-36 votes

Did Ron Paul sell out?

I'd like to hear people's comments on this:

http://manoflittlefaith.blogspot.ca/2012/12/how-ron-paul-sol...



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no

of course not!

Ron Paul says "I am a messenger"

Ron Paul always delivered the same consistant message.

The end

Good Job Ron Paul you never let me down. From Galveston TX RP's congressional district, voter and supporter for over 20 years.

Thank you In liberty what greater position that the messenger.

sovereign

"sell out" doesn't quite fit

You could say he maybe "gave up" on his campaign; or even say he quit, but he defiantly didn't sell out. If he endorsed Romney then you could of said that yea he's a "sell out" but what I believe happened is that he quit. When looking at all the evidence with vote manipulations and the various other acts of voter fraud; its safe to say THEY wouldn't let him win and given the time in Washington that Ron spent, he probably knew they wouldn't let him win.

With his hard work though getting the message out; inspiring grass roots to take over county's and what have you, he set the stage for 2016

I think the person who wrote that is frustrated and needs . . .

someone to blame and doesn't have the firmest grip on reality. The major reality is, of course, that having a different president isn't going to change the direction this country is heading and has been heading now for decades (or centuries)--

Ron Paul knows that, I believe, better than most.

Ron Paul is the only one who knows if he sold anything (out or in)--

None of us know what kinds of personal challenges he was facing or what kinds of battles he had to fight--

So, the article is myopic, in my opinion.

And, yes, the entire thing was rigged from the beginning, but Dr. Paul did a lot of hard work and woke many people up.

it's hard to be awake; it's easier to dream--

oh yea

its biased

jrd3820's picture

Call it what you want

Maybe he "sold out," maybe he "gave up," maybe he did not even care either way, but this article is still missing a bit of reality.

First of all, no matter how nice or mean Ron Paul was to the other candidates, the republicans were never under any circumstances going to nominate Ron Paul. He could have won every primary and it would not have happened. Running as a 3rd party or independent would not have gotten him the Presidency either. That being said, he knew he would not be President, we knew he would not be President, we supported him (or at least I did) anyways because we anted him to keep talking and we wanted others to hear him.

Which brings me to my next topic. This article claims his campaign was a massive catastrophe. Well.... He is not President right now, so maybe, but I have a different vantage point. I spent a lot of time in 2012 on college campuses, and his underground youth following is still growing even after the election and his ideas are being talked about in a very positive manner. However, that is not just on college campuses, I had so many friends and family approach me and say things about how he was the only one making any sense in a debate the previous night.

Again.... call it selling out if you want, but he was never going to win, so who cares what it was? He sent a message and let's hope he continues spreading that message for years to come.

“I like nonsense, it wakes up the brain cells. Fantasy is a necessary ingredient in living.”
― Dr. Seuss

don't want to believe it

I don't want to believe it... But people do go berserk for their kids. The last C for L fund raising letter was offensively stupid. I vacillate. Politics is a dirty business. At the same time Ron will have to show that he applies the same principles of honesty to his political organization or he will continue to loss credibility. What is that saying again: All good causes become a business and then become a racket. I get the feeling the C4L is in the business stage.

Vickie

i don't get you drama queens

ron paul ran a NATION-WIDE campaign. if it were his entire national strategy to set up rand but never try to win, don't you think there would be more state-wide coordinators parroting this claim? the fact that out of thousands of counties you're hearing occasions of potential sabotage in single digits, what does that tell you?

and then let's entertain the scenario of a few bad apples. you can argue there will always be bad apples in any large organization, but even if there weren't, you think that was the sole determining factor in how the 2012 campaign was not won? think of the senior votes paul wasn't able to get despite them being most politically active and likely heard of paul's name much more than the working class. how many of you idiot boomers even here would hate when people talk about SS reform? paul's loss has nothing to do with reality and just the stupidity of the general populace, some represented even here? you fucking drama queens..

benton might have arranged paul's personal appearances, but it's retarded to think he can have hands on thousands of simultaneous local independent operations at the same time. the question is if this conspiracy is true, the scale of these rumors just doesn't make sense in being limited to the same old 1 crazy or 2 espousing it.. why don't you conspiracists ever grow some fucking sense of perspective?

I know for a fact the

I know for a fact the campaign intentionally sold out the Louisiana delegates.

