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Libertarian Party should not
Libertarian Party should not accept public funds.
But What If I Checked the Box?
Suppose I checked the box. I'm a libertarian (and a Libertarian). I would be very annoyed if they gave my money to both of the dominant parties, and none to mine.
Don't the people who check the box really have the right to say where it goes?
Of course, I never check the box because I don't want it to go to either dominant party. But there are plenty of people who think elections should be publicly funded. I have no problem accepting their money as long as I can live with the strings attached.
P.S. One reason to check the box is to keep the money out of the bureaucrats' hands, especially if it would be spent on making wars.
What do you think? http://consequeries.com/
God Bless Our Two-Party System System
It's from 2008 but it's worth looking at again:
http://youtu.be/HcEuhi7KKHA
Thanks for the explanation but...
...why should ANY public money go to ANY political party (which are private organizations)?
That is taxpayer money which is supposed to run a constitutional government.
If we're so broke, then why do the voter forms even offet that as an option to taxpayers?
"We have allowed our nation to be over-taxed, over-regulated, and overrun by bureaucrats. The founders would be ashamed of us for what we are putting up with."
-Ron Paul
No it shouldn't
considering the LIBERTARIAN Party is aiming this as it's main goal, that's not a good sign.
But what's in a name? It's about those who are in the party that decides everything.
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
Because the other option mean democracy to the highest bidder.
There is no way in the world that someone not supported by big political action commitees (funded by banksters) can compete with just personal donations.
Political campaigns ARE determined by who spends the most - don't pretend to be naive on that.
And if there is no source for funding for NONcorporate interests - then ONLY corporate interests will be able to elect candidates.
Individual contributions can NEVER keep up.
And we reaaly will have a government by plutocracy or of the rich.
You rock brother
Thank you so much for that article educating folks in the Washington State on why they should vote Gary Johnson.
Thank you.
Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
My website: http://www.libertypoet.com/
STAND WITH RAND 2016
Maybe the reason Ron Paul did
Maybe the reason Ron Paul did not endorse Johnson is so that he would not get the 5% and be a bigger force in 2016. Dr. Paul feels that the best chance for change will come from working from within the GOP and I think the master plan is for Rand to run in 2016. If the votes are split between Johnson and Rand Paul then neither will have a chance.
Can you quote Dr. Paul actually saying that?
Because as recently as 2008 he wasn't discouraging third-party efforts, rather just the opposite. He not only endorsed Chuck Baldwin he said "I continue to wish the Libertarian and Constitution Parties well. The more votes they get, the better.". And the rest of that letter makes it clear that although he chose to remain a Republican, he thought the liberty movement was strengthened by diversity. Which, from a liberty-minded viewpoint, is the only thing that makes sense.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/23001.html
Also:
http://lewrockwell.com/yk/what-paul-said-to-mccain.html
As for Rand, contrast Ron Paul refusing to endorse a warmonger like McCain, with Rand's decision about what to do for Mitt. They're different people.
"You decide." -- Judge Napolitano http://youtu.be/D5J84fWqEK0
It will help with ballot access too
In some states if you get a certain percent of the vote (often 5% but sometimes 1 or 2%) then you get automatic ballot access next time around. Then you don't have to spend lots time and money to just get on the ballot.
I have commented to your Johnson 5% thread many times...
But you never replied to the points I made, why is that?
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
...
I guess it just comes down to that... no one gives a flying dolittle-f.u.c.k about your points.
Woah
Calm down... I was just bringing up valid points, don't be upset. Here's are what I posted
http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2804599
http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2806947
http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2810426
Not all are direct replies to LL, but this is what I posted before. I suggest all GJ supporters who want to achieve the 5% to read them
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
What valid points?
You say things like "Creating a Third Major Party DOES not automatically mean a victory for Liberty." Nobody is saying that a third party means an "automatic" victory for liberty, are they? If that's not the actual claim, what you've got here is just a strawman.
And you then say "Just like Tea Party, C4L, Republican Party, they can be taken over if the real power holders decides they're important enough to warrant their attention and donate their money to them." But as a hypothetical, who is arguing otherwise? Again, strawman.
From these two strawmen, you conclude: "When you see this, creating a third party seems to be... pointless." But the fact that a plan *might not work out* doesn't mean that the plan is pointless. WIth that sort of logic, rejecting any plan that *might* fail, how do you ever justify any action at all?
"You decide." -- Judge Napolitano http://youtu.be/D5J84fWqEK0
I'm glad you replied
Strawman... That's funny, all this time I was thinking that LL and those who are convinced by him are indeed fighting for the cause of liberty, and not just for a political party. I put the second statement of infiltration because many ignore the fact that almost all organizations become corrupt when they are viewed in a group, aka party-line voting.
I was actually advocating a LIBERTARIAN ideology of individual importance, as opposed to what I was arguing against.
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
BTW, do you know what Ron Paul said about this in 2008?
Even when the LP nominee was Bob Barr, and even after Barr snubbed Dr. Paul at a rally, Ron Paul *still* said that he thought the more votes the Libertarian Party (and the Constitutional Party) got, the better. He urged his supporters to support third parties, and in spite of Barr being the candidate he included the Libertarian party as one of those he would like to see supported.
