-30 votes

Are you misled on the issues surrounding the Israeli/Palestinian conflicts?

For a while now I've been seeing a lot of anti Israel rhetoric here on DP. I wanted to take a minute to say that I think many of you are mislead on the issues surrounding the Israeli/Palestinian conflicts. I see people coming down on the side of the Palestinians and view Israel as the perpetrators of all aggression time and time again. I do not and here is why.

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Israel became a nation in about 1440 BC (at Mount Sinai), two thousand years before the rise of Islam.

In about 70 AD the Romans took over the whole land, flattened Jerusalem, burnt down the Temple and killed and exiled a large part of the Jewish population of the area.

In 139 AD, the descendants of those who remained, under the command of Bar Kokhba, again rebelled against Rome. The Roman army came in again and this time they killed many thousands of Jews, flattened Jerusalem again and built a new Roman city on the ruins, calling it Aelia Capitolina. They then expelled all the Jews, who had survived the slaughter.

The Roman Procurator in charge of the captured Jewish territories called for historians and asked them who were the worst enemies of the Jews in their history. The historians replied, "the Philistines";

Thus, the Procurator declared that the Land of Israel would from then forward be called "Palaestina" to dishonor the Jews and obliterate their history.

For nearly 2000 years the land of Israel was known as Palestine. In 1948, it became Israel once again.

The Arab nations initiated at least four of the Middle Eastern wars- in 1948, in 1967, in the War of Attrition and in 1973-and they lost. Israel defended herself each time and won.

The PLO’s charter still calls for the destruction of Israel.

Article 9: Armed struggle is the only way to liberate Palestine. Thus it is the overall strategy, not merely a tactical phase. The Palestinian Arab people assert their absolute determination and firm resolution to continue their armed struggle and to work for an armed popular revolution for the liberation of their country and their return to it. They also assert their right to normal life in Palestine and to exercise their right to self-determination and sovereignty over it.

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“Since 1948 it is we who have demanded the return of the refugees while it is we who made them leave. We have rendered them dispossessed. We have accustomed them to begging. We have participated in lowering their moral and social level. Then we exploited them in executing crimes of murder, arson and throwing bombs at men, women and children.”
Khaled al-Azzem, former Syrian Prime Minister 1973.

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DO THE PALESTINIAN MOSLEMS REALLY WANT PEACE WITH ISRAEL?

"The governments of the world should know that Islam cannot be defeated. Islam will be victorious in all the countries of the world and Islam and the teachings of the Koran will prevail all over the world."
(Ayatollah Khomeini "The Blood of the Moon" page 72)

"We shall export our revolution to the whole world. Until the cry, ‘Allahu akbar’ resounds over the whole world, there will be struggle. There will be jihad!"
(Ayatollah Khomeini "The Blood of the Moon" page 72)

"Anyone who relinquishes a single inch of Jerusalem is neither an Arab nor a Muslim."
Yasser Arafat, Chairman of the P.L.O.(Voice of Palestine, Algiers, 2 September 1993)

"The Zionist entity exists on seized land. The Jews remain enemies because they expropriate lands, build settlements and pay high sums to buy properties. They are the greatest enemies of us Muslims."
"The Zionist entity" is a common euphemism used by those who do not recognize the legitimacy of the State of Israel.
Ikrama Sabri, Palestinian Authority mufti for Jerusalem.
(The New York Times, 18 May 1997)

"I want to say that this is our Palestine, from Metulla [Israel's northernmost city] to Rafiah [Southern border] and to Aqaba [Israel's southernmost point], from the [Jordan] River to the [Mediterranean] Sea; whether they want it or not."
Dr. Jareer Al-Kidwah, advisor to President Arafat, PA TV broadcast, November 29, 2000

"Allah’s messenger- may peace be upon him- has commanded: Fight the Jews and kill them. Pursue them until even a stone would say: Come here, Moslem, there is a Jew hiding himself under me. Kill him. Kill him quickly."
(Moslem Tradition)

"Our war against the Jews is an old struggle that began with Mohammed…It is our duty to fight the Jews for the sake of Allah and religion. It is our duty to end the war that Mohammed began.
(Al Ahram. Nov 26th 1955)

