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Vermont Secession

http://www.boston.com/news/local/vermont/articles/2007/06/03...

Looks like some of us may have a place to go after all. Ron Paul for president of Vermont!




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Nukes a must!

The only state (if you believe the fed still recognizes the concept of states) that could actually leave the USA would have to have a like minded governor with the launch codes and ability to aim them at D.C. for whatever nukes are kept in that state.

Let's face it. It's not happening.

Ending the Fed and allowing states to coin their own money still remains the only viable option to save the US from the NWO.

THE THIRD NORTH AMERICAN SECESSIONIST CONVENTION...

was held this past weekend in Manchester, New Hampshire. I attended this event and was very impressed with the diversity of the group. Here are a few links that I want to share with all of you here on the DP.

The Middlebury Institute
http://middleburyinstitute.org/

Alaskan Independence Party Vindicated
Northern Exposure on CNN: Dexter Clark
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8u66f76Q7Uo

Vermont Commons; Voices Of Independence
http://www.vtcommons.org/

The Hawaii Supreme Court ruled that the State cannot sell ceded lands...
http://bigfiles90.angelfire.com/CededNoSell.html

Independent Long Island
http://www.ilination.net/info.html

United Republic of Texas
http://www.texas.freecountries.org/

OSS.NET: Robert David Steele
http://www.oss.net/extra/page/?id=290

The Fourth N. American Secessionist Convention...

will take place next year in state of Texas, probably in Nov. 09. So stay in touch with some of these sites I posted on Nov. 16

I wish I had known about the

I wish I had known about the event!! I live near Manchester, NH and would have definitely attended if I had known about it. Feels like a missed opportunity, although, I hope the meeting was genuinely productive.

---
"Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils." -- General John Stark.

---
"Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils." -- General John Stark.

the second vermont republic

Fortune Favors the Bold

is nothing new. they have been working on it since at least 2006. My understanding is that the movement is already past the peak of its popularity. Apparently the fact that they were supported by the League of the South turned off alot of the hippie supporters.

Fortune Favors the Bold

It needs to be a multi-state effort if it is going to work

It would be great if Washington, Oregon, Montana, Wyoming, Idaho, North and South Dakota all banded together and seceded. I would be on my way to any one of those states!

Formerly rprevolutionist

Possibly. Another option is

Possibly. Another option is for one of them to secede first, and as a result of demonstrating how superior the free life is, the rest eventually follow.

Getting a majority in WA and OR to champion secession will certainly take some convincing. At least unless they are willing to split themselves down the middle of the Cascades.

For any of the others, if a secession movement starts looking like it might get serious traction, my guess is it would draw in secession advocates from the neighboring states, and perhaps scare away internal unionists, until the population is sufficiently polarized to favor secession in at least one state. And from then on, it's pure gravy....

This is great!

Well said, valid arguments - SC needs to do the same...she did it before, she can do it again!

"When all government, in little as in great things, shall be drawn to Washington as the Center of all power, it will render powerless the checks provided of one government on another and will become as venal and oppressive as the government from which we separated." – Thomas Jefferson

The law cannot make a wicked person virtuous…God’s grace alone can accomplish such a thing.
Ron Paul - The Revolution

Setting a good example is a far better way to spread ideals than through force of arms. Ron Paul

Hey SC

NC here wanting to go with you...Wish the rest of the state would
WAKE UP
Freedom is another way to God...A corrupt government is a straight way to hell.

