13 votes

Consensus Rand Paul 2016?

So I know many where disappointed when Rand Endorsed Mitt Romney for president. I myself was... but in the grand scheme of things, was it to gain credibility by the Republican party? As we all know how badly and cheated we where as Ron Paul supporters during the republican primary.. Physically abused, mocked, ridiculed.. I just want to say what if he didn't endorse mitt romney? Would we be ignored by the right wing media, and even the liberal media once again, would the voice of our supporters try to be silenced once again? I honestly believe so. I think he made a hard decision and sure he could have chosen to not endorse, but it would have made is run just as hard as to win as the last times.. I cant complain to much besides that fact. Rand Paul is not Ron Paul, but in the eyes of many he's electable, likable, and not as ''radical'' has his father... But, i can tell you Rand images his fathers message better than anyone we do have to run, to return this country to the future we seek. A free america, once again. With Rand Paul as president, i think i could wake up free of chest pains in the morning.. And our message would be able to spread that much more, and i believe we now have the numbers to win an election. Rand Paul 2016 has my vote and support! Does he have your's?




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Mitt Romney can be referred

Mitt Romney can be referred to as a flip-flopper because there are very few issues where you cannot find him taking both sides at some point. Literally every single issue, he simply tells the crowd what they want to hear. He is one of the worst in political history. Rand is NOTHING like him. It is not even REMOTELY comparable.

I really don't know what the issue is with the sanctions, but your perspective is completely out of whack. Taking absolute positions like you've done, and closing your mind, is just not productive. Let's just wait and see what Rand does, we simply don't have all the information at this juncture.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Okay, I'll admit....

I will admit that Rand isn't as bad as Mitt and if I believed in voting for the lesser of two evils I would vote for Rand tomorrow but I don't.

So far what I have seen from Rand is him supporting both sides of the Iran sanctions, and both sides of foreign aid (he thinks we should question all foreign aid unless it's going to Israel). He also endorsed a lying neocon Romney who is absolutely NO better than Obama. Romney stands against EVERYTHING that we (the ones who support the Constitution) stand for.

How could you be so sure that Rand would stand up for us when he double talks about foreign aid and sanctions and supports someone like Romney who DEFINATELY would have wiped his ass with the Constitution like Obama and the rest do???????????

A man of honesty and principal would never do that! NEVER!!!!!

How can I be so sure? I'm

How can I be so sure? I'm not. You are the one who is so sure.

I judge candidates by their actions, not their rhetoric. This goes both ways. Endorsements are nothing. They mean nothing. They are political pawns and that is it.

This is exactly my point. You have that one issue, and that is all you care about. Once he endorsed Mitt, even though he said he would all along, you completely closed your mind to him. Now you view everything he does through a tainted viewport.

Endorsements don't matter, and people making their decisions based on them disgust me. You probably don't even realize how many countless endorsements Ron Paul has made for complete establishment neocons like Newt Gingrich. He also hired and supported Jesse Benton for the longest time. He brought Doug Wead on, and if you knew Doug's past and applied the same lens to Ron as you are to Rand, there is no way you could still support him.

I don't like his position on sanctions but no one else in office holds a candle to his record, for the few negatives there are SO many positives.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

About 90% of us on the DP...

...I feel will be with Rand. He needs to convince the moderates...

We need to get an early start on 2016: Support Rand PAC 2016

www.randpac2016.com

https://twitter.com/randpac2016

jrd3820's picture

90%

On the DP? You think so? Have you read all the Rand hate here lately....

The problem with Rand is that I do not think he can appeal to democrats or young people like Ron could. I am an ex dem and simply do not see in Rand the strong anti war or personal freedom message I saw in his Dad. With Ron going on a college speaking tour, we can get a lot of young people over here with the message of ending wars, but then we try to give them Rand?

exactly

with very little digging rand would be a turnoff to the college crowd interested in ron's message. for now gary johnson has already been picked as their 2nd choice, & to the chagrin of all the neocon lites who have infiltrated this site.

From a purely logical

From a purely logical standpoint, yes, Ron Paul appeals to a wider range of people.

From a reality-based standpoint, that is obviously completely and utterly false. Rand will easily surpass Ron in support, rightly or wrongly.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

From a purely logical

From a purely logical standpoint, no.

Ron Paul was able to bring democrats in, not because of economics and social issues, but because of the message of Freedom.

They close their ears to Rand, and most other republicans. This is a reality.

It has been drilled that the young generation is the hope of the future. It is an entire generation that will decide the fate of our Republic. We must bring them on board before they are beholden to the establishment parties.

