60 votes

Two weeks ago I was ready to give up on the GOP

but I'm now beginning to think we need to take over one of the two parties. There are two reasons for my shift in thinking:

1) I live in a conservative part of the state where most people value their life, liberty, and property. But on election day all the third parties combined got less than 2% of the vote in the presidential race. And the voter turnout was very good; far, far above the national average. I just don't see how we can educate the 98% well enough before the country is beyond redemption, without taking over one of the two main parties. Most won't even look beyond the two parties, much less consider their positions. (And no they won't Google "Gary Johnson")

2) I attended a Ron Paul supporter dinner last week and there were speakers from Dr. Paul's campaign, Young Americans for Liberty, the Virginia Campaign for Liberty, and several recent liberty candidates. What struck me is that all of them were convinced that the only way to succeed in getting Ron Paul libertarians elected was through one of the two major parties. Most speakers really didn't care which party, but they felt the better option at the present was the GOP.

So my plan for the next two years is to go to the county, district, and state GOP meetings/conventions and stand for liberty. I will be respectful of the "old guard", but I won't deviate from Dr. Ron Paul's gospel. I think we need to continue to work from the grassroots up and increase our position in the GOP until we are the GOP -- or at least a majority of it. The sooner the better. Obama's election should create opportunities we didn't have in 2012.

What do you think?



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be careful of compromise...

I don't mean to rain on your parade but, at the convention there were several rule changes. Those need to be undone. As a member of the broward county libertarian party, I urge you to take this little quiz, just to see how "republican" you really are http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz
At one point, the republican party was as small as the libertarian party...

Label Jars, Not People!

I am struggling with this issue.

I have been active with the GOP since 2007 and am on good terms with our county board. People have been encouraging me to run for a GOP board position that is opening up. The problem is that board members are supposed to be detached from pushing policies and candidates. I am a board member of a Ron Paul group called Mesa County Patriots and we are very outspoken. We were on the radio the other day ranting against the FED, war, regulations and plugging Dr. Paul. After a long conversation with our current treasurer who is running for chair I made the decision that I won't be running for the board. I work too many hours at my day job and I want my activities to be more aggressive for the cause of liberty than a muted board member.

Huh?

You're working too many hours to spend 2 hours a month in a GOP meeting where you can get access to media, parades, debates because you want to "be more aggressive" (spend more time) on media, parades and debates against the GOP?

GOP Takeover is the way to victory!

I see a lot of comments that seem to feel that taking over the GOP is not going to get us anywhere. I'm here to tell you that is simply not the case. We can take over and make this our party.

I have examined the RNC structure and it can be taken over. It can be taken over in less than 10 years time if we are aggressive and can all get on the same page about this. Do you think we can elevate a minor political party to the same level as the GOP or DEMs in that same amount of time. We are running out of time and need to work the fastest route possible, even if it isn't the preferred route. I suggest some of you get over your bitterness and use that anger to put the squeeze on these political hacks that sold us out.

I outlined the RNC structure in this thread: http://www.dailypaul.com/254025/education-time-learn-the-nat...

The whole RNC is made up of basically 3 people from each state. So, gaining control at the state level is all that is necessary to get the people into power at the national level. I went to the CCRP meeting here in Las Vegas (just moved here) and they managed to sweep all the local executive board positions that were up for vote. All it takes is showing up and getting voting rights at your local GOP. If you can't spend 2-3 hours a month at a local GOP meeting, then I guess freedom just ain't worth your time, now is it? I'm directing that last comment at all those couch-sitters who think we will win freedom by sending $20 to a moneybomb every few months.

This is the perfect time to do it as well. If your party is dominated by establishment RINOs, they won't suspect you of being a Paulite, not right now. You have the perfect story for becoming a member now. "After seeing us lose the last election, I decided I needed to get active personally if we're ever going to get control." Technically, that statement isn't a lie, either. Chances are, they'll be glad to appoint you as a PC, etc., if you ask. Then just play it cool till you figure out who is who. Then you'll know who to align with. Start bringing friends as well. Half the battle is just showing up.