Maybe he was sold out

http://www.dailypaul.com/268388/jesse-benton-i-have-never-be...

allegory - ˈalɪg(ə)ri/ - noun - 1. a story, poem, or picture which can be interpreted to reveal a hidden meaning, typically a moral or political one.

I remember Ron Paul winning a

I remember Ron Paul winning a number of early primaries who's results were obviously tampered with.

Ron Paul did what he needed to do to win.

But he wasn't willing to do our job.

We failed him. We allowed the fraud to continue, and the masses stopped voting for him.

I tried to spread the word about the fraud. As did many others. But that's all we did. So they just ignored it, and went on their way. I failed Ron Paul.

Not quite

There were PLENTY of people calling out the blatant fraud, and the campaign did practically nothing about it, and most of the people here justified it by telling each other "the campaign doesn't want to look like sore losers". Lets not forget the treatment of the grassroots toward the latter third of the campaign, either.

I don't know if he "sold out" or not, but given all that's happened over the past decade, I certainly wouldn't rule it out as a possibility.

A signature used to be here!

I know there were plenty of

I know there were plenty of people calling out fraud. That's the point. That's all we did. We called it out, and hoped someone else would see it and do something.

What did we expect? We would call fraud and the media would share it...nope. We would call fraud and the crony in Maine would step aside? Or that the GOP would say "You caught us, we'll undo everything we've done now". Nope. It was on us to DO something.

I grew up in government schools. If someone broke a rule, and I wanted it followed, I could make it know to the authorities who would DO something. That's how we acted. Only the "authorities" were the ones breaking the rules, and simply ignored us. We were not mentally equipped to make the change we wanted.

We deserve everything we have. I know this, because we have it. And in reality the only way to deserve something is to make it happen. If it doesn't happen, then you don't deserve it.

The only way you can say that is if....

....you physically walked precincts, recruited RPers to run for GOP local party offices, committeeman and delegate slots, filled as many as you could and PERSONALLY got as many as you could through to the conventions.

In that case, I'd agree.

However, the campaign CANNOT do that work. It is impossible. So, if you did not do it, no one did in your area. You can't blame the campaign for that. You can only blame yourself.

It is the way to win. And it is the way to overcome fraud - through NUMBERS.

ie Woods

Tom Woods said he tried to talk to a VIP in the campaign about the BS and was disbelieved.

Vickie

Tom Woods 2016

:)

.
~wobbles but doesn't fall down~

It Was Obvious Long Ago...

...that the pathetic dive taken by the Paul campaign had to be done with the knowledge and agreement of Dr. Paul. He bears responsibility as the 'captain of the ship'.

It has become even more obvious since it all imploded and ended.

Lil' Rand and the C4L are now the primary focus, having conceded to and morphed with the establishment. The faithful-minions abound, busily rationalizing and justifying what is actually a clear picture.

Sadly, those who came into the 'fight' for liberty because of and focused on Dr. Paul, were and are in it for the wrong reasons. It is about the principles, philosophy and ethic of 'Liberty', not any 'man'. A cult-like following coalesced around Dr. Paul. Now that that cult-following has rationalized and justified Dr. Paul's actions, they have coalesced around Lil' Rand and to a lesser extent, the C4L.

Pathetic.

For the minority, it never was and never will be about 'a man', but, rather, it is about the on-going and increasingly desperate fight for individual liberty. Some of us were doing this before Dr. Paul entered the national stage. This battle did not begin with, nor will it end with, Dr. Paul...at least for the hard-core.

It is what it is and there has always been a small, hard-core percentage of men who yearn for and strive for liberty, against all odds, uncompromisingly and unapologetically. the pity is, that most who claim to be in the fight have conceded the bedrock of no-compromise and rock-solid principle, before they even begin, thus assuring a continuing rot within what should be dirt-simple stances and principles.

I am usually classified as a

I am usually classified as a "conspiracy theorist". I am skeptical about the first thing I hear and try to investigate as many possibilities as I can before I make my decisions. I've believed 9-11 to be a fraud for quite some time, although I've never asserted any specifics of that fraud, merely pointed out that things do not add up. I find myself in a very similar spot for Sandy Hook. So for me to believe a government operative acted like they were on our side to further their cause is not that difficult.