"You don’t understand…Islam can never negotiate or recognize Israel."
(Hamas leader in BBC interview 1994)

"Our position is clear: all of Palestine. Every inch of Palestine belongs to the Muslims."
Mahmoud Zahar, senior leader of Hamas -Quoted in the Jerusalem Post, November 14, 2003

"Our primary assumption in our fight against Israel states that the Zionist entity is aggressive from its inception, and built on lands wrested from their owners, at the expense of the rights of the Muslim people. Therefore our struggle will end only when this entity is obliterated. We recognize no treaty with it, no cease fire, and no peace agreements, whether separate or consolidated. We vigorously condemn all plans for negotiation with Israel, and regard all negotiators as enemies, for the reason that such negotiation is nothing but the recognition of the legitimacy of the Zionist occupation of Palestine. Therefore we oppose and reject the Camp David Agreements, the proposals of King Fahd, the Fez and Reagan plan, Brezhnev's and the French-Egyptian proposals, and all other programs that include the recognition (even the implied recognition) of the Zionist entity."
Excerpt from the Hizballah Programme, 16 February 1985.

“The hatred which we indoctrinate into the minds of our children from their birth is sacred”
(Suleiman Al-Khash in Al-Thaura, the Ba’ath party newspaper, May 3, 1968).

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MOSLEM REACTIONS TO THE ATTACKS ON AMERICA

"If you want to know the real perpetrator of every disaster or every act of terrorism, look for the Zionist Jews. They are behind all the violent and terror operations that have occurred everywhere in the world...It is the Jews, with their hidden filthy hands, who play their part with expertise in order to harm the Arabs and Muslims and to intensify hatred towards them...Actually, it is they who are behind the events of September 11..."
Dr. 'Atallah Abu Al-Subh, a columnist for the Hamas weekly Al-Risala (Gaza), November 1, 2001.

"What happened is, in my opinion, the product of Jewish, Israeli, and American Zionism, and the act of the great Jewish Zionist mastermind that controls the world's economy, media, and politics..."
Ahmad Al-Muslih,Al-Dustour (Jordan), September 13, 2001.

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WHAT DO PALESTINIANS REALLY THINK OF ISRAEL ?

The following are quotes from ordinary Palestinians. No names, no pack drill.

"The hell of Israel is better than the paradise of Arafat. We know Israeli rule stinks, but sometimes we feel like Palestinian rule would be worse."

"If a secret poll was conducted, I am sure an overwhelming majority of Jerusalem Arabs would say they would prefer to stay in Israel."

"They tell me—we are not like Gaza or the West Bank. We hold Israeli IDs. We are used to a higher standard of living. Even if Israeli rule is not so good, it is still better than that of the PA."

"I prefer Israeli control."

"I can only tell you to pray that the Israelis don't leave your town," because "the Jews are more human" than Palestinians."

"Here you can say whatever you like and do whatever you want—so long as you don't touch the security of Israel. Over there, if you talk about Arafat, they can arrest you and beat you up."

"We no longer fear the Israelis or the Americans, regardless of their hostility, but we now fear our Arab ‘brothers.' “

_____________

“When Yasser Arafat and the PLO arrived in Gaza in 1994 there was a lot of hope that the Palestinians would enjoy a free media. However, one of the first thing the PLO did was to order an immediate crackdown on the Palestinian media. Many local journalists - including those working with the international media and those who had independent press offices were targeted. Some were arrested, beaten, their equipment confiscated and offices torched. Sadder still, the foreign media did not really cover the story.

Why was there a crackdown? Because those who came with Arafat from Tunis came with a different mentality. They did not live here. Most of them had never spoken to an Israeli Jew in their lives. As such, they came with what could be called an "Arab regime" mentality, like that of Arab dictators. They wanted to make sure that the Palestinian media was 100-percent under control. They secured that control by appointing editors, closing down newspapers and funding competing ones.

