10 votes

Transitioning to the Message

Perhaps the next couple of years affords us the opportunity to spread the message in many ways free from association with any political party given the parties, by design, only serve to divide.

Ron Paul (and most significantly his message) is now free of any party if he so chooses. He can remain behind anyone from any party who works at the local level and within party ranks for liberty and education. In doing so, he is behind them all without allegiance to any party. I feel he said so much when even to the end he refused to endorse any party candidate indicating he felt "all" parties had proven untrustworthy.

As a Ron Paul (the message) purist, I have often been upset with the direction of the DP. However, I have since changed my position and see the past year at the DP as a necessary education, however distasteful at times.

Michael has his own candidate views which he is entitled to and as owner of this site he made a decision to give everyone a voice,while sometimes expressing his own individual preference. By making that decision and offering a forum for it, many of us were exposed to factions within the voting public that surprised us.

And, yet to ever effect change, it is essential to understand those factions. While it became irritating at times, better understanding the so-called infiltrators and trolls was and is an education. After all, even the "paid to sway" are hardly infiltrators as they fall into two categories (1) those who can be paid to sway because they have political convictions behind what they do and (2) those who are down deep apathetic and can be paid to do anything, much like most of our current Congress. So called trolls are just irritating and redundant and require fortitude to ignore.There are people everywhere in society who are irritating, redundant, contentious or argumentative for arguments sake.

I hope the DP stays and exactly as it is. A forum for all to express their opinions, learn and grow. Political Parties will always be well represented here with all the "good, bad, and ugly" that entails.

However, in addition the DP can continue to afford a place for education and activism. I see the next few years as a time to spread the liberty message and educate the voting public to think for themselves and not follow a person, but follow a message. Then, when the time comes, vote for those who best carry the message. Obviously rallying behind those perceived to be or hoped to be Liberty Candidates is essential, but only one prong.

I would see a transition to spread the message (associated with people not a person) as a very positive thing whose time has come. Can speaking tours continue to resonate and create a fervor? I think they can. And, in order to best present the message, it should be outside political parties...not affiliated with any. I would love to see Ron Paul continue speaking (through the donations of those who agree), but bringing in others who have proven an ability to reach the masses. I would put the Judge and Chuck Baldwin at the top of the list. Works best if it is people who are not in Congress or running for. Let their platforms stand on their own as they measure up to the message. Keep politics out of it.

On another note, I would not get on the bandwagon at this time for any candidate for 2016. The next few years will be their proving ground. I am glad some are in Congress and hope they will continue to chip away at this issue or that. As the message gains steam, they may well expand the number of Liberty issues they are willing to stick their necks out for and stand, like a Ron Paul, behind.

As a footnote Thank you Michael and I hope the DP stays open and works toward balance., as we all look toward ways to spread the message and let people know that there is an option.

Just my thoughts.

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ytc's picture

I agree that DP has been and CAN continue to be a

comfortable, non-confrontational gathering ground for liberty minded folks to learn and grow as wholesome freedom-loving persons.

BUT I sincerely believe in financially chipping in for the use of Michael N & his supporting staff's time, energy & resources that they put in. It's important to SUBSCRIBE and become paying members, as much as our personal circumstances allow. Free market of ideas needs to be nurtured and supported economically, so that we can all prosper for many years to come.

To continue we need a banner and a vision

The banner has been Ron Paul. Not just in his ability to inspire and as something to rally behind, but as a label to give the movement identity and unity.

The liberty movement should and must remain unique and independent and ought to operate through sites like this one and via labels such as rEVOLution, which recall the good ole' days so to speak.

But remember in Iowa when Ron Paul had like 30% plus? There's a huge chunk of the GOP that was and probably is ready to go along with the liberty movement and achieve real results that are meaningful to all of us. THAT'S what we should be devoted to now.

I envision the GOP falling apart, and America realigning into liberty vs. statist. With such a stark choice, reality and economic law will give liberty the win.

I propose we all create and join a third party movement intent to replace the GOP. And we bring in that Iowa 30% to build it. It means resolving difference through a truce based on federalism: letting a lot of issues get settled at the state level, or by proper constitutional means, but uniting when it comes time to reduce the power of the federal government.