The difficulty I have is that Ron Paul did not help the establishment. He massively improved our cause. I do not agree with your assertions. You have clearly not come up with enough evidence to even cast doubt on the mighty Ron Paul.

What I have found is that when I argue my "conspiracy theories" I am usually reasonable and logical and calm (not to claim this all the time by any means), while the entities disagreeing with me are emotional, illogical, and angry. If I do slip into emotion and fallacy I find it's usually either because the other person is repeatedly ignoring my points and I need to move on, or because I find myself arguing something that is wrong.

What I lay on Dr.Paul's shoulders is not being the kind of

person that can see the bad in people easily.

I think Benton and a few others conspired against him and us to trip us up.

So although you are correct, Dr.Paul was the captain, I hold no animosity towards him because I don't believe he was trying to do harm. I do however think his surrounding group was and is.

I just got a letter from an attorney for C4L today with language that smacks of manipulation and fear-mongering in an attempt to get me to send money. Absolute bullshit.

I love Dr.Paul and all that he has tried to do but I will not send anymore money to him if he's connected to people like that for whatever the reason he might be.

As you say.. it's about the message, not the man but I also say, it was about the man a little because we need to trust the man that will carry the message.

We got burned by Bentondick.. Unfortunately, that's going to happen on occasions, because these people are trash.

Patriot Cell #345,168
I don't respond to emails or pm's.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=qo8CmO...
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution, inevitable.

Same stupid letter that I

Same stupid letter that I got. If they want continued support they need to expel the parasites.

Vickie

tasmlab's picture

Decent Reason article

There's a decent article on the Paul campaign in this month's Reason. They asked Dr. Paul about the late summer campaign announcement and Dr. Paul says he was just trying to be honest with the base about his chances.

Currently consuming: Morehouse's "Better off free", FDR; Wii U; NEP Football

ytc's picture

Is Ivan Jankovic the author of this trash?

??

The consequences of dashed desiderata.

The people who put their hopes in Ron Paul are for the most part seeking solutions to what they have discovered about their country in just the past few years. Since Ron Paul has been fighting for forty years the forces of darkness that have held his country in thrall for one hundred years it was inevitable that he would become the cynosure of these hopes and just as inevitable in hindsight that such hopes would remain unfulfilled given the nature of the powers arrayed against us and the timing of these events.

This article in the OP is a crystallisation of all those disappointed aspirations which have now turned into bitterness and recrimination. These feelings demand a scapegoat on which to pile all the detritus of failed ambitions and broken dreams. Once again the dynamics of the drama of life insist that Ron Paul be the scapegoat...and so it came to pass.

There was never any hope of victory apart from divine intervention. The powers working against us are spiritual and the only way to victory is spiritual. I was personally convinced that Ron Paul was chosen to lead America and that his mission was to be President. In this I was wrong. I realised after some rumination that in placing these events into the paradigm into which we are moving I had as it were gotten ahead of the divine plan. We were still in the old paradigm and it was in this context that Ron Paul was defeated. He has however successfully completed his assigned mission.

Ron Paul was a prophet and this was the clear mission that he has fulfilled. He has issued the warnings to the people in power. They have refused to listen and we now await the fulfilment of his warnings. I posted a fairly long article on these considerations back on July 23, 2012.

http://www.dailypaul.com/245856/final-victory-is-certain-par...

The article itself is still relevant to ongoing events and is worth reading from that point of view. It will also help to recapture the hope I had at the time that Dr. Paul would win the nomination and the Presidency and pull America back from the brink. It would be an understatement to say I was disappointed that he did neither. However that was more a consequence of my own error rather than anything anyone else did least of all Dr. Paul himself. Psalm 127 is very much to the point in this regard:

127:1 If the Lord does not build a house, then those who build it work in vain.
If the Lord does not guard a city, then the watchman stands guard in vain.
127:2 It is vain for you to rise early, come home late,and work so hard for your food.
Yes, he can provide for those whom he loves even when they sleep.
127:3 Yes, sons are a gift from the Lord, the fruit of the womb is a reward.
127:4 Sons born during one’s youth are like arrows in a warrior’s hand.
127:5 How blessed is the man who fills his quiver with them! They will not be put to shame when they confront enemies at the city gate.