If Rand does surpass Ron in support, it will be because of the establishment republicans who typically 'fall in line' behind the nominee, not because of the true message, the fight for Liberty, Freedom.

That is why it is imperative to vet and to make sure that we are well represented with that message of Liberty, Freedom. The young generation must take over for all of the right reasons, and not ones of compromise, now and into the future.

Please, consider this, as you vet and make up your minds.

At the risk of sounding preachish, and please forgive me, what would Ron Paul expect?

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Rand has a similar message to

Rand has a similar message to Ron, I work with a lot of Democrats and all the parts that appealed to them about Ron they still feel about Rand, and the "crazy" sentiment is far duller.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Absolutely NOT. Not under any circumstances.

Rand is a PINO (Paul in name only).

Rand is a neo-CON. Beware.

Rand is not a neocon.

Rand is not a neocon. You are either completely ignorant to what the term "neo-con" means, completely ignorant to Rand Paul's record, and/or being intellectually dishonest.

Rand has pushed to end foreign aid. He takes a VERY strongly anti-war position. He has gone completely against the establishment on many issues.

I do not agree with his position on sanctions. But there is no question he is one of the best senators we have.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Rand's voting record is

Rand's voting record is closer to Ron Paul's than any Senator in the last 100 years.

Tom Mullen's picture

Rand Paul would be best president since Grover Cleveland

His votes for sanctions on Iran bother me much more than his endorsement of Romney, which doesn't bother me at all. Endorsements are nothing but politics. Nobody who believes in the things Ron Paul does changed their mind about Romney because of Rand Paul's endorsement. All it did was buy him political capital.

If he didn't endorse Romney, he would have had ZERO chance of ever winning the White House. In fact, he would have broken his campaign promises in Kentucky where Republicans repeatedly asked him if he'd support the 2012 Republican nominee.

Endorsing Romney did nothing to US citizens. It didn't infringe upon any of their rights. It didn't expose them to unnecessary risks. It's a nothing.

Voting for sanctions on Iran is a different story. I'm willing to overlook that and conclude that - as disappointed in him as I am that he doesn't believe sanctions to be acts of war, which he told me directly that he doesn't - that weighing everything he'd still be the best president the US has had in over 100 years. Even with the sanction vote (which any candidate for president we'll likely see took or would have taken), nobody else who will seek the nomination out of the major parties in 2016 will be in the same league as Rand Paul. The rest will all be traditional conservatives, which don't think like libertarians, don't see the world like libertarians and therefore will never take policy positions like libertarians.

He made the endorsement of

He made the endorsement of Romney on the radio show of a man who had viciously smeared his dad as a racist. I wouldn't do that to my dad even if he was a raving Communist. Let me also add that he made his endorsement (giving his dad 20 minutes notice) at a time when the delegates were heroically trying to win over state conventions. Why don't these two facts "bother" you? If you had a son who did those things to you, how would you feel?

Oh....let me also note that Rand compaigned tirelessly for Romney he didn't lift a finger to help his own dad at the crucial state conventions. You can gild the lily all you want but Rand had DEEP character issues which go beyond mere political differences.

As long as you are arguing

As long as you are arguing that his endorsement matters, you are arguing from a purely emotional point of view. Logic doesn't enter into your argument for even a second. At the end of the day, I couldn't give less of a shit how his endorsement makes you "feel".

I am much more concerned with the policy. How he votes, and what effect he has on his colleagues. His record is not by FAR the best and closest to Ron Paul of every other senator, to say anything else is simply a lie.

To summarize...stop making your decisions based on rhetoric and emotion.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Did you read my post????? I

Did you read my post????? I was not criticizing him for the endorsement itself. Hey, I see the argument that he "had" to do it and can respect that. I was complainng about the nature and timing of the endorsement. If you are going to disagree and be so dismissive, you could at least read my post!

I did read your post. I do

I did read your post. I am clearly not the one being dismissive here. You commented with the express purpose of dismissing Rand and all the good points people have made about him, over one tiny, purely emotion-based negative you see in him.

You are nitpicking at details and getting all upset over something that doesn't affect the real world. The endorsement is what you're upset over, and you're specifically pointing out reasons why it made you upset. But all of it is emotion-based, none of it has anything to do with his record.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Again, you are making

Again, you are making assumptions that run contrary to the evidence. Review my posting history and you will see that while I've been mostly critical of Rand I've also vigorously defended him many times here on genetically modified foods, corporations, and some of his foreign policy/civil liberty stands. I've also said that he is the best senator.