Times are changing, social issues just don't play anymore. More Americans are dependent and willing to embrace socialism. Our electoral process WILL shift to reflect that. So let's get ahead of it so that OUR values represent liberty's side and not billionaire 'libertarians'.

I have a proposal I've been hoping people would read, discuss and build upon with me:


I think this is an error...

...education is essential, and the best way to educate is by conducting political campaigns. I don't know how one could have watched the last two Ron Paul campaigns and drawn any other conclusion.

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

I Never Meant

...that political campaigns are not an important way to educate. Nor did I mean that the DP is not an excellent means to awareness.

My only point was that there are many prongs and all are important. On another post I shared a personal story about one small group of homeschoolers who were becoming educated through a form of education that encourages digging deep and free speech. There are many others. I was recently told on another post that there was no interest in another "educational campaign." However, it is not a political campaign that is going to by itself turn this around. One is intrested in the candidate and then goes to hear him speak. Dr. Paul proved how important that can be and awakened many of us.

Hopefully there will be many more liberty candidates that do the same.
There have been many motivational speakers who have developed huge followings. I was simply suggesting that since Dr. Paul has indicated that he will continue speaking when invited or where there is interest that he is "free" to speak on behalf of all liberty candidates rather than one party and that perhaps others would join him and there might be a groundswell.

I do not always express myself very well and apparently didn't on this thread. Sorry...I'll go back to reading .



Very nice post, yes, I think you have a point...Education is in order. It is the message, not the man. Of course that man will never be forgotten and I would imagine as he continues to share the message of Liberty people will still flock to hear him!

I do think it wonderful idea for others to speak that message as well. It costs money I imagine to travel to speak. That is one thing we were able to help Dr. Paul with while he was campaigning. Of course this day and age, I suppose traveling isn't quite necessary, but the in-person-thing is very effective.

It concerns me that the Tea Party was so easily co-opted. mdefarge explained to me the different aspects of the tea party and its splits and co-opt, but I can't remember all that right now. Are you familiar with G.Edward Griffen?

One of his videos spoke about foundations and how collectivists take over foundations and use the power and money resident in the foundation to accomplish collectivist goals. I think that is what we are up against even when we start speaking outside the political process, there will be wolves in sheep clothing ready to take over the power and redirect it to their elitist goals. It concerns me that Friends of Liberty will not be on the watch for it.

Griffin's solution is for Liberty minded individuals to begin participating in those foundations and retaking them. I think that is what Dr. Paul has in mind for the GOP. There is resident power in the party that can be used. It is not a fast process, but must be carried out deliberately and patiently, which is exactly how our country is being taken down over a very long period of time.

I am glad to hear your words about the DP. Liberty is something that can call us all together. I enjoyed reading your explanation of Trolls here and your explanation on your Debate post about the defferent types of communication exhibited by different types of people here on the DP. Very interesting to see it put into words.

I think your words about watching to see who is worthy of Liberty support are wise…especially if there is not a steady record already on the books. I do think it is important to get involved politically locally. I haven’t done that yet. I am not fast on my feet, and have not learned to couch my words, except when writing, so as to not blast a person. It is also hard for me to absorb information without wanting to interrupt. So I have some personal work cut out for me if I can keep from alienating myself before being accepted. lol :)

Good luck on Your Grandson’s debate! The program sounds like education for parents as well as the children. Just think of all the promise your grandson holds! It makes me happy just thinking about it! I wonder if there are any people on the DP that went to debate class and or participated in debates. I probably would have enjoyed that in school, but never looked into it. mdefarge, do you know her? She was very active in her children's private school education. I wonder if she has any ideas?

Is there a way to look up an ID on the DP? I haven't ever found it unless it is someone I communicate with then I have to go back and find a comment and click on their ID. I wish I could just call up an ID. I wish I knew some programming skills. I would help the DP out with some of those type of user friendly processes...free of charge just so I could use them lol.


Just Put The User

...name into the search engine box if you can't find a post by the person to click on. Once to their profile you can click "all comments" and see everything they have ever posted. In my case...gulp...haha.