Ron Paul has had many "sons" in the past forty years. His message has awakened many to the perils facing their nation. This Psalm in the final verse gives us a sure hope that their labours will not be in vain.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

lindalsalisbury's picture

Prophet

In my past, I have been hot and heavy into philosophy. I see you are into the underlying nature of things.

I am not good at creating links, nor is religion my primary thought in my daily life, but I stumbled onto this in YouTube, and found it to be the most thought provoking and enlightening stimulus in years.

If you can suffer through the first 15 minutes, you may find it so as well.

It is, "Alert! Proof The Biggest EVENT in History is About to Happen"

The link in my comment above...

addresses the revelations given to Jonathan Cahn in some depth. I believe I have watched the Sid Roth interview and, if my memory serves correctly, at the end of the interview Sid mentions to Jonathan that firemen at the WTC site at the time of the attack found a Bible that was lying open among the debris. It was open at Jeremiah chapter 11.

My own understanding of the revelations given to Jonathan is somewhat different than his interpretation of these harbingers. I address the difference in the article I linked to. When Sid Roth mentioned Jeremiah chapter 11 it was noticeable that Jonathan paid scant attention to this fact yet from my perspective it carried weight because of a similar experience I had in 1983.

I read the chapter in question and it confirmed to me the understanding that I have taken from these events. Does this mean that my understanding is correct and Jonathan's is wrong? No, it simply means that we are limited human beings with an already established framework in which we interpret our experiences. In Jonathan's case he is a Messianic Jew who believes in the coming salvation of the nation of Israel and their being raised to the head of the nations. In other words he understands world events in the light of the futurist eschatology. It is this eschatology that also informs the prelude to the Sid Roth interview dealing with the prophecies of Daniel in the Old Testament.

I do not believe this interpretation of scripture and therefore have a different framework in which to place these events and their significance. e.g From all of these harbingers that Jonathan has written about he foresees a coming judgement on America. I see a coming judgement that is already in progress on the world empire that presently controls America and seeks to subjugate her to the world government that is being put in place by the governing elites in every nation of the world with few exceptions. This world empire is actually heralding its aims with the name of the new WTC. It is called One World Trade Center.

I believe that this one world government as planned by the elites will never be instituted. It is already being destroyed and this is good news for all the nations who are presently under its sway. Does this mean there will be no dislocations? No there will indeed be shakings taking place and many may see these as God's judgements which they are but not as most will understand them. All the institutions of secret Babylon are being destroyed but the institutions of the original American vision will be preserved and restored. As I say this is my own understanding reached within the framework which I believe God has placed in my heart and mind. The article I linked above gives more detail on this.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

lindalsalisbury's picture

Thank you

I will check it out.

I sense Ron Paul

knows well the machinations that the Capitol Hill gang operate by. He is not and never was part of that gang and never made any real headway because of that fact.

BUT, at a local and grassroots level he made a huge impact, which is the best he could do.

The dealings in DC are deep, dark, and dangerous. He did his best and kept himself and his family safe.

The law cannot make a wicked person virtuous…God’s grace alone can accomplish such a thing.
Ron Paul - The Revolution

Setting a good example is a far better way to spread ideals than through force of arms. Ron Paul

The only think one can fault RP for is....

....cutting the legs out from all of his GOP activists who made it to their state conventions before the conventions cycle was over by stating the way he did that his campaign was "no longer active" at the end of April.

That was the one and only thing. People worked so hard and the campaign cut them off at the knees as they were going into convention.

While that was pretty egregious, no he did not "sell out".

lindalsalisbury's picture

Ron Paul,

like God, is not talking to me. However, I am not turning my back on the Constitution or the Ten Commandments.

Whatever happened here is all water under the bridge. The enduring question is what do we do now? We are wading in deep waters in troubled times. I do not trust Rand, C4L, or any of these people associated with the campaign.

My wish is that we find another candidate and "play to win", or should I say "pray to win". No secret plan! No secret play, just as old fashioned basketball "pass and run" for the goal.

I salute everyone fighting tirelessly for liberty!!!

,

As i see it Ron was trying to provide a guiding light to anyone who would listen, I don't know how Ron could have gotten further without losing who he was. If enough of America did wake up he would have served as President but they didn't. At least those who listened can be on a personal gold/silver standard and survive the collapse and perhaps liberty ideas themself will survive because of what he did.