The GOP is a brand. It's just like Coke or Pepsi, Walmart or Target, etc. There are a lot of people who donate to the GOP, just because they are the GOP. They have no clue what the actual party platforms are, they're just pro-Israel or pro-Gun, or whatever, and think the GOP is the only party. They are blind donors and blind voters. Unfortunately, because stupidity exists at epidemic levels in this nation, we have to control the brand if we are to effect a change in this nation.

________________________________________

I think both party's could use a little Ron Paul Love

The Democrats should be just as pissed as the Republicans about getting their party hijacked by the progressives.

Interesting that you said the speakers

really didn't care which party to get involved with, although feeling that the GOP was the better option at this point. I was recently thinking that it's about time (especially now that Obama has won), for people to become involved with the Democratic Party. For some issues, I think Democrats would be easier to turn into activists, e.g., re the wars/military engagements and NDAA issues.

When we try to pick out anything by itself, we find it hitched to everything else in the Universe.
~ John Muir

'bout time ...

Well, taking over the Republican Party from the ground up has been the plan all along. I'm a bit of a late comer to it as well; only started hearing about it in 2007 or so. If you were paying attention to the Ron Paul primary campaign, you would have noticed that there was a lot of that going on, including taking over at the local and state level. I'm sure somewhere, there's some straightforward information about how successful that was. Obviously not successful enough to win the election, but there was some progress.

It's not the first time serious conservatives have battled for the Party either. It's really an ongoing thing. Now, it's important to drive out the Reagan RINOs; an absolute necessity to secure liberty and bring manufacturing and other outsourced jobs back to the USA.

But let's be realistic. It's not a one-way battle. The Reagan coalition will continue to fight back and it's being run by people who don't play by the rules. That's another thing you should have learned from Ron Paul's campaign. They're not going to give up power peacefully. If they're losing, they'll just cheat.

Now, I've said it's a necessity to reform the GOP. Maybe it's not. I'm just saying that I'm for it anyway. But I'd rather that everyone at least get on the side of a solution that will work and will work for a long time. We need a multi-party system. The takeover of the Republican Party wouldn't be such a problem now if we had one. We wouldn't be stuck in the lesser of two evils con game. The Republican Party as it is today wouldn't get enough support to have any power and they'd have to improve in order to get back in the game. If the Libertarians had a better offer, they wouldn't be stopped by the "third parties waste your votes" issue.

Correlation does not prove causality!

Ron Paul is very far right

Ron Paul is very far right wing as is Jefferson. History teaches that right wing are the fascists, which is WRONG and a LIE. It confuses people.

Freedom and limited government are VERY RIGHT WING

As they go left WE go right in the Republican party. To victory.

I'm with you

I became a precinct delegate this summer. I have to miss the upcoming County Convention this week, but I will get back into the swing of things as soon as I can.

3rd Party is a waste of time, unless 2% of vote turns you on

Regardless of the prevailing wisdom around here, most people don't want to flush their vote down a toilet. 99% would rather vote against someone than be completely irrelevant. Gary Johnson's 1% doesn't exactly make the establishment's blood run cold. But a growing force within a major party does.

We need to bring new people into the Republican party and convert certain groups of conservatives.

Over the next 4 years of economic misery, there will be many disaffected independents and democrats punished by the misguided policies of the Social-Democrats. The Libertarian wing of the GOP may be the only place for them to go,

We will also see Afghanistan and Iraq falter and descend into chaos and it will become very apparent how all the money and lives were wasted. Not to mention, Obama is good for a couple of middle eastern disasters in the coming years. Some of the Hawks will break ranks and join us, finally realizing that every war since Korea has amounted to nothing but carnage and looted treasure.

All we need to do is cobble together 25% of the GOP vote and we effectively control the party. We are already half way there.

The social conservatives and religious right will fight us. We must convince as many of them as we can that not advocating government interference in peoples lives does not equate to endorsing behaviors we do not care for. We must sell then on being true to minimalist government in all realms, so as not to seem hypocritical when combating "Big Government" on the economic front. We must also remind them that the powers of the federal government are limited and enumerated in the constitution and that any "worthy cause" that requires using government as a sledgehammer against others is contrary to our founding principles.

