did something similar

My son who is a fifth grader did something similar. Apparently they had a school wide vote and I found out about it afterwards. My son said that under the names Romney and Obama, he drew a box with a check mark and next to it wrote in the name Ron Paul. I was totally impressed!

I'm curious to see if they actually count his vote. I'm not holding my breath but I'd feel slightly better about the world if they would just count his vote.

My daughter says she's going to do the same thing early this week.

Hopefully they will honor these kids votes. After all, the school is supposed to be demonstrating getting your voice heard in the voting process and why it's important to vote.

My daughter

Did something similar in 2008. She was in 5th grade and they had to convince people to vote for their candidate. Well, my daughter convinced the class to vote for Ron Paul and he won. I know her teacher well and he was surprised and impressed. Maybe he is a Ron Paul supporter now. :)

if so, it will be counted as "other"

x

My 2 kids in public school...

The older one wrote in Ron Paul and said that almost everyone in her class can't stand Obama and Romney...the younger one in Gr 2 only had the 2 choices so she did "eeny-meenie-mineee-moe."

I work at a school

I work for a company that does before and aftercare at a local school here in NJ. We have been closed this past week. I don't know if they are going to be doing any lessons on the the upcoming election this week. I'll be sure to correct them if I hear teachers telling kids that they only have two choices. The school staff, knows me real well, since I still have my Ron Paul car magnets on.

Sound good as sweet candy

But seriously, children at that age just parrot their parent or their teachers or their peers. A good muslim boy would recite Koran justifying cutting hands.

I would rather nurture rational independent mind in a child than produce my own replica. Politics is well above children age. Unfortunately, school teachers start brainwashing kids at early age forcing parents to counter act. Kids are also brainwashed listening to parents arguing at the kitchen table about politics. Both damage mind development. Little can be done besides home schooling.

If you're a parent, you

If you're a parent, you understand that children will get influence in all directions. It's just like peer pressure when they are teens. If the parents educate the children that certain controlled substances are dangerous, they'll use their own minds when they become adults whether they want to risk their health. But if you do nothing and allow others to influence your children, then they won't get enough information on their own to make wise decisions. The best thing is to teach her what is morally right, our history and why the Constitution is best at protecting our freedoms. If you don't at least give them a base to start out with, they will be filled with ignorance and lies. I was fortunate enough to have parents who told me in the 1970s, "Do not believe everything you see on tv." There are people today that are so ignorant that they think anything that comes through the airwaves is truth. I encourage my daughter to see the difference in what is propaganda and what is real. And I also tell her that with true Constitutional individual rights, no two people are going to be the same. We all have differences and it's not a bad thing. But I guess what I'm saying is if you don't say anything at all, they will soak up influence in places that we know are not healthy. When they grow up, those who were given different points of views will be better at making wise decisions.

Good morals and good examples...

...of parenting will produce a child that cares about others. Parents who work hard for what they receive will teach the children the same. Funny, we were that type of example, but our political views were the "religious neo-con". It was our child(right before adulthood) that brought us to realize the truth of what is really happening today. We no longer have those views and found that we shared the same as Paul's. Amazing!

Also a good illustration of

Also a good illustration of the power of good parenting trumping the public school system.

We HAVE a choice. (including NOT voting ...)

Do it!

Rights belong to individuals, not groups; they derive from our nature and can neither be granted nor taken away by government. Ron Paul

If anyone could shed some

Awesome post rix4paul. If anyone could shed some light on this It would be greatly appreciated. :) http://www.dailypaul.com/261364/i-need-your-help-finding-out...

We need to get an early start on 2016: Support Rand PAC 2016

www.randpac2016.com

https://twitter.com/randpac2016

awesome

the ideals of liberty will never die. We will only multiply. Which reminds me, I gotta settle down and create some freedom lovin babies. lol.

A bunch of our family and friends are

voting for the Lesser of two evils and if our 7 yr. old, 4 yr. old and 2 1/2 yr old knew, they'd be absolutely shocked to find out anyone they knew was voting for Mitt Romney. (Write-ins count in WI and they can't imagine why anyone wouldn't vote for Ron Paul, (they often chant "Ron Paul Revolution; give us back our Constitution!" even the toddler.

Its nice to get on here as a breath of fresh air and see that there are others holding the line, being principled and teaching their children to do the same! Good for you! God bless you!

As a side-note, have you all noticed that the Lesser of two evils is an entrapped circle? The reason people say they have to vote for the lesser evil is because only Romney or Obama will be president. But the reason only one of them will be president is because they are voting for the lesser evil and it goes on and on every election cycle. The only way to break it is exactly what we here are doing. Go patriots! And may these precious children grow up in a free country!

"they are voting for the

"they are voting for the lesser evil and it goes on and on every election cycle."

Check this out (I am STILL writing in Ron Paul, but the following goes to your point):

http://www.dailypaul.com/261538/lol-guy-trying-to-justify-no...

2014 Liberty Candidate Thread: http://www.dailypaul.com/287246/2014-liberty-candidate-thread

2016 Potential Presidential Candidates: http://alturl.com/mt7tq

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

That was excellent!

Wow, Keith should tell that guy what he really thinks, uh? :-)

Thanks!

Nice :-)

Be sure to include the comparison sheet too. They can use it for discussing the facts - something msm or history books won't show :-)

http://www.dailypaul.com/260894/3-candidate-comparison-sheet...

We did it and it went, well, I'll let you know how it went, lol.

2014 Liberty Candidate Thread: http://www.dailypaul.com/287246/2014-liberty-candidate-thread

2016 Potential Presidential Candidates: http://alturl.com/mt7tq

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Hahaha! Love it.

Love reading about great parents such as yourself educating children. They are the future:)

The world is my country, all mankind are my brethren, and to do good is my religion.
-Thomas Paine

In socialism class... I mean sociology class...

My professor was talking about how the federal reserve in his opinion was one of the main causes of income desparity between the rich and poor, and the biggest problem in our country and how nobody ever talks about the fed. Then he said that Ron Paul was the only person that he has heard even mention the fed in serious discussion and he supported auditing the fed. Then he went on to say that he didnt really like RP though! I thought to myself that if that was the only reason he had to support RP its still more reason than the other two clowns combined! I guess logic is still lost on some people...

I'll bet he does like Ron

I'll bet he does like Ron Paul but didn't want to "offend" the Roboma supporters or stir up any "controversy". I guess being a teacher you are suppose to come off neutral.