I believe in Hope & Change..I Hope the government will Change
Spindale-Rutherford County-North Carolina

Rightful liberty is

Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law', because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual. – Thomas Jefferson

THE FEDERAL RESERVE - Americas OVERLORD

It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men.
— Samuel Adams

13 No servant can serve two masters; for either he shall hate the one, and love the other, or else he shall lean to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and riches. - Luke 16

Republicae's picture

The Republic of South

The Republic of South Carolina was a far different State then, she has lost so much of her courage, so much of her sense of self and the purpose of Statehood. If only we could bombard Fort Sumter again.

http://www.1776solution.blogspot.com

I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue. Barry Goldwater

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

Republicae's picture

You also have to remember

You also have to remember that Vermont was the first State to elect a Socialist to the Senate, I believe it was last year....not sure how Liberty, Individual Freedom and Free-Market economics would fly in a State that would go as far as electing a Socialist.

http://www.1776solution.blogspot.com

I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue. Barry Goldwater

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

Far as I can tell...

...there are about 534 socialists in Congress, but only one admits it openly.

----
"An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it. Truth stands, even if there be no public support. It is self sustained." -Mahatma Gandhi

----

"...a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." -John F. Kennedy

Republicae's picture

Yep...thats

Yep...thats true....LOL

http://www.1776solution.blogspot.com

I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue. Barry Goldwater

http://militantjeffersonian.com

"We are not a nation, but a union, a confederacy of equal and sovereign States" John C. Calhoun

I doubt it would be

I doubt it would be libertarian at all, but we should still welcome it as a first falling domino.

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

If the people of Vermont

If the people of Vermont want to be Socialists that is their business. If they were too secede I would support them 100%. I would never go there, unless they were attacked by the Federal Gov.

If we just had politicians

If we just had politicians with the backbone to reject federal money, we could ignore their mandates and all their other BS. Until we can tell them to take their money and shove it, we are their slaves, bought and paid for.

Pat

BOHICA!!

Pat

BOHICA!!

Remember... the RP Army is WORLDWIDE

Freedom is not just popular here.

Just look at the meet-up groups that formed in other countries worldwide. We are not alone. If there ever is a secession, we could fill any state will massive numbers if we invite our brothers and sisters in arms from around the globe.

Ahhhhh.... but I dream...

I may not know the truth, but I know when I'm being lied to...

I may not know the truth, but I know when I'm being lied to...

After the devestating results

of this election and the dire outlooks it brings for the rest of the world I do reconsider the Free State idea.

Fellowship of the White Rose

Ron Paul was right

Here's what's wrong with the Free State Project concept.

WITHOUT truly criticizing founder Jason Sorens, who I think means well.

I was in the Free State Project pretty much throughout its history right up until the point, after selection of New Hampshire, when they politely asked everyone who wasn't moving to Hampshire to leave. So I left, along with many others who had been pulling for Wyoming, Montana, and Idaho.

For those who are just now learning about it, the project proposes to move 20,000 libertarians to one state with a population below one million, where their concentrated numbers will supposedly "take over" the political culture of the state.

In my opinion, it suffers from two fatal errors:

1. It has no political platform, meaning no point of focus. It proposes a convergence of "liberty oriented" people and "libertarians" to effect change.
This is a problem, because:

-If you ask Rush Limbaugh, Barack Obama, and George W. Bush if they believe in liberty, they will each answer "yes".

-If you ask Camille Paglia, Bill Maher, Neal Boortz, and Alan Greenspan if they are libertarians, they will each answer "yes".

No focus means no sights on the rifle, so to speak. (A problem this movement has as well--although we at least have Ron Paul to lead by example.)

The FSP has no one to lead and no defining platform. This ensures that interactions will almost certainly be social experiences with lots of what I call "cocktail weiner libertarian" talk, instead of focused action. When I posted on the FSP Forums, there was constant argument, hem-haw, and squabble over "what is and isn't libertarian". With the faithful who moved there, I'm guessing there may be less squabbling and more Beer 'n' Pretzels chatter, but little more forward movement, I would suspect.

2. The second problem I will sum up quickly: There is a reason border states of Canada---and all the FSP finalist states were touching or relatively close to Canada---have low populations:

Because most of the jobs are further south, and it's harder to make a living in the far northern US. There's not as much economic base in New Hampshire or Vermont as in North Carolina or Florida. There aren't as many jobs in Wyoming as there are in Oklahoma or Alabama. These northern tier states have thin populations for a reason. Because it's hard to make a living there.