Finally, the untapped goldmine is ant-corporatism. We must rail against facist-corporatism at every turn. We must expose the cosy, money relationships between the political and business class over and over again.

Agree completely

The midterms, after what can only be considered an abysmal failure by GOP leadership, offers great opportunity. The establishment candidate did what no other candidate has done. Lost to an incumbent with 8% unemployment. That is how bad the candidate they offered was. If ever people were ready to listen, that time is now. On top of that, there will be additional apathy because of the loss, so the midterms, already lacking in participation will be even more so. We won't need near as many people to impact the midterms after this massive loss as we would have in pretty much any other circumstance.
Start now, if you didn't start before (thanks Granger :) ). This is a fantastic opportunity.

I agree 100%

We need to be focused on gaining power within the Republican Party. We made huge strides in 2012. We now control several State Parties. And we got several good liberty candidates elected to Congress. We need to elect more of them in the coming mid-term elections, and the long-term goal has to be making a Ron Paul Republican the 2016 Presidential nominee of the Republican Party.

Third parties are useful as a protest vote in general elections when the Ron Paul Republican has lost his primary; but that is the extent of their usefulness.

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

And that is why we are in this mess.

The reason only 2% went to other options is because people falsely believe in the "wasted vote" idea.

This is reinforced by people in Point #2

And point #2 is merely someone else's opinion.

I'd counter that you are giving too much weight to the opinions of people who are simply going to lead you down the path you are already traveling.

Trying to work within either of the two major parties is not going to get us anywhere except over the cliff both are racing towards.

In the GOP and the DNC, the driver doesn't get to hit the brakes or steer the car more than a few degrees. About all he/she can do is either let up on the gas a little, or push the pedal to the metal. The vehicle is controlled by the auto-pilot of the masses of fools and charlatans riding backseat and shotgun. (think of it as a driver's ed car, where someone else can take control if they so desire)

That isn't a recipe for restoring Liberty or the Republic.

The problem is that those two parties control too much of the process.

You aren't going to change anything from within them.

The solution is to relegate ALL parties to their rightful place, and remove their influence from the Law directly.

That can only be done from the outside.

There is one more reason 3rd parties don't get more votes - they are not organized to the same degree that the other two parties are.

This task is made difficult only because people keep buying into the self-fulfulling prophecy of your two points above.

If they convince you too to work in the GOP, then you won't be organizing the opposition now will you?

If you aren't organizing the opposition, and they've even got you trying to convince others not to as well, how likely do you think it is that a 3rd party candidate will do well in your State?

On the other hand, we know our power.

If we used it to organize the opposition party(s) instead of beating our heads against brick in the GOP, then we would get somewhere.

Once we reach the tipping point, and our 3rd party of choice is well organized and ready to handle the growth of interest and members and candidates, then we'll start to see real results and victories.

You'll NEVER see that in the GOP.

The GOP has NEVER really been the party of Liberty. They have ALWAYS - from the BEGINNING been about strong centralized government in the hands of the elites.

Who was their first president again?

The GOP knows they need to talk the Liberty talk or they lose elections. But they rarely if ever govern that way in the slightest.

Notice, Romney didn't even try to talk the conservative talk did he? He gave a few shout outs here and there, but everyone knew he was an elitist, and not a conservative.

He got his butt handed to him. he won only one of the eleven "battleground" states.

Personally, I'd figure the GOP is mighty toxic right now and is in disarray. They are scared that the libertarian wing, the true fiscal conservatives are going to bolt the party, and then the GOP will be history.

I say lets give those people somewhere to bolt to.

We're working hard on that right now in Louisiana.

This story is exactly why we

This story is exactly why we should let the RATubliCONS kill their own party.

http://nbcpolitics.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/11/13/15141771-pol...

The point of nominating Rmoney, whas to bring the parties closer (in (liberal) views) while destroying one of them (guess which one).

I agree 110%.