The PA, for example, ordered a crackdown on the pro-Jordanian An-Nahar newspaper in Jerusalem and closed it down. Another newspaper edited by the Khatib family, which had been operating with an Israeli license between 1967 and 1994, had its offices burnt down, and the publisher fled to London.

THREE YEARS ago I began reporting daily for The Jerusalem Post. The irony is that as an Arab Muslim I feel freer to write for this Jewish paper than I do for any Arab newspaper. I have no problem writing for any Arab newspaper if it will provide me with a free platform and not censor my writing. My Post editors do not interfere with my writing.
The fallen hope for Palestinian press freedom, Khaled Abu Toameh. January 3, 2006

___________________

"Honestly, the problems we face in our relations with some of our Arab brothers are much worse than those we face vis-á-vis Israel."
Yasser Arafat, 1985

http://www.peaceforourtime.org.uk/index.html

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I agree. Lets discuss the truth.

If you would like to revise your post and include the ACTUAL history of the "Jews" running Israel, I am all in favor. But I think the people at the DP deserve the truth.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

I stand by my post.

I stand by my post.

The problem with Israel is America

The problem for Palestine is the UN.

Modern Israel is a UN creation, a collaberation of states that dumped their gulags and prisons of innocent Jews, militarized the willing, and sustains on MIC. Israel is perhaps the best military in the world at this point and does not need American "investment", as much as Americans need to invest to sustain the addiction to armed conflict.

The perpetual conflict is provoked an embellished in MSM to divide people over the human matrix that establishes Israel despite Palistine.

America needs to remain friends to both Israel and Palestine by adopting a less agressive foreign policy.

Perhaps the problem with America is Israel.

http://www.facebook.com/notes/we-are-all-vittorio-arrigoni/l...

Granger, please take the time for this. Also, learn how AIPAC came into being:
http://mycatbirdseat.com/2012/05/grant-smith-the-rise-of-aip...

The attack on the USS Liberty was an act of war. Israel is at war with us. They use people's religion to shelter their politics. If you have never been there, go to whatreallyhappened.com and let a Sephardic Jew - the kind the Bible talks about - tell you what he thinks.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

I don't do facebook

So far, I find the video hostile.

I have never been to Israel; however, I would love to visit as a Catholic tourist. I have had the pleasure of meeting many askenazi, sophardic and farci, and orthodox Jews, and talked about occupation of Palestine and I have come to the conclusion that like much about what we see and read in MSM, what we know about Israel is far from truth.

As a Catholic, one of the things I came to understand was that government come and go. It should come as no surprize to me if I was to read that the USA no longer exisits as I've known it as a child. The Church has sustained many governments. This is the situation in Israel.. it's a matrix of history with perpetual conflict between religion and secular power that many seek to resolve with a new age or relevation.

Listening to the vid.. the guys ranting about dirty tricks AIPAC played to advance Israel. It's sour grapes. It's like.. if we were smarter.. we would be doing that for Ron Paul. But we are not smarter.. instead.. we see this and remain suspended in shock and awe rather than get in the GOP and fight?

You don't have to do facebook.

I don't either, but this is a stand alone link, you won't have to sign in.

As for the video, try to get past the messenger and hear the message. When one first realizes a great deception has been played upon them, they tend to be angry, and perhaps overzealous as they try to bring the deception to the attention of others. It is unfortunate, they are often discredited for the zeal, maybe even called a "kook" - even though the message is valid. And I do not provide these links as the answer, I provide them as clues that you may use to do your own investigation. Put all your upbringing aside and seek the truth or you become a defender of lies that you have been told since birth.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

I read the link

UPDATE: December 4, 2007 I knew I saw it before. I became aware of this back in Y2K through A.N.S.W.E.R war protests in Los Angeles The end of ANSWER seemed to be because ANSWER protesters would get into conflicts with those who protested ANSWER. I witnessed it several times. When there was an ANSWER protest, vans filled with folks waving Israeli flags would show up and they would park and come to the protest armed with literature and tried to educate the ANSWER war protesters. Most seemed to not be American because their stories, experiences were passionate, they too had been hurt and were hurting. They claimed we were being lied to in MSM and didn't understand the truth. I listened. I read their literature too. And I think many of us saw their point. War is not the answer, so what it?

