30 votes

Randall may not equal Ronald but...

Every person is an individual that is responsible for his or her own actions. The Pauls are no different. Rand Paul is not Ron Paul, and he should not be expected to mirror his father.

Many times and rather often, I have heard that most politicians are well-intentioned. This may or may not be the case for many of them, but I do believe that Rand Paul is well-intentioned, although I have openly criticized him in the past because I think he panders more than is necessary to stay in the graces of the GOP establishment and risks being labeled as a follower of men rather than a leader of them because of it.

As well, I believe Rand has been weak on foreign policy (probably as a tactic to avoid being pigeon-holed like Ron was by the neo-con propaganda wing of the media). Certainly in rhetoric and in strategy, Rand is not equivalent to Ron, but time will tell if his way will be more effective.

One thing is for sure, Rand is no longer walking in his father's shadow which can neither be labeled as good nor as bad. Rand is his own man.

All criticism aside, someone tell me who would be a better and more viable candidate to represent the agenda of the Liberty Movement for POTUS in 2016? I highly doubt that even if a more acceptable candidate became available that that candidate would be as viable for the simple reason of name recognition.

If given the option, I will likely vote for Rand Paul in 2016.

No one person will be the savior of Our nation. It will take effort from all of us. If we can agree on nothing else, we can probably agree that Rand Paul would at least be a step in the right direction.

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.

OldNo.7J.D.

I am not writing Rand off just yet, but for me, here is where the major problem is:

Rand, on CSPAN, national tv, had every opportunity to explain to the people that feinstein-lee amendment was worse than 2012 ndaa. He did not do that. Instead, he touted it like it was in the best interest of Americans on American soil. He did admit that it needed work for off American soil, but again, he explained the amendment like it was honorable, in the right direction and must be passed. The average American listened to that. The American people, and many here, believed that Rand, fienstein and lee were working on something good and trustworthy.

So, Rand had a chance to actually call them out on it, as Justin Amash did, and educate people to the truth and just how low feinstein, lee and others were. Rand, imo, failed with an F.

Rand should have taken that opportunity, in front of all viewers, to call for 1021 and other sections to be STRICKEN.

Thus the first line in my sig.

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

No.7's picture

I think Rand and Justin believe the same things

but Rand has been a good GOP doggy and leadership likes him.

We can't say the same for Justin. I don't understand what Rand is doing either but he has the blood of the good Dr. in him and I trust him to do what is right.

Voting against Iran sanctions or fighting that bill wouldn't have accomplished much in my eyes but I'm glad Justin Amash stood up against it. Justin doesn't have much to lose, but Rand could lose the support of the GOP which is the only way our movement will see the 2016 nomination in my opinion.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

Concerning Rand, this is a dilemna.

Play lap dog to advance his career while keeping America in the dark, or educate Americans while he is still in office.

gop understands game playing. I am sure that they know full well that if Rand does advance his career, he would potentially do the right things. I don't see them letting that happen, I don't see them actually liking Rand. Rand, while he has the chance, should educate his constituents and the American people of the atrocities that are taking place, and what is in the actual bills. Otherwise, how would people know when and what to seriously object to.

Many believe that he should play the game, support sanctions, not berate feinstein-lee, while others like me believe that the truth should be told so that constituents have the opportunity to make noise and do what is right, here and now.

This nation is in the sh|tter. There is no more time to play games, IMHO.

I pray for all of us.

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

No.7's picture

Well, I can't say your wrong.

It's hard to say I disagree, so to say that I agree with the weird things Rand has done. I can't say I agree with playing small to serve other's interests. I can't say I agree with Iran sanctions, I can't say I supported Mitt Romney, and I can't say I like what I've heard about the NDAA bill concerning Rand.

However I refuse to judge Rand so harshly. It's hard to imagine what Rand's shoes feel like. It seems to me that every time Rand opens his mouth he risks losing his shot at the nomination. I remember hearing the words "Ron Paul doesn't have a chance" from GOP pundits over and over and over but I haven't heard that about Rand. Who knows though, they might have Rand right where they want him.

However, no good deed goes unpunished/no evil deed unrewarded. Justin Amash has done the right thing and he has lost power to do right because of it. Whereas Rand seems to be gaining influence, old guard GOP supporters here in Tennessee seem to like Rand much more than Ron. They don't call Rand crazy like they do Ron.

I think Rand is picking his battles, like Sun Tzu.

A good general wins the war without fighting, and positions himself for the best chance at success. Perhaps Rand is trying to stay under the radar of GOP leadership and not end up like Amash, living to fight a battle he can win.