I've joined College Republicans and am planning to go to my first ever Tea Party meeting Thursday night. Most people don't get that involved in politics in the offseason, so, if a million Ron Paul Republicans don't let up between now and 2014, the Tea Party wave the country feels two years from now will be just as powerful as it was two years ago, only instead of people like Allen West, Michele Bachmann, and Marco Rubio, it will be people like Thomas Massie, Justin Amash, and Rand Paul filling Congress.

I dont think leaving the GOP was ever part of the plan

Its a matter of time until we are the GOP and just remember to bring friends! you stand out much more when you introduce fresh faces into the party.

His name is Edward Snowden

What is Capitalism?
http://youtu.be/yNF09pUPypw

Exactly, like Ron Paul

Exactly, like Ron Paul said...we need a second party!

I'm already doing my part. I'm involved. Like you, I've been very respectful to the "old guard" but have made my reasoning known. I've been networking and have got quite a few to come to our side, fairly easily actually.

We have a lot of armchair activists in this movement, trying to light the fire under those guys' butts!

That is exactly right

Armchair activists. Make a real commitment to the cause of liberty. Get off your computer and "be the change". (This includes myself by the way, there is certainly more I can do)

Second Party!

Time for a second party!

"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul

Educate the masses, and win in the end.

YES, It is the only way

It is obvious that the GOP will always be controlled by outside forces as will the Democratic party. We are wasting our time in the GOP. Start a strong second liberty party not controlled by the media and the world order and we can gain a majority siphoning off Democrats and Republicans alike. The country is ready for it. "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or government", Thank You Ron Paul

hthomas

The Ron Paul Liberty party.

The Ron Paul Liberty party.

:D

I don't understand why some people want us to help them to get corporate welfare so much. Changing the institution doesn't make a difference!

"Truth is Treason in an Empire that lies" - Ron Paul

Educate the masses, and win in the end.

Excellent idea!!!

:)

Rand Paul At 91% In This Poll...

http://www.dailypaul.com/263012/vote-in-this-2016-poll

Vote For Him. You bet I have hope for the future. Just like his dad.

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Dont' give up on it. We need to push forward

I was a state delegate in TX. It was cool when half were cheering for ron paul. We just need to keep pushing forward. IOWA and 5 other states got taken over by ron paul supporters. We need to push forward in the rest of the 44 states. Alot of the whiners here never did anything ron paul told them to do...join the republican party. If you really believe in ron paul's message, then you will listen to him to flood the republican party.

and after all your hard work,

and after all your hard work, once you finally get the vote to take control at the local level, the "old guard" will empty the accounts, cancel the lease, take the mailing list, move across the street and go right back to work, while you survey your new empty kingdom in the dark.

They will fund a Democrat just to beat your guy. You will become disenfranchised and leave, they move back across the street and run their guy against the Dem in the next go and they're back on plan.

They are way more experienced at evil than we will ever be.

That is the part I don't understand

when we talk about taking over the gop. If 80% of the same people and corporations fund the dems and the gop what are we taking over? How do we get any press coverage when they own the media? It will be the same type of co-opting that happened to the local tea parties. Unfortunately, I am not well read on the history of how other political parties developed with any sucess.

The meetings

There were supposed to be 21 people at my GOP meeting. There were 2.

Asw I continued to go to the meetings, I read in the by laws, a member miss three meetings and they could be removed.. so, when they would miss three meetings.. I would petition to have them removed. Eventually I was appointed a seat.. my elected seat begins in January.. The more od us that showed up.. the more of them began.. and Palin's people are now coming in..

The tea party was around before Ron Paul... I threw crates in the River screaming DOWN WITH KING GEORGE in 05.. Sons of Liberty and Redman Society..

Here is one that came to mind

Here is one that came to mind after reading your post.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r21CMDyPuGo

Do you think there should be more than 2 viable parties?

Is two choices always the right answer? Should there be more voices at the table? How will there ever be anything more than this in America if people keep sticking around the same corrupt parties and never doing anything to directly challenge them from the outside?

Keep working through the GOP means hundreds of thousands of people keep paying GOP dues and feeding funds to this corrupt institution. What if all the liberty people left and put all the money to independent candidates on the local and state level and left the GOP to rot in its own worthless corruption.

I am ready to move on.