Such a project would actually do better to propose moving 40,000 people, or 60,000, to a southern or western state with a stronger economy, instead of sending 20,000 intrepid souls to a scenic enclave dependent largely on agriculture and tourism. More members would be able to relocate because they would be able to get jobs.

According to what I've heard, only 450 people have relocated to the Free State Project, which is equivalent to a very small town in Texas. It would be very easy, by comparison, to get 45,000 libertarians to move to Texas. The economy will support people there, and there are jobs.

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

Open up the markets and you will get your jobs

Manufacturing bases and other numerous jobs would flock to a truly free-market state. But I definitely agree with you on your post. I hate when socialists like Paglia and Maher call themselves libertarians but then endorse HUGE government obama. It doesn't make any sense and it taints the movement.

"Greater than the force of mighty armies is the power of an idea whose time has come"
- Victor Hugo

"Greater than the force of mighty armies is the power of an idea whose time has come"
- Victor Hugo

good points

Fortune Favors the Bold

the definition of liberty is a big thing, and indeed, problematic even here.

Fortune Favors the Bold

I think the the Free State

I think the the Free State Project was a great idea back then, but getting people to move for political, not immediate economic, reasons during a massive boom, is hard. When free money has everybody promoted and compensated way beyond their natural 'station' just where they're at, it's hard to get them to move to where they have to start lower on the rungs.

As economic outlooks, and NH real estate, return to normalcy, maybe we'll see some pickup.

Also, I think voting for one state up front was a mistake. If you look at the actual tallies, the reason NH won, was because the western states' votes were all split evenly amongst at least MT, WY, ID, with some for the Dakotas and AK.

I feel that by promoting moving to any one of the finalists, the number of people actually committing to moving to NH would not have dropped much, while many more would have committed to move to one of the other states. This would have helped the whole movement maintain forward momentum currently lacking.

As well, we would then have freedom fighters in many state legislatures. And also, if patriots in one state should turn out to be getting closer to real traction, those who chose another state, could easily have moved again.

But please, I urge anyone who is considering moving anyway to look at the list of FSP finalists, and read the rationale for why these were chosen, before making their decision. There are more than enough patriots around to form majorities in at least one, likely a few state legislatures, and in many more local ones, if we banded together. And then, as outsiders start seeing how much better free people live, we might just start educating them by example.

But aren't states like SD, ND, AK too big?

How do they compare population wise to NH? Doesn't the state with the tiniest population have the largest chance of success?

Not if you consider that

Not if you consider that fewer people will find jobs there.

Actually South Dakota was a FSP finalist. I thought it was one of the better choices.

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

Again...

... Any State that did not have the intelligence and courage to vote for their own freedom in the republican primary is going to secede. All this talk of secession is ridiculous. The .05 percent of the US population that still believes in freedom is not going to prevail against the pussies that inhabit the US. Stop already.

In many small states' GOP

In many small states' GOP primaries, RP got a lot more that 0.05% of the vote. Look at MT and ND.

Also, there are many people who have reservations about the federal govt that is not necessarily RP supporters. In VT per article, some of the most vocal secessionists sound like they are closer to socialists, whose main gripe is with the federales' current fascination with empire building.

The majority of Vermonters are coming at it from the other end

They are wanting to secede so they can have a more efficient, peaceful, socialist state. They want to be free to have their own style of socialism, read up on the politics of Vermont and read in this article who is pushing for it.

They are on the other end of the line from what is supposed to be republican thought.

What percentage of the folks living in the colonies fought in the revolution?

Thank you Dr. Paul for making me act on what I already knew was right.

*May the only ones to touch your junk, be the ones you want to touch your junk.*

Exactly!

There was an article on the website of the Vermont Seccesionists proposing that Bernie Sanders could be Vermont's president. Ack!

Lol

jeez...