111 votes

Thanksgiving for the (actual) "crazy Ron Paul people"

I frequently read comments on the Daily Paul regarding the apparent infiltration of the Liberty Movement and DP by various fringe elements, the so-called "new age" folks. Being an honest and informed citizen, I know how it feels to be part of the fringe, so please read no implied judgment in the use of the word "fringe."

Most readers need no further explanation to conjure up the image of the fringe people under consideration. They are the folks who believe in planet Niburu (with respect to Mr. Nystrom's rules, I will not check the spelling of the planet's name). Some of them believe that lizard people walk among us (I have to admit that when I see Ed Schultz on MSNBC or Bill O’Reilly on Fox News, I find myself considering the plausibility of their theory; have you ever really looked good and hard into the eyes of those guys?).

Other members of that fringe have ideas about “bigger picture” changes afoot, or they spend time trying to connect the dots asking “what does it all mean?” like caricatures of stoners. Some of them will probably comment that certain mind-altering substances help human beings to perceive the world in a way that our mind typically does not permit (by the way, I would agree, since that is what it means to take a “mind-altering” substance). They also populate the ranks of the former and current hippies, the anarchists and the everyday libertarians who believe that people must and will change for the better. Admittedly, I align myself philosophically with this fringe in the sense that I believe any chance of the Liberty Movement succeeding requires a sea change in the attitudes and behavior of people: humanity needs a moral compass, and this is not a change that can be effected through the political process.

So why are there so many of these "new agers" attaching themselves to the Liberty Movement? Why are there so many folks who wake up to liberty and eventually move to the new age fringe? Like many of you, I ended up here because I naturally pursue truth. I try to embrace truth when it challenges my previous beliefs, even beliefs long held. I try to seek truth in the shadows when those with the spotlight would divert my eyes to falsehoods. I don’t accept authority that is founded on anything other than truth. I rebelled against teachers when I thought they were wrong, nuns when I thought they misunderstood the true message of their religion and occasionally peer pressure when I thought my peers wrong.

For anyone else out there like me whose journey has taken them here, we have seen the manner in which institutional structures have pulled the proverbial wool over our eyes for a lifetime. Worse, we see the desperation with which many of our friends try to avoid removing the wool from their eyes (perhaps because deep in the core of their subconscious they fear the changes that come from accepting the truth).

In an apparent paradox for someone like me who believes in the pursuit of objective truth whenever possible, I have come to the conclusion that virtually anything is possible. Throughout history, daring to go out on a limb for the truth has been a perilous endeavor. The non-fringe did not take kindly to the fringe that thought that the world was round, that all humans are endowed with rights, that doctors should wash their hands between medical procedures, that sleep was something other than the process of returning blood from the feet to the brain (these last two are actually true, believe it or not; perhaps we should start a thread of incredibly irrational ideas that institutions and societies clung to at the peril of those who challenged the ideas).

After discovering that the foundation of my American experience is a steaming pile of lies and deceit, how can I accept that anything is outside the realm of possibility just because it is not a widely accepted theory? Planet X colliding with earth? I hope not. Lizard people among us? Probably not ready to accept it, but that is different than ruling it out. Age of Aquarius ringing in a change for the better in all of humanity? I could live with that (and I could use some of what you’re smoking, provided that there are no agents of former admitted drug using presidents watching!).

So, from one man to all of the fringe types, thank you for your thoughts and your involvement. You have enriched my life over the past year. Many call you crazy. Some of you probably are crazy, but so are most geniuses who live with the unfortunate burden of being ahead of their time.

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double post

I got a "504" so I thought it didn't post, then I posted again... my apologies.

I think

You got 'em all in there. Great list. Well said.

Unlearning and self-teaching since 2008. Thanks, Dr. Paul!

Nice thread,

imo. I actually was New-Agey before I woke up to Liberty. I've never been religious, but as far back as I can remember, I've been Spiritual.
Too many things about religion just did not make any sense to me. For instance, if God is love then how could he possibly condemn some of his children to an eternity in Hell? What's loving about that?