And this is where I agree with Ron Paul, we need to remain friends with Israel and Palestine and continue to trade, but we do not need to entangle ourselves in their politics. Israel is capable of defending its self.. the UN needs to get out too. There can be peace in Israel when the global influence leaves.. perhaps because of religion it won't?

Most of the folks on that list are long gone from the political areana.

I finally get to

+1 you! I would only add that along with remaining friends with them, we also cut off 100% of the $$ we give both of them.

Cheers

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Yep!

Did you know the Rothschilds take credit for forming Israel?

"Baron Benjamin de Rothschild, you are media- and publicity-averse. Why did you agree to this interview?

"We are becoming more and more important in the Israeli financial system, and our philanthropic activity in Israel is also growing. So we decided to open ourselves a little bit more to the Israeli public, so we can be better known, if only because my great-grandfather started the country."

http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/family-values-1.323094

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

No, I did not know that

Butit makes sense. It was interesting interview, THANK YOU for sharing it. I thought this was interesting:

"I believe that there is a demand for international investment services for Israeli institutions. In my opinion, the rules in Israel are too tough for institutional investors who want to invest internationally, and they are unable to act as they would wish. Israelis should invest abroad more than they are doing today, for two reasons: First, because investments should be diversified; and second, because the Israeli market is simply too small. In one way or another, Israeli institutions should be allowed to invest more in global markets."

I wonder what he means by "institutions".. security?

Did you know Mises was funded

Did you know Mises was funded by Rockefeller. Just sayin...

and, thus, it is the trillionairre Rothschild and Rockefeller

cabal who perpetrated 9-11, as per Nicholas Rockefeller, "there would be an event" which would change the world and lead to perpetual war. It wouldn't even be a real war. It would be a "fake", and U.S. military would be looking for terrorists "in caves" and it's all fake.

And in gratitude all those hundreds of Israeli spies came here in 2001 to facilitate the murders.

Don't see any reason to hide their crimes. Do the OP-ED writer wish to minimize these revelations? Please explain.

agreed.

I did a check for "Ashkenazi" and found no mention of it.

At that point, I lost interest in your revisionist history lesson. The overwhelming majority of people in Israel calling themselves "Jews" are not descendants of any tribe anywhere in the Middle East.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZn8rq9_xD0&feature=player_em...
Happy Chanukah.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

There are many self described

There are many self described Jews who have converted to the Jewish religion.

"The overwhelming majority of people in Israel calling themselves Jews are not descendants of any tribe anywhere in the Middle East."

You'll have to take that with the article posted further down that makes the case that Palestinians are genetically identical to ancient Jews and modern Jews.

I made no mention of

I made no mention of "Ashkenazi" in my post.

Hitler would be pissed to

Hitler would be pissed to find out he wasted all that time killing fake "Jews"

Exactly, which is a big problem.

If you honestly don't know, watch the video.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

You made is sound as if I did

You made is sound as if I did and since your search for it turned up nothing you discredited the all information I'm presenting.

I see now that is not what you meant. My apologies.

Sorry I haven't read everything you put up ...

... but I was actually thinking the same thing. I had heard someone that Israel was defending itself, or retaliating against earlier attacks. It made me more fully appreciate the idea of neutrality: this issue between the Israelites and the Palestinians is strictly their issue. It is unfair and unjust of us on the outside to be taking up sides. How much better it would be for us to not prop up nor condemn either side.

"Moderation in temper is always a virtue; but moderation in principle is always a vice." -- Thomas Paine

Is it wise to stay neutral on fact or fiction?

Borders are the lines used to divvy up the tax slaves, so let's just put the nationalism aside. The Israeli Mossad motto is "By way of deception thou shalt wage war."
By way of truth, I seek liberation. This man's post has a huge, glaring omission of fact. See my reply above.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

I have many conflicts

about the actions happening in that region. I am aware of most of the information you've posted as well. Personally, I think we should let them solve it themselves an stay the hell out of it. The American government is funding ALL sides of this conflict, trying to buy control and 'friends'.

