-24 votes

Sad Amash Report

Amash: "I Am Not Going To Take Anything Off the Table"
What kind of libertarian could say this?

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2012/12/amash-i-am-not-...



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jrd3820's picture

People here seem to forget

That there has to be some level of compromise with the other side in government. Let's say Ron Paul had won Presidency this past November, but the house and the senate were exactly as they are now. We would not get everything we want, there would still have to be compromise. It's not fun and if we had a libertarian house, senate, and President we could do what we want, but that is unrealistic.

“I like nonsense, it wakes up the brain cells. Fantasy is a necessary ingredient in living.”
― Dr. Seuss

There is compromise and there

There is compromise and there is compromise. If the compromise represents an incremental step toward liberty, I'm all for it. If, on the other hand, it represents a step AWAY from liberty such as more sanctions on Iran, NDAA, and MORE aid for Israel it is not a compromise but a sell-out. Unfortunately, some of the Rand apologists don't understand the distinction.

EPJ = disruptor agent.

EPJ = disruptor agent.

Thomas Jefferson 1796, 1800, 1804; James Madison 1808, 1812; Ron Paul 1988, 2008, 2012; Rand Paul 2016.

disruptor agents

I call them "agents incompetente." If they are not govt agents sent to muck things up, they might as well be. I have a list that goes way back. Not ready to put any of these guys on the list just yet, but...

"To the morally inverted, war appears as a quick, clear path to the top." -- Preston Parker
firelightermedia@gmail.com

I really think these

I really think these anarchists would not dare attack Ron Paul if he had done something like this but now they are making a power play to stop the political action part of the movement.

Ventura 2012

EPJ = libertarian truth

EPJ = libertarian truth

“The welfare of the people in particular has always been the alibi of tyrants.” — Albert Camus

both are hyperboles

but i find loyalty and pride in a libertarian label most ludicrous and paradoxical, considering constitutionalists are supposed to be individualists, it requires something much less vague than 'libertarian' as a label to rally behind. there's nothing more disgusting than the libertarian social ego.

even beltway libertarians have the word 'libertarian' in there. i'm not sure what pride is supposed to go automatically with the term. people aren't just doing it because there are magazines to be sold or site hits to be made these days, right?

I hardly think Amash is open to new taxes

He'd have to do more than that to prove everything else he's ever said wasn't true... like actually voting for a tax increase, which he has not.

I think I recall Dr. Paul refusing to speak in absolutes on many occasions - even on spending issues. He always said that if a spending bill was accompanied by deep enough spending reductions he would compromise for the net spending reduction. Isn't this just another way of saying it?

- Grow Mushrooms at Home
http://subfarms.com

Even Dr. Paul refusing to speak in absolutes on many occasions

Good principle. see quote below:

Obi-Wan Kenobi: Anakin, my allegiance is to the Republic, to democracy.
Anakin Skywalker: If you're not with me, then you're my enemy.
Obi-Wan Kenobi: [realizing that Anakin is consumed by evil and there's no reasoning with him anymore] ONLY a Sith deals in ABSOLUTES.
[draws his lightsaber]
Obi-Wan Kenobi: I will do what I must.

"Only a Sith deals in

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes," is itself an absolute.

No it's not

The absolute would be "Siths always deal in absolutes"

What I find troubling is

that talking about cutting public employee salaries, benefits, and pensions must be taboo. Expenses such as car allowances, travel, food, seminars, etc. need to be cut drastically or eliminated all together. Every stone must be turned over before cutting "entitlements".

Maybe you don't know it but...

Federal employees have had their pay frozen for three years in a row, and most agencies are going through major budget reductions which affect travel et al. Also there is a large and growing trend of reducing staffing of federal workers and budget cutting of contracts (and contract employees in the process) almost across the board.

As a federal employee in DC, I'm living in the middle of this situation right now - and it's tough for everyone. What I find troubling is that people like you have a concept in your mind that federal employees are not Americans. We are. I believe and support the notion that government should be limited and small, but I don't accept the idea that government employees should have a "bare bones" work environment. You have to actually like your job to do it efficiently and effectively.

How 'bout we stop blowing people up all over the world and sending our citizen's stolen money to prop up dictators and pay for foreigner's abortions before cutting anything that directly affects Americans first???

So what?

Boo hoo, federal employees don't get enough of your stolen tax dollars. They shouldn't be getting any.

Regardless of any pay freeze, public workers still outpace private workers, their jobs are far more secure even in a down economy even if they are lazy and useless, and they get a ridiculous benefits package that is unrivaled in the private sector among the same pay levels.

I don't believe

I don't believe that Federal employees should have a "bare bones" work environment.

I just believe there shouldn't be federal employees in the first place.

http://lionsofliberty.com/
*Advancing the Ideas of Liberty Daily*

Well put

As the subject line says...

Eric Hoffer

Seriously? Leave federal employees alone?

I really hope you don't call yourself a libertarian.

You need to cut WHEREVER possible, if it were up to me the whole federal government would be cut and no pensions, no benefits, nothing.

I can't think of any group more deserving of pay cuts and lay offs than employees of the state.

You are payed with stolen property FFS!

Check out the Laissez-Faire Journal at LFJournal.com


"The State is a gang of thieves writ large." - Murray Rothbard

.

"What kind of libertarian could say this?"

Justin is a republican NOT a Libertarian.
those pesky facts again.

"OH NO! He has a SON?" Neoconservatives and Liberals EVERYWHERE!

Rand Paul 2016

OMG! I cannot believe what I

OMG! I cannot believe what I am reading these days on the DP. These people are clueless.

Here's a hint for them. Amash, Davis, and both Paul's...to name a few...are republicans. Not only that, anyone who serves as congress or senate do so because they also believe there has to be some government. No government is going to be perfect but these guys we have who are fighting in the front are the best we have.

Fools are those who turn against our greatest allies. Fools!

OMG yet another straw man

OMG yet another straw man argument as a means to quash criticism. Nobody here, least of all me, is demanding that any politician be against all government.

.

you arent criticising the right ones. thats the straw man you speak of.

"OH NO! He has a SON?" Neoconservatives and Liberals EVERYWHERE!

Rand Paul 2016

.

agreed!
Libs here hate the fact that our heros are constitutional conservative republicans and seek to infect, confuse and distract- nothing more.
Their eyes and ears are always closed to most of Ron Pauls msg... but i guess some still have open minds..if not they wouldnt be here.
maybe that will save them.

"OH NO! He has a SON?" Neoconservatives and Liberals EVERYWHERE!

Rand Paul 2016

Some on here are the worste

Some on here are the worste I've seen. A good tool to have...you can actually block people on here. I only used it because some weasel engaged in every sentence with me with vulgar name calling. Uncalled for and totally unproductive. I love a friendly debate but will not stand for obscene name calling. Filthy, classless, and ignorant! That's what some of these libs are. I am a hard working, mother and wife! I have put my time into this movement more than any most of these clowns. This will not be tolerated.

So, I say we start a banning campaign. Just block em and their very existence seizes to exist.

Libertarian Republicanism?

Posted by Lew Rockwell on December 9, 2012 03:44 PM
If you think that the richest government in the history of mankind needs more of your property to make everything right, that the vampire is not sucking enough blood out of the victim, you'll like this.

the richest government in the history of mankind?

The government is trillions in debt.

I think a lot of Libertarians like Ron Paul, and now me, and those Ron Paul republiCANs I know in the GOP who came from the LP because after decades of FAILURE, if any party is dead it's the LP and why they run Republicans. like Bob Barr and GJ.

.

sorry Granger.
Ron Paul is not a Libertarian and has never claimed to be one.
He ran as a Libertarian candidate but never joined that party to do so. It was his agreement with them. He quit the republican party, but never joined another.
Journalists refer to him as a libertarian, and he never corrects them.
BOTH Drs Paul refer to themselves as "Constitutional conservative republicans" and always have.

"OH NO! He has a SON?" Neoconservatives and Liberals EVERYWHERE!

Rand Paul 2016

I agree Ron Paul is not a Libertarian

However, he does have Libertarian Principles that are suited to the GOP, so when I refer to Ron Paul as a Libertarian, it's to his intelligent principles, not the party.

I did not know that he was never a Libertarian.. but like Bob Barr, and GJ, I recall one of the reasons I dropped out of the LP in 92 was because I was tired of the LP fronting the Republicans who didn't ahve a chance in the GOP.

Please accept my apology, for I agree with you, Ron Paul is not a Libertarian Party member. He is a Republican, and so am I because of him. Matter fo fact, I just filled out a questionaire for the RNC and I made this statement:

Honestly, In my area, the Republican Party is a third party by comparison to Democrats and No Party Prefrance. The hostility, open anger, vandalism, threats, and rebukes from the general public are abundant and constant. Republicans ask me, "Aren't you afraid to tell people you are a Republican?' Democrats and others tell me, "You should be ashamed to be a Republican. How dare you! Traitor". and so on,, none was nice." I campaigned very hard for Ron Paul because Ron Paul makes sense. Ron Paul represents the kind of Republican I want to be, with integrity, disapline, and real solutions for the problems we face, economically, domestically and foreign. Ron Paul gives me hope, not just for the Republican Party, but for the Nation and the world.

I'm proud to be a Ron Paul Republican and I will stand for the intelligence and principles executed by Ron Paul. I am very dissappointed in the RNC and the direction of the GOP, and I would rather work to restore the Republican Party to a Political Party the majority of Americans want to join working to rebuild America, than to watch it implode, or be destroyed by those who are in the Republican Party but stand for global democracy (just like Democrats), just not in our own Republic or Party. The RNC was a shame, and the world saw, how desperate, unjust, and corrupt we are.

To not allow Ron Paul to speak. To not allow Ron Paul's name to be heard. To change the plurality rules. To remove vetted delgates from states to force Romney a win, was very dissappointing to watch. To stand behind censorship of Republican Ron Paul in Main Stream Media, was not a job well done, but why people want nothing to do with the Republican Party.

Had you selected Ron Paul, you would have won. I am now supporting Rand Paul for president 2016. Join me and let's win an election honestly.

May God Bless us and help us find our way back to peace and prosperity.

.

No need to apologize granger! Im happy you didnt convert to libertarian party!!! I thought you did by your post!!!
phew!!!!
Blessings to you and yours!

"OH NO! He has a SON?" Neoconservatives and Liberals EVERYWHERE!

Rand Paul 2016

so are you for more taxes?

if not then you agree with lew.

as for the LP, i agree that barr was the dumbest choice they ever made.

a lot of people are saying the GOP is near dead too.
http://lewrockwell.com/buchanan/buchanan275.html

No I am not for more taxes

The people who say the GOP is near dead are not in the GOP working to restore the Republic, but outside the GOP hoping to destroy it.