Yes, I know Griffin, subscribe to his newsletter and have read "Creature from Jekyll Island" which you would really like if you have not read it. Pretty much a classic now and very eye-opening.

Say a prayer for mdefarge and Nonna. Both are off-line friends of mine (along with Granger). They both are having a lot of personal difficulties due to the storm and much to deal with. All three are fantastic, sincere and genuine people. If you communicate away from the DP with any, ask for my email if you would like. I don't know how you give someone your email address privately as I don't have that button on my profile.

You are doing great. Thought the respect you got from the Octobox thread on your pro-life stand was wonderful. Basically it seemed to me that they saw your genuine goodness and were saying that once we evolve spiritually (maybe it is earn not evolve) to that consciousness level, most of these issues would not be issues. We would all be doing the right things and it would be baffling how anyone could ever tell anyone they had to ..say.. sit in the back of a bus. That one is still baffling to me. I concur and kudos to your spirit that they said that. Have a great evening.

PS: Best place to hide and have a personal conversation is in almost any article I have posted cuz nobody goes to them. Don't take that as a pity party. I always connect with the people I want most to connect with, it seems! Like you.


ytc's picture

Exciting: you know mdefarge, Nonna & Granger personally!

When you talk with them next time, please convey my best wishes & love to them from me, too.
Their presence is a part of the reason I love this place. Perhaps a generational sense of solidarity?
(Your article and posts are not THAT hidden, fonta :-)

I Will ytc

....and they will appreciate your comment. We just gravitated to each other because their posts were reasons I loved this place. Love yours too and, there may well be a bit of a generational thing going on sometimes.

The four of us have not met personally; however through email we know each other very well. It began when Nonna and I discovered online that we shared the same birthday. All four of us are "here" but have some outside challenges as well. We don't even talk politics much offline, just enjoy the support and sharing. They were there for me at a time when I needed them and, hopefully, I am for them as well. Such are friendships and why they are cherished!

And, LOL, woopsies. Posts are not good "hiddie places" ...even if they "seem" ignored. This initially unnoticed one moved last night up to top recent topics just because Bear and I had a "lil" personal exchange. Oh well...Bear drew me out in the open. Such are the nature of Bears...or at least "that" one, God love her! Enjoyed your reply...thanks!


Hee Hee

"Best place to hide and have a personal conversation is in almost any article I have posted cuz nobody goes to them."

HeeHee, unless someone is hiding in the bushes and reading all the comments from the nearly newly released comments tab...that really bugged me when it first came out. I am the paranoid sort and didn't want all my words so easily read...now I could care less who reads what. It is funny how feelings change lol

Look me up and let me know if you want me to remark on something you post. I don’t post too much, only when I am really inspired, and there are a few that I ask to stop in and comment. I have one post I am embarrassed of and that was the Benghazi flag post. It was distasteful IMO

You are so funny, I can’t even remember which conversation I had with Octobox re Pro-life…I had so many of them with so many different folks. I have a really bad memory too. I had a fun one with jetguy today. I pulled the constitution on him. May have been a trump lol. One thing I have found, and it seems that I have watched some…if people refrain from personal attacks, or should I say if at least 1 party does, it seems to keep the “discussion” from escalating from productive to non-productive.

I wish the DP would have a sort that I could pull all my conversations with one ID up. Kinda like a comments tab but with the conversations by ID.

Thank you for telling me about Nonna and mdefarge. I will keep them in my prayers. If you speak to them let them know. I had started worrying about mdefarge so I am glad she is ok considering. It is funny how I have gravitated to your friends already :) I don't do off line though because I boycotted email when I started the DP lol. Plus I used to do eBay and I get alot of garbage. Plus I think I am going one of those control things. No, I am not going to eat that spinach and no I am not going to log on to email and no one can make me lol. Maybe a part of my rebellious waking up! I want control now that I realize so much has been stolen.

Anyways, I have thought about your words about having to move from a difficult situation. I am sorry that you have had to go thru difficulty. Sometimes I continue to think about things after I make my reply.


Hey fonta.

I'll be back here when I can. I have a couple of house chores lol It seems hours can fly on the DP!

A Most Excellent Post

I couldn't have said things better myself, fonta :-)

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul