56 votes

Torturing is “a part of human nature"; Being liable for torture would “distract” military leadership.

These comments by our "justice officials" are just STUNNING!

The 7th US Circuit Court of Appeals has thrown out a lawsuit by two US whistleblowers, Donald Vance and Nathan Ertel, who were tortured by the US military after coming forward with evidence of wrongdoing by the contracting company they were working for.

The court ruled that US military commanders “enjoy broad immunity” in cases of torture abroad and that the military chain of command “couldn’t be responsible” just because detainee abuse crossed a legal boundary. The ruling added that torturing detainees is “a part of human nature that is very difficult to control.” They added that being liable for the torture would “distract” the military’s leadership.

US Court of Appeals Judge James Gwim had previous rejected Obama Administration arguments to this effect, saying that torture lawsuits could continue against officials and that US citizens were always entitled to due process related to their detention. The administration condemned Gwim for “second-guessing” the military.



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The Corruption

is getting more and more blatant isn't it? Why don't they just come out and crown Rockefeller or Rothchild or someone "King of the World" and be done with it?


Oh that pesky ~distraction~ of being liable for the tortures.

Nevermind responsibility and seeing to it that things like tortures don't happen. That would be too distracting.

Those darned victims getting in the way...

I'm Shocked

I bet the contractor didn't get in any trouble at all. That's how it goes. Punish the heroes and let the villains run amock.

Consider it like you might

Consider it like you might consider yourself as a boss of a company.

1) If one or a number of your employees breaks the law, on or off duty, then it is that employee that is liable, in my ethical (not legal) opinion.

2) If I or another manager order an employee to do such an illegal act, then both manager and subordinate are liable.

3) There's got to be proof of both in 2) or in either case to indict one.

4) There's a problem, though, when illegal acts become a culture in an organization. A manager can't hide behind the law and allow tortures to continually happen and use the reverse-Nuremberg defense.

5) In any case, if the military head of command sees these things happen, it is minimally incompetence and a disgrace to his unit; and heads should roll after a review of the internal code.

6) Finally, there's always the Jack Bauer code of ethics. If you see some bad shit coming for a large number of people, and you see that you would have to do something bad to stop it, then make your own call. Just know that it doesn't make you immune from prosecution just because you may or may not have saved the world.


ecorob's picture

wtf, man!

...how the hell do we let these IDIOT judges get on the bench?

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

Probably The Same Way

Romney got nominated and Obama got elected. They are chosen by the rats above.


replace "torture" with

replace "torture" with "slavery" and you'll see how tortuous(pun intended) their logic is.

"My theories explain, but cannot slow the decline of a great civilization. I set out to be a reformer, but only became the historian of decline."
- Ludwig Von Mises

let me get this straight

So, these guys approach the government with evidence that the contracting company they work for in Iraq is doing illegal things. Then the government picks them up (the 2 guys, not the illegal company bosses) and detain and torture them. Then the courts say oh well too bad, torture is human nature and the government can't be accountable for what their subordinates do.

Truly amazing.


It surprises you that a government that drops depleted uranium on entire countries and exposes their own soldiers to it telling them it's harmless and then gets away with it also gets away with torturing whistleblowers? The same government that sends drones out to kill innocent women children and men who can't defend themselves? The same government that throws people in jail for pot but makes us all eat polluted and genetically messed up food? Oh I could go on and on. Just doesn't surprise me one bit is all.


The "Justice for all" cornerstone of this country

is all but crushed.

Soon all government employees will be exempt from any criminal activity as long as they are engaged in government "business".

Conscience does not exist if not exercised

"No matter how cynical you get, it's impossible to keep up!
---Lily Tomlin

no, torture is govt nature.

no, torture is govt nature.

this is not the America

That my family has fought for since colonial days. Chilling.

'Peace is a powerful message.' Ron Paul

Whose pockets were greased...

To get this ruling? Oh, right. The 7th Circuit Court of Appeals.

Criminals always excuse their own criminal behavior.

The Courts are worthless, in spite of the money we waste on them.

Free includes debt-free!

ecorob's picture

just like the nazis...

history will paint us in the same corner with them...

truly sad...

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

Oft said of the German people. How could they let that be!?

Resistance is futile!

That may be true today, but if the sun comes again someone may hear that not all complied or were assimilated.

Free includes debt-free!


We have a very sicko federal government that will do ANYTHING to justify its means.

such is "reasoning" very typical of psychopaths



Where have we heard this before????

We were just following orders - We would have been shot if we disobeyed.

Looks like we are getting ready for a repeat performance.

Have people totally lost their minds?

Lest there be any doubt remaining that the country we will soon live in will not be anything close to the republic it was supposed to be, this ends it. It seems we've lost our minds, hearts and souls.

you stated that so well

my original comment seemed to detract from it.


"The two weakest arguments for any issue on the House floor are moral and constitutional"
Ron Paul

Very important topic.

Excellent thread. Thanks for posting.

We're F-ed. That's it.

We're F-ed. That's it.

Southern Agrarian

Its IMMORAL to keep funding and supporting

these criminals. EVERYONE must STOP!

Just in case anyone

had any doubt that the creeps ruling our lives are murderous, sadistic psychopaths.