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West Point cadet quits, cites 'criminal' behavior of officers promoting fundamentalist Christianity

http://www.opednews.com/populum/linkframe.php?linkid=159634

Note the update - he got an honorable discharge. I'd say he earned it.



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OK,

I'm serious now. Do your parents know you are doing this? You cannot be out of middle school if not younger.

This site is a good place to learn from, but it is not a good place to just regurgitate the same thing over and over you heard an adult say. I hope you become part of the liberty movement, we need the young. But, you should do some research into libertarian philosophy as well.

By the way, there isn't anything called "Stalinism" - that's what gave you away.

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

No soldier should be disrespected for his beliefs.

But, holding a same-sex "wedding" in a West Point chapel shows just how morally screwed up this country's society has become. America will go the way of Sodom, ancient Greece, and Rome if it doesn't repent of its degeneracy.

America is a pretty disgusting place

full of sinners. It is good that you recognize that America is a fading country with no hope or future (without Christ of course but even then Americans will sin ;) ). Of course, we Christians will still be around. We are not bound by the existence of some secular government, unless someone wants to kill us for our beliefs. Then, it will be the good ole days with us.

Better memorize your 10 Commandments, Creed and Lord's Prayer. You will need it.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Yup

Equal rights are disgusting. No wonder we have hurricanes.

I mean how morally corrupt do you have to be to allow one person to have the same amount of liberty as another? Only moral people have the ability to restrict the free association and contractual obligations of others!

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

Hurricanes are a result of Original Sin

the depravity of the world, not homosexuality. All suffering is the result of sin.

Nice strawman there with your argument, along with some ad hominums, clearly you are the logical debater of our age. It is as if you have never read or researched Christianity, nor have you researched the historically verifiable Resurrection that we place our hope in.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Dishonest, as usual

First, I don't think "sin" exists. I was making a joke. If you want to blame hurricanes on Adam & Eve, fine.

"Nice strawman there with your argument, along with some ad hominums" -- Without examples of course, more lies. I'm glad lying and dishonesty arent' sins, you would be in big trouble.

"It is as if you have never read or researched Christianity, nor have you researched the historically verifiable Resurrection that we place our hope in." --- Another lie, or more specifically a false assumption. I was raised Christian and was more adept at Bible Study than anyone of my fellow students through HS. I know it better than most people I have every met. And, yes, I have researched the resurrection. And, no, it is not now nor has it ever been "historically verifiable". You know what happens when you assume....

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

"Sin" does not exist

then what do you call theft, murder, adultery, coveting and so on. I guess those are all fine and dandy. People should just experience that as many times as possible and feel no guilt.

And no, you don't know Christianity if you think this way. If you did, you would be rejoicing that the Gospel covers your sin.

I guess that you love to harm your neighbor and hate him. That is the essence of sin in the world.

Lying is totally a-okay with you. It is not a sin. It does not harm your neighbor. You could care less what objective truth is. Why should anyone believe you at this point logically? You basically defeated yourself.

You should really lay off the ad hominums. It destroys what little credibility you have.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Thick you are. And lying again

"then what do you call theft, murder, adultery, coveting and so on. I guess those are all fine and dandy." -- No, they are crimes. (Well, except coveting - that is the driving force behind capitalism). And no, your non-sequitur fallacy that because I don't call them sins they are fine and dandy is being dishonest again. And frankly a very childish thought process. Sort of like saying "I know you are, but what am I?"

"And no, you don't know Christianity if you think this way. If you did, you would be rejoicing that the Gospel covers your sin." -- So, by that logic, if I know all there is to know about pygmies in New Zealand that means I am one. Interesting logic... I could know everything about Hitler and read everything he ever wrote to understand his philosophy - but that doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

"I guess that you love to harm your neighbor and hate him. That is the essence of sin in the world." -- Ahh... the classic strawman fallacy. That would be lying about me - although you did say "guess". No, I do not love to harm, nor do I ever harm, my neighbor. See, I belong to this thing called the Liberty Movement based on libertarian principles, Ron Paul, and similar philosophy. That philosophy is about personal liberty and non-aggression. I cannot harm anyone unless in self-defense. And, if that is the essence of "sin" in your world, then I guess that means I am free and clear!! Whoo Hoo - bring on the sexy angels in the clouds!

"Lying is totally a-okay with you." -- Wow. A blatant lie. I've been pointing out over and over that you are the dishonest one and lying about me. Not bad for a 10 year old though.

"You should really lay off the ad hominums. It destroys what little credibility you have." -- Do you know what an ad hominem (correct spelling) is? You have used it several times and I don't think you get it. That would be appealing to emotion or prejudices instead of logic or reason - I have not, in all of my comments to you, appealed to your emotions. You have done that, I have not.

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

Not a right.

It is nobody's "right" to have a chapel perform a perverted wedding. If they want to be perverts, fine, but it's not their "right" to have an organization do it if said organization opposes their perversion. If West Point refused to perform this fake "wedding," it would not violate anyone's rights.

Assumption is the mother of all...

If the chapel in question did it under protest, then I wholeheartedly agree. But, you are assuming something not in the article. On military bases, there is a "chapel" building. But, it is not as in the civilian world. Every group uses it from Christians to Muslims to Universalists to Atheists. As a government-funded building they cannot discriminate. So, another assumption you made was that it was a Christian chapel. And, "West Point" did not perform the wedding, it would have been whomever performed the ceremony - again another false assumption.

And, the ability to enter into a contract (which is what marriage is) is absolutely a right. Maybe you missed the whole free-association aspect of the liberty movement.

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

Coming from the guy

who has assumed the most in this thread, the irony of your comment is not too funny to ignore.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Equal rights are disgusting

in some circumstances. An adulterer can be forced to resign or be court martialed in a military that does not believe moral degenerates are entitled to "equal rights." Does judgement come in the form of hurricanes? I don't know. But, when I look around at the oblivious ignorance of my fellow Americans regarding our debt crises, loss of freedoms, and perpetual war, why would God need to send hurricanes?

Well

I am glad that my Confessional Lutheranism can help out people with the idea of suffering. News flash, we are all sinners thus we deserve suffering. Homosexuals do not send hurricanes no more than does your pride, arrogance, lust, and so on. Hurricanes can be traced to pretty readily to Original Sin, that is our original rebellion. Creation groaned for a reason as perfection was lost. Thus, we are in this imperfect world with things like hurricanes.

We await for a day when there will be no suffering, and hopefully no hurricanes.

Of course, the guy you are replying too, is taking full advantage of your ignorance on the topic to drive home his Strawmen and Ad Hominums because you know he is much smarter and logical than you ever can be. He is being very charitable with you. You can tell where his beliefs are rooted in by all the kind words he has said to you.

When a 'rationalist' can tell me why suffering exists, then we can start talking. Until then, don't listen to his Post-Modern garbage.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

My mistake

I thought you understood Ron Paul's philosophy and the idea of individual liberty since you were here...

Someone who commits a crime, yes, loses rights because they infringed on the liberty of another person. (They committed adultery, thereby going against a contract with another person, breeching a contract infringes the other person's property rights). That has zero to do with two individuals entering into a marriage contract.

There is nothing immoral about homosexuality. Not to people who have rational thought.

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

Logic time

The Christian view of marriage is found in Genesis.
Gen 2:24
24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. 25 And the man and his wife were both naked and were not ashamed.

Marriage is only recognized when a man has sex with a woman. This verse is used by Christ on the teaching of divorce (that God had no intention of divorce in the original scheme of things).

Husband comes from the word: To sow in a fertile field.
Question, is homosexual sex sowing in a fertile field (a womb?). Clearly, the seed is being spilled on an infertile field. Thus the term, homosexual husband is an oximoron.

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=husband

Just saying, homosexuals are free to mock the institution of marriage.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Rational thought is strictly subjective.

I consider it irrational to think there's nothing perverse, immoral, or twisted about sexual activity between two beings, which both being healthy and of reproductive age could not reproduce.

By your take on adultery being a breach in contract, something that does make sense, a person could take that to the conclusion that adultery should be a misdemeanor at least. When people break any other kinds of contract there are legal repercussions.

Understood

It would be irrational if I agreed that two people having sex can only be for procreation or in a "perverse" way. According to that logic, anyone having oral sex, mutual masturbation, etc... fall into the same category. If that is your definition of immoral, then fine, I cannot argue. I don't agree, and we are not the only species that has sexual encounters outside of having babies, but we will never agree.

Thanks for your agreement on the contract breech idea. Actually, adultery is a crime in the UCMJ, punishable by imprisonment, loss of rank, etc... In the civilian world it has legal consequences in terms of said breech of contract. For instance, if one spouse commits adultery, they have breeched the contract and therefore may not be entitled to and even split in a divorce, etc.... Although, lawyers have figure out how to get around even that nowadays.

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

No, that's not what I was saying.

I said,
"I consider it irrational to think there's nothing perverse, immoral, or twisted about sexual activity between two beings, which both being healthy and of reproductive age could not reproduce."
I didn't say I think it's irrational not to think it's twisted to conduct sexual activity for purposes other than procreation. There's a natural order to things. Sex causes procreation. Most of us got here because of sex. Just like eating, sex is a fundamental necessity in any society. But, a society that rejects the natural use of sex will find its population shrink to unsustainable levels (Japan, Jews in Israel, white Europe, now America). It's not queer for a heterosexual, human couple to engage in sexual activity for whatever reason and in whatever way because ONLY heterosexual, human couples can produce human offspring. It is natural for an unmarried, 70 year-old man and woman to be attracted to each other even though they are past the reproductive age because if they were in the reproductive age, they WOULD be able to produce offspring. The natural attraction between makes and females is what keeps humanity going. There is no normal, natural attraction between humans and animals in that sense because humans and animals don't reproduce and even if they could, the results would be mutants. Likewise, there is no normal, natural, healthy attraction between two humans of the same sex because even if both are young, healthy and fertile, they cannot procreate. Just because such unions are made does not mean they are normal and not perverse or twisted. The same could be said of incest with an immediate family member. People never fail at finding ways to procure sexual gratification. Just because some people become attracted sexually to children, animals, or someone of the same sex does not mean that behavior is normal. Some people are more predisposed than others to be sex perverts just as others are more predisposed than others to become drunkards, depressed, thieves, etc. That doesn't mean society should accept those things as good or moral.

How dare you have an opposing view!!!

This forum is SOOOOOO tolerant that we will reject your Christian faith. Post-Modernism FTW.

Oh, bonus points for calling us haters just because we don't think homosexuality is the greatest thing for civilization. Boy, do we have some tolerant people on the DP or what.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Dishonesty again.....Starting to feel sorry for you

I didn't call you "haters".

"because we don't think homosexuality is the greatest thing for civilization" -- That wasn't what was said, the claim was made that homosexuality was "immoral". We could discuss the result and the affect on civilization, that is a different topic. I would probably agree with you on that. But, that isn't the question. Homosexuality is a random mutation, but we are discovering the causes. It obviously doesn't help the species biologically - but again, that is not the question.

"This forum is SOOOOOO tolerant that we will reject your Christian faith" -- Another lie. No one has "rejected" your faith. And, to make the assumption that because we disagree on one topic out of hundreds, that the "forum" (not a singularity or even a person) rejects your faith is absurd. I'm not even sure what that means it is so lacking in reason. What exactly gives you that impression. Have Christians been pre-screened and banned? Nope, you are here. Has Michael made it a rule you cannot talk about God or Jesus? Nope, happens all the time. --- Basically you are pulling the little crybaby stunt popular in this day and age. Despite being an overwhelming majority of the population you still claim to be victims - so childish.

"Boy, do we have some tolerant people on the DP or what" -- You were the one who came to this posting and commented. I, and the others, have "tolerated" your posts, your lies, and your condemnation of equal rights. So, I guess the answer would be "or what".

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

You are trying to say

"all of our ethics are bad, our ethics our good". That is pretty much saying that we are all trash. Thanks for playing.

I am saying that rejection in that context.

Also, you think lying is good, so I do not know what your problem is. Lies do not harm people in your world view.

FYI, I said you get bonus points for calling us haters. I know you love to throw stones at people. That is your job. Throw some more stones at me. You only embolden my faith.

May the LORD bless you and keep you
May the LORD make His face shed light upon you and be gracious unto you
May the LORD lift up His face unto you and give you peace
Follow me on Twitter @ http://twitter.com/Burning_Sirius

Very good

You have learned how to avoid logic.

Back to your Language Arts homework I hope? I'm guessing 8th or 9th grade?

"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot."--Mark Twain

Hoorah and kudos to this

Hoorah and kudos to this young man!