He couldn't win on the NDAA, he couldn't win on Iran sanctions. He couldn't have spoken at the RNC by endorsing dad and He couldn't win a senate seat without the support of the GOP. So while I can't say he did the right thing, I can say that I believe the man was raised right and that He is doing what he thinks is best for himself and all of us.

I sure as hell hope so.

At least this way we have two guys with a lot of potential playing both sides of the fence. We've got outlaw Justin doing the right thing, and we have the loyal Republican Rand Paul doing... whatever it is he's doing.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

OldNo.7J.D., I was hoping that you would reply

OldNo.7J.D., I was hoping that you would reply to this.

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

No.7's picture

I did my best in a quick manner

I won't lie, I got a little excited to see you ask for my opinion.

Even if you disagree and slaughter me with a counter-reply, thanks for the ego-boost lol

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

OldNo.7J.D. please read this.

I would never think to slaughter you. I am very strong boots on the ground, grassroots. I know exactly where I stand on issues. But I am new to politics and still learning so I need all of the objective information that I can get. I know that we agree about many things so I value your input. Please keep me on MY toes :-)

What you said above makes sense and I will try very hard to keep that in mind. I have not written Rand off either. Knowing that we have so few Liberty as our representatives, I pray that you are right.

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

No.7's picture

When I say slaughter

I guess I actually mean prove me wrong on all fronts and force me to submit to your position and listen up lol.

That's happened to me more than once here, people here are good!

As for politics I'm not really an experienced ear so to speak. I'm just a kid who realized I have an obligation to the millions who have died for my Rights and freedom. So now I'm learning everything I can and sharing it wherever I can.

I always like challenging arguments on here because I usually learn something.

I'll be right here with you, fighting the good fight in this rEVOLution of the mind.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

re: when you said slaughter, lol, I knew that :-)

"I'll be right here with you, fighting the good fight in this rEVOLution of the mind."

OldNo.7J.D., count on me to be on the line with you.

Your age has nothing to do with it. Even as an over-achiever in many things in my life, at my age, I am *ASHAMED* that all of my life prior to this year I had NO interest in politics and asked my folks who to vote for, if I even voted. If I couldn't remember the names that they told me, I left them blank!

You are young, invigorated, intelligent, and I envy that. I would give up 10 years of my life to do it over again knowing what I know now. Please consider yourself lucky, and NEVER be afraid to confront the likes of me or others.

I may sound gruff sometimes, but I'm just a good-hearted mid-40's guy who likes to get my point across. And I like hot-wings and babes at bike night, when it's not too cold to ride :-)

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

No.7's picture

Thank you, I am lucky

and fortunate to know what I've learned from places like this, mises.org, C4L, CATO, and especially Stossel.

I love your attitude, especially that you feel you can learn from anyone.

The best lesson I've ever been taught was something my grandfather said often

"You can learn from a 5 year old negro if you'll just listen".

Keep in mind, my grandfather was born in 1930's Alabama and grew up with governor wallace. He wasn't a racist person but as with anyone else I've met of his age, he spoke the language of his time.

His message to me and everyone else he said that to was basically that we should listen to everyone, regardless of who they were or what they were saying.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

How about you taking your own

How about you taking your own advice.

Larry in North Carolina
The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men and women to not support Ron Paul!

No.7's picture

You got me there

My first comment was uncalled for, and I apologize. I don't want anyone to "go away"

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

go away? that's how you respond to a different view?

he endorsed and campaigned for a police state loving chicken hawk.
he kissed AIPAC’s … ring
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2010/09/rand_paul...
he voted for Iran sanctions: an act of war.
re: your 2nd sentence:
http://www.dailypaul.com/267615/is-rand-for-us-or-not#commen...

No.7's picture

Rand needs the GOP

just as badly as the GOP needs him. He wouldn't even be in the Senate without the GOP. I trust Rand to do what is right, he endorsed Romney because he took an oath to support the parties nominee. I think it's okay for Rand to play politics, he may not get shut down like his father.

Honestly, the votes in D.C. on the bills are over my head. If you just look at votes then Ron Paul doesn't look so smart, but he explains why and I believe him.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

But you know for a fact that

But you know for a fact that the nominee is preselected! You know it's rigged man and so does Rand, so why would he say, whoever the nominee is I will support? That doesn't make you sick? Idk guys!!!

juan maldonado

No.7's picture

You don't know that

and that is in no way fact. That is suspicion, no one can prove it.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

Really!? Lmao

Really!? Lmao

juan maldonado

i've heard that same kind of belief expressed

in regards to obama; regardless of what he does his supporters still trust him - i find it mind boggling.

correct me if i'm wrong but didn't GOP big shots try and keep rand from winning?

yes he took that oath but he didn't take one to campaign for the nominee, and did he really have to do it on a show that had shown nothing but disrespect for his dad?

i doubt if the GOP old boy network thinks they need any particular politician.

No.7's picture

They don't need him

but they need us and we just proved it to them. Would you vote for him in the 2016 primary?

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

if by us

you mean supporters of ron paul and the freedom movement, i'd say you were right, although the MSM nor the GOP admits it.

i would only vote for someone i believed continued to carry the revolutionary message of ron paul on all fronts.
i don't see rand, and i don't think he even see he sees himself as being that person.

You are crazy funny dwalters

you have a real knack for affixing yourself to the leg of the weak candidate and humping away just like you did with that facade of a candidate Gary Johnson.

Make sure to keep your eyes closed tightly because everyone knows there isn't anyone better than Rand.

How come you are no longer hanging with your best little buddy here?

November 6th 2012 I voted for Dr.Ron Paul
"We must remember, elections are short-term efforts. Revolutions are long-term projects." ~ Ron Paul

Well lookie here...

...the troll finally got himself banned, and not a moment too soon IMO.

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

I'm my own person... I do what I think is best and I don't....

hesitate to speak out.

Even throughout my school days, I was able to speak to any clique that existed. I don't belong or associate myself with any particular group. I reserve the right to disagree with anyone at anytime and will do so.

Rand is quite hated by

Rand is quite hated by progressives due to him branding himself with the the gop tea'rs. That association has already been firmly established 360 degrees. His name has been mentioned by some I know.

My spreading of the Liberty message to progressives does not contain the word Rand like I used to with Ron. To do so, is just about an almost rapport killer.

I agree with that sentiment...

I believe it is because of the pandering he does to satisfy the GOP.

Unfortunately it eliminates him from contention on a national

level.

His endorsement of Todd Aiken basically seals his fate with Dems & progressives:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/05/rand-paul-todd-akin...

http://www.businessinsider.com/rand-paul-todd-akin-claire-mc...

He also endorsed that lady 'who is not a witch.' So irrrelevant that her name is forgotten, but the ridiculous endorsement is not. Not to mention the ill timed, and very LOUD (on Hannity?!) Romney endorsement. Couldn't he have done it quietly, in a press release?

For all this talk that Rand is "playing the game," he's not playing very smart if he wants to be president.

Among the left, he may as well be Rick Santorum.

Yes, he's playing a different game from his dad, but it is the same in one respect: he's not playing to win.

The Diamond Dog is a real cool cat. | Reporting on the world from an altitude of 420.

I think that's an oversimplification...

...the Dems who will hate Rand because he made certain "tea party" endorsements are likely people who would hate him anyway simply for having an (R) next to his name, regardless of all other considerations: aka, the mindless party loyalists. On the other hand, many of the more thoughtful Dems, such as were sympathetic to RP, might see past the political show, and see that Rand would be the most anti-war and pro-civil-liberties Republican nominee in history, and vote for him for that reason. So, when it comes right down to it, I don't think Rand would have all that much less appeal among Dems than Ron, and certainly a lot more than Ryan, Rubio, Jeb Bush, Christie, or any of the other mainline neocon douches being discussed as possible contenders for 2016.

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

Good assessment.

Good assessment.

I don't think so...

Everyone I know who likes Ron gives a thumbs down and shakes their head when it comes to Rand. These are hardcore Ron Paul supporters. They're purists. Rand has to win more than that, of course.

But as far as mass appeal, you need to be more ... mainstream. The dems will just roll out his endorsement for Christine O'Donnel (remembered her name), Todd Aiken, and his support for the definition of life amendment to the Constitution, and it will be all over. That is why the GOP will never allow him to be the nominee, any more than they'd allow Ron, Sarah Palin or Rick Santorum. On a national scale, all of those candidates get slaughtered.

Elections are popularity contests. Ryan has more appeal than Rand. He's taller, more handsome, and he smiles more. Better hair, too. Same for Rubio.

No doubt Rand will be 'part of the conversation' - just like Rick Santorum and Sarah Palin were.

The Diamond Dog is a real cool cat. | Reporting on the world from an altitude of 420.

rand has more appeal than

rand has more appeal than ryan. people are brainwashed into ryan just as they were with romney. when his image is shoved in their faces 24/7, they are bound to start liking what they see and hear.