I agree that the Arabs have initiated the worst of the conflicts, but after 2,000 years (longer than USA has been a country by ALOT) I'm not so sure the ALLIES from WW2 should have had any business forcing a new Israel. How about the UN coming to America, pushing us all aside, and declaring that this land now be designated Native America?

I think the Muslims are a whackjob culture to say the least. I think they are brutal and feckless in every culture they dominate. I work in the film industry and we are swamped with people from all sides of this region from Jews to Persians and Arabs and on. Not a fan of working with very many of them in the realm of honesty and trust so am looking to bug out of here and go back to my small country home in the next couple years.

After years and years of paying close attention to the Middle East, working with people that found their way out of there to the USA, studying, reading, learning, watching. I've come to the decision that intervening, participating, or any other 'ing, it's not worth it. Let em fight it out and get it done. We are so dependent on the resources in the area is the only reason we give a shit.

My leanings, however, tend to go with the Jews for historical reasons. The Muslims tend to ruin everything they come in contact with. From the Buddhist statues they blew out of the cliffs in Afghanistan to the new idiot Muslim BroHood leader they have in office now in Egypt that just declared himself the new "Pharoah". The Muslims BroHood wants to start tearing down the damn Pyramids now and WE (not fucking me) backed all the political upheaval that is due to ruin the remnants of human history.

I am certain to get downvoted by all the Jew haters that don't understand the difference between Zionism and Judaism. But if I have to take a side, I side with the Jews at the end of the day. They don't NEED any help to quash all these idiots that build new mosques on top of centuries old monuments to humanity. Let them sort it out themselves is my stance.

Of course that will never happen as the USA will continue to determine it's own demise by the destruction in the value of the fiat dollar, Brownshirting our own citizens with the TSA, taxing people till they have no ability to save, forcing farmlands into corporate wastelands, redistributing our incomes to the lazy and expectant, and on and on. We have our own problems that are cratering this country and we will continue to see that happen for as long as we think we have any business in ANY other region to tell anyone what to do.

America, like Rome, will fall from it's glory. And the people of the middle east will still be there fighting like rabid dogs for Allah when our time in history has passed.

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Simple untrue. Israel started

Simply untrue. Israel started every war, with the possible exception of 1973. And its armies had made incursions in to the land alotted to the Palestinians, well before any surrounding nation "attacked" Israel.

I probably don't care as much as you may

, but 1967 was 5 Arab/Muslim countries amassing and attacking one country, Israel. And the 5 lost.

And that is all I am going to retort with because I know for a fact it's true 100% regardless of Palestine incursions or any other fly speck of truth you would like to splatter on the window.

You may like to pick the side you empathize with most, but I am not going to do it. I don't care about the conflict because it's vastly PR bullshit that is orchestrated by the OLD MONEY in this world that are working you and the entire situation like a puppet show and they are getting just what they want out of it.

Don't play with the big kids if you don't have your helmet.

Besides, I put up plenty of other reasons that I hold Islam accountable for the destruction of Historical monuments that even IF your pov was conscionable, there is nothing you can say that will rectify that situation.

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I think you pretty much

I think you pretty much summed up where I am at with all of this too.

So, according to your logic

So, according to your logic we should hand the country back to the Native Americans too. You go first.

Blessings )o(

No. Bad analogy. When Israel

No. Bad analogy. When Israel makes the indigenous people of Palestine full and equal citizens of Israel, then the conflict will be over. Israel has NEVER done that, despite illegally occupying and colonizing Palestine for 45 years. The US did make the American Indians full citizens and even gave them "reservations."

Wait, you're suggesting that

Wait, you're suggesting that because I think that the land belongs to Jews and you think the land belongs to Palestinians that somehow only one of us would come to the conclusion that Native Americans have a right to the land that was taken from them by early Americans?

It's not just my logic that history should play a role in determining the rightful ownership of property. See Bilderberger_Von_Rothschild below.

Tell you what, I'm going to

Tell you what, I'm going to give someone your house and all the property that goes with it, because history shows that it wasn't yours to begin with. That's the same logic you are trying to use here.

Blessings )o(