That wasn't because he thought that Bob Barr was a great candidate -- Dr. Paul endorsed Baldwin, and the letter made it clear that this was in part in response to Barr being a prick. It wasn't because Ron Paul thought that the LP was incorruptible. But it was something he did as part of his fight for the cause of liberty.
"You decide." -- Judge Napolitano http://youtu.be/D5J84fWqEK0
All in all
You were falsely claiming that I was arguing at all, I was trying to bring points up so others can see that Propping up the LP party doesn't really work, especially in this system.
And it's not like that the people would disappear without being in the LP Party.
Holy shit, I am not an FBI agent or something that keeps a track of everyone's comments on this website in a folder or anything. I was making a general statement, not an argument against specific people(besides a few comments by LL)
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
Strawmen to the left of me, strawmen to the right
Strawman... That's funny, all this time I was thinking that LL and those who are convinced by him are indeed fighting for the cause of liberty, and not just for a political party.
Well if that was what you were thinking, then why didn't you argue against *that*? Instead you came up with the strawman claim about the LP getting 5% being an "automatic" victory for liberty. But *nobody* is saying that. That's what made the first claim a strawman. That's the definition of a strawman.
I put the second statement of infiltration because many ignore the fact that almost all organizations become corrupt when they are viewed in a group, aka party-line voting.
Who is ignoring that? You set up this strawman to make it look like the people backing GJ were so naive that they thought that the LP getting 5% would mean automatic success and nothing could go wrong. But can you cite anyone saying any such thing?
Find something that someone actually said. Quote them accurately. Then make an argument responding to what they actually said.
"You decide." -- Judge Napolitano http://youtu.be/D5J84fWqEK0
...
I apologize. This day has just amplified my frustration with this country to an extreme.
What equally frustrates me
Is that the GJ supporters here, generally ignore these points I made. LL being a self-styled leader, spreading the 5% news on this site. But he has never answered to those opposition points I made.
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
You're right. The powers that
You're right. The powers that be would take the Lib. party if it became a force to reckoned with. I'm inching closer and closer to the realization that this country will never be taken back peacefully.
I really think
The only way to do that is to follow RP's strategy of "becoming the tent"
And take BACK the Republican party by filling it with strong willed, and principled individuals that are liberty lovers.
To spread the message of Liberty to those around you, and vote locally to become committeemen/women of local positions.
Only from the bottoms up, can this revolution be successful. If we do overthrow the government by violence... Well, history has not seen many successful results from that.
France thwarted the King to get Napoleon
Russia Overthrew the Czar to get the Communist party
China, Iran, Latin America, Nigeria, ETC ETC
Dr. Ron Paul was right... Again, this revolution must be peaceful, and the first step in in local and individual level
only then, can liberty truly be ensured(at least that's what I think)
BE(was typing feel, LOL) free to disagree or offer alternatives.
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
I feel like the constitution
I feel like the constitution was a failure. I have to agree with Patrick Henry and other authors of the anti-federalist papers who were against ratification. A strong central government left the door open to demagogues and special interests bent on economic control. At this point with the public opinion and media being controlled I don't think people even want to wake up.
Sadly, the majority of people seem perfectly happy playing on their iphones and driving their mustangs. I'm not very optimistic that enough people can be woken up, and even so the powers that be will crush them with violence if needed to preserve what they've built.
sad......
which is why on the local and personal level, it is far more important to educate and spread the message of liberty.
I too, need to educate my self, I hope you will do the same.
Don't fall into depression or apathy again! Cheer up, the future is bright, but only if you are willing to shine. I have no idea how a guy over the internet whom you just met a few hours ago, in a conflict, will do to convince you. No matter what it is, please fight on, and educate to awake those around you and yourself.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
I think I needed to hear that
I think I needed to hear that tonight. Thank you.
Maybe as long as there are still people out there like the fine people on this website we have a chance.
I'm going to sign off and go read for a while. I can't take anymore of this election coverage. I'll find out the winner tommorow (as if it really matters).
Take care my friend.
You too
Have a good rest tonight
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
tell you the truth
If I was to read and respond to all the people and to all the attacks I would NOT be able to have time to do my activist work.
Please see me side.
Thank you.
Now tell me what is wrong with GJ getting the 5%?
Now sadly it looks like GJ is not going to get the 5% --
so you win.
"Congrats"
Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
My website: http://www.libertypoet.com/
STAND WITH RAND 2016
I would've been fine
With GJ getting 5%. But I want to ask, does that do anything?
LP hasn't done anything to take those money, even if it's relatively small, from the people.
And it really won't make much of a difference either. I would've rather GJ to win than the other 2, but by lining up to vote for a party, is not only un-libertarian, but also a wrong approach.
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.
I don't know what to do... I
I don't know what to do... I voted GJ today because he was the best guy on the ballot. I know it doesn't really matter though. It's all smoke and mirrors. I like how George Carlin puts it. We have 2 choices for everything important but you walk into a bagel shop and there's 37 fucking choices and 500 tv channels owned by 4 companies. The illusion of choice....
Yes
This is this election cycle. Could you have imagined how little support RP and liberty got in '08?
This time, we were strong, but were cheated. From now on, please vote your conscious, for the most principled member you see.
EDUCATE yourself! Win the debates with those around you! convince them that liberty is the only option.
If RP announces a run in 2016 after the current tyrant is installed, Oh I imagine the progress we would make from the energy!
"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul
Educate the masses, and win in the end.