Am I crazy? I think that that depends on whose definition of crazy 'we' are using!! I do frequently attempt to use humor to get through life, hence a saying I made up years ago and frequently cite: I don't like normal people--they're boring!

True story:

About 2 1/2 years ago, I decided to take a break from a project I'd been chasing around online. I went and sat in my recliner, put my feet up and closed my eyes. Immediately, I could see this cream-colored 'paper', full of code/jargon, highlighted throughout in neon purple, scrolling backward. This lasted for awhile.

I did share the experience online, wondering what THAT was all about! It was suggested that perhaps I had tapped into the Akashic Record. Whatever it was, it had certainly captured my attention.

For the record, although I consider myself somewhat New-Agey, I don't buy into the doom and gloom. I don't think the world is ending on December 21st--I think it's the end of an era and the herald of an age of enlightenment. Other ways I differ from some New-Agey people is that I believe in and pray to Jesus and I believe in a Mother God as well as a Father God (It just makes the most sense to me--everything throughout nature is male/female!).

I don't buy into the lizard people and I certainly hope the Nibiru thing is bogus.

As far as fringe goes, I like fringe...I especially liked it on my leather jackets in the 60's!! :)

O.P.O.G.G. - Fighting the attempted devolution of the rEVOLution
Ron Paul 2012...and beyond

ecorob's picture

nice signature...

For a crazy person.

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.


I was raised Catholic... always attended Catholic school. I think that experience may have tainted me when it comes to religion. There was so much that was blatantly wrong or inconsistent with what I saw and learned compared to what I knew to be right. Some things were even inconsistent within themselves. Anyway, I would have considered myself atheistic for a while, then agnostic. I always deplored politicians who invoked Jesus, as I thought back to my upbringing. When I started to reflect on the message of the liberty movement and some of the underlying lessons that run throughout the Bible, I realized that I had been throwing out the baby with the bathwater, so to speak.

Upon considering Dr. Paul's message and invocation of Christ, and after reading God of the Machine by Isabel Patterson (Ayn Rand's teacher who split with her student over the God question), I have realized that I am more spiritual and a more firm believer in God than I ever was. I intend to re-read the Bible and then read the holy books of other religions. If I can muster up the courage to home school my kids (if and when they come), this reading will be part of the foundation of that education.

Obviously, there are incalculable notions of God that people maintain. I think about the manner in which life on earth has evolved (no offense to the creationists, I just think that the evidence of evolution is pretty conclusive, personally), and I can't help but reject the notion that this is the end... that we are fully evolved. For me, God is whatever has caused life to get thus far and in deferential respect to that power - even if it is sheer randomness, as some people might believe - I worship it by obeying the laws that are apparent in nature. It makes for a nice harmony of Objectivism and theistic philosophies.

Unlearning and self-teaching since 2008. Thanks, Dr. Paul!

Peace Peace Pass,

Peace Peace Pass, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhNrqc6yvTU&feature=fvwrel

Colorado Liberty is Alive and Well! more folks voted for 64 then romney or obama individually. Ron Paul Conservative Unity Slate Won The Colorado GOP Convention despite the actions of many corrupt colorado establishment. Liberty is Served in Colorado, Eat Up!!! Liberty 2014, Liberty 2016!!

Ron Paul 2016

The Comments

I'm sure this will surprise no one and perhaps it need not be said. I am, most often, even more profoundly enlightened, humbled, and inspired by the comments than the original post. From a brief affirmation to the post, to the deepest of personal anecdotes from another little human creature's beautiful, if downright painful journey, I can only tell you all, I am ever grateful for the camaraderie and heartfelt joy I get from my fellow DP'ers who share a bit of themselves in the comments. Mad love to you all.

None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.

Great thoughts!

Thanks for sharing, I couldn't agree more.

Ron Paul Revolution is spreading around the world: Freedom and Prosperity TV: libertarian network of alternative media in Western Balkans

Thanks! Nice to hear.

The fringe has been taking a beating lately and been ostracised from the campaign. A shame because these people came together despite many differences to boost Ron Paul.

Paradoxically this pushes many more people into the fringe and you left out one of it's major drivers: those who go off grid and opt for non-participation. These ranks grow every year too.

As far as this "dawning age of Aquarius" thing, I guess it does have a New Age ring to it however there are other indicators besides the cloying odor of herbal refreshments. Check out gun sales homes. Millions upon millions upon millions. They aren't showing up to RP rallies in those numbers. Are they all believers in reptilian ideology or do they represent a rising tide of awareness? Prepping is going mainstream after a total market bottom post Y2K. I see some oil drum fires on street corners on Staten Island but I have no indication they are Wiccan rituals.

So don't despair. And you left out flouride and chemtrails and DARPA and...well, Ales Jones would just puke at the incomplete nature of your examples.

Get your preps together! Learn historic food storage and preservation methods and the science that makes them work now, start saving money and the future

It is the mark of an educated

It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.



Well-written and insightful.

I think we all need reminding that NOT ONE of us knows it all.

As far-flung and absurd as some people's beliefs may seem to be here on the DP (LOL! Some of mine included! And yet I've had the nerve to mock others occasionally....), we are all at least in this "liberty thang" together.


What would the Founders do?

Really great post, could not have said it better myself

However I would have added the obvious caveats:

1) There more way more dead ends on the road to truth than there are open pathways that actually lead somewhere Real.

Learning to evaluate the difference is the essence of wisdom, and is an art learned continuously throughout a lifetime.

2) We must always keep vigilant to recognize the difference between idle speculation vs reasonable theories based on solid evidence vs verifiable fact.

See point #1, and

3) Some circumstances are much better suited and are more appropriate for a given conversation to take place.

In other words ..

Bringing up certain topics among certain people in a particular venue might actually work against you goal of (exploring / disseminating / convincing) influencing others to accept what you are saying.

And a given topic might be counterproductive to the overall primary goals of the group you've elected to be part of.

Hence (paraphrasing a guy's post below me):

".. oh yeah I find conversations about mutating green lizard men REALLY helps my credibility when introducing new people to the the Fed's role in intentionally inflating paper currency to funnel wealth the the elite" /sarcasm

People need to consider the circumstances. Use judgement. Always.

Especially here.

Don't dilute or poison the wellspring of Liberty with too much "idle stoner conversation" (airquotes) if you can possibly help it.


Good post

I would only disagree with "people must and will change for the better." Nothing wrong with the people, except our longing for perfection and thus rejecting reality. Aiming at perfection is natural and adds to positive motivation. When mind is not focused (and here Ayn Rand's philosophy enters into the picture uniquely), Utopia creeps in.

Most of people think they act rationally when
- building Utopia on Earth to help the poor or the workers;
- helping the poor in order to enter Utopia in the sky as a reward;
- multiplying the poor with fertilized eggs mania while criticizing welfare;
- wanting to restrict freedom of bankers & secret powerful groups while advocating free society;
- curbing or killing those who prevent us from achieving our Utopia (it is not for us, it is for our kids and others, of course. "The common good before the private good" - Adolf Hitler. )

The main Utopia, however, is yours - building a new Utopian man (both collectivists and anarchists long for.) Economists, on the other hand, observed a unique pattern - the number of people, %-wise, who actually contribute to our rapid progress (invent something) is not related to education or the progress of our civilization. The number, in fact, is DECREASING.

So what is "normal"?

That there is no such thing as right or wrong as we are all just groups of chemicals,our chemical forefathers having risen from some primordial soup eons earlier? The only "cause" in the universe was the Big Bang, and we have no more free will than a boulder rolling down a hill?
This is the accepted idea and those that think differently are "fringe"?
I think I like the fringe.

Yeah, since our credibility is already so high...

... with the general population, what we really need are MORE looney conspiracy theories on the Daily Paul.

I mean its so much easier to convince people that their trusted political leaders are tools of an international conspiracy if you mix it in with stuff about alien lizard people. At least that's been my experience.

The Virtual Conspiracy

ytc's picture

So good to have "our" people at all levels & sides of the

fringe borders. Liberty to express what we perceive to be truth at each stage of our lives is what we are aspiring to protect.

I give thanks to you ALL DPers!

I should add...

That I understand the need not to live in any particular fringe and to reach out and teach. I guess my post was meant to be a gesture of thanks to those who remain steady in their pursuit of understanding even in the face of a vast majority of popular opinion. I love individuals who are unafraid to stand out, even if they are different than I am.

But you're right that if your objective is to win people's minds, the lizard people argument is not the starting point :)

Unlearning and self-teaching since 2008. Thanks, Dr. Paul!

ecorob's picture

our credibility is, actually, very high!

and it will ONLY grow bigger as the nwo lame street media struggle mightily and daily with the loss of this election...they can't wrap their minds around why "they" lost

soon, though, they will "come around" as we will villify and expose those who seek the old ways of death and corruption...

there's a new sheriff in town and his name is Liberty!

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

I hear you, but

I have tried the whole "here are the facts" thing, and people still resist. At some point, in my opinion, it becomes less about convincing the masses who refuse to acknowledge truth - regardless of the preponderance of evidence - and more about discovering the truth. For example, regardless of what was truly behind the founding of the Fed, the institution has been off limits in the political debate (and the economic debate) for quite some time. If the brave few had chosen to cede truth to popularity and credibility, this movement would be missing some bedrocks.

Unlearning and self-teaching since 2008. Thanks, Dr. Paul!

Thank you so much JG!

I believe we're finding more like-minded people on these fringes. I find that the fringe is like being on the leading edge of thought away from the status quo thinkers. As you point out, many of our geniuses were leaders in thought and in regards to the Establishment, this is what the largest threat is.

And notice how the fringe isn't really the fringe anymore. I am absolutely amazed by the growing number of people who express the same fringe thoughts which makes me believe that slowly those who still cling to the status quo are becoming the fringe themselves.

Whatever label you want to give it, it is clear that whether you believe in the time of Revelation, a Paradigm Shift, a Consciousness Shift, ushering in the Age of Aquarius, the Mayan new Age, Golden Age, a Quantum Leap, the Awakening, etc., etc., something is indeed happening all over the World. It's quite exciting to be honest.

I very much appreciate your positive acknowledgment of these topics. We're all in this together!

"We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience"—Pierre Teilhard de Chardin

The 'humans are alien/primate combination' theory makes more...

...sense than either Creation and evolution.

Whether aliens genetically spliced their dna with earth primates or they got it on with bigfoot, it explains homosapiens' unique dna, our unique intelligence, etc. We just don't fit terrestrially...thus there is likely some extraterrestrial influence.

Hmmm...the bible actually backs this up if you read between the lines. Just substitute god with aliens. Made in his image. God made (terraformed) the earth. Etc.

Moses Jesus egyptians etc may have had access to ancient alien technology...example: a mana machine to help moses feed thousands in the desert.

I don't actually believe this, but it is gaining traction around the world.

Also consider that everything is energy

I'm not discounting the Alien hypothesis at all.

Consciousness is a form of energy. If there is some cyclical energetic boost that happens then consciousness will undergo a relative boost as well. This very well could have happened where primates suddenly began "awakening" and realized they were conscious. And from then on it may seem like there is indeed a "missing link" in evolution. But also along with your thoughts, perhaps this consciousness boost was assisted with technology.

We may never know for sure, or we may find out in one month if the next boost happens to us. The Apocalypse is defined as a "revelation of things hidden from mankind in an age dominated by falsehood and misconceptions" so maybe we'll experience a boost of consciousness that will allow us to see with pure clarity these things that have been hidden. But doesn't it seem like we're already uncovering so much that was hidden for decades? We sure are and there's nothing fringe about that ;)

"We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience"—Pierre Teilhard de Chardin

Neat...some feel this consciousness awakening came from...

mushrooms and other herbs. That the bible is actually code for it...the forbidden fruit being a red psychotropic mushroom (not an apple) that awakened Adam and Eve to cosmic truths.