If you've been similarly critical of Rand, when he deserves criticism, we can have an intelligent discussion. If you're ALWAYS defending him in a "true believing" manner, there is not point in such a discussion.

p.s. Betrayal of a wonderful father like Ron Paul by giving an exclusive to Sean "Ron Paul is a racist" Hannity and being MIA at the crucial state conventions, even while campaigning vigorously for Mitt, is not "nitpicking" IMHO. I also beg to differ that serious character issues of this type have no bearing on his "record."

I don't disagree with

I don't disagree with anything you said here, and I have not read your past history. Perhaps I was missing some context in my interpretation of your postings. I still feel you are overreacting and yes, nitpicking, but it sounds like you can rationalize the fact that despite a few flaws Rand is far better than most alternatives.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Better of two evils...

So you are saying that he will be the best of two evils?????
Yeah. How's that been working for the last 100 years......

Tom Mullen

"I'm willing to overlook that and conclude that - as disappointed in him as I am that he doesn't believe sanctions to be acts of war, which he told me directly that he doesn't - that weighing everything he'd still be the best president the US has had in over 100 years."

romney believes in his heart that fees are not taxes.

obama believes in his heart that socialism must prevail.

boehner believes in his heart that Amash and other true conservatives should not hold seats.

Because Rand does not believe that sanctions are an act of aggression, should I take that at face value and go along with it?

Remember where we came from. Remember Ron Paul's decades fight. We can no longer afford to compromise our values, principles, what our Republic stands for. If we do, it will only make a mockery of everything that we have worked for.

Rand is a big boy. Let us not try to 'appease' him and his political views because of his father.

We have 4 years. Let the vetting begin.

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

It's not about "appeasing:"

Because of Ron Paul's campaigns, I am in the GOP, where all of us have been mis-treated, but don't allow that to phase us because we get the message and believe, it can be done.. but it's going to take time.. Ron stood alone for decades.. Rand has never been alone.. he came in with MSM all over him. He is no dummy and he understands a big part of the political game is SURVIVAL.. compromising is part of it.. and to do that, you have to have your sights set beyond, if you intend to remain.. Ron Paul had no intention in remaining in the game.. he's out.

So Rand, shows us where we are being asked to compromise, in other words, who in the party is willing to work with us, cut a deal with us.. bend for us, compromise for us.. we learn how to address these topics at the committee table.. what we can expect.. but also looking for our own ways to stand strong and not compromise.. we sign loyalty oaths,. so compromising is part of the deal.. C4L makes clear our priority.

Rand is standing STRONG on several issues, and this is our foundation, that will help us secure for when the time is more likely to ending wars, which is going up against the UN, TPTB, MIC and global bankers, and executive branch of the Dems. if you know anyone who can beat this group in one election, by all means,, produce them. You got someone better than Rand.. who?

Granger

This entire movement, r3VOLution was built on sound and solid principle.

I am not about to cheapen it for one persons political gain. I don't care what his/her name is.

Have you ever seen a family business prosper, by the hard work of a father or grandfather, who started it all? He stood by principle, what was right and what grew the business huge, and passed down to his children who had the same vision. There was one sibling who had some grand idea, coerces the family to compromise just once. Then just once more. And then before you know it the entire business went belly up.

I commend you for obtaining your committe seat. I sincerely hope that you do it justice. But don't think for one minute that you or anyone else is going to coerce me into sacrificing my principles. 'Several issues' are not enough. Hell, romney and obama both have several issues that could be considered good.

The more you drive your candidate, the more I will drive mine. And if my efforts fail from lack of overwhelming support, mark my words it will still have negative effect on yours. Warning: Don't push it.

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Who is your candidate?

I'm not seeing who you are driving. Who are you driving? I'm not driving Rand.. I appreciate Rand for his duly elected office of Senator and getting MSM attention on issues, such as hemp.. this was my issue from 1993. And I cpompromised.. I compromised because though I don't believe the word "marijuana" is a legal term and belongs in courts, and while I'm not sure of the actual benefits of medical marijuana, I hoped the medical marijuana crowd would not forget us hempsters.. but not only they did forget us.. they tried to bury us, claiming that hemp crops would contaminate their medicine. Meanwhile, hemp is the solution on many levels of small business, and I think the idea of modern technology meeting hemp is exciting.. so Rand has my support based on that.. I think hemp is PEACE.. healing the planet and people.

I think the goal of ending wars is not going to be so easy because of who is involved. Most folks here don't have the guts to go to one committee meeting. They rage against a machine they fear too much to face.. well, committee is nothing but a gateway to bigger fish, and you've just seen what the big fish in the GOP do, to Amash.. they want to fight. Are we going to give them a fight? Or are we going to talk about what principled BS artists we are?

After Rand and everyone else gets dirty building the bridges, parting the PTB waters, so you have pure candidates you can vote for, you'll join then? What kind of principle is that?

Hint: peep peep peep peep peep chicken (dejavu, so what did you learn?)

((Granger))

"Are we going to give them a fight? Or are we going to talk about what principled BS artists we are?"

People who test me either find that they regret doing so, or get on board.

Ending wars will not happen until most people oppose it. This will not be accomlished within a single party. That is obvious, democrats chastised gw, but condone it with obama. republicans have turned lazy and don't care either way. I am speaking of the ordinary voting people, not politicians.

"After Rand and everyone else gets dirty building the bridges, parting the PTB waters, so you have pure candidates you can vote for, you'll join then? What kind of principle is that?"

I can not believe that you even said that, Granger. RON PAUL, r3VOLution got filthy dirty, physically hurt, building those bridges, and it continues to grow! And you elude that Rand should take that credit?! I see now, aside from your oath, how easy it was for you to vote for romney, and cast aside Ron Paul.

Listen to that NPR Talk of the Nation interview with Ron Paul. And have some wake-up coffee while you do.

peep peep peep peep peep GRRRRRRRR!! (I am a dog with big teeth tonight)

btw, please tell me that you called that leftist cry baby and left a voice message. Then I will be happy :-)

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

(((PAF)))

//People who test me either find that they regret doing so, or get on board.//

What board? Are you driving a candidate on your board?

//Ending wars will not happen until most people oppose it. This will not be accomlished within a single party. That is obvious, democrats chastised gw, but condone it with obama. republicans have turned lazy and don't care either way. I am speaking of the ordinary voting people, not politicians.//

Most people oppose war.. last I saw, I believe it was something like 71%. It's going to take being the majority in a major party to materialize the message, and because the GOP is a major party that is a third party in comparison to the Indy registration, and many places are like mine, with an absent GOP that can be taken.. because the incumbant Republicans own a mantel of shame, have lost their way.. taking the GOP is a brilliant idea and one worth persuing.

//I can not believe that you even said that, Granger. RON PAUL, r3VOLution got filthy dirty, physically hurt, building those bridges, and it continues to grow! And you elude that Rand should take that credit?! I see now, aside from your oath, how easy it was for you to vote for romney, and cast aside Ron Paul.//

RP rEVOLution did not "get dirty", we did get hurt. We did not lie, cheat, or commit fraud. We did what we were asked to do, like sign loyalty oaths, petition and work to become delegates.. but we did not get "dirty" until Rand endorsed Romney and those of us who knew we had signed loyalty oaths got the picture from Rand that the GOP was intending on holding us to them.. not Ron Paul.. but us, him/Rand. So that's when we "got dirty". Many here never got dirty, but ather remained principled.

//Listen to that NPR Talk of the Nation interview with Ron Paul. And have some wake-up coffee while you do.//

I don't listen to radio and certianly NOT Nazi Public Radio.

I'm a piranha. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkF5VMRJGek

Do you like licorice sticks?

It is funny how you twist words to reinforce your views and try to be right. Don't worry Granger, I still agree with some of them :-)

Today I am no longer a dog with big teeth. Today I am an owl. Whoo, whoo.

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

I love black licorice

not everyone loves or even likes black licorice, but the people who do love black licorice, really really love black licorice.

Ahh, so that explains it!

I love black licorice. There might be a small chance that I like it more than you.

I love Reese's Beanut Butter Cups too. If it was a toss up, which I am glad that there is not, Cups win. Unless it's the spicy jelly bean black licorice. Then I would call it a tie.

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Good and Plenty

Haribo Raspberries..

When it comes to chocolate.. Sees Candies can't be beat.. there's a little heaven in each piece where with Reeses and chocilate like that.. it's like the two in the package are merely appotozers.. leaves you craving for more chocolate rather than giving you that fix like Sees does.. however.. If you get an assortment of Sees.. then you're in trouble, because it's wanting to discover which kind you like best, and before you get sick from eating way too much chocolate, well, there's also a two pound box that I have friends who admitted they have eaten a whole two pound box within hours.. chocolate.. anyone got that in their permagarden? LOL