It's all here in the Pharmacratic Inquisition: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5zGRzz_5YA

It's perfect timing for Christmas...as santa claus is one of many icons depiting a red mushroom. Ditto for gnomes, popes, the cross, wine glasses (the blood and flesh of christ), etc.

As above, so below...it not only deals with mushrooms but astronomy truths as well...which starts to play into the ancient aliens.

Yes, that's also one of the theories

Maybe even Ayahuasca. I really want to go to Peru to take part in a legit Shaman Ayahuasca ceremony.

Some say the forbidden fruit could have been a reference to sacred geometry's "Fruit of Life":


This pattern exists throughout the universe from our own creation as dividing cells to plant growth to proportions of galaxies, etc.

Wow, conversations like this make me realize i learned nothing of substance in school :)

"We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience"—Pierre Teilhard de Chardin


...you're crazy! ;)

Unlearning and self-teaching since 2008. Thanks, Dr. Paul!

check out these links

it makes more sense than what we are told

alien primate theory: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_603uf3Ixg

baalbek: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA2KILHxPJ4

Again, I don't believe in these things, but it's good to keep an open mind.

Speaking of which: Ancient Aliens Debunked: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9w-i5oZqaQ

Well said. Happy Thanksgiving

Well said. Happy Thanksgiving to all. An open mind is something I strive for knowing full well that most of the information I take in is rubbish -- I thank God for my BS filters.

Wonderful Post!

Gratitude to the OP and Michael and all of my Freedom Family here at the DP. It's is amazing how we have all grown together over the years is it not? One of my favorite lines in your post, jg, is:

"I try to seek truth in the shadows when those with the spotlight would divert my eyes to falsehoods. "

What eloquent imagery you use to describe the free thinker, the skeptical truth seeker! The willingness and capacity to do just this is key. And I have great pride and empathy for us "fringies" who are willing to brave the ire of the rapt audience - we who are willing to nudge those standing next to us, still blinded by the spotlight, and point to the shadows. And, amazingly, we continue to do it day after day, week after week, and year after year! We are growing and we are winning the war of ideas.

So I will stand up and state it boldly,


There is much to be Thankful for and the DP Community is a huge part of the blessings in my life. Thank you all!

Forever in Freedom and Gratitude!

If my need to be RIGHT is greater than my desire for TRUTH, then I will not recognize it when it arrives ~ Libertybelle

Happy Thanksgiving to you too!..

...I believe that the main reason the British lost the colonies was that; while they were in control of the "picture" of history being painted at the time, they failed to see the "big picture", which encompassed so many more abstract ideals which were outside of the lines of the objectives of the time. I feel that we are at a tipping point now. I feel that the powers that be.. are so wrapped up in their greedy motives that they are failing to comprehend the power of individual ideas which, when unleashed, can redirect the destined course of history.
I give thanks to my ancestors who founded this great experiment called the United States of America.

Participate in America's future- Research Ron Paul- Truth will Prevail! You too, will be proud one day, to be able to say: "I was a Ron Paul supporter."

Michael Nystrom's picture

Thank you, and happy Thanksgiving!

I freely admit that I'm one of the crazies - a free thinker. It is nice to finally be able to understand and admit it, and own it, and be ok with it.

There is someone, I forget who, who used to have as their signature line this Krishnamurti quote: “It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.” I had no idea who Krishnamurti was when I read it, but I could clearly tell he knew what he was talking about. And because of that quote I went out and got his book, "Think on These Things." And that book was a profound education in and of itself. And that whole thread of learning for me started here at the DP, from someone's signature line.

I have learned so much here. Thank you jg for the thoughtful thoughts, and thank you everyone for sharing your knowledge and your teachings. Happy Thanks Giving, and love to all.


All art is only done by the individual. The individual is all you ever have, and all schools only serve to classify their members as failures. E.H.